Where is Movarth Piquine in the Tamriel World?

Ethromelb14_ESO · November 2015

One of the many reasons why there were naysayers about this game... Is because of ZOS lack of lore accuracy when it comes to the elder scrolls series. Shouldn't Movarth Piquine have existed in this time period? As well as the anonymous individual - obviously vampire - that turned him? According to the book Immortal Blood... If we are the Keerilth... Where does the invulnerability to sunlight come in to play?

On another related note. To greater inspire vampire players to feed. Why isn't sunlight invulnerability made contingent on feeding? The longer the player goes without feeding, the greater the debilitating affects of the sun, except of course at night time. This will allow players to either decide to play as strictly a night prowler or to feed in order to function in daylight society. I think it's a much better idea than the current one.

And if ZOS is concerned with how to implement this new feature. Simply create a storyline that involves the sunlight curse that befalls the player vampire, forcing us in to darkness. Perhaps the caster strives to make the curse a complete imprisonment from the day, but we (vampires) find and fight the caster - interrupting the spell - just a little too late. We're able to add an ingredient told to us by Lamae (our Matron Mother) that will at least give her children a surviving chance in the sun. Please think about this. Many players would enjoy the attention to detail, and only the truly dedicated to vampirism will remain as such. Thanks for reading.

RinaldoGandolphi · November 2015

lordrichter wrote: »

Ethromelb14_ESO wrote: »

One of the many reasons why there were naysayers about this game... Is because of ZOS lack of lore accuracy when it comes to the elder scrolls series. Shouldn't Movarth Piquine have existed in this time period? As well as the anonymous individual - obviously vampire - that turned him? According to the book Immortal Blood...

He may not have been born by 2E582, and even if he walks Tamriel, as mortal or vampire, the world is large and he is small.

It is a valid speculation that the one who made him was a member of what we know as the Cyrodiil vampire clan, experts in concealment and political finesse. These vampires, in 2E582, would be spread across Tamriel. Cyrodiil is not a seat of power at the moment. Movarth may yet make an appearance, if he exists as a vampire.

Movarth Piquine was alive in the 2nd Era 582 as he was one of the hand to hand trainers of the Fighter's Guild was chartered in this time frame. This means the Vampire who turns him is indeed alive at this time.

I have pointed out many lore inconsistency with this game before, but most simply don't care....the whole Sun light thing is stupid.....

Vampire's Weakness to the Sun was because of Arkay and Auriel(if you played Dawnguard you would know this), and nothing Molag nor Lamae can do can change that.

The ONLY VAMPIRES that can walk around in the sun without being burned by it are the f Vampire's from Cyrodill known as "the Order"

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Manifesto_Cyrodiil_Vampyrum

To Kin-father Molag Bal, who brought forth the Bloodmatron Lamae to spite Arkay, we owe our existence, as do all vampires, though not all honor Him. For him we revel in the feast, and acknowledge the gift adrift in our veins. To patron Clavicus Vile, beacon o'er our affairs, we owe our successes and social stature. Our bond with Vile makes us unique among our kind, for his guidance steels our savage craving with reason and savvy. For him we live amidst mankind, and twist them to our will from offices of power.

Clavicus Vile is the Daedric Prince of Power and Granting of wishes Thats his Sphere of Influence. If you play Skyrim go to Haema's Shame, there is a Shrine to Clavicus Vile there with a bunch of Vampires begging him to talk to them...what do they want? the ability to walk in the sun.....of which ONLY VILE has the power to grant for a price because thats his sphere of influence. Vile actually makes the Vampires appear human and weakens the Sun's influence over them as long as they feed.

its absolute lore breaking that Vampires in ESO can walk around in the sun with no bad effects.

Does anyone remember Vythur from Skyrim's Dawnguard?

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Vyrthur

He was a Snow Elf who was driven underground and into hiding by Ysgrammor and the 500 Companions after the Night of Tears in the late Merethic era! which is a few thousand years before the events of TESO. Vythur was bite not long after, and was plotting to corrupt Auriel's Bow so he could "Block out the sun and Auriel's Influence" so he would no longer be effected by it....why would he do this? He would be as close to Lame's line as you could possibly get yet he is vulnerable to the sun.....

ESO reasons for Vampires being able to walk around in the sun is just a crock and reconning at its finest when we have documented proof that only those who made a Pact with Clavicus Vile are able to do so and are able to look human.

Look in Skyrim,. when Vampires enter towns, the Guards attack them on sight because they are blood thirsty monters that don't have Vile's Gift to appear human and blend in. They have always been weak against the Sun because Auriel and Arkay made them so when Molag Bal created Lame to spit Arkay, that was Arkay and Auriel's response to Molag's Abomination....Vile gave the Cyrodillic Order a gift in a deal he made with them, but he made no such deals with any other Vampires....and Vile only did so because these vampires would be mucking around in governmental affiars and positions of power which is in Vile's realm and spehere of influence....and they were cursed with having to feed much more often or else they wouldn't blend in anymore and the sun would burn them again.

Elsonso · November 2015

Ethromelb14_ESO wrote: »

One of the many reasons why there were naysayers about this game... Is because of ZOS lack of lore accuracy when it comes to the elder scrolls series. Shouldn't Movarth Piquine have existed in this time period? As well as the anonymous individual - obviously vampire - that turned him? According to the book Immortal Blood...

He may not have been born by 2E582, and even if he walks Tamriel, as mortal or vampire, the world is large and he is small.

It is a valid speculation that the one who made him was a member of what we know as the Cyrodiil vampire clan, experts in concealment and political finesse. These vampires, in 2E582, would be spread across Tamriel. Cyrodiil is not a seat of power at the moment. Movarth may yet make an appearance, if he exists as a vampire.

RinaldoGandolphi · November 2015

Ethromelb14_ESO wrote: »

And if ZOS is concerned with how to implement this new feature. Simply create a storyline that involves the sunlight curse that befalls the player vampire, forcing us in to darkness. Perhaps the caster strives to make the curse a complete imprisonment from the day, but we (vampires) find and fight the caster - interrupting the spell - just a little too late. We're able to add an ingredient told to us by Lamae (our Matron Mother) that will at least give her children a surviving chance in the sun. Please think about this. Many players would enjoy the attention to detail, and only the truly dedicated to vampirism will remain as such. Thanks for reading.

I think the Vampire being forced to make a deal with Clavicus Vile that forces them to feed every so often so the Sun don't effect them would be the correct way to handle this as its been established in lore that only the vampires of Cyrodiil are able to blend in and not burn as long as they feed due to such a pact with Vile. It would make sense and be pretty easy to implement.

Enodoc · November 2015

I give them props for trying. They at least tried to retcon in a new strain of vampirism rather than messing with the established ones. They even gave it a logical name in Noxiphilic Sanguivoria.

Elsonso · November 2015

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

Ethromelb14_ESO wrote: »

One of the many reasons why there were naysayers about this game... Is because of ZOS lack of lore accuracy when it comes to the elder scrolls series. Shouldn't Movarth Piquine have existed in this time period? As well as the anonymous individual - obviously vampire - that turned him? According to the book Immortal Blood...

He may not have been born by 2E582, and even if he walks Tamriel, as mortal or vampire, the world is large and he is small.

It is a valid speculation that the one who made him was a member of what we know as the Cyrodiil vampire clan, experts in concealment and political finesse. These vampires, in 2E582, would be spread across Tamriel. Cyrodiil is not a seat of power at the moment. Movarth may yet make an appearance, if he exists as a vampire.

Movarth Piquine was alive in the 2nd Era 582 as he was one of the hand to hand trainers of the Fighter's Guild was chartered in this time frame. This means the Vampire who turns him is indeed alive at this time.

There is no reason to believe that Movarth, or his vampire Sire, would have to exist at the time of ESO. Certainly the Fighter's Guild exists afterwards and he could have been a trainer at a time far removed from 2E582. For all we know, Immortal Blood refers to a series of events that happened in the 3rd Era. I am not certain who decided that it described something from the 2nd Era, but I certainly challenge the assumption.

dodgehopper_ESO · November 2015

Just because Movarth might be around from this era doesn't mean we should necessarily know of him. Remember that Movarth was also located around Morthal, which is far west or east from any playable location in the game. Even then it would be too great a presumption to assume he would reside in Morthal currently. I really don't know what Movarth has to do with anything right now.

I'd like to point out that my vampire lord character in skyrim was not hunted on sight in towns, nor did he have much problem with sunlight (admittedly thanks to enchanting). This had nothing to do with Clavicus Vile. I wouldn't presume clavicus is the only means to be resistant to the sun. All our characters are freaks of nirn, vestiges, imbued with the power of skyshards. I think that having them break a few 'rules' is acceptable in this instance.

Enodoc · November 2015

I just read through all of Immortal Blood and I don't see any references to it being set in the Second Era.

RinaldoGandolphi · November 2015

The Fighters Guild was conceived in 2E 320 by Akavair Potentate Versidue-Shaie. Movarth Pinquine was a hand to hand trainer in the fighters guild for years prior to the events of Immortal Blood.

Paying attention to dialogue, etc in Skyrim will tell you that Movarth was born in the 2nd era, and since he had risen to ranks of hand to hand master trainer of the fighters guild and had been hunting vampires for years prior to the writing of Immortal Blood...it places Movarth right in the period of Interregnum.

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Movarth_Piquine

In Dawnguard, Serena is shocked when she awakes and hears that Cyrodiil is the seat of an Empire and ruling over Skyrim which leads her to say she has been gone" Far longer then planned" this would make Serena around 4,000 years old give or take a century...And we know Movarth succeed in killing a member of the Volihkar clan from Immortal Blood, and that book was written by the priest who turned him

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Lore:Fighters_Guild

http://www.uesp.net/wiki/Skyrim:Idgrod_Ravencrone

In the Skyrim Quest in Morthal, when Jarl Ingrid Ravencrone finds out about the master Vampire Movarth, she states that it was thought he was destroyed a century ago (meaning he was already a vampire for a very long time prior to the Oblivion Crisis being that he was a Master Vampire and built a few different covens over the many centuries he had been alive) Movarth's age is easy to discern because he is a Master Vampire, and the only Vampire type more powerful then him is a Nightmaster Vampire, and Vampires grow in strength the more they feed, the longer they are around, etc...it took a very very long time for Movarth to not only be as powerful as he had become, but he also survived what would kill most other Vampires which is why he was thought to have been dead for nearly a century.

All the lore, cross referencing dates, books, and in game dialogue from previous TES games puts Movarth's turn into a Vampire right dead around the time of the Intergerrum period which ESO takes place...

that does not necessarily mean we would meet him or run into him though....he was mostly likely turned within the 1st 20-30 years of the Fighter's Guild being chartered, and he doesn't appear in Skyrim until about a century after the Oblivion Crisis where he was thought to have been killed but wasn't...Movarth could literally be anywhere in the world at the time of ESO, and it don't break lore for us to not run into him at all, Tamriel is a pretty big place afterall

Gidorick · November 2015

vampires and werewolves is a part of TES that I always ignored (except for bloodmoon) so I wasn't aware of the lore inconsistencies. Those are really glaring inaccuracies. I wonder where Lawrence Schick was when they were designing the vampires?

Rosveen · November 2015

There are 300 years between ESO and the end of the Second Era. Where's proof that Movarth wasn't born later? Even if he's alive, he might not be a vampire yet.

Furthermore, lore consistency doesn't require adding to the game every single person known to be alive in that period, just like it doesn't require showing every single location. It's not a perfect simulation, it's a world cut and scaled down to fit the game it's used in. Large parts of provinces remain unexplored. As it happens, Movarth's lair is located in a part of Skyrim we can't visit in ESO. Even if we could visit, there's no guarantee he lived in the same place back in the Second Era.

Elsonso · November 2015

Yeah.... no one knows when Immortal Blood was written, other than it was written sometime before the events of the Oblivion Crisis. More than that, no one knows when the events described in Immortal Blood actually happened, other than it was prior to the time it was written. Being that Immortal Blood is the only account of Movarth prior to the events in Skyrim, one does have to question whether the events even happened.

Serena is irrelevant to Movarth, other than to note that she was not among the Volkihar vampires that Movarth killed.

The hand-to-hand training for the Fighter's Guild cannot be put to any period of time, or even an Era. Movarth could have been working for the Guild any time after the founding of the Guild.

I would not put a lot of analytical stock in the time it takes to become a Master Vampire. This cannot place Movarth's birth as a vampire definitively in the 2nd Era.

Ravencrone has no idea what era Movarth was born. To her, he is just an old, presumed dead, master vampire from before her time. Anything she knows about him before 4E201 was told to her by someone else.

Movarth does not even seem to be an important vampire. His great claim to fame appears to be an ill-conceived attempt to take over Morthal, which is not exactly a gem of a location. Even if he were alive in 2E582, he would be of no consequence. Were he of some consequence in 2E582, or any time up to Skyrim, he would not have been trying to take over Morthal.

Ethromelb14_ESO · November 2015

lordrichter wrote: »

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

Ethromelb14_ESO wrote: »

One of the many reasons why there were naysayers about this game... Is because of ZOS lack of lore accuracy when it comes to the elder scrolls series. Shouldn't Movarth Piquine have existed in this time period? As well as the anonymous individual - obviously vampire - that turned him? According to the book Immortal Blood...

He may not have been born by 2E582, and even if he walks Tamriel, as mortal or vampire, the world is large and he is small.

It is a valid speculation that the one who made him was a member of what we know as the Cyrodiil vampire clan, experts in concealment and political finesse. These vampires, in 2E582, would be spread across Tamriel. Cyrodiil is not a seat of power at the moment. Movarth may yet make an appearance, if he exists as a vampire.

Movarth Piquine was alive in the 2nd Era 582 as he was one of the hand to hand trainers of the Fighter's Guild was chartered in this time frame. This means the Vampire who turns him is indeed alive at this time.

There is no reason to believe that Movarth, or his vampire Sire, would have to exist at the time of ESO. Certainly the Fighter's Guild exists afterwards and he could have been a trainer at a time far removed from 2E582. For all we know, Immortal Blood refers to a series of events that happened in the 3rd Era. I am not certain who decided that it described something from the 2nd Era, but I certainly challenge the assumption.

Actually, it is likely that Movarth and his sire existed in the First Era. Why? Because... How could the book exist in the Second Era if the events had not occurred already? So it is safe to assume that the events in the book transpired either in the First or early Second Era. The was readable in the Third Era, now the Second. So the question is, how far back does it really go? And once again, why is Movarth and his Sire not in the game, among others like Harkon?

Elsonso · November 2015

Ethromelb14_ESO wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

RinaldoGandolphi wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

Ethromelb14_ESO wrote: »

One of the many reasons why there were naysayers about this game... Is because of ZOS lack of lore accuracy when it comes to the elder scrolls series. Shouldn't Movarth Piquine have existed in this time period? As well as the anonymous individual - obviously vampire - that turned him? According to the book Immortal Blood...

He may not have been born by 2E582, and even if he walks Tamriel, as mortal or vampire, the world is large and he is small.

It is a valid speculation that the one who made him was a member of what we know as the Cyrodiil vampire clan, experts in concealment and political finesse. These vampires, in 2E582, would be spread across Tamriel. Cyrodiil is not a seat of power at the moment. Movarth may yet make an appearance, if he exists as a vampire.

Movarth Piquine was alive in the 2nd Era 582 as he was one of the hand to hand trainers of the Fighter's Guild was chartered in this time frame. This means the Vampire who turns him is indeed alive at this time.

There is no reason to believe that Movarth, or his vampire Sire, would have to exist at the time of ESO. Certainly the Fighter's Guild exists afterwards and he could have been a trainer at a time far removed from 2E582. For all we know, Immortal Blood refers to a series of events that happened in the 3rd Era. I am not certain who decided that it described something from the 2nd Era, but I certainly challenge the assumption.

Actually, it is likely that Movarth and his sire existed in the First Era. Why? Because... How could the book exist in the Second Era if the events had not occurred already? So it is safe to assume that the events in the book transpired either in the First or early Second Era. The was readable in the Third Era, now the Second. So the question is, how far back does it really go? And once again, why is Movarth and his Sire not in the game, among others like Harkon?

All the books are in 2E582, even ones that have not been written yet. That is why the Mages Guild is looking for them. Thank Hermaeus Mora for that.

The Elder Scrolls Online

Where is Movarth Piquine in the Tamriel World?

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