What exactly IS The Elder Scrolls Online?

UltimaJoe777 · November 2015

Due to something I had to help my family with yesterday I was unable to make the Live session and I am now going through it and something Rich said bothers me. @ZOS_RichLambert , one of the developers of this game, actually used the term "endgame" when he was discussing Veteran Rank removal. MMORPGs are not supposed to end and I realize this term is figurative but it really makes you wonder...

Is The Elder Scrolls Online supposed to end or is it supposed to be endless like any other MMORPG? Perhaps a little elaboration on this would be nice from Zenimax's end? Feel free to discuss this freely though.

Overbowed · November 2015

Endgame in an mmo just means you are at the level cap/done the content and are in a sort of limbo busying yourself with raids, dungeons, repeatable and dailies until the next piece of content comes out. It doesn't mean you get a "you win" screen at some point.

Phinix1 · November 2015

"Sometimes a cigar is just a cigar."

I haven't watched the video, but if I had to guess I would say in this context, he was probably referring to the "end game" for veteran levels not the the end game for the game.

WolfingHour · November 2015

Endgame in the context of vr change, in that removing vr is the final stage of the CP to VR shift perhaps?

Endgame
noun
1.
Chess. the final stage of a game, usually following the exchange of queens and the serious reduction of forces.
2.
the late or final stages of any activity:
the end game of the negotiations.

UltimaJoe777 · November 2015

Overbowed wrote: »

Endgame in an mmo just means you are at the level cap/done the content and are in a sort of limbo busying yourself with raids, dungeons, repeatable and dailies until the next piece of content comes out. It doesn't mean you get a "you win" screen at some point.

Yeah and so many of the MMOs I've played have either made it hard to reach said cap or impossible or just had no cap. This game though... way too friggin easy, and all because people don't wanna grind? Pfft.

It just really makes you wonder where Zenimax wants to take this game ya know?

RedTalon · November 2015

It will go on till there is nothing more left to say, or its no longer profitable.

Given the time frame involved in elder scroll lore, their most likely is a plan to eventually close the stories down the road.

Don't know how to do the spoiler flag, but given their are more dreadic princes about to play their game on the world, and lines are being drawn among them...they sound like they have end things iin mind down the road. It was good to see the blind-man one last time since he died in my orc's story and my orc let the two love birds be together.

Just my two crowns.

UltimaJoe777 · November 2015

RedTalon wrote: »

It will go on till there is nothing more left to say, or its no longer profitable.

Given the time frame involved in elder scroll lore, their most likely is a plan to eventually close the stories down the road.

Don't know how to do the spoiler flag, but given their are more dreadic princes about to play their game on the world, and lines are being drawn among them...they sound like they have end things iin mind down the road. It was good to see the blind-man one last time since he died in my orc's story and my orc let the two love birds be together.

Just my two crowns.

The game has its quirks but is overall fine. Compared to Skyrim it's far more playable at least lol

I just wish we had more MMO elements with long-term goals, besides CPs that is.

Elsonso · November 2015

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

Overbowed wrote: »

Endgame in an mmo just means you are at the level cap/done the content and are in a sort of limbo busying yourself with raids, dungeons, repeatable and dailies until the next piece of content comes out. It doesn't mean you get a "you win" screen at some point.

Yeah and so many of the MMOs I've played have either made it hard to reach said cap or impossible or just had no cap. This game though... way too friggin easy, and all because people don't wanna grind? Pfft.

It just really makes you wonder where Zenimax wants to take this game ya know?

ZOS wants to build up a ton of content over time, most of it DLC content. They want anyone to be able to do it, all the way up to endgame players.

RedTalon · November 2015

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

RedTalon wrote: »

It will go on till there is nothing more left to say, or its no longer profitable.

Given the time frame involved in elder scroll lore, their most likely is a plan to eventually close the stories down the road.

Don't know how to do the spoiler flag, but given their are more dreadic princes about to play their game on the world, and lines are being drawn among them...they sound like they have end things iin mind down the road. It was good to see the blind-man one last time since he died in my orc's story and my orc let the two love birds be together.

Just my two crowns.

The game has its quirks but is overall fine. Compared to Skyrim it's far more playable at least lol

I just wish we had more MMO elements with long-term goals, besides CPs that is.

The clockwork city from the sounds of it, sounds like it may be more group focus. If we are indeed talking an opening war between the three princes mentioned

dday3six · November 2015

Typically 'endgame' is the content which provides motivation to keep players playing after they have reached max level and/ or completed the main scenario. It's the filler between expansions.

You're over thinking it, and running on a false narrative. "End" in that context refers to a stage of content progression. Honestly it's a pretty commonly used phase in video gaming as a whole. Endgame Gear - Endgame Raiding - Endgame Content.

UltimaJoe777 · November 2015

dday3six wrote: »

Typically 'endgame' is the content which provides motivation to keep players playing after they have reached max level and/ or completed the main scenario. It's the filler between expansions.

You're over thinking it, and running on a false narrative. "End" in that context refers to a stage of content progression. Honestly it's a pretty commonly used phase in video gaming as a whole. Endgame Gear - Endgame Raiding - Endgame Content.

Understandable, but at the same time it makes you think you have so little to do just because it uses the word "end" ya know? Also to be frank this is the first MMO I've ever played where people use that phrase lol but it's probably more used in P2P games, which I always avoided.

BabeestorGor · November 2015

Endgame always seems to be used by mmo players when talking about their characters in sp games like Skyrim. They're always planning their endgame character, trying to decide if they should do a quest before they have their endgame character (because the rewards might be less if done earlier). Personally I despise the idea. My characters take decisions based on the needs of the moment or because it suits the character's personality, not some dim and distant endgame, but then I'm not a very efficient player

Tholian1 · November 2015

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

Overbowed wrote: »

Endgame in an mmo just means you are at the level cap/done the content and are in a sort of limbo busying yourself with raids, dungeons, repeatable and dailies until the next piece of content comes out. It doesn't mean you get a "you win" screen at some point.

Yeah and so many of the MMOs I've played have either made it hard to reach said cap or impossible or just had no cap. This game though... way too friggin easy, and all because people don't wanna grind? Pfft.

It just really makes you wonder where Zenimax wants to take this game ya know?

Limit yourself to playing an hour per day like some of us have no choice about, and you will quickly experience the feeling of not ever making any progress or seeing any light at the end of the tunnel. I am in no danger of reaching the end of the game.

UltimaJoe777 · November 2015

Tholian1 wrote: »

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

Overbowed wrote: »

Endgame in an mmo just means you are at the level cap/done the content and are in a sort of limbo busying yourself with raids, dungeons, repeatable and dailies until the next piece of content comes out. It doesn't mean you get a "you win" screen at some point.

Yeah and so many of the MMOs I've played have either made it hard to reach said cap or impossible or just had no cap. This game though... way too friggin easy, and all because people don't wanna grind? Pfft.

It just really makes you wonder where Zenimax wants to take this game ya know?

Limit yourself to playing an hour per day like some of us have no choice about, and you will quickly experience the feeling of not ever making any progress or seeing any light at the end of the tunnel. I am in no danger of reaching the end of the game.

Same here but most games I play I invest so much time into getting far but this one? So far already without trying, and I am dragging my feet!

Sausage · November 2015

If Im right ESO is doing good job, CP is endgame, you can play or no, then when expansion comes everyone joins for them as CP is detached from it, so you dont need to grind CPs in order to enjoy an expansion.

NewBlacksmurf · November 2015

First....please stop thinking that MMO means anything other than a game played on a server with a massive amount of players. Next...it's a role plying game... That's it

Endgame can be what was mentioned but this specific game was to always have elements of TES gameplay so you will be frustrated if you're expecting a WoW like or Everquest like game.

The game design is determined by the devs and what and how it evolves is based on devs interpretation of player habits, data and feedback.

Ch4mpTW · November 2015

NewBlacksmurf wrote: »

First....please stop thinking that MMO means anything other than a game played on a server with a massive amount of players. Next...it's a role plying game... That's it

The game design is determined by the devs and what and how it evolves is based on devs interpretation of player habits, data and feedback.

I agree with this, and I must say. I notice quite a few people tend to make this "mistake" of classifying a MMO more than what it actually is. A MMO is a massive/massively multiplayer online (game). That's it. There's not much else to look into it. However, there are sub-genres to this such as: MMORPG which means Massively Multiplayer Online Roleplaying Game. And even then, as said. The overall design is chosen by that particular group of developers, and how they choose to modify it. It being either the early-game (beginning content), mid-game (intermediate content), and end-game (usually the "final touches" of gear, lore, etc.).

Artjuh90 · November 2015

the right anwser is a videogame

Shardaxx · November 2015

All games end, even if there isn't a defined "you completed the game" moment, you do all the content and get bored and go play something else, and eventually the servers close down.

temjiu · November 2015

Ch4mpTW wrote: »

First....please stop thinking that MMO means anything other than a game played on a server with a massive amount of players. Next...it's a role plying game... That's it

The game design is determined by the devs and what and how it evolves is based on devs interpretation of player habits, data and feedback.

yes and no. Sure, we can try and be analytical about an "MMO" and say it's just a massively multiplayer online game, but as with many facets of life that exist beyond a dictionary or isolated test environment, things tend to be allot more complicated.

MMO's as a genre have been around long enough, with enough evolution, that the Market expects certain things. Take a look at the iPhone as an example. not that I like them personally, but they pretty much revolutionized the cellphone industry, and Cellphones went from traditional cellphones to smartphones. any current manufacturer of Cellphones would be hard put to market a flip phone with no screen, no memory, no web surfing, and just the basic buttons. Sure, by description it's a Cellphone...but the market has evolved to the point that it has expectations that are far beyond what the basic description of a cellphone is.

In very much the same way, MMO's have evolved, and many things have become expected from the market. No matter what the dev's decide they are going to do, the market still has the final say. ESO has already felt that bite once already, and part of this huge shift in the End game is due to that Market influence. Wildstar underwent a very similar shock shortly after it's release.

MMO means more then just Massive and Multiplayer now. It's not the fault of the dictionary, it's the fault of the developers themselves, driven often my market demands (and inter-company politics). However, that being said, ESO certainly can be called an MMO, even if it isn't meeting all the market expectations at this time. But, it may not be the MMO that people want to play.

On the Subject,

I have seen a few MMO's recently start to refer to Endgame as "Elder Game" instead. I've actually been using that term myself, it just seems more fitting. most MMO's have a huge amount of things to do once you hit the level cap per-se, especially ESO. so Calling it the game at the end is a bit misdirecting IMO. Elder Game, on the other hand, denotes a point in the game where you have developed into a different stage in life, hopefully a sager, wiser, and more experienced version of yourself (hey, lvl 50 is allot more experience then lvl 1). it also denotes that the game continues, instead of ending. Just my 2 cents.

PrinceBoru · November 2015

ESO certainly is unique in its approach.
Ask all players and get all different answers.
Hence the confusion.
What is the game to me?
Perhaps that is the question gamers should concern themselves with.

Artjuh90 · November 2015

this feels like the same thing they do with metal.
have to name every brand/band a different genre

nimander99 · November 2015

Endgame = Doing the same couple activities over and over and over and over and over and over again till you gain an item that is about 1% better than the previous piece of gear...

Endgame for me = I hit cap and the progressive story is completed... returning in the next dlc, unless of course I haven't hit cap then I continue playing (I love you Champ System)

mtwiggz · November 2015

Whut?

Volkodav · November 2015

UltimaJoe777 wrote: »

Overbowed wrote: »

Endgame in an mmo just means you are at the level cap/done the content and are in a sort of limbo busying yourself with raids, dungeons, repeatable and dailies until the next piece of content comes out. It doesn't mean you get a "you win" screen at some point.

Yeah and so many of the MMOs I've played have either made it hard to reach said cap or impossible or just had no cap. This game though... way too friggin easy, and all because people don't wanna grind? Pfft.

It just really makes you wonder where Zenimax wants to take this game ya know?

Dont take this wrong,but not everyone finds this game as easy as you seem to.Not that I have a problem with it.I mean there are tons of players who like a challenge,but do not like their enemies to be so overpowered as to be nearly unkillable.Not everyone wants to stand still and wait,sometimes for hours,for someone to group with.
Not all people are hard core stat and endgamers. It's hard to strike a balance with players who are in it for the quests,etc,and those who want a hard challenge. Not being disrespectful to you though. :}