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[OUTDATED] The Unholy Herdsman - Thelon's Pet Build
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Thelon✭✭✭✭✭
✭Why Clannfear over Familiar? I would think the pulse from the Familiar would be more DPS than the Clannfear's attacks.
@Caff32
Sara the TriSaraTops (Clannfear) is not here for DPS, but acts as the build's heal-tank. For solo play, this buff is probably the most significant of the patch. When the build is finished you'll be able to see her in action!
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Caff32✭✭✭✭Why Clannfear over Familiar? I would think the pulse from the Familiar would be more DPS than the Clannfear's attacks.
@Caff32
Sara the TriSaraTops (Clannfear) is not here for DPS, but acts as the build's heal-tank. For solo play, this buff is probably the most significant of the patch. When the build is finished you'll be able to see her in action!
Does the Clannfear have more HP/Resistances than the familiar? I honestly don't know as nothing in the tooltip indicates that it does but they are often times completely unreliable. I think I prefer the stun at the end of the pulse from the familiar since the matriarch is providing the heals; however, I haven't tried it nearly as much as you have and I really look forward to seeing the build in action!0 -
SmalltalkJava✭✭✭Why Clannfear over Familiar? I would think the pulse from the Familiar would be more DPS than the Clannfear's attacks.
@Caff32
Sara the TriSaraTops (Clannfear) is not here for DPS, but acts as the build's heal-tank. For solo play, this buff is probably the most significant of the patch. When the build is finished you'll be able to see her in action!
Does the Clannfear have more HP/Resistances than the familiar? I honestly don't know as nothing in the tooltip indicates that it does but they are often times completely unreliable. I think I prefer the stun at the end of the pulse from the familiar since the matriarch is providing the heals; however, I haven't tried it nearly as much as you have and I really look forward to seeing the build in action!
Clannfear morph has highest hp of all sorc pets. The familiar has significantly lower hp. I notice it mostly in IC where your shield is cut in half.
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Thelon✭✭✭✭✭
✭SmalltalkJava wrote: »
Clannfear morph has highest hp of all sorc pets. The familiar has significantly lower hp. I notice it mostly in IC where your shield is cut in half.
Even if you set aside any difference in HP / Resistances, the heals that the Clannfear puts out are both significant and reliable for soloing.
What more can you ask of a heal-tank
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TotterTates✭✭✭✭ErrrdaberrrdCuppincakes- Imperial Dragonknight (Tank)
- Pre-TG vMA Score: 459,636 [55:36, 0 Sigils, 0 Deaths] (Stamina)
- Post-TG vMA Score: 537,328 [53:36, 0 Sigils, 0 Deaths] (Stamina)
- Altmer Sorc (DPS)
- Dunmer Dragonknight (Healer/DPS)
- Argonian Templar (Healer)
- Khajiit Nightblade (DPS)
My Twitch Channel: TotterTanks0 -
Thelon✭✭✭✭✭
✭I’ve completed a major update for the build. It is now current to patch 2.3.7.
Changes include:
– Updated character stats screenshot
– Updated ESOHead skills and passives used
– Changed the Mundus Stone section to focus on soloing content
– Altered the Mage section of the Champion Point distribution using the updated Sorcerer Arithmagic spreadsheet by @Asayre
– Altered the Warrior section of the Champion Point distribution with an increased focus on Hardy and Elemental Defender
– Changed the Gear section to indicate Dual Wield as the recommended 2nd bar weapon
– Moved the previously recommended Magnus’ Restoration Staff from the 2nd bar weapon to the Sideboard section
– Reworked the Skills section, removing references to FLEX slots and increasing the build’s AoE potential
– Updated the Skill Replacement section to reflect my most common skill substitutions and their corresponding situations
– Added a cost-saving recommendation to the Consumables section
– Updated the Kiting is Key hint to focus on the value of Streak
– Updated the Sara the Tri-Sara-Tops hint to draw a comparison between the Clannfear and Twilight’s heal in solo situations
– Added videos to support the build’s current versionEdited by Thelon on March 25, 2016 6:53PM2 -
Rakkul✭✭✭That#s what I'm struggling to get my head round - the move away from Resto staff to dual wield for the 2nd weapon. Basically you're saying that stam weapons are better than a mag one in a magica based build?
So you're not in fact using any of the dual wield weapon abilities - just carrying round for stat purposes. I'll try it, but to me it removes some flexibility from the build in group runs if the healer is up against it.
Having a resto staff on the second bar gives the option of slotting back up heals if things go a bit pear shaped in group runs.0 -
The_Lex✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I suppose that the Clannfear's tanking and HP capability is much more preferable than slotting the Matriarch and Volatile Familiar (which, I think, has more DPS than the Tormentor).Edited by The_Lex on March 25, 2016 9:08PM0 -
Xeven✭✭✭✭✭
✭1) High Elf destroys Breton on sustain. Claiming Breton is the superior choice for sustain shows that you don't really know what you're talking about.
2) Taking Bound Aegis over Inner Light is absurd.
-Bound Aegis: 8% Max Magicka
-Inner Light: 7% Max Magicka & 10% Crit
Again, there is no explanation here other than you just don't know WTF you're doing.
Overall the build is terrible and any content cleared with a 3 toggle pet build could have been cleared faster and more efficiently with a petless build. Since were necro bumping this, we might as well be truthful about it.
Edited by Xeven on March 25, 2016 8:01PM0 -
Thelon✭✭✭✭✭
✭1) High Elf destroys Breton on sustain. Claiming Breton is the superior choice for sustain shows that you don't really know what you're talking about.
2) Taking Bound Aegis over Inner Light is absurd.
-Bound Aegis: 8% Max Magicka
-Inner Light: 7% Max Magicka & 10% Crit
Again, there is no explanation here other than you just don't know WTF you're doing.
Overall the build is terrible and any content cleared with a 3 toggle pet build could have been cleared faster and more efficiently with a petless build. Since were necro bumping this, we might as well be truthful about it.
1) Breton has magicka cost reduction which Altmer lacks, hence the sustain recommendation. The magicka cost reduction is favored over the Altmer's magicka recovery for PvE. The Breton also benefits from spell resistance, making it a slightly tankier selection, though this is a minor consideration.
2) The 10% crit you reference for Inner Light is Major Prophecy, which we receive from Spell Power potions. Hence, you actually receive more magicka by choosing Bound Aegis. You can refer to the Consumables section for more info.6 -
Thelon✭✭✭✭✭
✭The_Patriarch wrote: »I suppose that the Clannfear's tanking and HP capability is much more preferable than slotting the Matriarch and Volatile Familiar (which, I think, has more DPS than the Tormentor).
You got it! The Clannfear is your heal-tank, so its DPS is irrelevant while soloing0 -
Thelon✭✭✭✭✭
✭I've changed some fonts and formatting to improve the clarity of several sections. Thank you to those who let me know about this issue!0 -
Ghanima_Atreides✭✭✭✭✭
✭I love your build, so ingenious and versatile.
I am trying something similar with one of my own characters, although she has 0 CP, no monster sets or any of that good stuff (second account). Still, it could be fun to experiment. Also, Sara the Tri Sara Tops is the best name for a Clannfear I've read. 
[The Beauty of Tamriel] My collection of ESO screenshots
Show me a completely smooth operation and I'll show you someone who's covering mistakes. Real boats rock.0 -
The_Lex✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Ghanima_Atreides wrote: »I love your build, so ingenious and versatile. I am trying something similar with one of my own characters, although she has 0 CP, no monster sets or any of that good stuff (second account). Still, it could be fun to experiment. Also, Sara the Tri Sara Tops is the best name for a Clannfear I've read.
I don't have the helms yet either. It would be interesting if these dungeons could be soloed without them - at least on normal.Edited by The_Lex on March 26, 2016 2:13PM0 -
Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭The_Patriarch wrote: »Ghanima_Atreides wrote: »I love your build, so ingenious and versatile. I am trying something similar with one of my own characters, although she has 0 CP, no monster sets or any of that good stuff (second account). Still, it could be fun to experiment. Also, Sara the Tri Sara Tops is the best name for a Clannfear I've read.
I don't have the helms yet either. It would be interesting if these dungeons could be soloed without them - at least on normal.
Yes they can be, not necessary to have helms1 -
Thelon✭✭✭✭✭
✭So I hit 501 CP today (finally) and did some more testing on the CP distribution. Turns out I messed up some of the values in the Sorcerer Arithmagic spreadsheet and it gave me an unideal distribution.
I’ve updated the Champion Point section accordingly.0 -
TARAFRAKA✭✭✭✭✭2 manned vet CoH, Way rest and darkshade with my twilight today. Can confirm she's a beast.0
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Krycek89✭✭✭1) High Elf destroys Breton on sustain. Claiming Breton is the superior choice for sustain shows that you don't really know what you're talking about.
2) Taking Bound Aegis over Inner Light is absurd.
-Bound Aegis: 8% Max Magicka
-Inner Light: 7% Max Magicka & 10% Crit
Again, there is no explanation here other than you just don't know WTF you're doing.
Overall the build is terrible and any content cleared with a 3 toggle pet build could have been cleared faster and more efficiently with a petless build. Since were necro bumping this, we might as well be truthful about it.
1) Breton has magicka cost reduction which Altmer lacks, hence the sustain recommendation. The magicka cost reduction is favored over the Altmer's magicka recovery for PvE. The Breton also benefits from spell resistance, making it a slightly tankier selection, though this is a minor consideration.
2) The 10% crit you reference for Inner Light is Major Prophecy, which we receive from Spell Power potions. Hence, you actually receive more magicka by choosing Bound Aegis. You can refer to the Consumables section for more info.
ahahhahha the greatest slap down i have ever witnessed; i salute you good sir.
"Again, there is no explanation here other than you just don't know WTF you're doing."
^^ that comment added with your casual reply, i am in stitches- i take it @Xeven wont be showing his face again3 -
Rakkul✭✭✭1) High Elf destroys Breton on sustain. Claiming Breton is the superior choice for sustain shows that you don't really know what you're talking about.
2) Taking Bound Aegis over Inner Light is absurd.
-Bound Aegis: 8% Max Magicka
-Inner Light: 7% Max Magicka & 10% Crit
Again, there is no explanation here other than you just don't know WTF you're doing.
Overall the build is terrible and any content cleared with a 3 toggle pet build could have been cleared faster and more efficiently with a petless build. Since were necro bumping this, we might as well be truthful about it.
1) Breton has magicka cost reduction which Altmer lacks, hence the sustain recommendation. The magicka cost reduction is favored over the Altmer's magicka recovery for PvE. The Breton also benefits from spell resistance, making it a slightly tankier selection, though this is a minor consideration.
2) The 10% crit you reference for Inner Light is Major Prophecy, which we receive from Spell Power potions. Hence, you actually receive more magicka by choosing Bound Aegis. You can refer to the Consumables section for more info.
ahahhahha the greatest slap down i have ever witnessed; i salute you good sir.
"Again, there is no explanation here other than you just don't know WTF you're doing."
^^ that comment added with your casual reply, i am in stitches- i take it @Xeven wont be showing his face again
It was a ridiculous post criticizing Thelon in the first place. By all means put alternatives forward and discuss these, but throwing in personal attacks just drops the post into the troll bucket.
Despite the original post, Thelon did himself credit by replying in a constructive and helpful manner.
I've followed this build (previous one) for a while and found it to be really good. I'll be swapping things to the update version and see how we go.3 -
Xeven✭✭✭✭✭
✭1) "3%" cost reduction is never actually 3%, while 9% regen is actually always much more than 9%. Breton Sorc never beats High Elf Sorc on sustain (or anything else for that matter), it doesnt matter if it's PvE or PvP. We can do the math if you like, but it's already been done many times.
2) You are a Sorc, you are a shield tank. Shields do not receive any resistances, so that little bit of Spell Resistance does not benefit you whatsoever. The trait is almost useless for a Magicka Sorc. Not only that, but the alternative is 4% elemental damage (Overload, Crushing Shock, Streak etc.) in a game where all end game PvE content is a DPS race (vMSA).
3) Inner light can be used on only one bar, Bound Armor cannot.
4) Inner light does not require 100% potion uptime for 10% crit.
5) There is an opportunity cost associated with using crit potions, aside from the need to keep them active fulltime. You could be using that potion buff slot for other useful things, like unstoppable, health, or stamina.
6) Potions cost you a global cooldown, AKA one less ability every 45 seconds.
7) Pets do not benefit from spell damage, they're dumb as rocks, they do s*** damage, and they do not CC break.
The build is absolute garbage. I'm sorry if it offends people, but that is the reality of it. Pets are trash and they always will be.
Edited by Xeven on March 28, 2016 6:41AM1 -
Rakkul✭✭✭1) "3%" cost reduction is never actually 3%, while 9% regen is actually always much more than 9%. Breton Sorc never beats High Elf Sorc on sustain (or anything else for that matter), it doesnt matter if it's PvE or PvP. We can do the math if you like, but it's already been done many times.
2) You are a Sorc, you are a shield tank. Shields do not receive any resistances, so that little bit of Spell Resistance does not benefit you whatsoever. The trait is almost useless for a Magicka Sorc. Not only that, but the alternative is 4% elemental damage (Overload, Crushing Shock, Streak etc.) in a game where all end game PvE content is a DPS race (vMSA).
3) Inner light can be used on only one bar, Bound Armor cannot.
4) Inner light does not require 100% potion uptime for 10% crit.
5) There is an opportunity cost associated with using crit potions, aside from the need to keep them active fulltime. You could be using that potion buff slot for other useful things, like unstoppable, health, or stamina.
6) Potions cost you a global cooldown, AKA one less ability every 45 seconds.
7) Pets do not benefit from spell damage, they're dumb as rocks, they do s*** damage, and they do not CC break.
The build is absolute garbage. I'm sorry if it offends people, but that is the reality of it. Pets are trash and they always will be.
It would be better if, instead of this 100% negativity, you would post your build recommendations and possibly some videos of this in action. Players could then try both options and select their preferred play style.
I know, helping the player base is a bit old school - but try it. You'll find that people respect your opinions a whole lot more.Edited by Rakkul on March 28, 2016 7:13AM4 -
Thelon✭✭✭✭✭
✭@Xeven
I was going to respond to each of your points (again) but then I noticed your usual negative rhetoricThe build is absolute garbage. I'm sorry if it offends people, but that is the reality of it. Pets are trash and they always will be.
So instead, I will refer you back to the underbelly of the bridge from whence you came. If another troll has already taken up residence therein, send me a pm and I'll solo it for you9 -
SmalltalkJava✭✭✭When it comes to pets related posts it is best to just ignore Xeven. He doesn't like them and has posted numerous times his opinion on them.0
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Waffennacht✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭All I know is content that I couldn't beat without pets, I beat with pets. Therefore logically, pets make me better.3 -
TARAFRAKA✭✭✭✭✭
Yep, that's exactly what I did Thelon. Doubt we'd have done it without that burst heal. The heals were critting for damn near 14k and it's extremely low cost with champ points.
I am humbled in thy presence, my lord.
Edited by TARAFRAKA on March 29, 2016 6:04AM0 -
TARAFRAKA✭✭✭✭✭
And after watching your run in CoA I was inspired. So we 2 manned that too last night in under an hour, minus the talking and strategy/pep talks lol. Can confirm, skoria is a d**k lol.0 -
TARAFRAKA✭✭✭✭✭@Thelon
Also, how's this for my bar setup. This is hindsight but I want to make sure it's optimal as we plan to be 2 manning several times a week in the future.
Bar one: nirnhoned fire staff/precise fire staff depending on situation
Crushing shock
C frag (used only when procced)
Empowered ward (for the pets)
V. Familiar
Twilight (morphed to heal)
Bar two: Precise rest staff
Mage wrath (switched out for my root when needed)
Liquid lightning
Same
Same
Overload Bar
Mage wrath
L. Lightning
E. Ward
Same
Same
I'd love to slot Radiant mage light on my bars for the magicka but I haven't been able to confirm if having it slotted on only one bar makes it active regardless. I don't think it does and since I'm on console, info is limited, as always. I'd appreciate any feedback. I didn't copy your build, kinda made it my own with what my style is but I'd appreciate any suggestions!
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dpencil✭✭✭✭The passives to Inner Light are only active when you have the bar it is on active.
As a side note, I have been running Twilight Matriarch in pvp lately, and it has been very helpful. She puts a little extra pressure on enemies, hardly ever gets focused down, is useful for healing both myself and others around me, and having it on every bar guarantees I always have an oh crap button for when my shield gets bursted down.1
