Please change Rally

Elder_Night · March 2016

The burst heal from rally stifles build creativity in pvp for many stamina players as it's too important to pass up. If you want to play a stamina Nightblade with dual wield and bow for example, you are pretty much stuck relying on vigor as your only healing ability. Some abilities like mark target will heal you when you get a kill, but this does nothing in a sustained fight with someone in pvp.

I have seen others suggest moving rally, or rather the healing part of it, to a new skill for the fighters guild and I think this is a good idea.

If you have any other ideas to help broaden build diversity so that everyone and their dog isn't running around with a 2h just for rally, or disagree with this, then please do so constructively. Thanks!

Silver_Strider · March 2016

I'd be all for moving Rally into the Fighter's Guild.
It really sucks that stamina builds are more or less forced to run 2h just because there is only 2 stamina based heals in the game.

CtrlAltDlt · March 2016

100 % agreed. Move it to fighters guild.

GrumpyDuckling · March 2016

How about also taking a long hard look at how weapons perform, in general? The combination of Wrecking Blow and Rally in the 2H tree gives you the following:

Major Brutality
Heal over time
Knockback
Stun
Empower

That's a lot to get from only 2 skills. Now look at the bow. It has access to only 1 of the 5 things listed above (knockback), and that's on a skill, Scatter Shot, that has a 10 meter range. I'd love to use the bow, but I'm so underpowered if I do so.

altemriel · March 2016

Elder_Night wrote: »

The burst heal from rally stifles build creativity in pvp for many stamina players as it's too important to pass up. If you want to play a stamina Nightblade with dual wield and bow for example, you are pretty much stuck relying on vigor as your only healing ability. Some abilities like mark target will heal you when you get a kill, but this does nothing in a sustained fight with someone in pvp.

I have seen others suggest moving rally, or rather the healing part of it, to a new skill for the fighters guild and I think this is a good idea.

If you have any other ideas to help broaden build diversity so that everyone and their dog isn't running around with a 2h just for rally, or disagree with this, then please do so constructively. Thanks!

I am totally for this inovation! my first char is 2H/bow, but my NB is DW/bow and I can not heal so good yet..

and make stealth to be a stamina morph!

Forestd16b14_ESO · March 2016

Well let's see the other options for stamina users. Duel wield yes proven to be good in the right hands....... ok not really their chooses because of spin-to-win but never a less other options being the bow. Kinda got hit hard with the nerf gun cause of the snipe issue and has yet to fully recovered and lastly Sword and shield. SnS ......... do I really need to explain why no one uses this skill line ?

So as you can see it's not cause rally is a very very very good stamina heal but the fact two handed skill line is one of the 2 valid weapon lines for stamina DPS users. But seeing how this issue with rally and vigor is never gonna end cause magicka users want all form of stamina to be nerfed to uselessness I guess rally should be moved to fighters guild or something but the skill in the two handed line has to be replaced with something else then.

dodgehopper_ESO · March 2016

altemriel wrote: »

Elder_Night wrote: »

The burst heal from rally stifles build creativity in pvp for many stamina players as it's too important to pass up. If you want to play a stamina Nightblade with dual wield and bow for example, you are pretty much stuck relying on vigor as your only healing ability. Some abilities like mark target will heal you when you get a kill, but this does nothing in a sustained fight with someone in pvp.

I have seen others suggest moving rally, or rather the healing part of it, to a new skill for the fighters guild and I think this is a good idea.

If you have any other ideas to help broaden build diversity so that everyone and their dog isn't running around with a 2h just for rally, or disagree with this, then please do so constructively. Thanks!

I am totally for this inovation! my first char is 2H/bow, but my NB is DW/bow and I can not heal so good yet..

and make stealth to be a stamina morph!

I would love a stealth stamina skill line in dark brotherhood (Or better yet Thieves guild). I think cloak should remain magicka based for nightblades.

Lyrebon · March 2016

Rally's heal isn't all that good and won't save you in a direct fight if you end up having to 1v1 someone. The priority in that situation is to damage your opponent as much as you can before he kills you. Of course, if you have Vigor then use that but I find Rally is only useful for the Brutality.

Elder_Night · March 2016

Lyrebon wrote: »

Rally's heal isn't all that good and won't save you in a direct fight if you end up having to 1v1 someone. The priority in that situation is to damage your opponent as much as you can before he kills you. Of course, if you have Vigor then use that but I find Rally is only useful for the Brutality.

It gives a large burst heal after it has been running for a while. If that isn't useful and can't save your ass then I don't know what is lol.

Dirty_Digs · March 2016

I totally agree that rally sets the game out of balance. Duel wield lack the same easy heal, blood craze being the healing option for that line. Blood craze is cheap and effective but an attack must be made and it can be cleansed off rather easy by most builds. Also, blood craze usually only returns a fraction of what rally does.

My duel wield stam sorc is in poor shape with the change to critical surge that prevents dot or channel heals as rapid strikes/critical surge combo was my best and pretty much only way to heal without crushing my stats. I find it extremely hard to fight 2h players since the animation cancelling actually makes that massive sword FASTER than duel wield, rather odd. Before they removed sparks I could dance around a 2h player and stab them to death, lol, not anymore a 2h macro combo is too easy, too fast, and too powerful.

I would suggest to remove rally altogether. Brawler has a shield attached as well as a bleed, Every ability in the 2h line has too much, either that or every line in the duel wield is too little. I would accept the instant crush capabilities the 2h has over the duel wield if they removed all the stam buffs and heals that also allows 2h to have better stat management. ALL classes have other healing options and do not need rally, unless they are lazy and not creative. Not to mention it just looks stupid when players run around sticking that sword in the air.

Also, I can easily roll all 5 2h abilities on one bar and be just fine, lacking some class abilities but able to fight. Try that with all 5 duel wield abilities and the results are not good, especially if you run into a 2h player

.

mb10 · March 2016

"oh yeah just throw it in fighrers guild thats the solution. Come on ZOS listen to your fans!"

Haha have ANY of you stopped to look at the Fighters Guild abilities?

Do any of you realise the Fighter's Guild main objective atm in Tamriel is to fight against Daedra? Hence all the abilities being Daedra related?

Silver_Strider · March 2016

mb10 wrote: »

"oh yeah just throw it in fighrers guild thats the solution. Come on ZOS listen to your fans!"

Haha have ANY of you stopped to look at the Fighters Guild abilities?

Do any of you realise the Fighter's Guild main objective atm in Tamriel is to fight against Daedra? Hence all the abilities being Daedra related?

Regardless of the Fighter's Guild's main objective, them having a neutral fighting skill wouldn't be lore breaking and the only other skill line that could suit Rally being in would be Assault and people already complain enough about having to do PvP to unlock Vigor that putting the 2nd stamina based heal there as well would just *** people off more.

Strider_Roshin · March 2016

What a dumb suggestion. How about this, instead of messing with one of the two stamina heals in the game we add another one instead. A burst heal that everyone can access. How does that sound.

ub17_ESO · March 2016

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

What a dumb suggestion. How about this, instead of messing with one of the two stamina heals in the game we add another one instead. A burst heal that everyone can access. How does that sound.

Sounds a lot like vigor to me...Yay problem solved!!

GreenSoup2HoT · March 2016

I've seen this suggested mulitple time's. I agree. Give 2H that spinning AoE IC sweepers have in the sewer's and were good to go to switch Rally over to fighters guild. Carve/Brawler is a cone aoe so it should be fine to have another aoe. Something to compete with steel tornado would be great.

vontariel · March 2016

Dirty_Digs wrote: »

I totally agree that rally sets the game out of balance. Duel wield lack the same easy heal, blood craze being the healing option for that line. Blood craze is cheap and effective but an attack must be made and it can be cleansed off rather easy by most builds. Also, blood craze usually only returns a fraction of what rally does.

My duel wield stam sorc is in poor shape with the change to critical surge that prevents dot or channel heals as rapid strikes/critical surge combo was my best and pretty much only way to heal without crushing my stats. I find it extremely hard to fight 2h players since the animation cancelling actually makes that massive sword FASTER than duel wield, rather odd. Before they removed sparks I could dance around a 2h player and stab them to death, lol, not anymore a 2h macro combo is too easy, too fast, and too powerful.

I would suggest to remove rally altogether. Brawler has a shield attached as well as a bleed, Every ability in the 2h line has too much, either that or every line in the duel wield is too little. I would accept the instant crush capabilities the 2h has over the duel wield if they removed all the stam buffs and heals that also allows 2h to have better stat management. ALL classes have other healing options and do not need rally, unless they are lazy and not creative. Not to mention it just looks stupid when players run around sticking that sword in the air.

Also, I can easily roll all 5 2h abilities on one bar and be just fine, lacking some class abilities but able to fight. Try that with all 5 duel wield abilities and the results are not good, especially if you run into a 2h player .

It's not like that the 2h is OP, because it isn't. It's still behind point what magicka builds can perfom.
It's that DW is much weaker, and bow is in terrible state ATM.

Even moving rally to FG, while it would help Bow and DW, would not close the gap:

2h offers ATM all that melee user needs. You can run full bar on 2h slot, and every ability will be useful and valid both for PvE and PvP;
Gap closer, buffs, heals, shields, CC, heavy hitter and execute, all in one tree. 2h is in fact perfect example how weapon skills SHOULD look like. And except maybe brawler/carve all skills are currently best/great for slot for stamina user.
Charge skill with good/GREAT damage and optional cc?
Heavy hitter with cc and empower?
Finisher which also buffs other skills?
HoT which buffs damage?

Perfect inside tree synergy which should be example HOW weapon tree should look like.

ADarklore · March 2016

ub17_ESO wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

What a dumb suggestion. How about this, instead of messing with one of the two stamina heals in the game we add another one instead. A burst heal that everyone can access. How does that sound.

Sounds a lot like vigor to me...Yay problem solved!!

And for those who do NOT PvP? What's our option?!? It's nice to throw out a comment, another to actually think it through so that it would be easily available to everyone across the board like Rally is. Forcing players to play content they don't enjoy just to get a skill so they can play content they do enjoy is just downright ridiculous.

Strider_Roshin · March 2016

ADarklore wrote: »

ub17_ESO wrote: »

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

What a dumb suggestion. How about this, instead of messing with one of the two stamina heals in the game we add another one instead. A burst heal that everyone can access. How does that sound.

Sounds a lot like vigor to me...Yay problem solved!!

And for those who do NOT PvP? What's our option?!? It's nice to throw out a comment, another to actually think it through so that it would be easily available to everyone across the board like Rally is. Forcing players to play content they don't enjoy just to get a skill so they can play content they do enjoy is just downright ridiculous.

Then that's on you. It's stupid easy to get vigor now. At least you're not a PvPer that's forced to do undaunted pledges forever in order to get the undaunted mettle.

ADarklore · March 2016

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

Then that's on you. It's stupid easy to get vigor now. At least you're not a PvPer that's forced to do undaunted pledges forever in order to get the undaunted mettle.

Well that's on you.... most players don't use the Undaunted Mettle anyway.

altemriel · March 2016

it is a bit sad that vigor is obtainable only by pvp, so I when I mostly play pve will take long to obtain it. but nevermind, pvp obtainable skills are pvp, pve are pve. on pvp i mostly hate that thing, that I am riding 5 minutes to be ganked or killed by zerg in 2 seconds - 2 minutes....

Bdawwg · March 2016

Vigor has been reduced to 88k AP now that's almost a few hours of pvp, if you don't like pvp then join a big group and spam heals. Easy vigor.

LorDrek · March 2016

Vigor is crap heal 1 dot max 3-4k heal in VMA crap archer hit 7-8k. Lol stamana builds need more.

Xvorg · March 2016

Strider_Roshin wrote: »

What a dumb suggestion. How about this, instead of messing with one of the two stamina heals in the game we add another one instead. A burst heal that everyone can access. How does that sound.

WTB Stamina based GDB

Tanks will love it

milesrodneymcneely2_ESO · March 2016

CtrlAltDlt wrote: »

100 % agreed. Move it to fighters guild.

/signed
/thensignedagain
/andsignedsomemore

Seriously, ZOS.

DO. IT.

mrromeo187 · March 2016

Don't touch my Rally Please.....

Elder_Night · March 2016

mrromeo187 wrote: »

Don't touch my Rally Please.....

It needs to be touched

Autolycus · March 2016

Silver_Strider wrote: »

mb10 wrote: »

"oh yeah just throw it in fighrers guild thats the solution. Come on ZOS listen to your fans!"

Haha have ANY of you stopped to look at the Fighters Guild abilities?

Do any of you realise the Fighter's Guild main objective atm in Tamriel is to fight against Daedra? Hence all the abilities being Daedra related?

Regardless of the Fighter's Guild's main objective, them having a neutral fighting skill wouldn't be lore breaking and the only other skill line that could suit Rally being in would be Assault and people already complain enough about having to do PvP to unlock Vigor that putting the 2nd stamina based heal there as well would just *** people off more.

Well since Trapping Webs got nerfed so hard in the TG, it's clearly only the second-best option for all dps rotations atm. Lol

On a more serious note, they could easily replace this skill with rally and put something else in 2H (like a whirlwind ability, or a DoT).