The Elder Scrolls Online

Maintenance for the week of April 6:
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 6

can we go back and let non-vet characters not do veteran dungeons

Leave a Reply
Artjuh90
Artjuh90
✭✭✭✭✭
✭
I really don't get why a lvl 12 can que for a veteran diffuculty dungeon. they lack the skill points and arguably the actual skill to do this. they are new to that character so they will have to practice this again. and there is no need for them to do it on vet diffuculty because there is a normal difficulty. it used to be normal would be for people below vet and veteran as it's name implies for veteran. can we have that back please a lvl 12 tank and a lvl 26 healer wont work in a veteran difficulty group.

p.s. i am aware of the battle leveling this is about part these characters don't poses even with battleleveling
  • Volkodav
    Volkodav
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭
    Even though those L12 and L26 players wont fit in a veteran difficulty group,they still have the right to be there as well.Just dont have them in your group.Let them go it alone,or run a long with you,but not get the benefits from being in the group.
    It's not really a problem.If they arent in your group,dont pay attention to their presence. They just want to play too. :}
  • Artjuh90
    Artjuh90
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭
    Volkodav wrote: »
    Even though those L12 and L26 players wont fit in a veteran difficulty group,they still have the right to be there as well.Just dont have them in your group.Let them go it alone,or run a long with you,but not get the benefits from being in the group.
    It's not really a problem.If they arent in your group,dont pay attention to their presence. They just want to play too. :}

    well they can do a dungeon, it's called NORMAL mode. they aren't veteran so they shouldn't be able to que for it. before the rework of the groupfinder they couldn't do it why should they do it now. they still lack to mutch to complete it. i'm not speaking about the veteran 1 or 2 who should or shouldn't join im talking about players who have white/green gear with no sets at all no skill points to have a actual tank/healer or dps build and probably lack the skill to fully understand their character rotationwise and gamewise if it's a new players
  • Magdalina
    Magdalina
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭✭
    Non vet chars can queue for vet dungeons now?o.O That is odd. Sounds more like an oversight than an intended mechanic I'd say. With all respect for non-vet characters, of course.
  • laksikus
    laksikus
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭
    lol, i bet with the battle leveling as it is atm, i can outdps many average v16 DD with my lvl 30 dk^^
    im only missing 2 skills that i need for more aoe dps, but my single target dps is pretty good^^
  • Volkodav
    Volkodav
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭
    Artjuh90 wrote: »
    Volkodav wrote: »
    Even though those L12 and L26 players wont fit in a veteran difficulty group,they still have the right to be there as well.Just dont have them in your group.Let them go it alone,or run a long with you,but not get the benefits from being in the group.
    It's not really a problem.If they arent in your group,dont pay attention to their presence. They just want to play too. :}

    well they can do a dungeon, it's called NORMAL mode. they aren't veteran so they shouldn't be able to que for it. before the rework of the groupfinder they couldn't do it why should they do it now. they still lack to mutch to complete it. i'm not speaking about the veteran 1 or 2 who should or shouldn't join im talking about players who have white/green gear with no sets at all no skill points to have a actual tank/healer or dps build and probably lack the skill to fully understand their character rotationwise and gamewise if it's a new players

    I understand what you are saying,but why would it be a problem if they arent even trying to be in your group.As I mentioned,just ignore them and they'll either die or carry on. Newbies dont always understand everything right away.You could help them,if you wished. Some new players come into ESO and think this is like some other games,like Skyforge,where you just dive in and go for it.They dont realize it takes time and skills to run with the guys.
    I wasnt trying to disrespect you or anything. :}
    (it seems lately when I comment,I have to add this small disclaimer,or I get caught in a fireline.)
  • NewBlacksmurf
    NewBlacksmurf
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Is this a question that consider the NPC as Vet to define the dungeon as a vet dungeon
    Or
    Are you talking about the actual vet dungeons which are different than normal dungeons also scaled at Vr16?
    -PC (PTS)/Xbox One: NewBlacksmurf
    ~<{[50]}>~ looks better than *501
  • Caligamy_ESO
    Caligamy_ESO
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭
    I don't really understand why anyone ever thought scaling a new player up to match vet levels was a good idea. In most cases they simply lack the knowledge of game play mechanics and skill synergies to be effective at that level. Scaling the vet players down to the minimum level of the party members makes much more sense, and if programmed correctly wouldn't effect the higher level players rewards at the end in any way shape or form. Other games do this with immense success and it is beneficial to everyone involved in it.
    Edited by Caligamy_ESO on December 28, 2015 10:10PM
    love is love
  • Vixani
    Vixani
    Soul Shriven
    I have to agree to a certain extent, I don't believe a group of 3 v16's when using group finder should get a random lv10 as they lack the skills for the dungeon being scaled up. It should be set to if majority of the group is composed of vets, grouping tool should only pull a vet (even v1) into the group and vice-versa (lv49 & under). At least balance it a bit more.
  • zornyan
    zornyan
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Vixani wrote: »
    I have to agree to a certain extent, I don't believe a group of 3 v16's when using group finder should get a random lv10 as they lack the skills for the dungeon being scaled up. It should be set to if majority of the group is composed of vets, grouping tool should only pull a vet (even v1) into the group and vice-versa (lv49 & under). At least balance it a bit more.

    This, it simply should seperate vets and non vets, also non vets shouldn't be able to do veteran difficulty dungeons.

    Yes your stats are scaled, but a tank is not a tank when they have 5 skills, one bar, no passives in anything, not set gear, and sometimes not even a full armor set.

    Also they should not allow multi role selection, use the tool, get 4 peeps that selected 4 roles..
  • Hechicera
    Hechicera
    ✭✭✭
    It's not fun for us lowbies either. I started a thread over in the Dungeons & Group Content about it.

    http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/236319/dungeon-party-finder-tool-its-a-trap-lowbies-and-suggestions

    If you are lowbie, you're only chance of getting cross factions in (and perhaps greater chance of running soon) than shouts in your own zone is to use the tool. BUT even if you are all lowbies, the mobs and you get scaled to VR16. Utter disaster. The one dungeon was a silver pledge I think one day. The vets were also not amused. It just doesn't work for anyone when the mix happens and for lowbies at all.

    And I could queue for IC prison and White Gold Tower as soon as I opened the first dungeon too.
    Edited by Hechicera on December 21, 2015 12:45AM
  • Sithisvoid
    Sithisvoid
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Why? Half of them have better stats than we do
  • Fruitmass
    Fruitmass
    ✭✭✭✭
    Magdalina wrote: »
    Non vet chars can queue for vet dungeons now?o.O That is odd. Sounds more like an oversight than an intended mechanic I'd say. With all respect for non-vet characters, of course.

    I don't know about console but on PC a non vet character can't queue for an actual Veteran difficulty dungeon with the group finder. Nor can they use the group finder to queue for a dungeon that they do not meet the minimum level requirement for (a lv20 character cannot queue for Vaults of Madness for instance). However any group formed using the grouping tool, even normal difficulty dungeons, get scaled to v15 and the mobs to v16.
    Beware all ye who log on for here there be typos...
  • Hechicera
    Hechicera
    ✭✭✭
    Magdalina wrote: »
    However any group formed using the grouping tool, even normal difficulty dungeons, get scaled to v15 and the mobs to v16.

    Hysterically, even if every single one of them is level 12-16. Aaaaand, since everyone is scaled, our soulgems won't rez. Massive rage quitting ensues. Why yes, I have that t-shirt.
    Edited by Hechicera on December 21, 2015 3:00AM
  • Fruitmass
    Fruitmass
    ✭✭✭✭
    Hechicera wrote: »
    Magdalina wrote: »
    However any group formed using the grouping tool, even normal difficulty dungeons, get scaled to v15 and the mobs to v16.

    Hysterically, even if every single one of them is level 12-16. Aaaaand, since everyone is scaled, our soulgems won't rez. Massive rage quitting ensues. Why yes, I have that t-shirt.

    I haven't run into that problem yet but yeah, I'd be pretty mad about it too. Don't know if I'd rage quit but I'd certainly be irate.
    Beware all ye who log on for here there be typos...
  • IwakuraLain42
    IwakuraLain42
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    The soul gem issue is one of the more annoying features of the new GF as it mostly renders the lesser gems useless. If you use it you really need Grand SG's, even if you're a low level char.
  • syzmic
    syzmic
    ✭✭✭
    Volkodav wrote: »
    Artjuh90 wrote: »
    Volkodav wrote: »
    Even though those L12 and L26 players wont fit in a veteran difficulty group,they still have the right to be there as well.Just dont have them in your group.Let them go it alone,or run a long with you,but not get the benefits from being in the group.
    It's not really a problem.If they arent in your group,dont pay attention to their presence. They just want to play too. :}

    well they can do a dungeon, it's called NORMAL mode. they aren't veteran so they shouldn't be able to que for it. before the rework of the groupfinder they couldn't do it why should they do it now. they still lack to mutch to complete it. i'm not speaking about the veteran 1 or 2 who should or shouldn't join im talking about players who have white/green gear with no sets at all no skill points to have a actual tank/healer or dps build and probably lack the skill to fully understand their character rotationwise and gamewise if it's a new players

    I understand what you are saying,but why would it be a problem if they arent even trying to be in your group.As I mentioned,just ignore them and they'll either die or carry on. Newbies dont always understand everything right away.You could help them,if you wished. Some new players come into ESO and think this is like some other games,like Skyforge,where you just dive in and go for it.They dont realize it takes time and skills to run with the guys.
    I wasnt trying to disrespect you or anything. :}
    (it seems lately when I comment,I have to add this small disclaimer,or I get caught in a fireline.)

    Volkodav
    I think you are missing the point OP is trying to make.

    When you have say 3 in a group and want to run say a dungeon in vet mode and you use "Group Finder" anyone can join your group including level 12's. Granted they are battle leveled but you just can't ignore them. If as you say " they arent even trying to be in your group" why be in group finder in the first place?
  • Volkodav
    Volkodav
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭
    Hechicera wrote: »
    Magdalina wrote: »
    However any group formed using the grouping tool, even normal difficulty dungeons, get scaled to v15 and the mobs to v16.

    Hysterically, even if every single one of them is level 12-16. Aaaaand, since everyone is scaled, our soulgems won't rez. Massive rage quitting ensues. Why yes, I have that t-shirt.

    Hysterically?
  • Volkodav
    Volkodav
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭
    syzmic wrote: »
    Volkodav wrote: »
    Artjuh90 wrote: »
    Volkodav wrote: »
    Even though those L12 and L26 players wont fit in a veteran difficulty group,they still have the right to be there as well.Just dont have them in your group.Let them go it alone,or run a long with you,but not get the benefits from being in the group.
    It's not really a problem.If they arent in your group,dont pay attention to their presence. They just want to play too. :}

    well they can do a dungeon, it's called NORMAL mode. they aren't veteran so they shouldn't be able to que for it. before the rework of the groupfinder they couldn't do it why should they do it now. they still lack to mutch to complete it. i'm not speaking about the veteran 1 or 2 who should or shouldn't join im talking about players who have white/green gear with no sets at all no skill points to have a actual tank/healer or dps build and probably lack the skill to fully understand their character rotationwise and gamewise if it's a new players

    I understand what you are saying,but why would it be a problem if they arent even trying to be in your group.As I mentioned,just ignore them and they'll either die or carry on. Newbies dont always understand everything right away.You could help them,if you wished. Some new players come into ESO and think this is like some other games,like Skyforge,where you just dive in and go for it.They dont realize it takes time and skills to run with the guys.
    I wasnt trying to disrespect you or anything. :}
    (it seems lately when I comment,I have to add this small disclaimer,or I get caught in a fireline.)

    Volkodav
    I think you are missing the point OP is trying to make.

    When you have say 3 in a group and want to run say a dungeon in vet mode and you use "Group Finder" anyone can join your group including level 12's. Granted they are battle leveled but you just can't ignore them. If as you say " they arent even trying to be in your group" why be in group finder in the first place?

    I can see what you are saying about the group finder. I wasnt aware the OP was speaking singularly of the group finder. :}
    Edited by Volkodav on December 21, 2015 11:08AM
  • Artjuh90
    Artjuh90
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭
    Fruitmass wrote: »
    Magdalina wrote: »
    Non vet chars can queue for vet dungeons now?o.O That is odd. Sounds more like an oversight than an intended mechanic I'd say. With all respect for non-vet characters, of course.

    I don't know about console but on PC a non vet character can't queue for an actual Veteran difficulty dungeon with the group finder. Nor can they use the group finder to queue for a dungeon that they do not meet the minimum level requirement for (a lv20 character cannot queue for Vaults of Madness for instance). However any group formed using the grouping tool, even normal difficulty dungeons, get scaled to v15 and the mobs to v16.

    well on console peopel can que for the veteran difficulty aswell. they do need the level for the set instance for example fungal grotto they need lvl 12. but they can que for the veteran difficulty right of the bat which gives problem when you try to clear the vet with 3 non-vet. it's at the point i check if they are vet if not leave group try again. and given the fact there is no textchat it can take a whole day to find a actual group for the pledge......
  • laksikus
    laksikus
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭
    Sithisvoid wrote: »
    Why? Half of them have better stats than we do

    So true.
    Even with blue gear and white glyphs
    Edited by laksikus on December 21, 2015 11:24AM
  • Haquor
    Haquor
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    Volkodav wrote: »
    Even though those L12 and L26 players wont fit in a veteran difficulty group,they still have the right to be there as well.Just dont have them in your group.Let them go it alone,or run a long with you,but not get the benefits from being in the group.
    It's not really a problem.If they arent in your group,dont pay attention to their presence. They just want to play too. :}


    What are you even talking about? how can they 'go it alone' in a vet dungeon once they have joined your group through group finder? or not get the benefits of the group? Dude the problem is they ARE trying to join his/your/my group by adding themselves to finder for a VET dungeon.

    Are you like completely confusing this with delves or public dungeons or something?

    Its quite possible if what the OP is saying is true that group finder can put people without a second skill bar let alone the skills to put in it into a v16 group doing vet 16 scaled dungeon.

    might be a design flaw there ZOS.
  • TequilaFire
    TequilaFire
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    You forget vets have low level alts with battle scaling, 100s of Champion points and experience.
    Rubs some the wrong way when a level 20 beats their V16 though. lol
  • Fruitmass
    Fruitmass
    ✭✭✭✭
    Artjuh90 wrote: »
    Fruitmass wrote: »
    Magdalina wrote: »
    Non vet chars can queue for vet dungeons now?o.O That is odd. Sounds more like an oversight than an intended mechanic I'd say. With all respect for non-vet characters, of course.

    I don't know about console but on PC a non vet character can't queue for an actual Veteran difficulty dungeon with the group finder. Nor can they use the group finder to queue for a dungeon that they do not meet the minimum level requirement for (a lv20 character cannot queue for Vaults of Madness for instance). However any group formed using the grouping tool, even normal difficulty dungeons, get scaled to v15 and the mobs to v16.

    well on console peopel can que for the veteran difficulty aswell. they do need the level for the set instance for example fungal grotto they need lvl 12. but they can que for the veteran difficulty right of the bat which gives problem when you try to clear the vet with 3 non-vet. it's at the point i check if they are vet if not leave group try again. and given the fact there is no textchat it can take a whole day to find a actual group for the pledge......

    Yeah, that's a serious oversight. Makes me wonder who was doing what to leave such inconsistencies between platforms.
    Edited by Fruitmass on December 21, 2015 12:20PM
    Beware all ye who log on for here there be typos...
  • Hechicera
    Hechicera
    ✭✭✭
    Volkodav wrote: »
    Hechicera wrote: »
    Magdalina wrote: »
    However any group formed using the grouping tool, even normal difficulty dungeons, get scaled to v15 and the mobs to v16.

    Hysterically, even if every single one of them is level 12-16. Aaaaand, since everyone is scaled, our soulgems won't rez. Massive rage quitting ensues. Why yes, I have that t-shirt.

    Hysterically?

    Can you think of a better term for scaling a bunch of L12's with no or almost no passives to VR15 to fight VR16 monsters, all because they chose to use a tool to find a group (supposedly faster) than shouts?

    It is fairly comical. I think yakkity sax music should be playing in the background as we're all frantically kiting things around for the 5 minutes it takes to kill the first two trash packs. ;) Bam-da-baddah-ba-da-bumb-ba-daddah-bad-bumba-badaa .....
  • Shadesofkin
    Shadesofkin
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭
    Drives me bananas when a non-veteran shows up in a Vet LFG search. I'm willing to risk a 49+ but not some lvl 15 or 25. It isn't fun and then I feel like a jerk for having to say "I'm sorry you can't come" because we want to do it quickly rather than hand hold and watch for dead weight (and I say that with the least malice I can)
    @shadesofkin -NA Server.
    Tier 2 Player.
    MagDK Main forever (even in the bad times)
  • Young_Archiebold
    Young_Archiebold
    ✭✭✭
    Volkodav wrote: »
    Even though those L12 and L26 players wont fit in a veteran difficulty group,they still have the right to be there as well.Just dont have them in your group.Let them go it alone,or run a long with you,but not get the benefits from being in the group.
    It's not really a problem.If they arent in your group,dont pay attention to their presence. They just want to play too. :}

    Lol what?! You need to get me touch with your dealer, I'm tired of smokin that dirty, i need w/e it is that you got!
    Edited by Young_Archiebold on December 21, 2015 4:53PM
  • Slurg
    Slurg
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭
    I did Fungal Grotto the other day (veteran selected at the top level but not in the bottom menu). Group finder put me with level 12 and 15 characters with stats scaled up to V16 (the level of the character I was playing).

    We wiped several times but I stuck it out to see if it was possible to finish it as a veteran grouped with a bunch of lowbies. Yes, it was possible.

    But the super low levels just don't have the skill points or skills unlocked to play effectively scaled up to that level and it takes a lot longer for the group to finish. I know I'm not perfect either, but we really should have a choice when we are selecting from the menu to only group with other veterans - or at least level 45 and up eligible for pledges - even for normal difficulty.
    Happy All the Holidays To You and Yours!
    Remembering better days of less RNG in all the things.
  • Artjuh90
    Artjuh90
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭
    @slug im not saying i mind grouping up with lower levels at normal dungeons. i've done this enough but the veteran difficulty you couldn't que before and hearing that you can't still do it on pc i find it strange you can at console.at lower level even the normal can be a challenge especially for the newer players who don't know the mechanics yet and might be new to grouping up.
  • Enodoc
    Enodoc
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    NewBlacksmurf wrote: »
    Is this a question that consider the NPC as Vet to define the dungeon as a vet dungeon
    Or
    Are you talking about the actual vet dungeons which are different than normal dungeons also scaled at Vr16?
    Yeah I was wondering the same. Veteran dungeons should only be available after you hit 50, not at Lvl 12, so if they are, that must be a bug. But that's not the same thing as a Normal dungeon with vet-rank mobs in it.
    UESP: The Unofficial Elder Scrolls Pages - A collaborative source for all knowledge on the Elder Scrolls series since 1995
    Join us on Discord - discord.gg/uesp
  • Khaos_Bane
    Khaos_Bane
    ✭✭✭✭✭
    ✭
    IMO, it's great that the low level characters can queue for normal dungeons, and I didn't know someone as low as 12 could queue for Vet mode. Yes, in normal mode they scale to v16, but I am fine with that. It allows low level characters to find groups easily and it's not really hurting other players at all. In fact, I like the challenge it presents at times.
    Edited by Khaos_Bane on December 22, 2015 1:42PM
This discussion has been closed.