Thieves Guild Zone - Smaller Than Other Zones?

Publius_Scipio · February 2016

I haven't played the PTS and I was told last night that the Thieves Guild zone is a good deal smaller than other zones (at least smaller than Wrothgar). Can any of you speak to this? I think Wrothgar is the best zone in ESO to date and would hate for future DLCs to at least not meet the bar that was set. If the physical zone itself is indeed smaller, is the DLC at least packed with content?

WalkingLegacy · February 2016

But now there will be heists and thieving missions all over Tamerial so it is bigger than Wrothgar!

DaveMoeDee · February 2016

I don't think they need to force the issue on gratuitous zone size. Size does not necessarily mean content.

Toxic_Hemlock · February 2016

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

I don't think they need to force the issue on gratuitous zone size. Size does not necessarily mean content.

So what you are saying is size doesn't matter?

sorry couldn't resist

Publius_Scipio · February 2016

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

I don't think they need to force the issue on gratuitous zone size. Size does not necessarily mean content.

Well, I won't say no to a nice large zone in a fantasy game. But as I asked above, is it packed with content? From the short videos I have seen, ZOS seems to have succeeded and taken what they did and learned with Wrothgar and produced another zone that is just designed, populated, feels more natural and more "Elder Scrolls" than the zones ESO launched with.

WalkingLegacy · February 2016

Toxic_Hemlock wrote: »

DaveMoeDee wrote: »

I don't think they need to force the issue on gratuitous zone size. Size does not necessarily mean content.

So what you are saying is size doesn't matter?

sorry couldn't resist

No, she still won't come back to you...

TX12001rwb17_ESO · February 2016

Its far less then half wrothgars size, maybe 35% at the least but the city within it is one of the biggest in the game, but the zone itself is tiny like not much larger then the starter islands.

Publius_Scipio · February 2016

WalkingLegacy wrote: »

But now there will be heists and thieving missions all over Tamerial so it is bigger than Wrothgar!

Will these heists be something that is solo and instanced? Or are heists something that a group can participate in, and different players within the group have to perform different tasks in order for the overall heist to succeed?

Publius_Scipio · February 2016

TX12001rwb17_ESO wrote: »

Its far less then half wrothgars size, maybe 35% at the least but the city within it is one of the biggest in the game, but the zone itself is tiny like not much larger then the starter islands.

Interesting. Are the dungeons/delves themselves larger and more intricate versus previous ones (at least on the same levels as the ones from Wrothgar)?

WalkingLegacy · February 2016

Publius_Scipio wrote: »

WalkingLegacy wrote: »

But now there will be heists and thieving missions all over Tamerial so it is bigger than Wrothgar!

Will these heists be something that is solo and instanced? Or are heists something that a group can participate in, and different players within the group have to perform different tasks in order for the overall heist to succeed?

They are instanced and pretty sure they're solo. After all, what's an MMO without mostly solo content.

Dalsinthus · February 2016

Any sense of how many skyshards you can find in the smaller zone?

Publius_Scipio · February 2016

WalkingLegacy wrote: »

Publius_Scipio wrote: »

WalkingLegacy wrote: »

But now there will be heists and thieving missions all over Tamerial so it is bigger than Wrothgar!

Will these heists be something that is solo and instanced? Or are heists something that a group can participate in, and different players within the group have to perform different tasks in order for the overall heist to succeed?

They are instanced and pretty sure they're solo. After all, what's an MMO without mostly solo content.

O well. The idea of heists needing group members to perform different tasks at the same time sounds cool. As long as it wouldn't impede Thieves Guild zone storyline and become another Craglorn.

Lysette · February 2016

I wonder how these tasks which lead into other territories all over Tamriel will turn out, when you play it before you are level 50. Will you have access to regions, which you would otherwise have no access to before you get up to level 50?

Faulgor · February 2016

Yes, Hew's Bane is maybe 1/3 the size of Wrothgar. On the upside, it hast the largest city in any Elder Scrolls game to date (outside of procedurally generated cities in Daggerfall (?) and possibly the Imperial City)
Personally, I'd rather have small and dense handcrafted environments than larger and barren ones. Hew's Bane absolutely hits the mark in this regard.

Also, there's a reason the DLC is much cheaper (2000 crowns) than Orsinium (3000 crowns).

Reorx_Holybeard · February 2016

Dalsinthus wrote: »

Any sense of how many skyshards you can find in the smaller zone?

There are 6 Skyshards in the current version.

Lokryn · February 2016

To be fair, Orsinium is 3k crowns while TG will just be 2k.

bedlom · February 2016

Tbh I am shocked at how small it is and how little effort went into it, I suspect it didn't even take much time or thought to make this dlc.

I just hope its a one off but since the real eso visionaries dnt work for ZOS anymore, I worry it wont be.

Abeille · February 2016

It is really tiny. Tiny to the point where it has only 2 delves and 2 group bosses.

The city is big, though. And I really like the city. I've been running around it for a while, looking all over the place for returning characters, with no luck.

Taternater · February 2016

The new dlc targets mostly players who enjoy stealth gameplay, which is not everyone at all. Orsinium however probably had a much larger target audience. That might explain why The Thieves Guild dlc is smaller than Orsinium is.

Enodoc · February 2016

Consider that this is a new Guild with attached content, rather than a full new zone. The new zone is about 1/3 the size of a normal zone, which explains why it only has 2 delves, 2 group bosses and 6 skyshards. Hew's Bane exists to flesh out the world of the Thieves Guild, unlike Wrothgar which was designed as a new story zone.

Wizzo91 · February 2016

They could of gotten a lot more out of it. Considering that the zone is not part of an alliance they could of implemented crossfaction gameplay in the zone. This includes Trading, Chatting, Etc. ZoS would of generated an (un)official trading and community hub in ESO. Something I've been missing since release.

This would actually keep the DLC alive for a long time and not turn it into a ghost town after most people completed all the quests. Replayability is extremely important. That's what they also missed out on in IC without objectives and meaningful contributions to the alliance war.

Mojmir · February 2016

I would describe the size as quaint, yet modest. I think its meant to be merely a hub for questing only since it takes you across tamriel. thieves are not known for showing off there hideouts.

BlackEar · February 2016

bedlom wrote: »

Tbh I am shocked at how small it is and how little effort went into it, I suspect it didn't even take much time or thought to make this dlc.

I just hope its a one off but since the real eso visionaries dnt work for ZOS anymore, I worry it wont be.

So all you care about is the size of the zone and not the content and new aspects they introduce?

THAT is being visionless.

Mashille · February 2016

There is a ton of questing content with Daily's and repeatables with the Outlaws refuges across all Tamriel as well, I like the small zone, very compact and it looks absolutely amazing.

Faasnu · February 2016

I like how small it is, just as I like Bleakrock Isle or Bal Foyen. I think this DLC costs much less than Orsinium, too, so everything is fine in my opinion.

Enodoc wrote: »

Consider that this is a new Guild with attached content, rather than a full new zone. The new zone is about 1/3 the size of a normal zone, which explains why it only has 2 delves, 2 group bosses and 6 skyshards. Hew's Bane exists to flesh out the world of the Thieves Guild, unlike Wrothgar which was designed as a new story zone.

Exactly.

JD2013 · February 2016

I see Hew's Bane as more of a hub for the Thieves Guild than an actual zone. I think that's what it intends to be.

The Gold Coast of Cyrodiil with the Dark Brotherhood may be the same, but bigger as its going to include Anvil and Kvatch, but I can see the Dark Brotherhood containing more story.

I bet that the Q3 and Q4 DLC's, whatever they may be, at least one of them will be rather larger and story orientated as we do have a big new story coming, hinted at in the Wrothgar main story . . .

BabeestorGor · February 2016

Publius_Scipio wrote: »

WalkingLegacy wrote: »

Publius_Scipio wrote: »

WalkingLegacy wrote: »

But now there will be heists and thieving missions all over Tamerial so it is bigger than Wrothgar!

Will these heists be something that is solo and instanced? Or are heists something that a group can participate in, and different players within the group have to perform different tasks in order for the overall heist to succeed?

They are instanced and pretty sure they're solo. After all, what's an MMO without mostly solo content.

O well. The idea of heists needing group members to perform different tasks at the same time sounds cool. As long as it wouldn't impede Thieves Guild zone storyline and become another Craglorn.

It was mentioned on ESO Live ( at about 55:17) that heists would be instanced and could be done by a group. From the sound of what they said you'd all need to be pretty stealthy or else you'd end up making it harder rather than easier.

deleted008293 · February 2016

Hew's Bane looks awesome. As a zone I think its just a little bigger than Khenarthi's Roost and about 1/3 of Wrothgar.
2 Delves (solo). Both with awesome design.
2 World bosses (group). Nice surrounding and mechanics.
1 Trial. Awesome. Situated in Reaper's March.
1 Giant City.
1 Giant Ruin south of Abah's Landing. Looks great. Lots of towers... lots of buildings... walls... you have to see it!
Also 1 small city near Eastmarch, that you can access during the Thieves Guild Questline. Perhaps other quest specific areas, not to put those from repetitive quests. Another zone I loved a lot.

Abah's Landing is just... HUGE. I can't say how big but similar to Orsinium if not bigger. You can trespass lots of buildings and there are some widely open spaces too. There are hundreds of NPCs at least. You just have to see it first.

Downside... this zone is one of the most demanding I ever seen! I've got around 50% less fps both in the city and in the surroundings. Also overall the performance was bad on PTS.
Questing... didn't got too far but... as soon as I landed in Abah's Landed it feel strange. Biggest City to date and not a single quest giver??? It feels empty even with all these characters around.

Mr.Hmm · February 2016

Enodoc wrote: »

Consider that this is a new Guild with attached content, rather than a full new zone. The new zone is about 1/3 the size of a normal zone, which explains why it only has 2 delves, 2 group bosses and 6 skyshards. Hew's Bane exists to flesh out the world of the Thieves Guild, unlike Wrothgar which was designed as a new story zone.

What he said.

Wrothgar was a whole new story zone.

Hew's Bane is just a small zone to flesh out Thieves Guild and I believe they will do the same for Dark Brotherhood.

TX12001rwb17_ESO · February 2016

Mr.Hmm wrote: »

Enodoc wrote: »

Consider that this is a new Guild with attached content, rather than a full new zone. The new zone is about 1/3 the size of a normal zone, which explains why it only has 2 delves, 2 group bosses and 6 skyshards. Hew's Bane exists to flesh out the world of the Thieves Guild, unlike Wrothgar which was designed as a new story zone.

What he said.

Wrothgar was a whole new story zone.

Hew's Bane is just a small zone to flesh out Thieves Guild and I believe they will do the same for Dark Brotherhood.

The Dark Brotherhood is taking place on the Gold Coast of Cyrodiil which consists of both Anvil and Kvatch, it would be pretty damn big considering, personally I believe after what I have seen Zenimax is probably going to take the Small DLC then Big DLC then small DLC then Big DLC route. so after the DB we will probably get the clockwork city which will most likely be a smaller zone like what the Imperial City is.

Publius_Scipio · February 2016

So it sounds like that they kept the zone smaller but increased the size of the city. Not a problem if the city is designed well and is fun to be in.

Wizzo91 wrote: »

They could of gotten a lot more out of it. Considering that the zone is not part of an alliance they could of implemented crossfaction gameplay in the zone. This includes Trading, Chatting, Etc. ZoS would of generated an (un)official trading and community hub in ESO. Something I've been missing since release.

This would actually keep the DLC alive for a long time and not turn it into a ghost town after most people completed all the quests. Replayability is extremely important. That's what they also missed out on in IC without objectives and meaningful contributions to the alliance war.

That would have been cool if alliance neutral lands would be cross-faction (with pvp turned off I would think).