Why Don't Zos just add an extra 5k hp to Battle Spirit?

leepalmer95 · January 2016

Should stop the 1 hit kills people are doing with camo exploits.

Or when people are 2-3 hitting people with wb/Sa or such.

Of course there will be some burst people just can deal so much dmg if they time it right, such as a inev det + curse + frag + dawnbreaker + mages fury or such, but to be fair if someone actually manages to get all them off you at once and you decide to not block or cc them to stop it, then fine your suppose to die.

It would also help those heals/shields that for some reason are badly reliant on %. Sun shield with it's hp % (still going to be bad) or GDB with it's % heal.
Sure there still going to be bad but they'll be slightly better because of higher hp.

1. Help with 1 hits
2. Help with badly designed skills with % post IC
3. Increase TTK - which is what the IC update failed to do.

I'm sure there are some bad reasons, like maybe those burst builds trading that 5k for more tooltip dmg. But they won't have a huge increase in dmg i guess, whats the min hp you can have in cyrodill isn't it like 16k/17k?

Thought's people?

Xjcon · January 2016

What I think happened in the studio was this.

Dev 1, have you seen how high players get damage to spike in PVP on players with zero mitigation?

Dev 2, yea it's kind of funny.

Dev 3, should we balance the skills out so it's better for everyone?

Dev 1, Nah let's just reduce everything across the board by 50%, way easier.

SemiD4rkness · January 2016

Xjcon wrote: »

What I think happened in the studio was this.

Dev 1, have you seen how high players get damage to spike in PVP on players with zero mitigation?

Dev 2, yea it's kind of funny.

Dev 3, should we balance the skills out so it's better for everyone?

Dev 1, Nah let's just reduce everything across the board by 50%, way easier.

Dev 4, Why don't we just nerf templars a little bit more?

Solariken · January 2016

They should absolutely boost Battle Spirit HP. Absolutely.

Wollust · January 2016

would be just another bandaid fix

Jura23 · January 2016

Wrong. Instead they should make HP meaningful stat.

Didgerion · January 2016

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Why Don't Zos just add an extra 5k hp to Battle Spirit

Because it would make healing even more OP!

Battle spirit should alter PVP healing abilities too and shield abilities and other abilities. It is much more complex than just buffing the health pool. Every skill should be touched individually ...applying a 50% cut here and there is just a lazy and cheap solution.

Cathexis · January 2016

Because this wouldnt stop the abuse of lame gap closer stun Ambush spam

Derra · January 2016

Fights already last too long if people know what they´re doing. Don´t want another 5k hp to burn through on top of that. They need to fix broken stuff and not bandaid it.

eliisra · January 2016

5k more hit points wont save a vampire from getting instakilled by sneak attack + camo proc. Even vampire emperors get instakilled by the combo and they have over 40k health

It wont save a mortal either, if the ganker is lucky enough to proc Camouflage Hunter when sneak attacking.

I honestly dont think 5k hp will make a difference anywhere. You live a second longer yay. Hit points is a junk stat in PvP. It's a junk stat in PvE to. Even as tank you want go as low as possible these days, just enough to miss a block. Survivability, utility and usefulness in this game currently comes from big magicka or stamina pools.

They need to make health a useful attribute, like in other MMO's.

imredneckson · January 2016

eliisra wrote: »

5k more hit points wont save a vampire from getting instakilled by sneak attack + camo proc. Even vampire emperors get instakilled by the combo and they have over 40k health

It wont save a mortal either, if the ganker is lucky enough to proc Camouflage Hunter when sneak attacking.

I honestly dont think 5k hp will make a difference anywhere. You live a second longer yay. Hit points is a junk stat in PvP. It's a junk stat in PvE to. Even as tank you want go as low as possible these days, just enough to miss a block. Survivability, utility and usefulness in this game currently comes from big magicka or stamina pools.

They need to make health a useful attribute, like in other MMO's.

Agree, I can snipe players for 25k-30k easy my best was about 35k in one second. Adding an extra 5k hp isn't going to save your life or stop players from one second fighting to the next second dropping wondering "WTF just hit me"

leepalmer95 · January 2016

1 hit shots should just be gone all together.

It annoys me in group fight when nb's or such and just sneaking at the back 54m away and just sniping for stupid numbers.

I've got to ask does camo hunter proc get affected by battle spirit?

I've seen people hit for 11k or so with it, isn't that mean't to be halved in pvp?

Browiseth · January 2016

Players could also just invest into their own HP and defenses

leepalmer95 · January 2016

Browiseth wrote: »

Players could also just invest into their own HP and defenses

Like people have said, emperors are getting 1 shot sometimes.

There's only so much you can do as well, with every stamina build with vigor and magicka with ward if you don't have enough dmg to burst someone you'll never kill anyone.

Besides there is so much penetration around that armour is useless.

imredneckson · January 2016

leepalmer95 wrote: »

1 hit shots should just be gone all together.

It annoys me in group fight when nb's or such and just sneaking at the back 54m away and just sniping for stupid numbers.

I've got to ask does camo hunter proc get affected by battle spirit?

I've seen people hit for 11k or so with it, isn't that mean't to be halved in pvp?

From what I experienced in PvP was if you die too quick for the game to register then itll show 11k or another high number dealt by camo hunter but when I look at my combat log itll show I got hit by other attacks and camo hunter will be like 3k.

Artjuh90 · January 2016

goes min/max and complains he has to little health points? what?!

Xjcon · January 2016

Cathexis wrote: »

Because this wouldnt stop the abuse of lame gap closer stun Ambush spam

I'll stop spamming Ambush when they give us more abilitys to hit players while they dodge roll.

RoyJade · January 2016

They need to seriously boos armor's utility first.
Blocking in LA is still far better than having a HA. Using shield or heal is still more effective than having a HA. But I can understand how hard boosting armor's mitigation cap can be for balance.

leepalmer95 · January 2016

Artjuh90 wrote: »

goes min/max and complains he has to little health points? what?!

1. No ones complaining, it was just a though't
2. I don't min max my characters usually run around with 23k-26k hp.

leepalmer95 · January 2016

Xjcon wrote: »

Cathexis wrote: »

Because this wouldnt stop the abuse of lame gap closer stun Ambush spam

I'll stop spamming Ambush when they give us more abilitys to hit players while they dodge roll.

Or you know they could dodge it?

They did pay the stamina too after all, it's called dodge roll not 'dodge apart from nb root spam skill, you'll have to just take them because no min range... for reasons'

Xjcon · January 2016

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Xjcon wrote: »

Cathexis wrote: »

Because this wouldnt stop the abuse of lame gap closer stun Ambush spam

I'll stop spamming Ambush when they give us more abilitys to hit players while they dodge roll.

Or you know they could dodge it?

They did pay the stamina too after all, it's called dodge roll not 'dodge apart from nb root spam skill, you'll have to just take them because no min range... for reasons'

Dodge roll is too good. It negates all damage for a short time, builds with high sustain use this to their advantage.

We all use the tools given to us by ZOS. Untill something changes then we find what ever works next.

tplink3r1 · January 2016

That would make Blazing Shield less weak, thats why they don't increase it.

leepalmer95 · January 2016

Xjcon wrote: »

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Xjcon wrote: »

Cathexis wrote: »

Because this wouldnt stop the abuse of lame gap closer stun Ambush spam

I'll stop spamming Ambush when they give us more abilitys to hit players while they dodge roll.

Or you know they could dodge it?

They did pay the stamina too after all, it's called dodge roll not 'dodge apart from nb root spam skill, you'll have to just take them because no min range... for reasons'

Dodge roll is too good. It negates all damage for a short time, builds with high sustain use this to their advantage.

We all use the tools given to us by ZOS. Untill something changes then we find what ever works next.

Cloak does the same thing ^^ though it doesn't have a increased cost and is actually better for magicka nb's.

If builds dodge 2-3 times in a row it really puts strain on them, magicka builds just can't.

I just prepare to cc them immediately if there going to use stamina up like that i'll make them use even more.

reften · January 2016

Browiseth wrote: »

Players could also just invest into their own HP and defenses

This.

I'm a vamp, I pvp a LOT. And can only recall getting one shotted just one time with snipe and camo hunter.

This is all so exaggerated...it's ridiculous. I run with 26k hp, full V16 medium armor, with impen and nirm on it.

If you're running with all divines, and all your CPs in offensive items...and you don't run mirage or quick cloak, and you don't use immovable pots, and you have low hitpoints cause all your pts are in stam....then don't come to the forums and complain when someone snipes you.

So frustrating. l2p

HeroOfNone · January 2016

In battle spirit apply an armor buff of 150 - 200%, reduce regeneration, battle roar, shards, and other resource generating abilities by 50%.

This would be in conjunction to the current battle spirit buff.

Watch the meta charge from instagib to more caculated fights where heavy armor can be viable but not over powered and your mitigation will start to be important again.

leepalmer95 · January 2016

reften wrote: »

Browiseth wrote: »

Players could also just invest into their own HP and defenses

This.

I'm a vamp, I pvp a LOT. And can only recall getting one shotted just one time with snipe and camo hunter.

This is all so exaggerated...it's ridiculous. I run with 26k hp, full V16 medium armor, with impen and nirm on it.

If you're running with all divines, and all your CPs in offensive items...and you don't run mirage or quick cloak, and you don't use immovable pots, and you have low hitpoints cause all your pts are in stam....then don't come to the forums and complain when someone snipes you.

So frustrating. l2p

I have a templar, run 5x impen, have 15% worth of resistant cp, magicka build so LA but i have 16k physical resist.

Still being hit for 8k wb's and 6.5k-7k SA and i run with 24k hp on it.

3 wb's
4 SA

Not including and heavy/light/medium weaving, gap closer dmg or some ranged dmg or even ult.

WB + take flight i'm usualy dead, if not then execute before i can get up.

Heavy + SA put me down to 50% hp and then i'm stunned even if i break free fast i'm in execute range then.

The dmg stam builds do is out of control with the high crit/dmg meta with stacked dmg.

Still 26k hp vamp huh. My sorc has a 15k tooltip for dawnbreaker. So thats a 22.5k damane on hit to you (11.25k in pvp) thats without a crit or without the DOT.

Dot is 17k tooltip so 25.5k over 5s which is roughly 5k a sec so 2.5k in pvp thats without crits.

On impact without crits your looking at nearly 14k on impact. That'll put you at 40% hp? and knock you down which means i'd get another tick.

So i could dawnbreaker + execute you and you wouldn't get up.

Yolokin_Swagonborn · January 2016

Or they could just revert the Attribute heath nerf they put in with the champion system. And while they are at it, remove the terrible champion system, re-instate softcaps and revert the lighting patch

leepalmer95 · January 2016

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Or they could just revert the Attribute heath nerf they put in with the champion system. And while they are at it, remove the terrible champion system, re-instate softcaps and revert the lighting patch

We'd get a Batman class before that happens.

Zimm · January 2016

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

Or they could just revert the Attribute heath nerf they put in with the champion system. And while they are at it, remove the terrible champion system, re-instate softcaps and revert the lighting patch

I never thought I would hit the agree button on something posted by anyone with the words "Yolo," or "Swag," in their name... Yet here we are Mr Yolokin Swagonborn, here we are.

Baconlad · January 2016

I agree that making health more effective stat would be better. I don't think we should be getting this battle spirit buff is good...pve should be the same as pvp as far as gear and even build altogether, shouldn't have to have a different build from pvp to pve. At least I don't like it

reften · January 2016

leepalmer95 wrote: »

reften wrote: »

Browiseth wrote: »

Players could also just invest into their own HP and defenses

This.

I'm a vamp, I pvp a LOT. And can only recall getting one shotted just one time with snipe and camo hunter.

This is all so exaggerated...it's ridiculous. I run with 26k hp, full V16 medium armor, with impen and nirm on it.

If you're running with all divines, and all your CPs in offensive items...and you don't run mirage or quick cloak, and you don't use immovable pots, and you have low hitpoints cause all your pts are in stam....then don't come to the forums and complain when someone snipes you.

So frustrating. l2p

I have a templar, run 5x impen, have 15% worth of resistant cp, magicka build so LA but i have 16k physical resist.

Still being hit for 8k wb's and 6.5k-7k SA and i run with 24k hp on it.

3 wb's
4 SA

Not including and heavy/light/medium weaving, gap closer dmg or some ranged dmg or even ult.

WB + take flight i'm usualy dead, if not then execute before i can get up.

Heavy + SA put me down to 50% hp and then i'm stunned even if i break free fast i'm in execute range then.

The dmg stam builds do is out of control with the high crit/dmg meta with stacked dmg.

Still 26k hp vamp huh. My sorc has a 15k tooltip for dawnbreaker. So thats a 22.5k damane on hit to you (11.25k in pvp) thats without a crit or without the DOT.

Dot is 17k tooltip so 25.5k over 5s which is roughly 5k a sec so 2.5k in pvp thats without crits.

On impact without crits your looking at nearly 14k on impact. That'll put you at 40% hp? and knock you down which means i'd get another tick.

So i could dawnbreaker + execute you and you wouldn't get up.

And that is not a one shot kill, that was a pretty good combo of attacks you just described there. After the first hit did you break stun and dodge roll and pop vigor or a heal?

MAYBE, just maybe, when someone gets the jump on you, and you aren't blocking, and you didn't attack first, you SHOULD die?

You're exaggerating here. I get jumped all the time, break stun, dodge roll, vigor, maybe a health pot if necessary and I usually can escape and live to fight or wait for help to arrive. And if I die, usually it's because I didn't react quickly enough.