Speak more on this, please.

I just opened enough silver chests to get a motif, but I've not been in an undaunted dungeon in a while.

I actually like that there are crafting materials that can only obtained by doing dungeons. It might not be perfect, but it's much better than almost all other styles that require no effort to craft them as soon as you have the motif.

Its cool to have a material (and style) thats rare and only acquirable through dungeons..

Why must everything be the same?

I have done 8 silver pledges up to now (reluctantly at first but they went well so far, all of them using the group tool, so I might keep going just to level the Undaunted skill line) and got zero laurels. Do they only drop in gold pledges? I am kinda terrified of those...

On the other hand I have bought/found all the motif chapters and I keep getting more in the silver rewards. It's annoying to know how to craft something but not being able to get the materials for it.

svartorn wrote: »

WTS 100+ Laurel

I'm crying as I read this...

I have all chapters learnt, and completed 12 silver pledges up to now: got a total of 2 laurels from endbosses. At this rate it will take me ages to get a full set... so this style I will craft only for myself.

The problem with Mercenary is not just laurels, it's the whole mechanic for the drops.

The drop rate for the motif is ridiculously high, which has completely devalued it. People don't even want the pages if you offer them for free, they are so common and yet crafters have to struggle to provide mercenary crafting services because it unfairly caters to one specific type of player - the one who has one main that does everything.

You like playing on mostly one character, you're golden. You don't miss out on anything. If you have more than one character that's specialized, you are at a huge, unprecedented disadvantage for no over-all benefit to the game. No mechanic has ever demanded that all your characters be good at all the skills for you to enjoy the rewards of doing content. I can obtain a Valkyn Skoria helm for my DK DD while healing on my Templar. This has never been criticized as a bad thing.

This mechanic is the equivalent of requiring a character to have destruction staff skill line leveled to 50, have 10 skill points in the passives and have a fire staff in inventory to obtain a Valkyn helm. A stamina DD or a tank shouldn't be forced to do that just so he can obtain something that's useful for a different character.

Encouraging alts is good for the game because it allows for greater grouping flexibility. I've never had to consider that I would suffer a serious penalty if I switch to a different role in order to help out my group until now.

The mercenary motif hasn't made crafters suddenly more useful. The new 6-9 trait sets that are in demand have helped. If anything, the fact people can't take their laurels to a crafter and get a set means they are now forced to take up crafting themselves, thus further devaluing crafting as a profession.

Crafting should have value, I heartily support this. The best and most useful items should require extensive trait research. Motif learning should be difficult - make it so you require prior motif knowledge to unlock other motifs.

Maybe you need to know how to make Akaviri Daggers before you can learn Akaviri Swords. Maybe some kind of combination motifs even. Need Motif A and Motif B to unlock Motif C.

I enjoy crafting, I enjoy doing dungeons - what I don't enjoy is having to shelf my alts because logging into the 'wrong' one is a mistake.

Any of the following alternatives is better

1. Laurel - BoP gold item that only drops for crafter-mains and is also available from crownstore.

Laurel Leaf - BoE refinable item that drops uncommonly from silver and bronze chests (to encourage people to do silver pledges instead of just gold or make it part of the special loot bag drop for LFG tool formed groups) for all pledge runners- tradeable. 10 laurel leaves refine to 1 laurel.

OR

2. Laurel - drops rarely from end boss of veteran dungeons for all runners, is BoP and can be banked. Also available from crownstore.

OR

3. Laurel - drops very rarely from end boss of veteran dungeons for anyone, is BoE and can be banked. Alternative available from Crownstore called Crown Laurel in packs of 10.

In addition, severely cut down on the drop rate of the mercenary motif. Only drops from gold chests though I fear it's too late for this. Epic items should never be so common that within 4 weeks of their release they are consigned to level of vendor trash.

Any of these alternatives are more helpful across the board. It's a mid-high value item that people can trade for gold and/or favours stimulating the economy and incentivizing grouping through the LFG tool or doing silver/low level pledges.

Erdmanski wrote: »

Lithium Flower wrote: »

The problem with Mercenary is not just laurels, it's the whole mechanic for the drops.

The drop rate for the motif is ridiculously high, which has completely devalued it. People don't even want the pages if you offer them for free, they are so common and yet crafters have to struggle to provide mercenary crafting services because it unfairly caters to one specific type of player - the one who has one main that does everything...

Your argument makes no sense to me. You complain that the laurels are too rare and the motifs are too common, so you just want to switch them? Does that really make a difference in the end?

As you pointed out, it's not that hard to get a few pages of the motif. It's also not that difficult to find a group to farm vet dungeons at VR1 for the laurels. So is there really a problem with the mechanic or do you simply want everything immediately available without any work required? I personally like the fact that there is something that requires a well-rounded character and some grind to acquire.

If ZOS keeps catering the game to people not willing to put in any work, the game is going to die fast. The fact that you can take a brand new character to VR16, fully gear them and get 100+ champion points in a week or two is ridiculous.

Yeah, that's it. I have 6 veteran 16 characters, one at veteran 6, 9 traits learned for every craft, 90% motif knowledge because I don't want to put in work.

I want the motif to be more rare. I want the laurels to drop less. I want these to be more valuable and retain their value longer while at the same time being available with more flexibility, like other important drops. There is no other drop/system in the game that punishes you for playing with an alt and for good reason. It is a good thing to be able to farm/grind on whichever one of my characters is more useful to the group. This is equivalent to Bind on Character and is a bad thing. Imagine if Kena helm was Bind on Character - who would ever bring a tank to the dungeon? Or a healer or damage dealer to farm Bloodspawn?

If I want to farm for a perfect Kena helm, I can join on any of my characters that fills a needed role instead of passing up on the opportunity to join a group activity because I derive no benefit from it (or worse lose out). This is a good thing for the game because it promotes grouping. Where as if I want to farm laurels, I can only selfishly bring one character. Not only is this frustrating for me, it is also frustrating for the group searching for a healer, because there is less incentive for me to log in with a different character and help them.

The mechanic as it is, is not making the item more valuable or rare - because the motif pages and the laurels both drop far too commonly. Every pledge run you make with a character that has the pages learned gets a laurel. Every chest you open showers you with motifs. Where is this so called 'work' that I'm afraid to put in? The only thing this mechanic discourages is people using alts to farm laurels and there really is no logical reason for the game to be doing that because alts are a good thing. You want long term players to have lots of alts, it makes them play longer, and keep playing (and paying). It helps group activities because there is an overall greater pool of characters to fill roles.

Less BoP items and more rare BoE items are also a good thing because it encourages the game's economy. A PvE only player farming for laurels he can sell in a guild store is good. He can get gold to buy his potions from a crafter who only likes to solo and wants to purchase laurels so he can fulfill an order for a PvPer who doesn't care for dungeons. There's a healthy flow of gold and people able to do the activities they enjoy instead of every one having to spend hours doing things they don't enjoy.

newtinmpls wrote: »

Lithium Flower wrote: »

Every pledge run you make with a character that has the pages learned gets a laurel. Every chest you open showers you with motifs.

Have not yet gotten any laurels. This is despite my having used my dozen or so keys to get the ... 4? Not sure, but all the motifs I got I learned on the same character.

Feel free to give me your "extra" motifs any time.

4? More like 20 smthin

Get loads of them, Laurels as Well i don't see whats The big deal. So one material is hard to get....

You could give all the motif pages that you can't even give away, to your alts. But, the only problem with that is that they probably don't have the crafting skill level to learn them.

I don't do group dungeons - never have, and so have consigned myself to the fact that I won't be crafting this style. Unless, of course, the Laurels become available in the Crown Store. I have one page of the motif that someone gave to me, but I haven't learned it yet since I don't know if I'll be able to craft in that style.

Same goes for the Akaviri motif. I don't PVP so don't have the ridiculous amounts of AP to purchase the pages or the style material. I've seen a few of the pages at Guild traders at rather fair prices, as well as a few of the Ancient Scales (at rather expensive prices). This is another style that I've resigned myself to not being able to craft.

But, this is my choice. I don't expect them to change anything. If I really wanted them, then I would run dungeons and start doing PVP. But I don't enjoy those activities, so I just live with it. Perhaps they'll become available in the Crown Store, and that's probably the point of why they're restricted to only certain game activities. It gives something for those that love doing Undaunted pledges or PVP, but gives more incentive for someone who doesn't enjoy those activities to just purchase them in the Crown Store. Remember, both of these motifs are available in the base game, so they want to provide some incentive for people to purchase them in the Crown Store.

lolo_01b16_ESO wrote: »

I actually like that there are crafting materials that can only obtained by doing dungeons. It might not be perfect, but it's much better than almost all other styles that require no effort to craft them as soon as you have the motif.

I disagree. Once you know the motif you should be able to craft the gear. Making new motifs several pages long and hard to get was more than enough. Nearly unobtainable mats should NEVER have become a thing. Worst decision ever ZOS.