Maintenance for the week of April 6:
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 6
• PC/Mac: No maintenance – April 6
Is Large Scale PvP Really A Good Idea?
Panda_iMunch
✭✭✭✭
While I understand that by all means it is a very good thematic style of player vs. player combat, the way the game plays doesn't agree with it. How many times has the game been broken and needed to be fixed by patches? Even some of the combat changes, like the diminishing damage on AoE abilities in large groups, seem to go against large scale pvp. Hell, even IC is made out to be small scale pvp. At this points, i'm just waiting for the arenas to show up, that would be fun as heck!
More: Just to be clear, I am not asking for the removal of large scale pvp, I'm simply trying to say that certain aspects, changes, and issues seem like they would favor more of a smaller group pvp, like arenas. Large scale pvp is awesome and all, it's just that the issues it causes with balancing and lag makes it seem like large scale pvp was not intended at times. Seems like they are trying to push for more dueling and arena style fighting.
Edited by Panda_iMunch on December 16, 2015 8:30PM More: Just to be clear, I am not asking for the removal of large scale pvp, I'm simply trying to say that certain aspects, changes, and issues seem like they would favor more of a smaller group pvp, like arenas. Large scale pvp is awesome and all, it's just that the issues it causes with balancing and lag makes it seem like large scale pvp was not intended at times. Seems like they are trying to push for more dueling and arena style fighting.
1
-
Panda_iMunch✭✭✭✭I enjoy it. Sure...there are some hiccups. But it is still immensely fun.
That is true, but I'm saying that the game seems to be designed, or at least altered, to work better with small scale pvp.0 -
MisterBigglesworth✭✭✭✭✭
✭The devlopers want to push everyone toward using seige (it was recently implied that faster and more powerful seige weapons would be part of the "solution" to the AOE caps problem, for example) but the problem is players don't really like seige. They want to actually play the character they built. Go figure.Really we do it without like, the musical instruments. This is the only musical: the mouth. And hopefully the brain attached to the mouth. Right? The brain, more important than the mouth, is the brain. The brain is much more important.3 -
Panda_iMunch✭✭✭✭MisterBigglesworth wrote: »The devlopers want to push everyone toward using seige (it was recently implied that faster and more powerful seige weapons would be part of the "solution" to the AOE caps problem, for example) but the problem is players don't really like seige. They want to actually play the character they built. Go figure.
And that's kinda where my point is. While the game has that large scale pvp with AoE caps and zergs, the game itself seems to favor smaller scale pvp due to design choices. :^)0 -
maxjapank✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭MisterBigglesworth wrote: »The devlopers want to push everyone toward using seige (it was recently implied that faster and more powerful seige weapons would be part of the "solution" to the AOE caps problem, for example) but the problem is players don't really like seige. They want to actually play the character they built. Go figure.
This is absolutely not true. Siege has always been a part of the game. They weren't meant to simply take walls down. They were meant to be used against players as well. It's fine if some don't like to use siege. Don't. Others will. And fyi, some people are looking forward to siege changes.0 -
MisterBigglesworth✭✭✭✭✭
✭MisterBigglesworth wrote: »The devlopers want to push everyone toward using seige (it was recently implied that faster and more powerful seige weapons would be part of the "solution" to the AOE caps problem, for example) but the problem is players don't really like seige. They want to actually play the character they built. Go figure.
This is absolutely not true. Siege has always been a part of the game. They weren't meant to simply take walls down. They were meant to be used against players as well. It's fine if some don't like to use siege. Don't. Others will. And fyi, some people are looking forward to siege changes.
Yeah, but I'm pretty sure it's just a means to an end. Why would you enjoy playing as a seige weapon all the time rather than making use of your own class, abilities, gear, everything you worked on leveling up.Really we do it without like, the musical instruments. This is the only musical: the mouth. And hopefully the brain attached to the mouth. Right? The brain, more important than the mouth, is the brain. The brain is much more important.0 -
Baconlad✭✭✭✭✭
✭I have to say I LOVED battlegrounds in WoW. Having a pvp guild and running battlegrounds was incredibly fun. I think sometimes that ESO should adopt battlegrounds, (that's what I thought that IC upper city districts were going to be). But at the same time, it worries me that a battleground system would absolutely kill cyrodil. Would love I arenas were a little bigger than just two V two...i like at least ten V ten0 -
GreenSoup2HoT✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I just wanna see game-play like in the trailer. You could have even bigger battle's and literally have one campaign if the server could handle it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9utl3m08Vu0 Edited by GreenSoup2HoT on December 15, 2015 9:50PMPS4 NA DC4 -
maxjapank✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭MisterBigglesworth wrote: »MisterBigglesworth wrote: »The devlopers want to push everyone toward using seige (it was recently implied that faster and more powerful seige weapons would be part of the "solution" to the AOE caps problem, for example) but the problem is players don't really like seige. They want to actually play the character they built. Go figure.
This is absolutely not true. Siege has always been a part of the game. They weren't meant to simply take walls down. They were meant to be used against players as well. It's fine if some don't like to use siege. Don't. Others will. And fyi, some people are looking forward to siege changes.
Yeah, but I'm pretty sure it's just a means to an end. Why would you enjoy playing as a seige weapon all the time rather than making use of your own class, abilities, gear, everything you worked on leveling up.
I don't think you'll be playing siege all the time. I envision that siege will get overrun pretty quickly because of how more deadly they will be. And siege operators can also be hit by other siege. You're definitely going to have to be careful of red circles now, though.
0 -
Personofsecrets✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭noRest in Peace:
The Dragonknight
2014-2025
This commemoration is for the class that has constantly been plundered and dismantled by designers for no obvious reason while other classes continue to have coherent skill lines and feel both powerful and cool.0 -
dday3six✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes and no. I think the biggest mistake was trying to force PVE and PVP to co-exist. Imagine if the size of Cyrodiil was cut and all PVE activities were removed. I'd wager there'd be a lot less lag. Then balance would be more simple, because it could be done independently for each mode. There would be no worry about balance changes causing ripple effects between the modes.3 -
leepalmer95✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I like it when it doesn't lag, which is only in IC at the moment open cyrodill is disgusting with how much lag there is.PS4 EU DC
Current CP : 756+
I have every character level 50, both a magicka and stamina version.
RIP my effort to get 5x v16 characters...0 -
dRudE✭✭✭I'm all for the siege change, it should do more damage than a single player can. I think it needs a sort of skill line though, if a level 10 can put out as much damage on the first time they siege as a vet16 high alliance rank who has a lot of experience using it then it pidgeon holes low levels into being siege monkeys. If the vet put out more damage with siege then a strategic decision would have to be made before expecting the low level to do it.
Faster reload and better accuracy passives or something~Necrow0 -
Panda_iMunch✭✭✭✭I'm all for the siege change, it should do more damage than a single player can. I think it needs a sort of skill line though, if a level 10 can put out as much damage on the first time they siege as a vet16 high alliance rank who has a lot of experience using it then it pidgeon holes low levels into being siege monkeys. If the vet put out more damage with siege then a strategic decision would have to be made before expecting the low level to do it.
Faster reload and better accuracy passives or something
Not a bad idea, would give way to more strategy, but would screw over people with little skill points. Can't really base the change off them though :^)0 -
MisterBigglesworth✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes and no. I think the biggest mistake was trying to force PVE and PVP to co-exist. Imagine if the size of Cyrodiil was cut and all PVE activities were removed. I'd wager there'd be a lot less lag. Then balance would be more simple, because it could be done independently for each mode. There would be no worry about balance changes causing ripple effects between the modes.
Announced today by Blizzard devs for upcoming PvP system:The only contribution your gear will make to your overall power is through a small modifier based on your average item level. For every point that your average item level increases, your pre-determined PvP stats will increase by 0.1%. That means a 25 item level difference between two players only results in a 2.5% difference in stats, compared to the 25% difference it makes today. There’s still a little incentive to improve your gear – a concept we think is important for World of Warcraft – but the benefits are much less pronounced.
These changes bring a couple of major advantages. First of all, it puts everyone participating in organized PvP on a much more even playing field. Obviously, you'll still want to unlock your Honor Talents to reach your full potential, but you'll be able to hold your own in battle in the meantime.
...and a whole lot more information besides!
http://blue.mmo-champion.com/topic/396120-legion-pvp-preview/
So refreshing to see a dev that cares about fairness and balancing.Really we do it without like, the musical instruments. This is the only musical: the mouth. And hopefully the brain attached to the mouth. Right? The brain, more important than the mouth, is the brain. The brain is much more important.1 -
Robbmrp✭✭✭✭✭
✭I enjoy it. Sure...there are some hiccups. But it is still immensely fun.
Totally. Even with the lag at times, large scale PVP is a LOT of fun. It's 10 times funner when there's minimal to no lag.
On a weekend night a few months back, my wife and I ended up in a 2 hour battle between the Alessia Farm and Mine that was about 60v60. It was a blast with everyone on there, the game was working great as it was late at night so the server wasn't pop capped. It was a blast that I hope to see again very soon!NA Server - Kildair2 -
JMadFour✭✭✭✭✭I have to say I LOVED battlegrounds in WoW. Having a pvp guild and running battlegrounds was incredibly fun. I think sometimes that ESO should adopt battlegrounds, (that's what I thought that IC upper city districts were going to be). But at the same time, it worries me that a battleground system would absolutely kill cyrodil. Would love I arenas were a little bigger than just two V two...i like at least ten V ten
DAoC style Siege RVR is a unique brand of PVP that only exists in a small handful of games.
I love that style of PVP. It's massive, and immersive(to me) and fun in a way that the generic team deathmatch arenas and small battlegrounds that every other MMO has never was for me.
I loved PVP in DAoC. I've hated PVP in every other MMO I've played since, except for GW2 and pre-battleground WoW. I loved the Open World Horde vs Alliance PVP in WoW before they decided that PVP should only be played in a 10x10 box.
I sincerely hope that ZOS does not give up on this style of PVP in favor of a shoehorned version of the generic team deathmatch/capture the flag that every other MMO has.
Keep iterating and make Cyrodiil better at what it is supposed to be, rather than changing it to something else.Edited by JMadFour on December 19, 2015 4:54AM0