SirDopey wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Komma wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Finally well' have more skilled healers around and not just templars even other classes will be able to do the healers now
(i've not tested my DK yet but since the "healing fist" has been buffed i believe it can easily crit above 15k in pts)

how does nerfing templars make other healers better? hrm?

It's quite simple my friend, finally OTHER CLASSES will be considered as good as templars, right now if you are not a templar healer ( mainly due to BOL that makes every templar a good healer) it will take days to join a group and no one except guildies want you.

Well, if this was the point of the "nerf" then why not just delete the entire restoration tree?? I'm so sick of reading "this is fair because now other classes will be as good". I'm sorry, BUT OTHER CLASSES DO NOT HAVE AN ENTIRE TREE DEDICATED TO HEALING.

Other classes should NOT be as good, FULL STOP.

If that is, indeed what the community wants, then get rid of the freaking tree all together and give templars something else to make them a unique class....

From the nach potes

DK

Sea of Flames (Inferno morph):
This morph has been renamed to Cauterize, and will now summon an Aura of Cauterizing Flames, launching a fireball at an ally to heal them instead of an enemy to damage them.
Magma Shell (Magma Armor morph):
This morph no longer grants a synergy to allies for a powerful damage shield; instead, it automatically applies the damage shield on nearby allies when the ability is used.
Obsidian Shield:
Igneous Shield's increased damage shield effect is now a baseline effect for Obsidian Shield.
Note: The Igneous Shield morph will continue to grant you the Major Mending buff as a morph effect.
Obsidian Shard (Stonefist morph):
Increased the healing from this morph by 16%.

NB

Bolstering Darkness (Consuming Darkness morph):
Increased the healing from the Hidden Refresh synergy from this morph by 20%.
Refreshing Path (Path of Darkness morph):
Reduced the time this morph continues to heal yourself and allies to 2 seconds after leaving the path, down from 3 seconds.
Funnel Health (Strife morph):
Reduced the application of the heal over time to you and one additional friendly target, previously two friendly targets.
Soul Siphon (Soul Shred morph):
This morph now heals and applies the Major Vitality buff to yourself as well as your allies.

SORC

Summon Twilight Matriarch (Summon Winged Twilight morph):
This pet’s special ability will now cause it to heal itself and up to 2 friendly targets for 20% of your maximum Magicka.
Unstable Clannfear (Unstable Familiar morph):
This pet’s special ability will now heal you and the Clannfear for 35% of your maximum Health

I call this re-balancing classes in order to get similar healing output.
ALL THE CLASSES have something dedicated to healing STOP thinking templars as the only healers of the game, only because you have an ultimate dedicated to healing (and if i'm not wrong no one use it anymore).
Nerfing BOL ( with the consequential buff of other classes as seen above) was the right thing to do,FULL STOP.

The more I read the notes and feedback from the PTS. I think the reality of the situation is DPS will suffer the most.

Tanks have survivability and often an emergency/backup heal in their pocket via skill selection. Most of the DPS cats i've met in this game through group-finder just focus 100% on damage and expect the healer to save them.

With the reduction of ease to heal multiple people standing inside of the Red areas (that people KNOW they should back out of but don't expecting healer to save their ass) we're going to have a lot of "git gud" complaints.

Just an idle thought...

If their intent is to homogenize all the classes into being self sufficient, then could we get a rework of our healing line? I cannot see the point in having a complete line dedicated to healing others when more often than not we only need the one skill to keep ourselves alive. Maybe then we could get some mobility or shields that are sorely lacking on the templar.

Seeing as all classes can use the restoration line, that is better at healing than our restoring light line is IMO, then why not just remove that line and give us better options.

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/245710/would-you-be-happy-if-bol-is-a-battle-spirit-buff-for-pvp-only#latest

check out my poll on my thought of BoL and how it should end up

Talyena wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

SirDopey wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Komma wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Finally well' have more skilled healers around and not just templars even other classes will be able to do the healers now
(i've not tested my DK yet but since the "healing fist" has been buffed i believe it can easily crit above 15k in pts)

how does nerfing templars make other healers better? hrm?

It's quite simple my friend, finally OTHER CLASSES will be considered as good as templars, right now if you are not a templar healer ( mainly due to BOL that makes every templar a good healer) it will take days to join a group and no one except guildies want you.

Well, if this was the point of the "nerf" then why not just delete the entire restoration tree?? I'm so sick of reading "this is fair because now other classes will be as good". I'm sorry, BUT OTHER CLASSES DO NOT HAVE AN ENTIRE TREE DEDICATED TO HEALING.

Other classes should NOT be as good, FULL STOP.

If that is, indeed what the community wants, then get rid of the freaking tree all together and give templars something else to make them a unique class....

From the nach potes

DK

Sea of Flames (Inferno morph):
This morph has been renamed to Cauterize, and will now summon an Aura of Cauterizing Flames, launching a fireball at an ally to heal them instead of an enemy to damage them.
Magma Shell (Magma Armor morph):
This morph no longer grants a synergy to allies for a powerful damage shield; instead, it automatically applies the damage shield on nearby allies when the ability is used.
Obsidian Shield:
Igneous Shield's increased damage shield effect is now a baseline effect for Obsidian Shield.
Note: The Igneous Shield morph will continue to grant you the Major Mending buff as a morph effect.
Obsidian Shard (Stonefist morph):
Increased the healing from this morph by 16%.

NB

Bolstering Darkness (Consuming Darkness morph):
Increased the healing from the Hidden Refresh synergy from this morph by 20%.
Refreshing Path (Path of Darkness morph):
Reduced the time this morph continues to heal yourself and allies to 2 seconds after leaving the path, down from 3 seconds.
Funnel Health (Strife morph):
Reduced the application of the heal over time to you and one additional friendly target, previously two friendly targets.
Soul Siphon (Soul Shred morph):
This morph now heals and applies the Major Vitality buff to yourself as well as your allies.

SORC

Summon Twilight Matriarch (Summon Winged Twilight morph):
This pet’s special ability will now cause it to heal itself and up to 2 friendly targets for 20% of your maximum Magicka.
Unstable Clannfear (Unstable Familiar morph):
This pet’s special ability will now heal you and the Clannfear for 35% of your maximum Health

I call this re-balancing classes in order to get similar healing output.
ALL THE CLASSES have something dedicated to healing STOP thinking templars as the only healers of the game, only because you have an ultimate dedicated to healing (and if i'm not wrong no one use it anymore).
Nerfing BOL ( with the consequential buff of other classes as seen above) was the right thing to do,FULL STOP.

So where is the re-balancing to get similar stealthing abilities? Similar tanking abilities? Similar magic DPS output? Similar physical DPS output? The fact is, each class does something better than the other classes, why should healing be any different? Why should the one class with an entire line dedicated to healing not be the best class for healing? The only way to have balanced classes in an MMO would be to do away with classes. Those whining for balance are just that, whiners.

Well that's hilarious the only thing i've been whining is to make magika DK's viable again in pvp... I was just giving my opinion in the CATASTROPHIC thread title but it seems that the whiners are just the templars who want to remain the ONLY GOOD choice for a 4 man group.

The fact that you are claiming that evry class is different and special BUT everything except healing (magika templar tanks are awesome like NB and Sorcerers, DK have only the root; like dps some classes are a little bit better ) in this game is quite balanced within the classes, is the proof that the only thing left was healing.

Bad English i hope is readable...

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Talyena wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

SirDopey wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Komma wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Finally well' have more skilled healers around and not just templars even other classes will be able to do the healers now
(i've not tested my DK yet but since the "healing fist" has been buffed i believe it can easily crit above 15k in pts)

how does nerfing templars make other healers better? hrm?

It's quite simple my friend, finally OTHER CLASSES will be considered as good as templars, right now if you are not a templar healer ( mainly due to BOL that makes every templar a good healer) it will take days to join a group and no one except guildies want you.

Well, if this was the point of the "nerf" then why not just delete the entire restoration tree?? I'm so sick of reading "this is fair because now other classes will be as good". I'm sorry, BUT OTHER CLASSES DO NOT HAVE AN ENTIRE TREE DEDICATED TO HEALING.

Other classes should NOT be as good, FULL STOP.

If that is, indeed what the community wants, then get rid of the freaking tree all together and give templars something else to make them a unique class....

From the nach potes

DK

Sea of Flames (Inferno morph):
This morph has been renamed to Cauterize, and will now summon an Aura of Cauterizing Flames, launching a fireball at an ally to heal them instead of an enemy to damage them.
Magma Shell (Magma Armor morph):
This morph no longer grants a synergy to allies for a powerful damage shield; instead, it automatically applies the damage shield on nearby allies when the ability is used.
Obsidian Shield:
Igneous Shield's increased damage shield effect is now a baseline effect for Obsidian Shield.
Note: The Igneous Shield morph will continue to grant you the Major Mending buff as a morph effect.
Obsidian Shard (Stonefist morph):
Increased the healing from this morph by 16%.

NB

Bolstering Darkness (Consuming Darkness morph):
Increased the healing from the Hidden Refresh synergy from this morph by 20%.
Refreshing Path (Path of Darkness morph):
Reduced the time this morph continues to heal yourself and allies to 2 seconds after leaving the path, down from 3 seconds.
Funnel Health (Strife morph):
Reduced the application of the heal over time to you and one additional friendly target, previously two friendly targets.
Soul Siphon (Soul Shred morph):
This morph now heals and applies the Major Vitality buff to yourself as well as your allies.

SORC

Summon Twilight Matriarch (Summon Winged Twilight morph):
This pet’s special ability will now cause it to heal itself and up to 2 friendly targets for 20% of your maximum Magicka.
Unstable Clannfear (Unstable Familiar morph):
This pet’s special ability will now heal you and the Clannfear for 35% of your maximum Health

I call this re-balancing classes in order to get similar healing output.
ALL THE CLASSES have something dedicated to healing STOP thinking templars as the only healers of the game, only because you have an ultimate dedicated to healing (and if i'm not wrong no one use it anymore).
Nerfing BOL ( with the consequential buff of other classes as seen above) was the right thing to do,FULL STOP.

So where is the re-balancing to get similar stealthing abilities? Similar tanking abilities? Similar magic DPS output? Similar physical DPS output? The fact is, each class does something better than the other classes, why should healing be any different? Why should the one class with an entire line dedicated to healing not be the best class for healing? The only way to have balanced classes in an MMO would be to do away with classes. Those whining for balance are just that, whiners.

Well that's hilarious the only thing i've been whining is to make magika DK's viable again in pvp... I was just giving my opinion in the CATASTROPHIC thread title but it seems that the whiners are just the templars who want to remain the ONLY GOOD choice for a 4 man group.

The fact that you are claiming that evry class is different and special BUT everything except healing (magika templar tanks are awesome like NB and Sorcerers, DK have only the root; like dps some classes are a little bit better ) in this game is quite balanced within the classes, is the proof that the only thing left was healing.

Bad English i hope is readable...

most templars i know have no problem with bol healing being nerfed, the point is the lack of compensation, temps are the stepchild in dps regardles of magica or stam, BoL is the most expensive spell of all classes a 25% healing reduction MUST go hand in hand with a 25% cost reduction.
simultaniously they intent to screw templar mana manegement by forcing them to stick into the tiniest ground effect of all classes WTF !!! you call this balancing? this is bending temps over for their proper filling and nothing else.

PVP Combat Medic MagNB build's time to shine.

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Talyena wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

SirDopey wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Komma wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Finally well' have more skilled healers around and not just templars even other classes will be able to do the healers now
(i've not tested my DK yet but since the "healing fist" has been buffed i believe it can easily crit above 15k in pts)

how does nerfing templars make other healers better? hrm?

It's quite simple my friend, finally OTHER CLASSES will be considered as good as templars, right now if you are not a templar healer ( mainly due to BOL that makes every templar a good healer) it will take days to join a group and no one except guildies want you.

Well, if this was the point of the "nerf" then why not just delete the entire restoration tree?? I'm so sick of reading "this is fair because now other classes will be as good". I'm sorry, BUT OTHER CLASSES DO NOT HAVE AN ENTIRE TREE DEDICATED TO HEALING.

Other classes should NOT be as good, FULL STOP.

If that is, indeed what the community wants, then get rid of the freaking tree all together and give templars something else to make them a unique class....

From the nach potes

DK

Sea of Flames (Inferno morph):
This morph has been renamed to Cauterize, and will now summon an Aura of Cauterizing Flames, launching a fireball at an ally to heal them instead of an enemy to damage them.
Magma Shell (Magma Armor morph):
This morph no longer grants a synergy to allies for a powerful damage shield; instead, it automatically applies the damage shield on nearby allies when the ability is used.
Obsidian Shield:
Igneous Shield's increased damage shield effect is now a baseline effect for Obsidian Shield.
Note: The Igneous Shield morph will continue to grant you the Major Mending buff as a morph effect.
Obsidian Shard (Stonefist morph):
Increased the healing from this morph by 16%.

NB

Bolstering Darkness (Consuming Darkness morph):
Increased the healing from the Hidden Refresh synergy from this morph by 20%.
Refreshing Path (Path of Darkness morph):
Reduced the time this morph continues to heal yourself and allies to 2 seconds after leaving the path, down from 3 seconds.
Funnel Health (Strife morph):
Reduced the application of the heal over time to you and one additional friendly target, previously two friendly targets.
Soul Siphon (Soul Shred morph):
This morph now heals and applies the Major Vitality buff to yourself as well as your allies.

SORC

Summon Twilight Matriarch (Summon Winged Twilight morph):
This pet’s special ability will now cause it to heal itself and up to 2 friendly targets for 20% of your maximum Magicka.
Unstable Clannfear (Unstable Familiar morph):
This pet’s special ability will now heal you and the Clannfear for 35% of your maximum Health

I call this re-balancing classes in order to get similar healing output.
ALL THE CLASSES have something dedicated to healing STOP thinking templars as the only healers of the game, only because you have an ultimate dedicated to healing (and if i'm not wrong no one use it anymore).
Nerfing BOL ( with the consequential buff of other classes as seen above) was the right thing to do,FULL STOP.

So where is the re-balancing to get similar stealthing abilities? Similar tanking abilities? Similar magic DPS output? Similar physical DPS output? The fact is, each class does something better than the other classes, why should healing be any different? Why should the one class with an entire line dedicated to healing not be the best class for healing? The only way to have balanced classes in an MMO would be to do away with classes. Those whining for balance are just that, whiners.

Well that's hilarious the only thing i've been whining is to make magika DK's viable again in pvp... I was just giving my opinion in the CATASTROPHIC thread title but it seems that the whiners are just the templars who want to remain the ONLY GOOD choice for a 4 man group.

The fact that you are claiming that evry class is different and special BUT everything except healing (magika templar tanks are awesome like NB and Sorcerers, DK have only the root; like dps some classes are a little bit better ) in this game is quite balanced within the classes, is the proof that the only thing left was healing.

Bad English i hope is readable...

Which class is the best tank? The best magic DPS? The best stamina DPS? I'm sure a class popped up first in most people's mind. Why should all classes be perfectly balanced when it comes to healing? Templars stand out in healing. Sure, they CAN do good DPS and they CAN tank, but on that same note, other classes CAN heal. Why should templars have an entire line dedicated to healing but not heal any better than classes that have one healing spell?

If healing is to be balanced, then templars need their healing line removed and replaced with something useful. They shouldn't need an entire line only to heal as well or just marginally better than other classes.

Yeah after 20 months on a Templar you would have to be stupid to heal. Sorcs and dks will be able to heal better and be more survivable.

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Talyena wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Talyena wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

SirDopey wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Komma wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Finally well' have more skilled healers around and not just templars even other classes will be able to do the healers now
(i've not tested my DK yet but since the "healing fist" has been buffed i believe it can easily crit above 15k in pts)

how does nerfing templars make other healers better? hrm?

It's quite simple my friend, finally OTHER CLASSES will be considered as good as templars, right now if you are not a templar healer ( mainly due to BOL that makes every templar a good healer) it will take days to join a group and no one except guildies want you.

Well, if this was the point of the "nerf" then why not just delete the entire restoration tree?? I'm so sick of reading "this is fair because now other classes will be as good". I'm sorry, BUT OTHER CLASSES DO NOT HAVE AN ENTIRE TREE DEDICATED TO HEALING.

Other classes should NOT be as good, FULL STOP.

If that is, indeed what the community wants, then get rid of the freaking tree all together and give templars something else to make them a unique class....

From the nach potes

DK

Sea of Flames (Inferno morph):
This morph has been renamed to Cauterize, and will now summon an Aura of Cauterizing Flames, launching a fireball at an ally to heal them instead of an enemy to damage them.
Magma Shell (Magma Armor morph):
This morph no longer grants a synergy to allies for a powerful damage shield; instead, it automatically applies the damage shield on nearby allies when the ability is used.
Obsidian Shield:
Igneous Shield's increased damage shield effect is now a baseline effect for Obsidian Shield.
Note: The Igneous Shield morph will continue to grant you the Major Mending buff as a morph effect.
Obsidian Shard (Stonefist morph):
Increased the healing from this morph by 16%.

NB

Bolstering Darkness (Consuming Darkness morph):
Increased the healing from the Hidden Refresh synergy from this morph by 20%.
Refreshing Path (Path of Darkness morph):
Reduced the time this morph continues to heal yourself and allies to 2 seconds after leaving the path, down from 3 seconds.
Funnel Health (Strife morph):
Reduced the application of the heal over time to you and one additional friendly target, previously two friendly targets.
Soul Siphon (Soul Shred morph):
This morph now heals and applies the Major Vitality buff to yourself as well as your allies.

SORC

Summon Twilight Matriarch (Summon Winged Twilight morph):
This pet’s special ability will now cause it to heal itself and up to 2 friendly targets for 20% of your maximum Magicka.
Unstable Clannfear (Unstable Familiar morph):
This pet’s special ability will now heal you and the Clannfear for 35% of your maximum Health

I call this re-balancing classes in order to get similar healing output.
ALL THE CLASSES have something dedicated to healing STOP thinking templars as the only healers of the game, only because you have an ultimate dedicated to healing (and if i'm not wrong no one use it anymore).
Nerfing BOL ( with the consequential buff of other classes as seen above) was the right thing to do,FULL STOP.

So where is the re-balancing to get similar stealthing abilities? Similar tanking abilities? Similar magic DPS output? Similar physical DPS output? The fact is, each class does something better than the other classes, why should healing be any different? Why should the one class with an entire line dedicated to healing not be the best class for healing? The only way to have balanced classes in an MMO would be to do away with classes. Those whining for balance are just that, whiners.

Well that's hilarious the only thing i've been whining is to make magika DK's viable again in pvp... I was just giving my opinion in the CATASTROPHIC thread title but it seems that the whiners are just the templars who want to remain the ONLY GOOD choice for a 4 man group.

The fact that you are claiming that evry class is different and special BUT everything except healing (magika templar tanks are awesome like NB and Sorcerers, DK have only the root; like dps some classes are a little bit better ) in this game is quite balanced within the classes, is the proof that the only thing left was healing.

Bad English i hope is readable...

Which class is the best tank? The best magic DPS? The best stamina DPS? I'm sure a class popped up first in most people's mind. Why should all classes be perfectly balanced when it comes to healing? Templars stand out in healing. Sure, they CAN do good DPS and they CAN tank, but on that same note, other classes CAN heal. Why should templars have an entire line dedicated to healing but not heal any better than classes that have one healing spell?

If healing is to be balanced, then templars need their healing line removed and replaced with something useful. They shouldn't need an entire line only to heal as well or just marginally better than other classes.

Have you ever done a 3 dps run with 1 templar magika tank that tanks and also heal the whole group thanks to BOL spam? no other class can do that... and if you ask me it is a little OP.

The real problem that i see with BOL is that everyone (dd's and tanks) are too much used to it and anything else except templars are just not welcome, because, if a DK healer or a NB healer join the group then they (dd's and tanks) need to start to think at how avoid a little more damage or the big red circles, they need to stay close to the healer and a lot of other stuff.

I am one of those in favour of buffs because nerfs don’t help the game, but the Zenimax had already the hammer so why not use it?

And if you ask me the BOL nerf it was made ONLY to make the new content more difficult (or at least is this what i'm starting to think) the re- balance is a way to hide all the group content difficulty stealth buff.

If they were to reduce the cost of BoL by 25% to make up for the 25% loss in healing or if they made the second heal hit as hard of the first heal I'd be more than fine with the change. The problem I have is with people saying other classes with one heal spell should be able to heal as well as a class with an entire line built around healing. Not every class will do everything as well as every other class. The fact is, I think a lot of templars are overreacting and I also think a lot of other classes will be disappointed that the nerfs aren't having the desired effect and will continue to call for more.

Mostly I'm disappointed that the devs listened to the whiners just because they have big Twitch channels and decided to nerf a class those guys don't play while giving abilities like steel tornado a reduced range but increased damage and not even touching wrecking blow (which does everything but heal the user).

Reposting because it is relevant.



Temps having a skill line dedicated to healing yes, but it is mostly baked in utility. All that says is that potentially, a templar healer did not necessarily have to rely on a resto staff.

Flexibility, i know crazy right?

The problem with alot of people in this game is they want to shoe horn each class into a specific role and call it a day. Its obvious the devs do not want this now and never have.

DKs have mitigation skills that can also be achieved through s/b, undaunted and armor skills

Templars have healing and utility that can also be achieved through resto staff, and undaunted (for the exception of stam regen, unique perks that each class brings?! how insane!)

DK healers have igneous plus BoR (amazing that they specifically dont need combat prayer since they have mountains blessing passive right?). Major mending tied to igneous is a very intentional utility and finally a support ultimate that is much easier to use and benefits multiple players.

NB funnel health nerfed down to one target? same nerf as BoL, interesting is it not? Refreshing path is receiving a very nice buff in potency and now NBs have access to major mending. Couple that with one of the best group mitigation ultimates in the game and the unique ability to deal damage and provide good healing at the same time (unique perks that each class brings?! how insane!)

Look, at the end of the day the blame lies squarely on ZOS. They facilitated for the longest time a group environment that suggested templars should be the only real healers based purely on balance oversight and lack of communication to less informed players that may see templar and go "hey this class has a skill line that is focused on healing that means they must be the healers in this mmo!". What festered was a mindest that players with a templar healer could mostly play like jack asses ie. not worry about stacking or a slightly less emphasis on syngerizing while being showered with BoL via ESOs not so glorious smart cast heals.

The notion became things like "why bother coordinating and whatnot when templars can just do their thing while i do mine". You know something is wrong when a group gets annoyed (unfortunately rightfully so in the games current state) when you go in as a NB healer for example and say something along the lines of "hey guys, make sure to stay close more often than not for trash pulls so sap essence gets you covered" or "do not forget to activate bone shield and Orb if you need mana". Players want to put in the least effort possible and nerfing BoL and funnel health and giving major mending to resto staff users universally is an obvious step in a direction that this game desperately needs, interactive hands on healing as opposed to passive healing. BoL, funnel health and ward ally all share a similar application and that is not a coincidence.

Templars are not "The healing class" of ESO and i promise you that you will see more changes going forward that will put most classes in line for the role.

On a small side note, the most recent and most satisfying group experience i had was when doing vWGT the other day with a nightblade healer and our group all acknowledged the unique strengths of the NB healer and played to them as a whole.

Here's a suggestion to help make the restoring light skill tree more interesting since it seems ZOS doesn't want the class to be the premium healer but with a whole tree focused on that one task. How about, we change rune focus to work like the nightblade's manifestation of terror skill does now on pts?

When the templar places the focus another is cast where the templar is looking, could be 20m away or something like that. However, if the templar is standing in one focus they could activate a synergy and go to the other rune, likely with some delay back and forth but make it an alternative move type to make using the class interesting.

Iove wrote: »

exeeter702 wrote: »

Reposting because it is relevant.



Temps having a skill line dedicated to healing yes, but it is mostly baked in utility. All that says is that potentially, a templar healer did not necessarily have to rely on a resto staff.

Flexibility, i know crazy right?

The problem with alot of people in this game is they want to shoe horn each class into a specific role and call it a day. Its obvious the devs do not want this now and never have.

DKs have mitigation skills that can also be achieved through s/b, undaunted and armor skills

Templars have healing and utility that can also be achieved through resto staff, and undaunted (for the exception of stam regen, unique perks that each class brings?! how insane!)

DK healers have igneous plus BoR (amazing that they specifically dont need combat prayer since they have mountains blessing passive right?). Major mending tied to igneous is a very intentional utility and finally a support ultimate that is much easier to use and benefits multiple players.

NB funnel health nerfed down to one target? same nerf as BoL, interesting is it not? Refreshing path is receiving a very nice buff in potency and now NBs have access to major mending. Couple that with one of the best group mitigation ultimates in the game and the unique ability to deal damage and provide good healing at the same time (unique perks that each class brings?! how insane!)

Look, at the end of the day the blame lies squarely on ZOS. They facilitated for the longest time a group environment that suggested templars should be the only real healers based purely on balance oversight and lack of communication to less informed players that may see templar and go "hey this class has a skill line that is focused on healing that means they must be the healers in this mmo!". What festered was a mindest that players with a templar healer could mostly play like jack asses ie. not worry about stacking or a slightly less emphasis on syngerizing while being showered with BoL via ESOs not so glorious smart cast heals.

The notion became things like "why bother coordinating and whatnot when templars can just do their thing while i do mine". You know something is wrong when a group gets annoyed (unfortunately rightfully so in the games current state) when you go in as a NB healer for example and say something along the lines of "hey guys, make sure to stay close more often than not for trash pulls so sap essence gets you covered" or "do not forget to activate bone shield and Orb if you need mana". Players want to put in the least effort possible and nerfing BoL and funnel health and giving major mending to resto staff users universally is an obvious step in a direction that this game desperately needs, interactive hands on healing as opposed to passive healing. BoL, funnel health and ward ally all share a similar application and that is not a coincidence.

Templars are not "The healing class" of ESO and i promise you that you will see more changes going forward that will put most classes in line for the role.

On a small side note, the most recent and most satisfying group experience i had was when doing vWGT the other day with a nightblade healer and our group all acknowledged the unique strengths of the NB healer and played to them as a whole.

What?

Ok let me break it down for you.

Resto skill line skills:

1. A heal that does nothing else
2. A heal that is situational
3. An aura than most classes have anyway.
4. A heal over time/cleanse.
5. Small armor buff thingy that you have to stand in.
6. An effing heal. That no one uses. A WASTED ULTIMATE.
7. Healing passives!

Tell me another class that has a skill line with 4 heals in it?

Now tell me more how Templars should not be the best healers, with things as they stand.

HOWEVER, IF
If they remove the healing skill line and replace it with a mix of skills, damage, support, group shields, mobility and a new ultimate, then Templars won't be the healing class and I won't be angry!

was my post not clear? you seem to have this difficulty understanding that simply because you have a skill line dedicated to healing that does not make you the defacto healer in this game. Seeing as there are only 4 base classes here that would be absurd. This game is not designed that way, and as i have mentioned ZOS kind of messed and its obvious they are moving in the direction of templars not being the primary healer in this game, and rightfully so.

If they really wanted templars to be the end all healers without question then they would have went full on with Restoring light skill line and omitted a restoration staff weapon from the game entirely.

You do not need to break down anything and its evident you really didnt even read my post past the first sentence. Restoring light is absolutely a dedicated skill line for healing, no one in their right mind would argue that. Also worth noting is that there are a large amount of templar healers that dont even use resto staff when properly geared.

ZOS does not want a rigid linear class make up tied to the trinity, if you cant understand and accept that then i dont know what else to say.

Iove wrote: »

exeeter702 wrote: »

Iove wrote: »

exeeter702 wrote: »

Reposting because it is relevant.



Temps having a skill line dedicated to healing yes, but it is mostly baked in utility. All that says is that potentially, a templar healer did not necessarily have to rely on a resto staff.

Flexibility, i know crazy right?

The problem with alot of people in this game is they want to shoe horn each class into a specific role and call it a day. Its obvious the devs do not want this now and never have.

DKs have mitigation skills that can also be achieved through s/b, undaunted and armor skills

Templars have healing and utility that can also be achieved through resto staff, and undaunted (for the exception of stam regen, unique perks that each class brings?! how insane!)

DK healers have igneous plus BoR (amazing that they specifically dont need combat prayer since they have mountains blessing passive right?). Major mending tied to igneous is a very intentional utility and finally a support ultimate that is much easier to use and benefits multiple players.

NB funnel health nerfed down to one target? same nerf as BoL, interesting is it not? Refreshing path is receiving a very nice buff in potency and now NBs have access to major mending. Couple that with one of the best group mitigation ultimates in the game and the unique ability to deal damage and provide good healing at the same time (unique perks that each class brings?! how insane!)

Look, at the end of the day the blame lies squarely on ZOS. They facilitated for the longest time a group environment that suggested templars should be the only real healers based purely on balance oversight and lack of communication to less informed players that may see templar and go "hey this class has a skill line that is focused on healing that means they must be the healers in this mmo!". What festered was a mindest that players with a templar healer could mostly play like jack asses ie. not worry about stacking or a slightly less emphasis on syngerizing while being showered with BoL via ESOs not so glorious smart cast heals.

The notion became things like "why bother coordinating and whatnot when templars can just do their thing while i do mine". You know something is wrong when a group gets annoyed (unfortunately rightfully so in the games current state) when you go in as a NB healer for example and say something along the lines of "hey guys, make sure to stay close more often than not for trash pulls so sap essence gets you covered" or "do not forget to activate bone shield and Orb if you need mana". Players want to put in the least effort possible and nerfing BoL and funnel health and giving major mending to resto staff users universally is an obvious step in a direction that this game desperately needs, interactive hands on healing as opposed to passive healing. BoL, funnel health and ward ally all share a similar application and that is not a coincidence.

Templars are not "The healing class" of ESO and i promise you that you will see more changes going forward that will put most classes in line for the role.

On a small side note, the most recent and most satisfying group experience i had was when doing vWGT the other day with a nightblade healer and our group all acknowledged the unique strengths of the NB healer and played to them as a whole.

What?

Ok let me break it down for you.

Resto skill line skills:

1. A heal that does nothing else
2. A heal that is situational
3. An aura than most classes have anyway.
4. A heal over time/cleanse.
5. Small armor buff thingy that you have to stand in.
6. An effing heal. That no one uses. A WASTED ULTIMATE.
7. Healing passives!

Tell me another class that has a skill line with 4 heals in it?

Now tell me more how Templars should not be the best healers, with things as they stand.

HOWEVER, IF
If they remove the healing skill line and replace it with a mix of skills, damage, support, group shields, mobility and a new ultimate, then Templars won't be the healing class and I won't be angry!

was my post not clear? you seem to have this difficulty understanding that simply because you have a skill line dedicated to healing that does not make you the defacto healer in this game. Seeing as there are only 4 base classes here that would be absurd. This game is not designed that way, and as i have mentioned ZOS kind of messed and its obvious they are moving in the direction of templars not being the primary healer in this game, and rightfully so.

If they really wanted templars to be the end all healers without question then they would have went full on with Restoring light skill line and omitted a restoration staff weapon from the game entirely.

You do not need to break down anything and its evident you really didnt even read my post past the first sentence. Restoring light is absolutely a dedicated skill line for healing, no one in their right mind would argue that. Also worth noting is that there are a large amount of templar healers that dont even use resto staff when properly geared.

ZOS does not want a rigid linear class make up tied to the trinity, if you cant understand and accept that then i dont know what else to say.

No I didn't misread, I just think you're crazy.
Templars are now a gimped class with a useless skill line but you think it's right.
Wow.

if you are going to reduce my point down to that then its clear you have no interest in an actual dialogue.

Iove wrote: »

Talyena wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

SirDopey wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Komma wrote: »

Tonnopesceb16_ESO wrote: »

Finally well' have more skilled healers around and not just templars even other classes will be able to do the healers now
(i've not tested my DK yet but since the "healing fist" has been buffed i believe it can easily crit above 15k in pts)

how does nerfing templars make other healers better? hrm?

It's quite simple my friend, finally OTHER CLASSES will be considered as good as templars, right now if you are not a templar healer ( mainly due to BOL that makes every templar a good healer) it will take days to join a group and no one except guildies want you.

Well, if this was the point of the "nerf" then why not just delete the entire restoration tree?? I'm so sick of reading "this is fair because now other classes will be as good". I'm sorry, BUT OTHER CLASSES DO NOT HAVE AN ENTIRE TREE DEDICATED TO HEALING.

Other classes should NOT be as good, FULL STOP.

If that is, indeed what the community wants, then get rid of the freaking tree all together and give templars something else to make them a unique class....

From the nach potes

DK

Sea of Flames (Inferno morph):
This morph has been renamed to Cauterize, and will now summon an Aura of Cauterizing Flames, launching a fireball at an ally to heal them instead of an enemy to damage them.
Magma Shell (Magma Armor morph):
This morph no longer grants a synergy to allies for a powerful damage shield; instead, it automatically applies the damage shield on nearby allies when the ability is used.
Obsidian Shield:
Igneous Shield's increased damage shield effect is now a baseline effect for Obsidian Shield.
Note: The Igneous Shield morph will continue to grant you the Major Mending buff as a morph effect.
Obsidian Shard (Stonefist morph):
Increased the healing from this morph by 16%.

NB

Bolstering Darkness (Consuming Darkness morph):
Increased the healing from the Hidden Refresh synergy from this morph by 20%.
Refreshing Path (Path of Darkness morph):
Reduced the time this morph continues to heal yourself and allies to 2 seconds after leaving the path, down from 3 seconds.
Funnel Health (Strife morph):
Reduced the application of the heal over time to you and one additional friendly target, previously two friendly targets.
Soul Siphon (Soul Shred morph):
This morph now heals and applies the Major Vitality buff to yourself as well as your allies.

SORC

Summon Twilight Matriarch (Summon Winged Twilight morph):
This pet’s special ability will now cause it to heal itself and up to 2 friendly targets for 20% of your maximum Magicka.
Unstable Clannfear (Unstable Familiar morph):
This pet’s special ability will now heal you and the Clannfear for 35% of your maximum Health

I call this re-balancing classes in order to get similar healing output.
ALL THE CLASSES have something dedicated to healing STOP thinking templars as the only healers of the game, only because you have an ultimate dedicated to healing (and if i'm not wrong no one use it anymore).
Nerfing BOL ( with the consequential buff of other classes as seen above) was the right thing to do,FULL STOP.

So where is the re-balancing to get similar stealthing abilities? Similar tanking abilities? Similar magic DPS output? Similar physical DPS output? The fact is, each class does something better than the other classes, why should healing be any different? Why should the one class with an entire line dedicated to healing not be the best class for healing? The only way to have balanced classes in an MMO would be to do away with classes. Those whining for balance are just that, whiners.

If you shared even a quarter of your logic with someone at Zenimax, we wouldn't have such a broken game

I agree with a lot of what is posted there, except the "do away with classes" part.

Iove wrote: »

exeeter702 wrote: »

Iove wrote: »

exeeter702 wrote: »

Reposting because it is relevant.



Temps having a skill line dedicated to healing yes, but it is mostly baked in utility. All that says is that potentially, a templar healer did not necessarily have to rely on a resto staff.

Flexibility, i know crazy right?

The problem with alot of people in this game is they want to shoe horn each class into a specific role and call it a day. Its obvious the devs do not want this now and never have.

DKs have mitigation skills that can also be achieved through s/b, undaunted and armor skills

Templars have healing and utility that can also be achieved through resto staff, and undaunted (for the exception of stam regen, unique perks that each class brings?! how insane!)

DK healers have igneous plus BoR (amazing that they specifically dont need combat prayer since they have mountains blessing passive right?). Major mending tied to igneous is a very intentional utility and finally a support ultimate that is much easier to use and benefits multiple players.

NB funnel health nerfed down to one target? same nerf as BoL, interesting is it not? Refreshing path is receiving a very nice buff in potency and now NBs have access to major mending. Couple that with one of the best group mitigation ultimates in the game and the unique ability to deal damage and provide good healing at the same time (unique perks that each class brings?! how insane!)

Look, at the end of the day the blame lies squarely on ZOS. They facilitated for the longest time a group environment that suggested templars should be the only real healers based purely on balance oversight and lack of communication to less informed players that may see templar and go "hey this class has a skill line that is focused on healing that means they must be the healers in this mmo!". What festered was a mindest that players with a templar healer could mostly play like jack asses ie. not worry about stacking or a slightly less emphasis on syngerizing while being showered with BoL via ESOs not so glorious smart cast heals.

The notion became things like "why bother coordinating and whatnot when templars can just do their thing while i do mine". You know something is wrong when a group gets annoyed (unfortunately rightfully so in the games current state) when you go in as a NB healer for example and say something along the lines of "hey guys, make sure to stay close more often than not for trash pulls so sap essence gets you covered" or "do not forget to activate bone shield and Orb if you need mana". Players want to put in the least effort possible and nerfing BoL and funnel health and giving major mending to resto staff users universally is an obvious step in a direction that this game desperately needs, interactive hands on healing as opposed to passive healing. BoL, funnel health and ward ally all share a similar application and that is not a coincidence.

Templars are not "The healing class" of ESO and i promise you that you will see more changes going forward that will put most classes in line for the role.

On a small side note, the most recent and most satisfying group experience i had was when doing vWGT the other day with a nightblade healer and our group all acknowledged the unique strengths of the NB healer and played to them as a whole.

What?

Ok let me break it down for you.

Resto skill line skills:

1. A heal that does nothing else
2. A heal that is situational
3. An aura than most classes have anyway.
4. A heal over time/cleanse.
5. Small armor buff thingy that you have to stand in.
6. An effing heal. That no one uses. A WASTED ULTIMATE.
7. Healing passives!

Tell me another class that has a skill line with 4 heals in it?

Now tell me more how Templars should not be the best healers, with things as they stand.

HOWEVER, IF
If they remove the healing skill line and replace it with a mix of skills, damage, support, group shields, mobility and a new ultimate, then Templars won't be the healing class and I won't be angry!

was my post not clear? you seem to have this difficulty understanding that simply because you have a skill line dedicated to healing that does not make you the defacto healer in this game. Seeing as there are only 4 base classes here that would be absurd. This game is not designed that way, and as i have mentioned ZOS kind of messed and its obvious they are moving in the direction of templars not being the primary healer in this game, and rightfully so.

If they really wanted templars to be the end all healers without question then they would have went full on with Restoring light skill line and omitted a restoration staff weapon from the game entirely.

You do not need to break down anything and its evident you really didnt even read my post past the first sentence. Restoring light is absolutely a dedicated skill line for healing, no one in their right mind would argue that. Also worth noting is that there are a large amount of templar healers that dont even use resto staff when properly geared.

ZOS does not want a rigid linear class make up tied to the trinity, if you cant understand and accept that then i dont know what else to say.

No I didn't misread, I just think you're crazy.

Iove wrote: »

exeeter702 wrote: »

Iove wrote: »

exeeter702 wrote: »

Iove wrote: »

exeeter702 wrote: »

Reposting because it is relevant.



Temps having a skill line dedicated to healing yes, but it is mostly baked in utility. All that says is that potentially, a templar healer did not necessarily have to rely on a resto staff.

Flexibility, i know crazy right?

The problem with alot of people in this game is they want to shoe horn each class into a specific role and call it a day. Its obvious the devs do not want this now and never have.

DKs have mitigation skills that can also be achieved through s/b, undaunted and armor skills

Templars have healing and utility that can also be achieved through resto staff, and undaunted (for the exception of stam regen, unique perks that each class brings?! how insane!)

DK healers have igneous plus BoR (amazing that they specifically dont need combat prayer since they have mountains blessing passive right?). Major mending tied to igneous is a very intentional utility and finally a support ultimate that is much easier to use and benefits multiple players.

NB funnel health nerfed down to one target? same nerf as BoL, interesting is it not? Refreshing path is receiving a very nice buff in potency and now NBs have access to major mending. Couple that with one of the best group mitigation ultimates in the game and the unique ability to deal damage and provide good healing at the same time (unique perks that each class brings?! how insane!)

Look, at the end of the day the blame lies squarely on ZOS. They facilitated for the longest time a group environment that suggested templars should be the only real healers based purely on balance oversight and lack of communication to less informed players that may see templar and go "hey this class has a skill line that is focused on healing that means they must be the healers in this mmo!". What festered was a mindest that players with a templar healer could mostly play like jack asses ie. not worry about stacking or a slightly less emphasis on syngerizing while being showered with BoL via ESOs not so glorious smart cast heals.

The notion became things like "why bother coordinating and whatnot when templars can just do their thing while i do mine". You know something is wrong when a group gets annoyed (unfortunately rightfully so in the games current state) when you go in as a NB healer for example and say something along the lines of "hey guys, make sure to stay close more often than not for trash pulls so sap essence gets you covered" or "do not forget to activate bone shield and Orb if you need mana". Players want to put in the least effort possible and nerfing BoL and funnel health and giving major mending to resto staff users universally is an obvious step in a direction that this game desperately needs, interactive hands on healing as opposed to passive healing. BoL, funnel health and ward ally all share a similar application and that is not a coincidence.

Templars are not "The healing class" of ESO and i promise you that you will see more changes going forward that will put most classes in line for the role.

On a small side note, the most recent and most satisfying group experience i had was when doing vWGT the other day with a nightblade healer and our group all acknowledged the unique strengths of the NB healer and played to them as a whole.

What?

Ok let me break it down for you.

Resto skill line skills:

1. A heal that does nothing else
2. A heal that is situational
3. An aura than most classes have anyway.
4. A heal over time/cleanse.
5. Small armor buff thingy that you have to stand in.
6. An effing heal. That no one uses. A WASTED ULTIMATE.
7. Healing passives!

Tell me another class that has a skill line with 4 heals in it?

Now tell me more how Templars should not be the best healers, with things as they stand.

HOWEVER, IF
If they remove the healing skill line and replace it with a mix of skills, damage, support, group shields, mobility and a new ultimate, then Templars won't be the healing class and I won't be angry!

was my post not clear? you seem to have this difficulty understanding that simply because you have a skill line dedicated to healing that does not make you the defacto healer in this game. Seeing as there are only 4 base classes here that would be absurd. This game is not designed that way, and as i have mentioned ZOS kind of messed and its obvious they are moving in the direction of templars not being the primary healer in this game, and rightfully so.

If they really wanted templars to be the end all healers without question then they would have went full on with Restoring light skill line and omitted a restoration staff weapon from the game entirely.

You do not need to break down anything and its evident you really didnt even read my post past the first sentence. Restoring light is absolutely a dedicated skill line for healing, no one in their right mind would argue that. Also worth noting is that there are a large amount of templar healers that dont even use resto staff when properly geared.

ZOS does not want a rigid linear class make up tied to the trinity, if you cant understand and accept that then i dont know what else to say.

No I didn't misread, I just think you're crazy.
Templars are now a gimped class with a useless skill line but you think it's right.
Wow.

if you are going to reduce my point down to that then its clear you have no interest in an actual dialogue.

I like to get to the point. As a Templar healer, whatever healing changes they give to other classes don't mean a thing to me? I just care about being gimped, with a useless skill tree. Because if everyone will now heal the same, I demand the same mobility, strong passives and more variety in skills like the other classes! While we're at it, give them all stealth because every class must have fair access to everything right? I now wanna stealth gank people in PvP and I can't. QQ.

I hear where you're coming from, but don't you see how such is antithetical to the heart of a true RPG?

I got this game thinking it would be more to the core of RPG's in general, with strict class identity separation...not mix and match flavor text abilities.

I'm having fun in dungeons playing "my way" as a templar tank, but I know I won't be delving deep into other classes as there really isn't much difference between them all. The community seems to want each class to be capable of what every other class can do.