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The problem isn't macros, it's animation cancelling, and we might be stuck with it.
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magnusthorek✭✭✭✭✭
✭And this is the reason why I don't go PvP and I almost don't do veteran dungeons either. PvP is full of, with the excuse of the word, ***, that because of these "tricks", for example, are able to stop fighting a monster / enemy, kill players of other alliances that are just passing through, without being killed by the said monster / enemy in the meanwhile.
And in veteran dungeons, that are not as well balanced to all classes as they should (try to pass the netches part in Darkshade Caverns with a sorcerer, for example) those top dog cheaters players abandon the fight in the middle of it because someone in their team is not as good as they are because can't cheat master as they can.
As a result, for example, as far as I could notice, Monster Helmets are being held by a fraction of players while the great majority that really could be benefited by their bonuses.I am the very model of a scientist Salarian, I've studied species Turian, Asari, and Batarian.
I'm quite good at genetics (as a subset of biology) because I am an expert (which I know is a tautology).
My xenoscience studies range from urban to agrarian, I am the very model of a Scientist Salarian.0 -
Ezareth✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭Thread Necro FTL.Permanently banned from the forums for displaying dissent: ESO - The Year Behind
Too Much Bolt Escape - banned for "hacking the game to create movement not otherwise permitted by in game mechanics."
Ezareth VR16 AD Sorc - Rank 36 - Axe NA
Ezareth-Ali VR16 DC NB - Rank 20 - Chillrend NA
Ezareth PvP on Youtube3 -
Gilliamtherogue✭✭✭✭✭
✭Stop necroing animation canceling threads.Old member of The Order of Mundus, Mostly Harmless, Hostile, and Genesis Elite. Avid theorycrafter. Herald to competitive stamina DPS pre 1.5. How far we've come!
Have questions? Send me a message on the forums or my other social media. Seeing people learn is my dream and passion.
Guides and other fun videos at https://youtube.com/c/gilliamtherogue4 -
Knootewoot✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Emma_Eunjung wrote: »Why did ZOS add animation cancelling to ESO? Because all the alternatives were BAD. If the devs had coded ALL actions to lock out other actions until their animations were finished, combat in ESO would feel extremely sluggish and unresponsive. This is NOT what most players want from ESO, especially the players who came from a background of the Elder Scrolls single player games, which are known for their snappy combat. Animation cancelling is not a bug, it's a feature... and a good feature in my opinion.
Not that good. If I shoot arrows at a DK I know I have to stop once he flaps his wings. But if the cancels his flappy wing I can't even see the animation is it NOT a good feature.
Before people did animation cancelling, nobody complained about the game being to sluggish.
For me, I wish it was "removed", but I don't know the concequences or however you write that (im not native English). Zos doesn't know it either is my guess. That is why it is still here. Because above example might not harm PvE, but in PvP some animations are ment to play so people can react to it accordingly.٩(͡๏̯͡๏)۶
"I am a nightblade. Blending the disciplines of the stealthy agent and subtle wizard, I move unseen and undetected, foil locks and traps, and teleport to safety when threatened, or strike like a viper from ambush. The College of Illusion hides me and fuddles or pacifies my opponents. The College of Mysticism detects my object, reflects and dispels enemy spells, and makes good my escape. The key to a nightblade's success is avoidance, by spell or by stealth; with these skills, all things are possible."0 -
kuscoe✭✭✭KiraTsukasa wrote: »To quote a Bioware dev on the subject of animation cancelling during Mass Effect 3 multiplayer matches:
"Sounds to me like clever use of game mechanics."
How do I favorite this?
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Skiserony✭✭✭Imo Animation cancelling is a good feature. If we get rid of that the combat gameplay will be much less responsive. And once combat gameplay fails in ESO we're pretty much done.2 -
Idinuse✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭
Imo it's clear and in black and white right there. Third party hardware and software giving players advantages in playing abilities. Advantages players without such third party hardware and software lack. Looking the other way when players clearly violate the ToS gives a bad taste in my mouth.
ToS from EsoYou agree not to use any hardware or software or any other method of support that is not authorized by ZeniMax or that may in any way influence or advantage Your playing abilities, or influence or advantage Your use of the Services. Third party tools, the use of ‘bots’, “speed hacks”, “deep-link”, “page-scrape”, “robot”, “spider”, algorithm or other programs that copy or monitor any part of the Services (including, but not limited to, the Game(s) and/or forums).
Nothing about macros being illegal
An alternative could be to actually add macro programming to the key bindings in the UI, then at least this would be to some extent offered to all players, regardless of the price of their keyboard/mouse or third party software.
And yes, I do agree that the more macro users in an area in Cyrodiil, the bigger the lag, for some reason.
Edited unnecessary wording.Edited by Idinuse on November 9, 2015 2:05PMSed ut perspiciatis unde omnis iste natus error sit voluptatem accusantium dolorem que laudantium, totam rem aperiam, eaque ipsa quae ab illo inventore veritatis et quasi architecto beatae vitae dicta sunt explicabo. Nemo enim ipsam voluptatem quia voluptas sit aspernatur aut odit aut fugit, sed quia consequuntur magni dolores eos qui ratione voluptatem sequi nesciunt. Neque porro quisquam est, qui dolorem ipsum quia dolor sit amet, consectetur, adipisci velit, sed quia non numquam eius modi tempora incidunt ut labore et dolore magnam aliquam quaerat voluptatem. Ut enim ad minima veniam, quis nostrum exercitationem ullam corporis suscipit laboriosam, nisi ut aliquid ex ea commodi consequatur? Quis autem vel eum iure reprehenderit qui in ea voluptate velit esse quam nihil molestiae consequatur, vel illum qui dolorem eum fugiat quo voluptas nulla pariatur?1 -
kupacmac✭✭✭Animation cancelling doesn't equate to responsive combat. That's a lame excuse to keep such an exploit in the game. Responsive combat means your character reacts as you execute your skills. When I use animation cancelling I feel disconnected from my character. He's doing one thing on screen while I'm having him do something else... something I don't even see. If I use attack #1 and then instantly use attack #2, the responsive reaction would be attack #1 gets interrupted and attack #2 starts.1 -
Skiserony✭✭✭Animation cancelling doesn't equate to responsive combat. That's a lame excuse to keep such an exploit in the game. Responsive combat means your character reacts as you execute your skills. When I use animation cancelling I feel disconnected from my character. He's doing one thing on screen while I'm having him do something else... something I don't even see. If I use attack #1 and then instantly use attack #2, the responsive reaction would be attack #1 gets interrupted and attack #2 starts.
It's something you practice, and it does feel more reesponsive actually. Being able to weapon swap immediately, or block the moment you give the command to, fire a light or heavy attack right when you want to and not a little bit after the animation. It is more responsive, even for those who have,'t mastered animation cancelling yet. It's not that hard, just keep trying to do it.
It's not an exploit either, it's a fair mechanic.1 -
caperon✭✭✭✭Animation cancelling doesn't equate to responsive combat. That's a lame excuse to keep such an exploit in the game. Responsive combat means your character reacts as you execute your skills. When I use animation cancelling I feel disconnected from my character. He's doing one thing on screen while I'm having him do something else... something I don't even see. If I use attack #1 and then instantly use attack #2, the responsive reaction would be attack #1 gets interrupted and attack #2 starts.
It's something you practice, and it does feel more reesponsive actually. Being able to weapon swap immediately, or block the moment you give the command to, fire a light or heavy attack right when you want to and not a little bit after the animation. It is more responsive, even for those who have,'t mastered animation cancelling yet. It's not that hard, just keep trying to do it.
It's not an exploit either, it's a fair mechanic.
That is perfectly fine, but cancelled animations should have cancelled efect. If you cancel your light atack, you don't do dmg. If you cancel your skill with block, it dosn't fire.1 -
Kublakan✭✭✭I hate animation canceling without cancelling the ability effect. Or you allow animation cancelling and cancel the ability, or you let throught the animation. You can not have both.Edited by Kublakan on November 9, 2015 3:25PM0 -
Forestd16b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭So any reason why we can't get rid of both? Get rid of macros and animation cancelling. Just sayin.0 -
rager82b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »So any reason why we can't get rid of both? Get rid of macros and animation cancelling. Just sayin.
Many players want to get rid of animation canceling. It does more harm than good for the game, and breaks the oh so ever immersion that the devs kept preaching about.
Balance can't happen until we fix this problem first.0 -
Lenikus✭✭✭✭✭Animation cancelling > Part of the game.
Using third party (not in the game) stuff > Not allowed.
/thread.... Mai cave. >:35 -
rager82b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Animation cancelling > Part of the game.
Using third party (not in the game) stuff > Not allowed.
/thread.
If animation canceling stays in the game. You might as well macro. It is telling the players that abusing the game system is ok, because they don't care enough to balance it out.
So go ahead and macro. It is not like you are going to get caught. Any good keyboard and mouse has a program built into it.
/thread0 -
kupacmac✭✭✭It's not an exploit either, it's a fair mechanic.
It is the very definition of an exploit:
"In video games, an exploit is the use of a bug or glitches, game system, rates, hit boxes, or speed, etc. by a player to their advantage in a manner not intended by the game's designers."
Edited by kupacmac on November 9, 2015 4:10PM0 -
rager82b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭The problem is One developer said that it was not intended. The other one said it is.
It seems like the devs are kinda clueless. As anyone can plainly understand that something that hits you that you can't see is bad game design.Edited by rager82b14_ESO on November 9, 2015 4:11PM0 -
Calippe_Hac✭✭rager82b14_ESO wrote: »The problem is One developer said that it was not intended. The other one said it is.
It seems like the devs are kinda clueless. As anyone can plainly understand that something that hits you that you can't see is bad game design.
Nice discussion but I tend to agree with the above.
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TheDarkShadow✭✭✭✭✭
✭I agree that there should be a way to immidietly block or dodge roll when you need, but block or roll should also cancel the effect of the skill as well as the animation. An example for this is Dark Deal, a sorc skill that has 1s animation. Its tooltip said "instant cast", but if you block before the 1s animation end, you wont get the heal from it. It's one of the rare skills you cant cancel animation, probably because it had a 1s cast time before they changed it to instant cast, but for some reason didnt totally fix the effect goes off time. I think all other skills including light/heavy attack should be the same. You cancel its animation, you cancel its damage/effect.Edited by TheDarkShadow on November 9, 2015 4:50PM0 -
Erock25✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭ontheleftcoast wrote: »On my main bar I have '4' bound to Conjured Ward and '5' bound to Critical Surge. If I press and release 4 then press and release 5 both animations play out but if I use rollover and press them at the same time only one animation plays. However I get both spells cast. That's rollover taking advantage of the ZOS coding decision on packet delays.
All through this terrible thread with a terrible necro and no one can even point out that the OP doesn't even know what animation cancelling is? What he describes up there is impossible or a bug and not a part of animation cancelling. If you simultaneously press two instant cast abilities at the same time you WILL NOT get both effects at once.You earned the 500 LOLs badge.
You received 500 LOLs. It ain't no fluke, you post great stuff and we're lucky to have you here. +50 points2 -
thelordoffelines✭✭✭✭✭Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »So any reason why we can't get rid of both? Get rid of macros and animation cancelling. Just sayin.
Ya because it would ruin combat in the game it would be removed.1 -
Resipsa131✭✭✭KiraTsukasa wrote: »To quote a Bioware dev on the subject of animation cancelling during Mass Effect 3 multiplayer matches:
"Sounds to me like clever use of game mechanics."
Reload cancelling your claymore? That game was a blast
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Digiman✭✭✭✭✭Imo Animation cancelling is a good feature. If we get rid of that the combat gameplay will be much less responsive. And once combat gameplay fails in ESO we're pretty much done.
Do you even know how animation canceling works!?
You have to press the sequence buttons in less then a 0.2 seconds, otherwise it won't register and the animation plays out.
Your outright lying and using a illogical fallacy. Combat wouldn't become clunky, it would be the same. The only difference is you wouldn't have a massive amount of damage done to you without being able to respond to each attack in the reaction you would if it wasn't done through animation canceling.0 -
CyrusArya✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I love the combat system in ESO as it is at this very moment. In fact, this is what hooked me to the game in the first place and what has kept me here. The fact that despite being an RPG, it plays very much like an action oriented game with fast-paced combat, demand for quick reflexes, and the option to improve your performance by improving your skill with the given interface. I don't want to play runescape. I don't want to play World of Warcraft. I don't want to play final fantasy. I want to play ESO. If a fundamental change is made that might jeopardize this most cherished aspect of the game to me, I can't guarantee I'll stick around.
Removing animation canceling in my view will definitely make the game more clunky and unresponsive. This is because it will disable our ability to weave and chain abilities as we currently can, and that is a staple of how combat works in this game. Period. Feel free to disagree, idc. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, sure. But here is my opinion: Don't fix what ain't broken. Cus then you run the risk of actually breaking what was and is the shining success of this game, its brilliant combat system.
And just a side note, if you can't compete in PvP now and can't complete vet dungeons and you think animation canceling is the reason, I guarantee you will still suck should this be removed.
In short: Git gud and L2P. Stop trying to fundamentally change the game to cater to your incompetence. A fundamental change like this is like opening pandora's box, and will have much broader and resounding ramifications than you can readily anticipate.3 -
rager82b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭I love the combat system in ESO as it is at this very moment. In fact, this is what hooked me to the game in the first place and what has kept me here. The fact that despite being an RPG, it plays very much like an action oriented game with fast-paced combat, demand for quick reflexes, and the option to improve your performance by improving your skill with the given interface. I don't want to play runescape. I don't want to play World of Warcraft. I don't want to play final fantasy. I want to play ESO. If a fundamental change is made that might jeopardize this most cherished aspect of the game to me, I can't guarantee I'll stick around.
Removing animation canceling in my view will definitely make the game more clunky and unresponsive. This is because it will disable our ability to weave and chain abilities as we currently can, and that is a staple of how combat works in this game. Period. Feel free to disagree, idc. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, sure. But here is my opinion: Don't fix what ain't broken. Cus then you run the risk of actually breaking what was and is the shining success of this game, its brilliant combat system.
And just a side note, if you can't compete in PvP now and can't complete vet dungeons and you think animation canceling is the reason, I guarantee you will still suck should this be removed.
In short: Git gud and L2P. Stop trying to fundamentally change the game to cater to your incompetence. A fundamental change like this is like opening pandora's box, and will have much broader and resounding ramifications than you can readily anticipate.
LMAO make the game clunky? It is clunky because hits happen that you can't see. You can't react to invis swings.
So going to toss the L2p back at you. People who don't want it change, want to abuse a system that people would be able to time blocks and counter, but can't see it coming so can't. So you want to dumb down the combat.
It works both ways.0 -
kupacmac✭✭✭I love the combat system in ESO as it is at this very moment. In fact, this is what hooked me to the game in the first place and what has kept me here. The fact that despite being an RPG, it plays very much like an action oriented game with fast-paced combat, demand for quick reflexes, and the option to improve your performance by improving your skill with the given interface. I don't want to play runescape. I don't want to play World of Warcraft. I don't want to play final fantasy. I want to play ESO. If a fundamental change is made that might jeopardize this most cherished aspect of the game to me, I can't guarantee I'll stick around.
Again, animation cancelling does not equal responsive combat. None of what you describe above would change if they fixed animation cancelling. You guys act like animation cancelling takes leet skills. It doesn't.0 -
Digiman✭✭✭✭✭I love the combat system in ESO as it is at this very moment. In fact, this is what hooked me to the game in the first place and what has kept me here. The fact that despite being an RPG, it plays very much like an action oriented game with fast-paced combat, demand for quick reflexes, and the option to improve your performance by improving your skill with the given interface. I don't want to play runescape. I don't want to play World of Warcraft. I don't want to play final fantasy. I want to play ESO. If a fundamental change is made that might jeopardize this most cherished aspect of the game to me, I can't guarantee I'll stick around.
Removing animation canceling in my view will definitely make the game more clunky and unresponsive. This is because it will disable our ability to weave and chain abilities as we currently can, and that is a staple of how combat works in this game. Period. Feel free to disagree, idc. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, sure. But here is my opinion: Don't fix what ain't broken. Cus then you run the risk of actually breaking what was and is the shining success of this game, its brilliant combat system.
And just a side note, if you can't compete in PvP now and can't complete vet dungeons and you think animation canceling is the reason, I guarantee you will still suck should this be removed.
In short: Git gud and L2P. Stop trying to fundamentally change the game to cater to your incompetence. A fundamental change like this is like opening pandora's box, and will have much broader and resounding ramifications than you can readily anticipate.
Clunky how? Point .3 second to input a skill after a light attack then press block in a instance or have the animations play out? Or do you use macros for it instead?
It's broken, being unable to respond to stream of instant attacks in less then a second isn't skill, it's borderline speed hacking.
I have used animation canceling and I don't like it. A person in real life can't swing a baseball bat then run immediately to first base right as the ball is hit without following through with the swing.
Removing it won't cause a pandera's box of problems, you can still move and do other things. Especially considering THE WHOLE POINT OF ANIMATION CANCELING REQUIRE INSTANT ABILITIES!
My solution is logically simple, using such abilities in animation cancelling increases the cost by 50%, light attacks do less damage when animated cancelled.
After all if you not putting all your effort into attack you are wasting energy and not completing a swing only weakens the landing.
Especially when I try to chop a person with sword but stop halfway to use a thrust instead.0 -
Digiman✭✭✭✭✭rager82b14_ESO wrote: »I love the combat system in ESO as it is at this very moment. In fact, this is what hooked me to the game in the first place and what has kept me here. The fact that despite being an RPG, it plays very much like an action oriented game with fast-paced combat, demand for quick reflexes, and the option to improve your performance by improving your skill with the given interface. I don't want to play runescape. I don't want to play World of Warcraft. I don't want to play final fantasy. I want to play ESO. If a fundamental change is made that might jeopardize this most cherished aspect of the game to me, I can't guarantee I'll stick around.
Removing animation canceling in my view will definitely make the game more clunky and unresponsive. This is because it will disable our ability to weave and chain abilities as we currently can, and that is a staple of how combat works in this game. Period. Feel free to disagree, idc. Everyone is entitled to an opinion, sure. But here is my opinion: Don't fix what ain't broken. Cus then you run the risk of actually breaking what was and is the shining success of this game, its brilliant combat system.
And just a side note, if you can't compete in PvP now and can't complete vet dungeons and you think animation canceling is the reason, I guarantee you will still suck should this be removed.
In short: Git gud and L2P. Stop trying to fundamentally change the game to cater to your incompetence. A fundamental change like this is like opening pandora's box, and will have much broader and resounding ramifications than you can readily anticipate.
LMAO make the game clunky? It is clunky because hits happen that you can't see. You can't react to invis swings.
So going to toss the L2p back at you. People who don't want it change, want to abuse a system that people would be able to time blocks and counter, but can't see it coming so can't. So you want to dumb down the combat.
It works both ways.
Or macro it.0 -
rager82b14_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭I love the combat system in ESO as it is at this very moment. In fact, this is what hooked me to the game in the first place and what has kept me here. The fact that despite being an RPG, it plays very much like an action oriented game with fast-paced combat, demand for quick reflexes, and the option to improve your performance by improving your skill with the given interface. I don't want to play runescape. I don't want to play World of Warcraft. I don't want to play final fantasy. I want to play ESO. If a fundamental change is made that might jeopardize this most cherished aspect of the game to me, I can't guarantee I'll stick around.
Again, animation cancelling does not equal responsive combat. None of what you describe above would change if they fixed animation cancelling. You guys act like animation cancelling takes leet skills. It doesn't.
Yup, I don't think people understand really what it is.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eTb2YpuRsP4
This is not only not immersive, but it also is bad game design as animation is pretty pointless in this game.0
