DjKahun wrote: »

No just no! Why would anyone put 100 in Magician? Are you mad? Max 20 in magician rest in Arcanist

On low regen builds Magician is actually better than Arcanist, especially if you have other means of getting magicka back (rune focus, engine guardian, potions, ...). But for high regen builds you're right, then Arcanist will become much better.

lolo_01b16_ESO wrote: »

DjKahun wrote: »

No just no! Why would anyone put 100 in Magician? Are you mad? Max 20 in magician rest in Arcanist

On low regen builds Magician is actually better than Arcanist, especially if you have other means of getting magicka back (rune focus, engine guardian, potions, ...). But for high regen builds you're right, then Arcanist will become much better.

I'm a low magicka regen build myself at 1.4k the reason I don't go more than 20 Magician is because after 20 you only get 0.1% which is not a lot so would be better off putting it into the recovery but thats my personal opinion from my experience :P I suppose both are good but I personally prefer the recovery over spell reduction.

Sorry it didn't help bro.

A lot of the info about how these work and what is missing by just reading the tooltip is useful to all magicka players so I disagree with you about what to title my own thread lol.

If u know what the cps actually do and their relative value to each other this can be applied to any build my aim was more to help with this than tell people here you just put these points there.

If what we are going for is casting the most amount of spells without running out of magicka, which I do, then yes magician should be better. Other classes will be able to animation cancel instant cast spells actually a lot more than Templar because we have so many channels.

The thing to consider here is how much magicka am I spending on spells on average every 2 seconds. If this number x .16 is greater than your regen without arcanist x .25 then yes magician is better for you.

For example let us take an elitist high elf. If he likes to kite a lot and try and los and run through ppls wrecking blows to cancel them and doesn't ac maybe he spends 3k average on spells each 2 sec. He has 2100 base regen.
3000 x .16 = 480
2100 x .25 = 550
Arcanist is slightly better

Take the same character played differently this one spams shields in people's faces while animation canceling them for lols and spitting out mines etc. this player spends 5k every 2 sec on average

5000 x .16 = 800
2100 x .25 = 550

Arcanist is very simple, consistent and clean to see its effectiveness. For magician's effectiveness u need to know exactly how u are playing in PvP in terms of magicka use. My guess is magician is under-rated for this reason.

Some of the extreme difference in sustain for me (22% more for the same number of cps invested in magicka sustain) is indeed due to the fact that rune and engine are not affected by arcanist.

We can account for this however by discovering the regen values of these and seeing how this regen would be affected by arcanist. If I am casting one spell a second engine procs once every 10 seconds (10% proc rate). It cannot proc again while it is active meaning it will proc on average every 16.5 seconds for 6.5 seconds, 39.3% of the time. But it is magicka only 1/3 of this time aka 13.1%

Engines tooltip is 1204 every .5 second. This is 4816 magicka recovery while engine is active. 4816 x .131 = 631 effective magicka regen from engine.

This is in a vacuum, engine most often does not hit for the full 6.5 seconds in PvP. It is interrupted, killed, or runs off while I am kiting about 2/3s of the time. I don't want to muddle this with guesswork however.

Rune is simple provides 480 regen.

So I have 1111 effective magicka regen not affected by arcanist. 1111x.25= 277 more mag regen arcanist would give me if the only way I got back magicka was regen. That plus the 280 it gives me on my actual 1100 regen is about 560

Ok but remember I was saying if the only thing I was casting in PvP was spamming puncturing sweeps ( a very low cost skill i can spam infinitely btw, so this is low balling it ) the effective regen from 100 magician was 720

Arcanist 560 magician 720

Even in this scenario where we are possibly overvaluing arcanist ( due to potentially giving engine guardian more credit than it is due ) and low balling magician, it still out performs.

I wish arcanist was better so that I could justify going for wind running, but it is not, it appears you need very high base regen or to be casting very few spells or getting them free casted somehow for arcanist to be better.