ZoS, you listened and gave us a no-CP campaign. How about one without AoE caps, proxy, or VD?

KenaPKK · April 2016

NA ~ PC

I for one appreciate how you disabled CP in Azura's Star. I have had capped CP for quite some time, but I honestly enjoy playing without them more. Some of my friends prefer Azura's as well, and many other players have communicated a preference for CP-less PvP by playing on Azura's like we have. This change that we requested was a positive one for some players for various reasons.

You listened to our request for PvP without (or with fewer) CP.

Now, may we have a campaign that does not have AoE caps, Magicka Detonation, or 5pc Vicious Death enabled?

It would be as simple as turning off AoE caps within the boundaries of that campaign alone, making Magicka Detonation and its morphs unable to be slotted on players' ability bars, and then preventing the equipping of 5pc Vicious Death as well. When players enter the campaign with mag det slotted, it can simply be automatically removed from their bars, and when they enter while wearing 5pc VD, the set can be automatically unequipped (with a message making them aware).

I am not sure if the game's combat engine can support having a campaign with AoE caps disabled while the rest of the game runs with AoE caps enabled, so please educate me if this is not possible. If this is the case, would it be possible to copy the combat engine into a new server platform and manually alter the code to operate without AoE caps just for the campaign?

I for one would even pay for an entirely new DLC in order to cover the costs of this implementation if it meant I could play in a campaign with these three changes made, and judging by all the cries for AoE caps' removal, I venture to say I'm in good company. In fact, I guarantee you many of the players who have left the game would return to it if this server doesn't lag as badly -- which is likely since all those AoE cap calculations would be removed.

Heck, you could even implement it on pre-lighting patch graphics to kill the lag 100%. Hardcore PvPers would flock to it, as we literally couldn't care less about lighting if it means lag. (Hint, we also hate AoE caps because they complicate combat and bring RNG into the picture).

Thoughts from the community?

@Lord_Hev hit me with your ZoS tag wall again m8.

@ZOS_GinaBruno @ZOS_BrianWheeler @Wrobel @ZOS_RichLambert

Alorier · April 2016

And how many people use the non cp campaign

KenaPKK · April 2016

davidtxr wrote: »

And how many people use the non cp campaign

It reaches 3 bars of population in AD and DC during prime time, and the map is always balanced with good fights occurring. It has been this way ever since I took my small group over there right after the TG patch and pushed back the AD zerg, which had already accumulated, to create some breathing room for DC. DC players promptly followed and have been playing there since. Heck, I heard that DC crowned an emp there during prime time with the help of Bitaken and EHJ (awesome!), but I was not present at the time. That 50k tick which was talked about on the forums last week occurred at BRK on Azura's as well.

I'd like to see more EP -- the other factions tend to leave their corner of the map alone most of the time -- but there are plenty of AD and DC players who frequent Azura's.

Edit: I'll also add that the players who frequent Azura's are a mix of new players and seasoned ones. It's become a sort of Blackwater Blade 2.0 for new players once they level out of BwB, but lots of experienced players also enjoy it. Damage feels the same in my opinion, shields feel balanced, and you actually have to manage your resources... It's become attractive for oldies who remember 1.5 and earlier.

Alorier · April 2016

What platform as I haven't seen that on Xbox Europe

KenaPKK · April 2016

davidtxr wrote: »

What platform as I haven't seen that on Xbox Europe

Sorry, this is in reference to NA PC. (adding to the OP)

Xarc · April 2016

many players too in azura & bwb EU PC. Good fights, balanced map & high to full pop most of the time.

About a "non aoe cap" i'm not really for that. I think non cp is good for balanced fights but aoe cap is a part of the game.

FENGRUSH · April 2016

If this happens - the campaign must be named FENGRUSH.

Asmael · April 2016

Already stated by Zos that it wouldn't be possible, since AoE caps are linked to the combat system itself, thus, removing AoE caps from a single campaign isn't possible without removing those from all campaigns, as well as PvE.

bitaken · April 2016

Most of EHJ has recently homed on Azuras. It feels like how ESO is supposed to be played - you make a mistake - you die - you have to manage your resources - and not everyone can insta heal to full after a CC break.

I have seen some organized groups from AD - a couple from EP but the camp could use more EP.

The scoring system is stupid and giving EP massive points and a stranglehold on second place.

I am there for the fun the fights - and the zerg busting.

THERE IS NO NEED to break VD or PD or AOE caps here though. There are plenty of ways to manage zerg busting in this camp when you run into the 30+ AD groups.

kuro-dono · April 2016

non cp friendlyfire campaign, that would be juicy.

Zheg · April 2016

I'd like for all campaigns to have those things removed. As evidence of wrobel's poor foresight though, without prox det the entire meta becomes steel tornado with token healers.

WTB campaign with combat balanced by someone other than wrobel please.

ToRelax · April 2016

Of course AoE caps should go. In 1.5 there was one reason for it not to that I could think off, dynamic ultimate - however even that would have been solved by adjusting the way and speed to gain ultimate. Similarly the situation is with Vicious Death, except it's helping to kill many instead of sustaining few. So like OP said, it shouldn't be in the game without AoE caps.
IDK what is going on at ZOS, but doing this would really help the game... both in terms of number of players and happieness among them...

Stratforge · April 2016

davidtxr wrote: »

And how many people use the non cp campaign

Yeah but that's different. Lots of people love champ points. Only FOTMBlades love Proxdet + VD and even they're going to get bored eventually.

Yolokin_Swagonborn · April 2016

bitaken wrote: »

Most of EHJ has recently homed on Azuras. It feels like how ESO is supposed to be played - you make a mistake - you die - you have to manage your resources - and not everyone can insta heal to full after a CC break.

I have seen some organized groups from AD - a couple from EP but the camp could use more EP.

The scoring system is stupid and giving EP massive points and a stranglehold on second place.

I am there for the fun the fights - and the zerg busting.

THERE IS NO NEED to break VD or PD or AOE caps here though. There are plenty of ways to manage zerg busting in this camp when you run into the 30+ AD groups.

THIS.

Prox Det really doesn't hit that hard when you can't crank your magic damage to ludicrous levels with CP. If you die to prox det or VD on BwB or Azuras, you really deserved it. That being said I still think the prox det meta is annoying and hope it goes away.

I am glad people are finally realizing how toxic the CP system was for PvP in general. Resource Management Meta >>> Burst Meta with infinite resources.

Vaoh · April 2016

I vote to change Azura's Star into a no AoE cap/Proxy/Viscious Death server. Most importantly no AoE Caps. AT LEAST TRY IT ZOS!!!! WHAT'S THE HARM IN LISTENING TO EVERY COMPETANT PLAYER IN YOUR GAME BY GIVING IT A SHOT WITH TESTING???

On NA PS4 Azura's Star (Vet server with no CP) there are almost always 0 bars across all three alliances, starting around a week after Thieves Guild released. The only consistently dead server on NA PS4. Sometimes you see one bar of AD during prime time but that's it.

Someone here on the forums was trying to tell me about how populated it was earlier, because it is so much fairer and such as I couldn't use my 370CPs to gain such a huge "unfair advantage" over players or 1vX as well.... I can see now how well this message resonated with the playerbase....

Fun Fact: Azura's Star was the most popular campaign prior to Thieves Guild releasing. I currently have 302 guild members (largest amount by 2x on any other campaign) yet it is utterly empty. Wonder if they're still logging in....

Rylana · April 2016

As the vicious death experiment has shown, a no cap campaign would be a disaster for anything resembling group play.

Might as well all be gankers and stam DKs if this ever went in, nothing else survives.

Rylana · April 2016

bitaken wrote: »

Most of EHJ has recently homed on Azuras. It feels like how ESO is supposed to be played - you make a mistake - you die - you have to manage your resources - and not everyone can insta heal to full after a CC break.

I have seen some organized groups from AD - a couple from EP but the camp could use more EP.

The scoring system is stupid and giving EP massive points and a stranglehold on second place.

I am there for the fun the fights - and the zerg busting.

THERE IS NO NEED to break VD or PD or AOE caps here though. There are plenty of ways to manage zerg busting in this camp when you run into the 30+ AD groups.

Well when youre the only EP guild in town, vs about 60 AD and 40 DC on a given night, low pop score bonus tends to kick in.

We get zerged like nobodies business, and im not surprised other EP guilds dont want to deal with it.

Zorgon_The_Revenged · April 2016

davidtxr wrote: »

And how many people use the non cp campaign

The EU PC non-CP campaign is also quite popular, AD and EP often have a queue to enter while for some reason DC might be lucky to reach 3 bars.

I've played on it and enjoyed it, some of my alts would need a total build change to be fun to play there but some cope quite well with less resources and regen, less damage isn't a problem as I just have to "work" at killing someone a little more.

Also, the zerg trains that I have seen have been smaller and, with the changes to siege, less effective.

I have 600+ CP and I'm certainly going to spend my time there or in the non-vet campaign, CP campaigns are either full and laggy or just empty.

FENGRUSH wrote: »

If this happens - the campaign must be named FENGRUSH.

Sorry, but people saying "they are entering FENGRUSH now" would put me off.

Glarin · April 2016

Unfortunately Kena, They have stated that a campaign with out AoE caps would be impossible because they are a part of the core combat and gameplay mechanics where as champion points are fluid and can be changed and rearranged at will. Sorry

Zheg · April 2016

Zorgon_The_Revenged wrote: »

davidtxr wrote: »

And how many people use the non cp campaign

The EU PC non-CP campaign is also quite popular, AD and EP often have a queue to enter while for some reason DC might be lucky to reach 3 bars.

I've played on it and enjoyed it, some of my alts would need a total build change to be fun to play there but some cope quite well with less resources and regen, less damage isn't a problem as I just have to "work" at killing someone a little more.

Also, the zerg trains that I have seen have been smaller and, with the changes to siege, less effective.

I have 600+ CP and I'm certainly going to spend my time there or in the non-vet campaign, CP campaigns are either full and laggy or just empty.

FENGRUSH wrote: »

If this happens - the campaign must be named FENGRUSH.

Sorry, but people saying "they are entering FENGRUSH now" would put me off.

Jeez, and the queue...

Would there be a backdoor entrance to FENGRUSH so one could avoid the queue? Maybe a VIP entrance?

Stikato · April 2016

WTB campaign without Prox Det

bitaken · April 2016

Rylana wrote: »

bitaken wrote: »

Most of EHJ has recently homed on Azuras. It feels like how ESO is supposed to be played - you make a mistake - you die - you have to manage your resources - and not everyone can insta heal to full after a CC break.

I have seen some organized groups from AD - a couple from EP but the camp could use more EP.

The scoring system is stupid and giving EP massive points and a stranglehold on second place.

I am there for the fun the fights - and the zerg busting.

THERE IS NO NEED to break VD or PD or AOE caps here though. There are plenty of ways to manage zerg busting in this camp when you run into the 30+ AD groups.

Well when youre the only EP guild in town, vs about 60 AD and 40 DC on a given night, low pop score bonus tends to kick in.

We get zerged like nobodies business, and im not surprised other EP guilds dont want to deal with it.

yet... EP had emp this morning...

KenaPKK · April 2016

bitaken wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

bitaken wrote: »

Most of EHJ has recently homed on Azuras. It feels like how ESO is supposed to be played - you make a mistake - you die - you have to manage your resources - and not everyone can insta heal to full after a CC break.

I have seen some organized groups from AD - a couple from EP but the camp could use more EP.

The scoring system is stupid and giving EP massive points and a stranglehold on second place.

I am there for the fun the fights - and the zerg busting.

THERE IS NO NEED to break VD or PD or AOE caps here though. There are plenty of ways to manage zerg busting in this camp when you run into the 30+ AD groups.

Well when youre the only EP guild in town, vs about 60 AD and 40 DC on a given night, low pop score bonus tends to kick in.

We get zerged like nobodies business, and im not surprised other EP guilds dont want to deal with it.

yet... EP had emp this morning...

Shots!

Morbash · April 2016

Zorgon_The_Revenged wrote: »

davidtxr wrote: »

And how many people use the non cp campaign

The EU PC non-CP campaign is also quite popular, AD and EP often have a queue to enter while for some reason DC might be lucky to reach 3 bars.

I've played on it and enjoyed it, some of my alts would need a total build change to be fun to play there but some cope quite well with less resources and regen, less damage isn't a problem as I just have to "work" at killing someone a little more.

Also, the zerg trains that I have seen have been smaller and, with the changes to siege, less effective.

I have 600+ CP and I'm certainly going to spend my time there or in the non-vet campaign, CP campaigns are either full and laggy or just empty.

FENGRUSH wrote: »

If this happens - the campaign must be named FENGRUSH.

Sorry, but people saying "they are entering FENGRUSH now" would put me off.

But we must become one with our LORD!

I agree with the OP. I'd like to see a campaign without AOE caps implemented. It'd serve as a great test-bed.

Unfortunately, I haven't had the time to play in Azura's, but from what I hear, I'm liking it so far. Gonna have to wait until I can craft new gear though.

KenaPKK · April 2016

Morbash wrote: »

Zorgon_The_Revenged wrote: »

davidtxr wrote: »

And how many people use the non cp campaign

The EU PC non-CP campaign is also quite popular, AD and EP often have a queue to enter while for some reason DC might be lucky to reach 3 bars.

I've played on it and enjoyed it, some of my alts would need a total build change to be fun to play there but some cope quite well with less resources and regen, less damage isn't a problem as I just have to "work" at killing someone a little more.

Also, the zerg trains that I have seen have been smaller and, with the changes to siege, less effective.

I have 600+ CP and I'm certainly going to spend my time there or in the non-vet campaign, CP campaigns are either full and laggy or just empty.

FENGRUSH wrote: »

If this happens - the campaign must be named FENGRUSH.

Sorry, but people saying "they are entering FENGRUSH now" would put me off.

But we must become one with our LORD!

I agree with the OP. I'd like to see a campaign without AOE caps implemented. It'd serve as a great test-bed.

Unfortunately, I haven't had the time to play in Azura's, but from what I hear, I'm liking it so far. Gonna have to wait until I can craft new gear though.

Just go with what you have and make do man. You don't need a radical change in your gear to play without CP... Switch a jewelry glyph or mundus to regen and you're pretty set.

audrieltheelf · April 2016

Can we have the torch bugs and deer back?

Xsorus · April 2016

Zheg wrote: »

I'd like for all campaigns to have those things removed. As evidence of wrobel's poor foresight though, without prox det the entire meta becomes steel tornado with token healers.

WTB campaign with combat balanced by someone other than wrobel please.

That is probably true....Steel tornado would probably be the best AoE as none of the other AOEs out there put out a ton of damage without multiple people doing it.

MoreDino · April 2016

I'd take more steel tornadoes over prox det any day. At least while they're mindlessly spinning like ballerinas, they're not casting other skills.

Rylana · April 2016

bitaken wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

bitaken wrote: »

Most of EHJ has recently homed on Azuras. It feels like how ESO is supposed to be played - you make a mistake - you die - you have to manage your resources - and not everyone can insta heal to full after a CC break.

I have seen some organized groups from AD - a couple from EP but the camp could use more EP.

The scoring system is stupid and giving EP massive points and a stranglehold on second place.

I am there for the fun the fights - and the zerg busting.

THERE IS NO NEED to break VD or PD or AOE caps here though. There are plenty of ways to manage zerg busting in this camp when you run into the 30+ AD groups.

Well when youre the only EP guild in town, vs about 60 AD and 40 DC on a given night, low pop score bonus tends to kick in.

We get zerged like nobodies business, and im not surprised other EP guilds dont want to deal with it.

yet... EP had emp this morning...

Nightcapping happens, as it turns out, that s-c-r-o-t-u-m (lol, really? thats censored?) guy isnt in our guild, dunno who he is. Only time I am ever in Cyro nowadays is US primetime a few days a week. Same with the vast majority of our guild, not much night or early day presence really.

Hell we stopped pushing the ring tonight at 4/6 and went messing about with Glade for a while just because of bad zone attitudes and whatever. Then called it an hour later as the AD zergblob capped errythan.

Mostly bored, only saw the competent blues once all night and that was at Alessia Farm right after we took that keep from yellow. Looked like pretty much all of DC was nice and cozy in Faregyl.

bitaken · April 2016

C'mon Ry. We had a nice fight at Dragonclaw - not sure how many you had It looked like about 18-20? We had 14 tonight with 4 guests from a guild we are getting to know and working with on Azuras. Then we had another fight at the farm and we almost caught you at bleaks before your first run to dragon.

Anyway - hope to see you more often it was nice to see EP doing something. If you realize that AD is always going to have more than you - you can find ways to deal with it.

Rylana · April 2016

bitaken wrote: »

C'mon Ry. We had a nice fight at Dragonclaw - not sure how many you had It looked like about 18-20? We had 14 tonight with 4 guests from a guild we are getting to know and working with on Azuras. Then we had another fight at the farm and we almost caught you at bleaks before your first run to dragon.

Anyway - hope to see you more often it was nice to see EP doing something. If you realize that AD is always going to have more than you - you can find ways to deal with it.

Mmk, I actually missed most of the dragonclaw fight (i heard about it though), as my new router went through a damn firmware update mid-siege. So that was your group there? K, twice >=/

And yeh, not including disconnection city me, we had 20ish around that time.

The general story about DC on teamspeak tonight was "where are all the ones we have fought before" the vast majority of DC engagements were against guys ive never heard of, honestly. Even during the Glade messaround, just a handful of guys, only one i recognized was King Richard. Figured most of yall were holed up in Fare, even when we took Aleswell, yall never showed up.