In the spirit of competition

Slayyer-AUS · February 2016

I am making this post regarding competitive raiding guilds who are streaming their boss kills in veteran Maw of Lorkhaj. First and foremost I mean no disrespect with my criticism of these guilds streaming their strategies, but I feel it is not in the spirit of competition to be doing this. The best part of challenging new content is figuring out mechanics and coming up with super secret strats. By streaming this content you are making a statement that says, "we don't value the spirit of competition." I understand everyone is excited, we have been starved of challenging group content for a year and a half. However, you are ruining the fun for other competitive guilds. You can set up a private stream for Zeninax if that is your reason. Otherwise, I don't understand your intentions by doing this. For the love of competitive raiding, I sincerely hope that nobody ruins the last boss kill by steaming or posting it on YouTube. You are not the only ones putting hours of your time into this raid. If your reasoning is that you want to "help people", then that is just arrogant. So please, for the time being and out of respect for your fellow competitive raiders, please no more streaming, videos, or guides. That stuff totally kills the competition.

hydrocynus · February 2016

Much like when White Gold Tower and Imperial City Prison were on PTS I imagine the difficulty of that trial will only be realised once it goes to the live server.

The shock and horror of the inhibitor on day 1 after the cake walk in PTS is enough to ensure that i wont put much faith in those tactics being used now as being effective once the DLC goes live.

Necrelios · February 2016

I see it as them helping other players learn the new content. The more players who learn the new content, the larger the pool of players available to compete against. I don't see anything stopping others from developing some secret strategy if that's their edge.

Unless you find a group that's not open to trying new things, but I doubt your going to pug competitively and I see these videos mostly helping pugs. You know how it is, some people are there to compete, but others just come for chance at some of the rewards. As someone who falls into the later category, I appreciate the videos and streams just to help get through the content since it will avoid a lot frustration for whatever group is unfortunate enough to acquire my dubious talents.

Slayyer-AUS · February 2016

Many of us enjoy new content because we like to figure out the mechanics our self. The people who figured this out and streaming or posting you tube videos are wrecking it for everyone who has been waiting over a year for this type of content. Yes i can just not watch the stream but it doesn't stop people coming into our raid saying "no guys this is how it is meant to be done".

Duiwel · February 2016

Actually OP the era of "I know how to do something let me keep it to myself" which in itself is a selfish and very shallow outlook on literally everything in life, is out of fashion.

We live in an era now where information is power, free and helping others especially people who struggle is generally understood as a given.

The amount of "secrets" I have given to people in terms of tips in this game alone have made many people better players and actually kept some of them in this game, instead of leaving.

IF you want to learn something today you don't need to spend $1000's or whatever currency you use, you can go on the internet and search a few websites for DIY tips or watch a few Youtube videos for free.

The positive side to this is people who require the assistance can get said help.

The negative is : it annoys you unfortunately.

Keep in mind : "You" don't need to watch them, just pretend they aren't there and then you will still have the immersion of doing it on your own ( I myself am also like this I like struggling and figuiring things out, although I also go and search videos for certain things, we all do that ).

IF you are serious about your post you need to apply that mindset to everything in life and then reflect back on whether or not you have ever read, searched or watched a tutorial online or in a magazine/book...

So OP just to clarify again: I am exactly like you and I personally also enjoy doing things my own way ( sometimes that's the right way, sometimes we wipe ), but that's how you learn and try new methods until you discover the actual "trick". HOWEVER I do fully support the mindset of today to help people and make this information available. If you don't want to see it, don't watch their Youtube videos or steams. I never do either of those 2 and I am perfectly ill-informed of any tactics for the new content

Edited because I wrote : "Actually OP the ear of..."

Islyn · February 2016

Slayyer-AUS wrote: »

I am making this post regarding competitive raiding guilds who are streaming their boss kills in veteran Maw of Lorkhaj. First and foremost I mean no disrespect with my criticism of these guilds streaming their strategies, but I feel it is not in the spirit of competition to be doing this. The best part of challenging new content is figuring out mechanics and coming up with super secret strats. By streaming this content you are making a statement that says, "we don't value the spirit of competition." I understand everyone is excited, we have been starved of challenging group content for a year and a half. However, you are ruining the fun for other competitive guilds. You can set up a private stream for Zeninax if that is your reason. Otherwise, I don't understand your intentions by doing this. For the love of competitive raiding, I sincerely hope that nobody ruins the last boss kill by steaming or posting it on YouTube. You are not the only ones putting hours of your time into this raid. If your reasoning is that you want to "help people", then that is just arrogant. So please, for the time being and out of respect for your fellow competitive raiders, please no more streaming, videos, or guides. That stuff totally kills the competition.

Yeah totally. Back in the day, the main guilds had agreements with one another to keep an embargo on any new strat videos until people started completing. We'd post a screenie of complete but no vids till the agreed point.

Slayyer-AUS · February 2016

Duiwel wrote: »

Actually OP the era of "I know how to do something let me keep it to myself" which in itself is a selfish and very shallow outlook on literally everything in life, is out of fashion.

We live in an era now where information is power, free and helping others especially people who struggle is generally understood as a given.

The amount of "secrets" I have given to people in terms of tips in this game alone have made many people better players and actually kept some of them in this game, instead of leaving.

IF you want to learn something today you don't need to spend $1000's or whatever currency you use, you can go on the internet and search a few websites for DIY tips or watch a few Youtube videos for free.

The positive side to this is people who require the assistance can get said help.

The negative is : it annoys you unfortunately.

Keep in mind : "You" don't need to watch them, just pretend they aren't there and then you will still have the immersion of doing it on your own ( I myself am also like this I like struggling and figuiring things out, although I also go and search videos for certain things, we all do that ).

IF you are serious about your post you need to apply that mindset to everything in life and then reflect back on whether or not you have ever read, searched or watched a tutorial online or in a magazine/book...

So OP just to clarify again: I am exactly like you and I personally also enjoy doing things my own way ( sometimes that's the right way, sometimes we wipe ), but that's how you learn and try new methods until you discover the actual "trick". HOWEVER I do fully support the mindset of today to help people and make this information available. If you don't want to see it, don't watch their Youtube videos or steams. I never do either of those 2 and I am perfectly ill-informed of any tactics for the new content

Edited because I wrote : "Actually OP the ear of..."

you obviously don't know anything about being competitive. I was in one of the guilds that first cleared sanctum and other guilds hated on our gm for posting a video of our serpant kill so what has changed now? Islyn obviously knows what i am talking about and im sure the guilds streaming there first boss kill in pts know what im talking about as well...like ffs the content isn't even live yet and they are ruining it for people.

Islyn · February 2016

It's NOT to hide anything from people - it's to avoid spoiling it for people by POSTING LINKS TO VIDS ON THE GAME'S MAIN COMMUNICATION NETWORK.

People want a chance to figure out their own strats etc - and posting all this just has no point. I mean let it get to Live at least.

This is one of my top 5 reasons why new Trials should be 'locked' in the PTS till they hit live.

Zorrashi · February 2016

If they want to be "competitive" by figuring out the strategy themselves, then they can simply avoid/not watch the video.
If they don't want to be "competitive" by referencing guides/vids to help them then go ahead and let them. It should be of little concern to you, I would think.

There is nothing wrong with people referencing videos and guides, so I see no reason to discourage it.

Slayyer-AUS · February 2016

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/135009/deviance-second-in-world-to-down-serpent-with-best-time-yet

This thread is what im talking about.

asneakybanana · February 2016

My point of streaming is so that the community can see the content and experience with us as we experience the challenges so that the people who may not be able to form a group who can conquer even the first boss on vet no less the second and eventually the third can give their feedback. As a plus during the streams the devs are there engaging with the community and taking notes so they can fix things based on our feedback. As others have said if you don't want to use watch my stream and see the strats we are using that's more than fine and I respect you for coming up with your own tactics but the benefit that the community gets both from seeing the new content as well as help with how to kill them far outweighs the "spirit of competition". Also this is the pts which stands for public TEST SERVER so its meant for testing and giving feedback so who gives a damn whether you get world first or not. Best of luck with your progress CSH