Animation cancelling - a skill to learn - confirmed it is not an exploit and can be used

Asmael · December 2015

JMadFour wrote: »

there needs to be a tutorial in the game somewhere to teach people how to cast 4 spells at the exact same time through animation canceling.

it also needs to explain and stress the importance of the fact that most players do it, that it is a perfectly legal and valid thing to do, and that is the reason that you die instantly in Cyrodiil from attacks that you cannot see.

Sigh.

The misinformation is real.

Does the term "GCD" or "Global CoolDown" rings a bell?

altemriel · December 2015

actually I am not sure according to which metrics it should be considered exploit or "unintended game mechanics". If I have a slow internet router, I get low ping (If I understand it correctly), so my game is slower. If I buy a better router, 5GHz for example, I get higher ping. What more is to say to that argument

. If you get a computer with weak graphic card, you get low graphic settings, can you then tell Zos, please decrease system requirements, you are harming us players, with weak graphic cards? No.

So why are you doing this thing about internet speed and ping?

I mean who are we to decide what is an exploitable bug or what is "unintended game mechanics"? Zos has stated that, they create the code. I have been now the previous two hours training the AC on mobs in one dungeon and one quest. It was pretty easy to do, I am not sure if Alcast or Deltia said it in their AC tutorial videos, but it only takes little practice to "rewire your brain" than instead of the regular combat pattern, light attack, heal, skill, skill, heavy attack, ultimate.... you do he AC pattern, which can be ultimate, light attack-skill, heavy attack-skill, skill-block, heal-dodge roll, heal-swap weapons. it is similar to the hearth beat frequency, the speed that you have to press the two buttons after each other. With one second casts (like wrecking blow or executioner of dragon knight) using skill-block key combination, you wait until the sword is half way there and then press block, it cancels the maybe half of the animation. It is totally not that hard. Of course you can do then large AC patterns, even the whole fight can be of ACs. But that requires really much practice for sure. Well, it is here and it will not be removed soon I guess, so lets use it, or be in disadvantage

. what more to say

? It is not that super hard science to do it, I practice it now maybe 3 hours and it goes already, starting to go. so guys, practice makes the master

!

RinaldoGandolphi · December 2015

Shunravi wrote: »

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

Shunravi wrote: »

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

As i said in your other thread.

AC gives players with a lower ping a far too big of an advantage against players with a higher ping.

Using my 60 ping vs 120 ping example, a 60 ping user with AC against a 120 ping user, that 120 ping user might as well have a 180 ping that's how much of a disadvantage he is put against with AC in its current form. There is no way to shake this as fair, this is as far as Ball groups getting a 50% damage reduction because they are protected by an AOE cap.

Look, I don't want Animation canceling gone altogether, I would however like to see AC slowed down a bit so maybe it takes 1 whole sec to rip off 3 attacks instead of 0.4 secs...I think that's a fair middle ground as over half this games population don't have a ping below 100, they shouldn't be ridiculously disadvantaged because of it, if you have a ping below 100 that's a huge advantage it itself, I think having the ability to rip off 3 attacks in 0.4 Secs is a bit much when you have a 50% lower ping advantage already, I think slowing AC down a bit is a fair middle road, no one wants its gone completely, atleast I know I don't.

I often play with 200+ ping. I can still cancel.

You missed the point entirely, it has nothing to do with canceling. What it has to do with is having 50% less latency + The ability to cancel your animations this gives you an absurd advantage over someone with a higher ping then you because your "ahead" of the action, you see things on your screen sooner then he does already, being able to cancel in such a matter just adds insult to injury, it has nothing do with the canceling itself especially in PVE. The AC is just an indirect advantage that hurts players with higher pings disproportionaly in comparison to to players with lower ping.

if two players of equal skill with a 60 ping fight each other, AC is a non issue because neither one of them are behind the action, however when someone has literally 50% less latency you do and is AC you will never win that fight, you will lose 100% of the time every single time to an equally skilled player...if AC wasn't as it is right now, you would have "a chance" maybe only a 25% chance but you would still have a chance...between 2 equally skilled players, AC + higher ping = zero chance of you winning period.

I just want to state, I don't want AC removed from the game, i just want it slightly tweaked, you should still be able to do it to some degree.

We all AC here to some degree because the game currently requires us to do so. At this point though, it really don't matter to me if they change anything or not as it won't relaly matter with the current latency spikes going on in th game the last few months...AC is the least of our issues right now

It gives me far more of a chance than if we both didnt have it.

(Im a bit amused you responded)

Im glad your amused

If you both couldn't AC the game would be boring.

Actually though i'd rather they fix the lag first and see how things fall before they do anything else.

altemriel · December 2015

Asmael wrote: »

JMadFour wrote: »

there needs to be a tutorial in the game somewhere to teach people how to cast 4 spells at the exact same time through animation canceling.

it also needs to explain and stress the importance of the fact that most players do it, that it is a perfectly legal and valid thing to do, and that is the reason that you die instantly in Cyrodiil from attacks that you cannot see.

Sigh.

The misinformation is real.

Does the term "GCD" or "Global CoolDown" rings a bell?

exactly, it is not like that, you can not do 4 skills in one second, only if they would be instant casts. but that you have to press these keys after another: skill-block, skill-block,skill-block, skill-dodge roll (or skill-sweap weapon), in about a speed of a heart beat. you can not do that all in one second for sure I guess. But yes, for the two one second cast skills of my DK for example - wrecking blow and executioner, it cancells maybe half or quarter of the animation, so from 1 second cast becomes half or 3/4 second cast. Still a decent advantage in PVE and PVE. But if you want, watch the video more above in my post, about the samurai guy, he is from this time and he can hit a fired bullet with his sword and slice it on two halves. How cool is that? Do you imagine that he is doing it somehow with his brain? How can he know where the bullet will go and in that super speed of the bullet? Would you call that animation cancelling or is it his skill of speed and precision? I mean it is exactly the same situation. A virtual world, which enables us to get really fast and increase our dps, our speed with keys and so with weapons or skills.

Any race, any level, any class or build can do that. Would you not use heavy attacks if someone would write about it in the forum, that that is disadvantage about players using it, as we normally do not use it, we are in disadvantage, nerf it or at least little bit decrease the damage of heavy attacks ZOS? No. Become fast with fingers and keys is the new mastery. Deal with it

MisterBigglesworth · December 2015

The reason you die in 1 second from an attack you never even saw is because of lag, not animation cancelling.

However, does it really matter what the reason is? You still died in 1 second. You still had no chance to fight back. Such garbage.

altemriel · December 2015

MisterBigglesworth wrote: »

The reason you die in 1 second from an attack you never even saw is because of lag, not animation cancelling.

However, does it really matter what the reason is? You still died in 1 second. You still had no chance to fight back. Such garbage.

well, in my opinion, the main reason why I die in 1 - 2 seconds in Cyrodiil is because I am a beginner in PVP. I was playing only half year ago some PVP, died a lot, had to ride those distances many times back, porting on keeps does not work many times. I joined some groups, big raids even and I got lag only like 5 - 10 times. It was really nothing to worry about from my side. I am not sure if it was less populated campaign, but it were fights for keeps with 30 + players on both sides, sieges, wall breaking, door breaking, gates fights, also 30+ players and I got almost no lags. So I am not sure if it is not more your internet connection speed and maybe computer speed. I have 5 GHz wi-fi router, 30 Mbit connection (I think 30), computer on max graphics.

Notebook - Intel Core i7 4720HQ Haswell, 17.3 "LED anti-glare 1920x1080 EWV, RAM 16GB NVIDIA GeForce GTX 980M 4GB SSD + HDD 512 gigabytes 2000 gigabytes 5400 RPM, DVD, WiFi ac, Bluetooth 4.0, HD webcam, USB 3.0, HDMI, Thunderbolt, WiDi , backlit keyboard, play AC Unity, backpack, headset, Leap motion, mouse, Windows 8.1 64-bit.

And I got some PVP skills (rapid maneuver is great) and that was all. if I would get better in PVPing, I would not die so fast I guess.

p_tsakirisb16_ESO · December 2015

Typical defending of animation cancelling again... yeah brush it under the "skill" carpet the keyboard made macros.
Plenty of information there how to create those macros, and what hardware is needed.
And the significant majority are using them.
ZOS should apply a cooldown, to balance out the Templars whos abilities are channeled.

Asmael · December 2015

p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »

Typical defending of animation cancelling again... yeah brush it under the "skill" carpet the keyboard made macros.
Plenty of information there how to create those macros, and what hardware is needed.
And the significant majority are using them.
ZOS should apply a cooldown, to balance out the Templars whos abilities are channeled.

The misinformation is real (bis).

1) misunderstand not only animation cancelling, but also what macros are, macros give you an extra 0% DPS output.

0%.

Why? because it doesn't bend the game mechanics, it doesn't change the GCDs and doesn't allow you to do anything faster.

2) Animation cancelling CAN BE DONE with channeled abilities. You can use a LA before jabs / jesus beam, and you can medium / heavy weave at the end of one.

3) Even if you don't realize it, you use animation cancelling, even if to a limited extent.

p_tsakirisb16_ESO · December 2015

You miss the point. Because i can assign these to macro mate, no need to bash keys all the time.

However refusing to use a broken mechanisn because is there either way. Same reason i do not hit the wall at vwgt last boss, to cheat like every one else does.

Shunravi · December 2015

p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »

You miss the point. Because i can assign these to macro mate, no need to bash keys all the time.

However refusing to use a broken mechanisn because is there either way. Same reason i do not hit the wall at vwgt last boss, to cheat like every one else does.

What is hitting the wall? Dont think ive ever heard of that before.

altemriel · December 2015

p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »

Typical defending of animation cancelling again... yeah brush it under the "skill" carpet the keyboard made macros.
Plenty of information there how to create those macros, and what hardware is needed.
And the significant majority are using them.
ZOS should apply a cooldown, to balance out the Templars whos abilities are channeled.

wait wait, I totally was not talking about doing it trough macros. Macros are forbiden and should lead to banning the player. I was talking about fast using of keyboard combinations in the right time frames. That is a skill and I am for it.

altemriel · December 2015

p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »

You miss the point. Because i can assign these to macro mate, no need to bash keys all the time.

However refusing to use a broken mechanisn because is there either way. Same reason i do not hit the wall at vwgt last boss, to cheat like every one else does.

Not anyone knows how to use macros. I don`t. Also I would never use them, as I know it is forbiden and I can be banned for it. I am not sure if ZOS has ways to detect who is using macros. But I would rather not try it, to be sure. It is the same as using exploits. I read here once, that there are tons of possible exploits, which are shared between some players and that many people are using them. Yes, but I would never use them. For example the infinite stamina bug, which was possible few monts ago. Now fortunatelly fixed already. I watched it on youtube how to do it, tried it, it really was easy to do and gave you infinite stam regen in 1 second. I would never use it in PVP. From one simple reason - I would not want anyone other use it on me in PVP. But still I know there are people who lack moral maturity and misuse exploits for their unfair advantage.

Animation cancelling is a valid combat mechanics. Anyone can learn it (if not talking about people with medical conditions/disabilities, but mostly anyone). It is not considered cheating by ZOS, they want people to use it. So what is the problem with it? I don`t get it.

But explain pls why you call it a broken mechanics, when even the lead combat designer Eric Wrobel said this:

"Animation cancelling, we are embracing it, and animation cancelling is part of the game and it`s an interresting sort of skill mechanics and the timing is little bit different between different abilities, it is just kind of interresting thing. So it is fully ok if you do that. It is not a hack nor exploit nor cheating or anything, So continue to animation cancel and do more damage."

source:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ThZtwhYkKSs