What's the most adorable is the idea that you *must* have Julianos and Hundigs to be the hotness. Because apparently no one can compete without those...it's like watching a baby walk and fall down, you can't help but laugh and say "oohhhh".

Kelleton wrote: »

Why is the most powerful stam dps set in the game a crafted item rather than a dungeon/raid drop.

Look at the alternatives:
Sheer venom - lose 1376 crit; lose 39 weapon damage - gain a 1204 dps proc
Briarheart- lose 297 permanent weapon damage - gain proc on 10% of critical hits 152 weapon damage. + heal guaranteed downtime due to cooldown.
Essence Theif - lose 1376 crit, ; lose 168 weapon damage; gain proc off 15% of light attacks to gain 12% damage (sounds like a lot but it isn't due to buff stacking issues)

A set that takes 0 effort to obtain and allows you to set the traits 100% to your liking, beats out sets that take 100s of hours to obtain maybe 1000s due to RNG.

There is no risk vs reward here crafted items should not be best in slot.

As a crafter that has spent the better part of a year researching traits and now have every trait researched for every piece, I take insult with your statement. This also does not take into account the cost and time to get every single style learned for each piece.

Your statement is made because there are players in the game like me that have put in the effort. So what you are really upset with now is anyone with coin can purchase items and not have to go through the research grind to get it right?


You state that RNG may take 1000 hours to get what you want.....

Do the math on crafting research for 7 pieces on medium to 6 traits. If you had all the skill points allocated at the onset and was an ESO Plus member and you were on every hour a research trait completed the lowest possible time to completion is 744 hours. But no one is at max clothier before researching traits, nor on every time a research completes to start the next trait.

So Hundings or 6 traits sets on 7 medium pieces take about a 1000 hours to complete. Are you starting to get the picture?

Now look ahead, all 9 traits for all pieces took me a year to complete. Do the math 365 days times 24 hours in a day equals how many hours?

Just because you play one portion of the game as you see it has no bearing on how others get their enjoyment. Crafting is an integral part of the economy just as you selling the items you only have to pick off of a corpse...

Mikmak wrote: »

You seriously want to nerf one of the only decent crafted sets in the game??? and force everyone to pray to rng gods...there is already plenty to grind in this game, leave my crafted sets alone!!!

Sorry, I couldn't resist. In all seriousness they shouldn't be nerfing Hundings but they should definitely improve the quality of dropped sets. Most of them are seriously underwhelming or have other silly restrictions like only available from lvl 30-35 or other silly nonsense. All sets should scale or there should be some crafting mechanism in place to scale sets for players. That would add some crafting value and improve the selection of dropped sets at the same time.

Nerf Kelleton please.

Just a side note I do think the game itself could do a better job informing new players of the importance and value of crafting. Something along the lines of when you hit lvl 15 or so maybe have a popup tool tip stating "hey! Crafting gear serves a very real purpose in this game, don't assume it's for gold making only! Don't neglect it" or somthing of the sort lol.

Wish they told me that about enchanting nice set of v15 crafted gear and I have no way to get decent starter white glyphs, why is there no market for this

Autolycus wrote: »

Kelleton wrote: »

so I guess everyone wants everything handed to them and want all gear dropped in dungeons useless, now that monster helms are purchasable what is the carrot for a dungeon?

Despite my initial impression to this post, I'm going to pull it apart anyway. For future reference, starting your comments with generalizations is a surefire way to get people to ignore you, not support you.

What exactly makes you think that dungeon gear is useless? I know plenty of people who are using dungeon dropped gear, i.e. bow nightblades with sheer venom, virtually every meta for healing demands spell power cure, and NB tanking in pvp or pve has at least one very viable build with leeching. I have other examples, but I don't think it's necessary to list them. Point is, I fail to see how having the option to use something like hundings or julianos makes all others obsolete.

The point is that one of, if not the, best set in the game is fairly easy to achieve. Outside of the Vr16 requirements.
I love crafting, I'm a master crafter, and Eso has done an amazing job creating a robust and interesting crafting system, but hunding's and Julianos are too strong, too reliable and too easy to obtain.
In my opinion they need to either push the trait requirement, nerf it slightly or buff some other crafted sets and some dropped ones at the same time.

sAnn92 wrote: »

Autolycus wrote: »

Kelleton wrote: »

so I guess everyone wants everything handed to them and want all gear dropped in dungeons useless, now that monster helms are purchasable what is the carrot for a dungeon?

Despite my initial impression to this post, I'm going to pull it apart anyway. For future reference, starting your comments with generalizations is a surefire way to get people to ignore you, not support you.

What exactly makes you think that dungeon gear is useless? I know plenty of people who are using dungeon dropped gear, i.e. bow nightblades with sheer venom, virtually every meta for healing demands spell power cure, and NB tanking in pvp or pve has at least one very viable build with leeching. I have other examples, but I don't think it's necessary to list them. Point is, I fail to see how having the option to use something like hundings or julianos makes all others obsolete.

The point is that one of, if not the, best set in the game is fairly easy to achieve. Outside of the Vr16 requirements.
I love crafting, I'm a master crafter, and Eso has done an amazing job creating a robust and interesting crafting system, but hunding's and Julianos are too strong, too reliable and too easy to obtain.
In my opinion they need to either push the trait requirement, nerf it slightly or buff some other crafted sets and some dropped ones at the same time.

Whether it is the best set in game or not is subjective. It sacrifices two set bonus slots for a mediocre increase in critical rating. Critical hits can be severely weakened by impenetrable and resistant, and don't work at all on shields while everyone and their dog is spamming shields in cyrodiil.

The set may be best for some players, depending on their preferred gameplay style, but it certainly is not universally best in all scenarios.

sAnn92 wrote: »

Autolycus wrote: »

Kelleton wrote: »

so I guess everyone wants everything handed to them and want all gear dropped in dungeons useless, now that monster helms are purchasable what is the carrot for a dungeon?

Despite my initial impression to this post, I'm going to pull it apart anyway. For future reference, starting your comments with generalizations is a surefire way to get people to ignore you, not support you.

What exactly makes you think that dungeon gear is useless? I know plenty of people who are using dungeon dropped gear, i.e. bow nightblades with sheer venom, virtually every meta for healing demands spell power cure, and NB tanking in pvp or pve has at least one very viable build with leeching. I have other examples, but I don't think it's necessary to list them. Point is, I fail to see how having the option to use something like hundings or julianos makes all others obsolete.

The point is that one of, if not the, best set in the game is fairly easy to achieve. Outside of the Vr16 requirements.
I love crafting, I'm a master crafter, and Eso has done an amazing job creating a robust and interesting crafting system, but hunding's and Julianos are too strong, too reliable and too easy to obtain.
In my opinion they need to either push the trait requirement, nerf it slightly or buff some other crafted sets and some dropped ones at the same time.

I wonder if you were playing back in the Craglorn update when Hundings became completely useless? It was months before Hundings was useful again. I think back on this time, and that experience is, at least in part, why I am so overtly opposed to nerfing Hundings now.

I don't think you and I have the same definition of "easy to obtain". I suppose that's okay; it's not like we have to agree on it necessarily. It's been quite some time since I leveled my crafting, but the way I see it, you have at least 3-4 weeks of researching traits before you'll ever make a Hundings set piece. Assuming you research 3 at a time on the armor weight you eventually want to wear, you can expect about 2 months of researching before you can make all five pieces for yourself. I am aware that you can simply go to someone else who can craft it already, but that person had to do the research too, so it's not like we can just say "oh he/she did nothing to get that gear."

Now, couple that with the 660 rubedo leather at the current (PC) market average:

660/200 = 3.3 stacks of rubedo X 50,000 gold per stack = 165,000 gold for the rubedo alone.

Assuming you don't want a unique style, like Akaviri or Ancient Orc or Glass, we'll ignore the cost of racial style materials. I'm also going to leave out the cost of green, blue and purple tempers, as those are all but negligible, relative to the rest of it. So then let's add in the Dreugh Wax:

5 pieces of gear X 8 Dreugh Wax per item = 40 Dreugh Wax X ~2,500 gold per Dreugh Wax = 100,000 gold

So far the running total (excluding racial style materials and all tempers except dreugh wax) 265,000 gold

Explain to me now how 265k and 2 months of research is "fairly easy to achieve"? I mean I guess it's not difficult in the same sense that vMA is or something. But I hardly consider this to be less of a grind than vWGT or vIP for the dropped sets. The key difference is that a large number of us have been playing for longer than that gear has been out, which poses another question: Can you even compare the two to each other?

Edit: Oops, I forgot enchantments. We can't forget enchantments, because dropped gear comes with glyphs already. So, assuming you want legendary glyphs:

5 Repora = ~ 10,000 gold
5 Kuta = ~ 40,000 gold

New running total = 265,000 + 50,000 = 315,000 for five pieces of legendary Hundings, fully glyphed

Dropped gear isn't going to be legendary, so you still assume the cost of about 100,000 gold to upgrade it. Let's remove that dreugh wax from the equation, and it's still worth 215,000 gold and 2 months of research.

Tallowby wrote: »

As a crafter that has spent the better part of a year researching traits and now have every trait researched for every piece, I take insult with your statement. This also does not take into account the cost and time to get every single style learned for each piece.

Your statement is made because there are players in the game like me that have put in the effort. So what you are really upset with now is anyone with coin can purchase items and not have to go through the research grind to get it right?


You state that RNG may take 1000 hours to get what you want.....

Do the math on crafting research for 7 pieces on medium to 6 traits. If you had all the skill points allocated at the onset and was an ESO Plus member and you were on every hour a research trait completed the lowest possible time to completion is 744 hours. But no one is at max clothier before researching traits, nor on every time a research completes to start the next trait.

So Hundings or 6 traits sets on 7 medium pieces take about a 1000 hours to complete. Are you starting to get the picture?

Now look ahead, all 9 traits for all pieces took me a year to complete. Do the math 365 days times 24 hours in a day equals how many hours?

Just because you play one portion of the game as you see it has no bearing on how others get their enjoyment. Crafting is an integral part of the economy just as you selling the items you only have to pick off of a corpse...

I have all traits researched on all items except staves , I have every style - just because I did something once 2 years ago shouldn't allow a BiS 5 piece for the remainder of the time I play the game.


On s a side note upping the quality of dropped gear rather than a nerf to the 5 piece on Hundings would increase the power potential of players...which is already too high for the content currently released. You are able to Heal/DPS through 90% of game mechanics atm.

Autolycus wrote: »

This point is only somewhat relevant. Hundings hasn't been BiS for two straight years. It was great in the beginning, then it was worthless, and now it's great again. To me that means viability of gear changes with each update.

No this is because champ points made sustain a non issue

exeeter702 wrote: »

Wish they told me that about enchanting nice set of v15 crafted gear and I have no way to get decent starter white glyphs, why is there no market for this

@exeeter702, you don't want trash white glyphs on your nice V15 gear. Go purple. Buy or farm some Rekutas (they drop in any zone that doesn't level nodes) and generously tip your guildie that does enchanting. Not guild? Ask in zone chat. A quick trip to the enchanting table shouldn't cost much; it's easy compared to running all over Tamriel to get to set crafting stations.

Autolycus wrote: »

Kelleton wrote: »

Autolycus wrote: »

This point is only somewhat relevant. Hundings hasn't been BiS for two straight years. It was great in the beginning, then it was worthless, and now it's great again. To me that means viability of gear changes with each update.

No this is because champ points made sustain a non issue

Actually, overhauling the stats in combination with CP and gear variety made sustain less of an issue. I still don't see how that makes crafted sets OP relative to dungeon gear. As I mentioned before, deciding between the two is contingent on one's build.

You can look at the OP for stats comparison to the 3 end game dungeon drops

edorfeus wrote: »

....

I find this to be offensive, and it's not even remotely constructive. If you don't want to actually contribute to the discussion, then at least keep your negativity out of it.

[Moderator Note: Removed moderated quote]