Huh? Far as group utility goes, templars have class heal(s) and cleanse, they have shards(only skill that restores stamina I think)...they do lack CC but so do, say, NBs. Far as buffing self goes, there's Blazing Shield and Channeled Focus which are totally wonderful skills imo, what makes you think templars are overall worse than other classes with all of that?
You also have a couple interesting ultimates, Nova reduces damage to group making it very useful sometimes, and that Radiant Sweep or whatever it's called - the tanky morph that reduces damage done to you - can also be extremeley useful for tanks since you can pretty much spam it and greatly profit from the damage reduction.

My sorc wishes she had any way to be useful to the group other than doing damage...to pick apart the skills you mention:

Lightning Form - good, but Channeled Focus is better. It costs much less, looks much prettier, provides same resistance buff AND magicka regeneration on top of it and now it also lasts some after you leave the circle so you don't have to stay stationary while using it. The Lightning Form does some damage as well but it's highly meh, especially considering most (magicka at least) sorcs stay ranged 90% of the time. Also, Blazing shield damage is WAY better.
Bolt Escape - yes it's great, but not really much use in group content. It's situational(and great for PvP, yes I know).
Bound armor - magicka/stamina buff, good but a toggle. Meaning you need to let it take slot on BOTH your bars(or all three with Overload) to profit from it. Meaning most sorcs don't actually use it much because we need those slots for something else. It's also kind of ugly in my opinion, at least the magicka version of it
Dark Exchange - ...no. At least definitely not during combat.
Surge - yes, but Entropy does essentially the same and it has the small benefit of providing you with Mages guild passives. Surge lasts longer, costs more and gives a bit more healing though. Still though, I wouldn't say that current form of Surge makes sorc that superior to someone using Entropy. Besides, Surge heal is nothing compared to Jabs. Surge has a mili cooldown meaning I won't profit that much from aoe damage(while taking full damage myself), but a templar can just jabsjabsjabs 6+ mobs and outheal most any damage(works in Sewers for example).

Oh and teh sorc ultimate is of course Overload which is a very interesting skill but it's SO buggy I often wish they'd replace it with something less powerful but more...you know, functioning.

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

Kadoozy wrote: »

All of the other classes have useful utility skills to buff and help them fight. Lightning form, bolt escape, bound armor, dark exchange, surge; blur, mark target, cloak, path of darkness; DKs are pretty much in the same boat but they still have more abilities and ones that actually work. As it is, the other classes have nice skills to compliment their builds or even make different builds. Temps have one great heal and cleanse and those are our only useful healing/utility abilities but we are considered the healing class. Not to mention they are mostly inefficient on stamina builds. Can we spread the sorc and nb love over to the other classes?

Templar do need a lot of love but that's making your powers work and using some of your attacks damage you guys have the best healing in the game with the highest regen bonus regen for have a power slotted and more when you use it I forget the name but my Templar has it up 24/7.

One class can't have it all.

Yet others do. DPS, mobility, escape and heals - all in one shake and bake. Fair enough. We play on Hard Mode you know, while others have Win Button Easy Modes.

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Idinuse wrote: »

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

Kadoozy wrote: »

All of the other classes have useful utility skills to buff and help them fight. Lightning form, bolt escape, bound armor, dark exchange, surge; blur, mark target, cloak, path of darkness; DKs are pretty much in the same boat but they still have more abilities and ones that actually work. As it is, the other classes have nice skills to compliment their builds or even make different builds. Temps have one great heal and cleanse and those are our only useful healing/utility abilities but we are considered the healing class. Not to mention they are mostly inefficient on stamina builds. Can we spread the sorc and nb love over to the other classes?

Templar do need a lot of love but that's making your powers work and using some of your attacks damage you guys have the best healing in the game with the highest regen bonus regen for have a power slotted and more when you use it I forget the name but my Templar has it up 24/7.

One class can't have it all.

Yet others do. DPS, mobility, escape and heals - all in one shake and bake. Fair enough. We play on Hard Mode you know, while others have Win Button Easy Modes.

Pretty sure the spambot temp's have it easy mode.

I don't think spambots do PVP.

Magdalina wrote: »

Huh? Far as group utility goes, templars have class heal(s) and cleanse, they have shards(only skill that restores stamina I think)...they do lack CC but so do, say, NBs. Far as buffing self goes, there's Blazing Shield and Channeled Focus which are totally wonderful skills imo, what makes you think templars are overall worse than other classes with all of that?
You also have a couple interesting ultimates, Nova reduces damage to group making it very useful sometimes, and that Radiant Sweep or whatever it's called - the tanky morph that reduces damage done to you - can also be extremeley useful for tanks since you can pretty much spam it and greatly profit from the damage reduction.

My sorc wishes she had any way to be useful to the group other than doing damage...to pick apart the skills you mention:

Lightning Form - good, but Channeled Focus is better. It costs much less, looks much prettier, provides same resistance buff AND magicka regeneration on top of it and now it also lasts some after you leave the circle so you don't have to stay stationary while using it. The Lightning Form does some damage as well but it's highly meh, especially considering most (magicka at least) sorcs stay ranged 90% of the time. Also, Blazing shield damage is WAY better.
Bolt Escape - yes it's great, but not really much use in group content. It's situational(and great for PvP, yes I know).
Bound armor - magicka/stamina buff, good but a toggle. Meaning you need to let it take slot on BOTH your bars(or all three with Overload) to profit from it. Meaning most sorcs don't actually use it much because we need those slots for something else. It's also kind of ugly in my opinion, at least the magicka version of it
Dark Exchange - ...no. At least definitely not during combat.
Surge - yes, but Entropy does essentially the same and it has the small benefit of providing you with Mages guild passives. Surge lasts longer, costs more and gives a bit more healing though. Still though, I wouldn't say that current form of Surge makes sorc that superior to someone using Entropy. Besides, Surge heal is nothing compared to Jabs. Surge has a mili cooldown meaning I won't profit that much from aoe damage(while taking full damage myself), but a templar can just jabsjabsjabs 6+ mobs and outheal most any damage(works in Sewers for example).

Oh and teh sorc ultimate is of course Overload which is a very interesting skill but it's SO buggy I often wish they'd replace it with something less powerful but more...you know, functioning.

Im speaking from a pvp perspective, not pve.

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

Kadoozy wrote: »

All of the other classes have useful utility skills to buff and help them fight. Lightning form, bolt escape, bound armor, dark exchange, surge; blur, mark target, cloak, path of darkness; DKs are pretty much in the same boat but they still have more abilities and ones that actually work. As it is, the other classes have nice skills to compliment their builds or even make different builds. Temps have one great heal and cleanse and those are our only useful healing/utility abilities but we are considered the healing class. Not to mention they are mostly inefficient on stamina builds. Can we spread the sorc and nb love over to the other classes?

Templar do need a lot of love but that's making your powers work and using some of your attacks damage you guys have the best healing in the game with the highest regen bonus regen for have a power slotted and more when you use it I forget the name but my Templar has it up 24/7.

One class can't have it all.

I'm not sure what you're talking about with regard to regeneration bonus. Repentance does give Major Whatever to regen, but it must be on the slotted bar, and Templar regeneration is garbage without it. All other classes have a passive bonus in one form or another, often very high passive bonuses. This means the Templar can provide his friends with the Major/Minor buff but will end up having less than his comrades, because he doesn't get a baseline buff to regeneration that he can then hit with Major/Minor like they can. The two skills that supply regeneration to Templar are the Radiant Aura morphs, and Rune Focus. I'm going to have to say I find these two skills generally inferior if you do anything outside of playing as a healer, when compared to the other classes.

Kadoozy wrote: »

So the smart heal, the aoe stun, the cleanse, the ult heal, the aoe heal dps move don't count as utility?

Never though't i'd see a mag templar ask for more group utility.

Templar does not have an aoe stun, it did, but it was removed in favor of a highly buggy and magic-only skill called Radiant Oppression. I would love to have my aoe stun (Blinding Flashes) back. Templar has always had the worst CC of all 4 classes, I don't know how anyone can still argue that point and believe they are right.

The ultimate heal is okay (other classes have similar healer oriented ultimates that operate in different ways).

The cleanse is clearly one of if not the best move Templars get.

Breath Of Life is a nice smart heal, but then so is the swallow soul morph that lets you drop some damage while also providing strong HoT's.

I'd like to also add that being able to feed people some stamina with Luminous shards means you also forego the dps option of this skill, and does absolutely nothing for returning stamina to self. Repentance is nice in that it can return heals/stamina to the team, based off of the fallen around you. This is situational and not helpful until the other side actually starts to die.

I make all these points, but I'd like to say @Kadoozy that a lot of these points have been discussed on previous threads, and the developers have stated they want to improve some of the flaws with the class. @kendellking_chaosb14_ESO also made the good point that much of the Templar's problem lies in the fact that many of the skills are broken or in need of repair. Its hard to balance a class when half of the abilities are glitchy or don't work as intended.

Idinuse wrote: »

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

Kadoozy wrote: »

All of the other classes have useful utility skills to buff and help them fight. Lightning form, bolt escape, bound armor, dark exchange, surge; blur, mark target, cloak, path of darkness; DKs are pretty much in the same boat but they still have more abilities and ones that actually work. As it is, the other classes have nice skills to compliment their builds or even make different builds. Temps have one great heal and cleanse and those are our only useful healing/utility abilities but we are considered the healing class. Not to mention they are mostly inefficient on stamina builds. Can we spread the sorc and nb love over to the other classes?

Templar do need a lot of love but that's making your powers work and using some of your attacks damage you guys have the best healing in the game with the highest regen bonus regen for have a power slotted and more when you use it I forget the name but my Templar has it up 24/7.

One class can't have it all.

Yet others do. DPS, mobility, escape and heals - all in one shake and bake. Fair enough. We play on Hard Mode you know, while others have Win Button Easy Modes.

If you think Nightblades and Sorcerers gave useable class heals you're off your rocker.
Swallow Soul is not closer to Breath of Life spell resistance and Shields kill it's damage and it heals for 26% of damage every 2 seconds for ten second no where near as good as BoL.

Sorcerers heals are so bad it's not laughable anymore

SemiD4rkness wrote: »

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

Idinuse wrote: »

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

Kadoozy wrote: »

All of the other classes have useful utility skills to buff and help them fight. Lightning form, bolt escape, bound armor, dark exchange, surge; blur, mark target, cloak, path of darkness; DKs are pretty much in the same boat but they still have more abilities and ones that actually work. As it is, the other classes have nice skills to compliment their builds or even make different builds. Temps have one great heal and cleanse and those are our only useful healing/utility abilities but we are considered the healing class. Not to mention they are mostly inefficient on stamina builds. Can we spread the sorc and nb love over to the other classes?

Templar do need a lot of love but that's making your powers work and using some of your attacks damage you guys have the best healing in the game with the highest regen bonus regen for have a power slotted and more when you use it I forget the name but my Templar has it up 24/7.

One class can't have it all.

Yet others do. DPS, mobility, escape and heals - all in one shake and bake. Fair enough. We play on Hard Mode you know, while others have Win Button Easy Modes.

If you think Nightblades and Sorcerers gave useable class heals you're off your rocker.
Swallow Soul is not closer to Breath of Life spell resistance and Shields kill it's damage and it heals for 26% of damage every 2 seconds for ten second no where near as good as BoL.

Sorcerers heals are so bad it's not laughable anymore

Who needs heals when you have 20k shields

20k magicka shields with 2 shields, 1 available for all classes, so templars could have 10 shield + be a healbot

Sorc has 10k hardened ward, templars have a heal which is instant 100% life, and heals 2 others.

SemiD4rkness wrote: »

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

Idinuse wrote: »

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO wrote: »

Kadoozy wrote: »

All of the other classes have useful utility skills to buff and help them fight. Lightning form, bolt escape, bound armor, dark exchange, surge; blur, mark target, cloak, path of darkness; DKs are pretty much in the same boat but they still have more abilities and ones that actually work. As it is, the other classes have nice skills to compliment their builds or even make different builds. Temps have one great heal and cleanse and those are our only useful healing/utility abilities but we are considered the healing class. Not to mention they are mostly inefficient on stamina builds. Can we spread the sorc and nb love over to the other classes?

Templar do need a lot of love but that's making your powers work and using some of your attacks damage you guys have the best healing in the game with the highest regen bonus regen for have a power slotted and more when you use it I forget the name but my Templar has it up 24/7.

One class can't have it all.

Yet others do. DPS, mobility, escape and heals - all in one shake and bake. Fair enough. We play on Hard Mode you know, while others have Win Button Easy Modes.

If you think Nightblades and Sorcerers gave useable class heals you're off your rocker.
Swallow Soul is not closer to Breath of Life spell resistance and Shields kill it's damage and it heals for 26% of damage every 2 seconds for ten second no where near as good as BoL.

Sorcerers heals are so bad it's not laughable anymore

Who needs heals when you have 20k shields

Granted Harden Ward is strong but I carry a 5 piece gold Shield Breaker so get a away and change five piece or Rez change and go back.

Besides you play defense and chain CC when fighting Sorcs then burst then when they can't CC break.

Yesterday I created my first templar (I'm still considering if I'll go for magicka or stamina) and the first thing I though was "why do they complain?"

The class is great, has some nice ranged attacks that can be easily combined with melee. In fact, the first thing I do was to morph javelinn to stam and paired it with crit rush (2H) and bitting jabs, and it was great. Then I combined solar flare with javelin and crit rush and jabs and it was greater. I just imagine what you will able to do with jav + dark flare/jabs + crit rush + WB and purifyng ritual as utility. Even Rally is an great option.

I don't know how templar becomes a ruined class in VRs having such a burst potential

AfkNinja wrote: »

Xvorg wrote: »

Yesterday I created my first templar (I'm still considering if I'll go for magicka or stamina) and the first thing I though was "why do they complain?"

The class is great, has some nice ranged attacks that can be easily combined with melee. In fact, the first thing I do was to morph javelinn to stam and paired it with crit rush (2H) and bitting jabs, and it was great. Then I combined solar flare with javelin and crit rush and jabs and it was greater. I just imagine what you will able to do with jav + dark flare/jabs + crit rush + WB and purifyng ritual as utility. Even Rally is an great option.

I don't know how templar becomes a ruined class in VRs having such a burst potential

Because it doesn't have burst, you haven't experienced PVP at high lvl, every class feels OP at lvl 10 against PVE. In PVP Dark flare is VERY easy to avoid, same with Javelin and Javelin does low dmg already. Biting jabs and Puncturing sweeps are both easily avoided as well as they are channels. All someone has to do to avoid your Jabs is just walk through you or roll dodge once. Till you play at a high lvl you can't really understand the class cause you have no context.

For that reason I say that IDK what happens in middle.

Sure, funnel health is easy to avoid too, same as Assasin's will, but I don't think the class is a complete wreck as DKs

Grendel_at_ESO wrote: »

Granted I have very limited PvP experience so far but the few times I have gone out on my Templar I wouldn't have minded if Focused Charge and it's morphs worked a bit more often. I'd say about 50% of the time it just does the animation but that's it. At first I though it was a geometry issue, going from a lower to a higher elevation or vice versa but I had some fights on perfectly level ground where is still did nothing. Ambush on my NB however works fantastically, it's basically the same thing just a different animation although it has got me stuck inside things a few times.

This is where I would say we are dealing with getting insult added to injury with the class. Focused Charge/Toppling Charge is just one example but honestly this skill has never worked properly. Meanwhile Ambush works beautifully, sometimes too beautifully well (like keep leaping, or the fact it has no range limits). I personally don't use the Templar charge (like many templar skills) because they are either too great a risk to use, or don't offer near enough for the cost/opportunity cost. I really feel the whole balance of the Templar class is broken in large part because it is balanced based upon what SHOULD work, when in reality much of it does not.

Oreyn_Bearclaw wrote: »

Cant tell if this is a troll post. They have an entire skill line devoted to utility, aka, healing. If you have no interest in healing, perhaps another class is better suited to you. They also have class abilities that: Gap Close, heal, restore stam, execute, DPS while self healing, Ranged DoTs, AoE DPS, ranged DPS, Purge, and probably some more I am missing. Of all the classes, I probably run more class skills on my templar than any other toon.

All of which are only viable for magicka builds, and even then the only templar skills I use besides heals are sweeps, shards for support and radiant destruction.

I don't see any harm in replacing Backlash or Eclipse with the old Flashes, or something similar. Nobody uses those skills anyway.

Troll thread

leepalmer95 wrote: »

So the smart heal, the aoe stun, the cleanse, the ult heal, the aoe heal dps move don't count as utility?

Never though't i'd see a mag templar ask for more group utility.

im not mag templar. plus the ult heal isnt worth mentioning if you are dps. all temp ults are outclassed by dawnbreaker and ice comet. not to mention barrier instead of the ult heal. and if you mean blazing spear as an 'aoe stun' then lol because it only effects one target and does poor damage.