What Ultimate Generation system do you want

Jhunn · October 2015

The 1.5 dynamic ultimate generation

Anything is better than this boring crap we have right now called static ulti gen.

Well, maybe not anything, ZOS could probably come up with some even worse concept.

Speely · October 2015

A dynamic ultimate generation system, but not the 1.5 one (develop)

Jhunn wrote: »

Anything is better than this boring crap we have right now called static ulti gen.

Well, maybe not anything, ZOS could probably come up with some even worse concept.

I will disagree here by saying that a dynamic Ult gain that makes Ultimates super-frequent is a worse alternative. They are generally super-powerful abilities that should be intermittently used. Giving players the ability to make them LESS intermittent based on some kind of performance-based gain is fine, but letting the powerful ones be accessed regularly is bad news. In short, if I had to choose between the current, imperfect system of semi-static gain and the old system of consta-bats/standards/meteors then I will choose the former because I think normal skills should dictate the greater part of battles and that Ultimates should be notable dynamics that affect said battles in a rarer fashion.

ToRelax · October 2015

A dynamic ultimate generation system, but not the 1.5 one (develop)

@Fizzlewizzle
Not very good ideas imo. The first one is punishing players whose playstyle requires less skills/min or weaving. The second one is punishing players for having high resource pools and cost reduction. Both are not at all helping to even the odds in outnumbered fights.

Cathexis wrote: »

Dynamic ultimate gain is certainly good in the context of smaller vs bigger group but it really only favors AoE builds. I have mixed feelings about this because while mathematically it makes sense that you would have to run AoE to damage the most targets, but AoE contributes to the larger systemic problems. AoE skills, especially stacked AoE with heavy animations contributes to serious network lag and the unfavourable AoE blob vs blob combat that many people detest.

Lastly, ultimate generation from skill damage particularly favours AoE ultimates, which means AoE ultimates will become the cookie cutter pigeon hole of the month.

I want to support it, I really do, but it can't just be skill damage = ult. The mechanism has to be rooted in player combat in some other way.

The ultimate you gain form AoE had already been lowered compared to what you gain from singletarget. If the enemies are so stacked up that you still gain more ultimate by uing AoE skills, then AoE is your best option anyway and you should be given more ultimate to give you a fighting chance.

Fizzlewizzle · October 2015

ToRelax wrote: »

@Fizzlewizzle
Not very good ideas imo. The first one is punishing players whose playstyle requires less skills/min or weaving. The second one is punishing players for having high resource pools and cost reduction. Both are not at all helping to even the odds in outnumbered fights.

The first one has indeed a disadvantage for people using HoT and DoT builds (or who have no clue how to weave like i do).
For those type of skills they could "re-introduce" the Heroism buff, which would give the player X ultimate every X seconds.
Of course, every HoT/ DoT skill should have its own Heroism buff, so spamming such skills will only give you the initial 1 ultimate per cast without stacking the ultimate regen from the HoT/ DoT effect. By giving every skill its own Heroism buff you prevent people from losing Ultimate regen when they use more than 1 Hot or DoT skill.

I wouldn't really say that the second one is that punishing for people with higher resources.
Resources have their own advantage in combat. Hitting close to nothing for 95% of the time just to be able to use your ultimate often (which also hits crap) doesn't really seem like a very solid playstyle.
The cheapest Ultimate (Consuming Darkness) costs 50 ultimate. That would mean that you have to spend a total of 500% of your resources to be able to use it. Someone burning through their resources won't be able to last for 5 rounds, it gets you killed.

As for outnumbered fights. Personally, if i know i'm getting overrun, all decency goes out the window.
I start blocking and spamming heals while the enemy chips away my health. That's 3 resource bars getting drained at the same time, Might not be able to survive for long that way, but i know both my Stamina and Magicka will be empty before my health, which will gives me at least 300 ultimate before i die (AS well as the ultimate i gained from the extra HP i gave myself though healing). Might not be the most beautiful style to fight outnumbered battles... but who cares.

pjwb16_ESO · October 2015

The 1.5 dynamic ultimate generation

I guess its pretty clear, 45% prefering 1.5 and 70% are prefering some dynamic ulti system that is NOT the 1.6 or similar to it.
Good Job ZOS with your game development

Quady · October 2015

I would like to see some timer to use and loose ulti, to prevent building ulti before fight.

When u die u should loose ulti and ww form too.

So should be able to build ulti in one hard fight and have to use it there. Costs of ulti should be more similar.

And sure, if u fight 1v3, u should get 3 times more ulti then enemies together.

Jhunn · October 2015

The 1.5 dynamic ultimate generation

Speely wrote: »

I will disagree here by saying that a dynamic Ult gain that makes Ultimates super-frequent is a worse alternative. They are generally super-powerful abilities that should be intermittently used. Giving players the ability to make them LESS intermittent based on some kind of performance-based gain is fine, but letting the powerful ones be accessed regularly is bad news. In short, if I had to choose between the current, imperfect system of semi-static gain and the old system of consta-bats/standards/meteors then I will choose the former because I think normal skills should dictate the greater part of battles and that Ultimates should be notable dynamics that affect said battles in a rarer fashion.

All the current system does is enhancing the zerg powaar. 1.5 gen over 1.6 gen anytime. And I was a templar before 1.6

Sanct16 · October 2015

The 1.5 dynamic ultimate generation

You should generate 1 Ultimate per 2000 (<-- number is just an example) damage done / healing done / damage taken.

Ishammael · October 2015

A dynamic ultimate generation system, but not the 1.5 one (develop)

Sanct16 wrote: »

You should generate 1 Ultimate per 2000 (<-- number is just an example) damage done / healing done / damage taken.

I like it. All playstyles would benefit.

LegendaryChef · October 2015

The 1.5 dynamic ultimate generation

I hate the 1.6 ultimate regen, 1.5 made so much more sense in my eyes. To be honest 1.5 as a whole was just so much better(and enjoyable) than what we currently have and I can't see pvp getting any better because zos seem to be on a one way street with no hope of turning round.

Shunravi · October 2015

The 1.5 dynamic ultimate generation

Sanct16 wrote: »

You should generate 1 Ultimate per 2000 (<-- number is just an example) damage done / healing done / damage taken.

Im wondering for balance, armor type changes the value? or maybe something like your mitigation values influence how much you get from damage taken. im not sure really why but it popped into my head that this should be considered, but it did.

Speely · October 2015

A dynamic ultimate generation system, but not the 1.5 one (develop)

Shunravi wrote: »

Sanct16 wrote: »

You should generate 1 Ultimate per 2000 (<-- number is just an example) damage done / healing done / damage taken.

Im wondering for balance, armor type changes the value? or maybe something like your mitigation values influence how much you get from damage taken. im not sure really why but it popped into my head that this should be considered, but it did.

Nah I think you are on to something here. Damage taken just means that Ult gain would be greater for those with less Armor, but damage passively mitigated would reflect that some players are built around taking damage vs just bad players who take a lot of damage. I like it. Tank types should not be penalized for having better mitigation.

hammayolettuce · October 2015

The 1.5 dynamic ultimate generation

If im fighting 3 people and said 3 people cant kill me because of lack of skill i should get more ultie than them just off of the basis of ..

Git Gud.

Sanct16 · October 2015

The 1.5 dynamic ultimate generation

Shunravi wrote: »

Sanct16 wrote: »

You should generate 1 Ultimate per 2000 (<-- number is just an example) damage done / healing done / damage taken.

Im wondering for balance, armor type changes the value? or maybe something like your mitigation values influence how much you get from damage taken. im not sure really why but it popped into my head that this should be considered, but it did.

Yeah good point. Damage taken should be independant of mitigation. Perhaps even make it damage mitigated with lets say 1 Ultimate per 1000 damage mitigated to help tanks.

Quady · October 2015

Hard to say if before or after mitigations/block..
Cause for example for tanks can be maybe even better when enemy on him get less ultimate even when he get less too..
For dps can be better fight tank that get less ulti too..

I would like to see less ulti depends fights, so im for after mitigations/blocks..

EgoRush · October 2015

The 1.5 dynamic ultimate generation

Oh how I miss the days of seeing multiple Storm Atronachs drop from a single person. And boss battles where DKs basically constantly had banner up haha. That was great, seeing 8-10 banners drop instantly and never go away.

ToRelax · October 2015

A dynamic ultimate generation system, but not the 1.5 one (develop)

Quady wrote: »

Hard to say if before or after mitigations/block..
Cause for example for tanks can be maybe even better when enemy on him get less ultimate even when he get less too..
For dps can be better fight tank that get less ulti too..

I would like to see less ulti depends fights, so im for after mitigations/blocks..

In PvP a tank is completely useless if you are not outnumbered. And if you are, it would help him and his group much more to get an ultimate themselves than reducing the speed at wich enemies gain ultimate. Additionally, There would be even less point in attacking a tank when you get less ultimate for doing so.

Derra · October 2015

A static ultimate generation system, but not the 1.6 one (develop)

No idea what i´ve voted...

Oh good lord. I want my vote back.

I´d like a combination of static (if you have very low gains) and a dynamic system. Like when you´re in combat you´ll be guaranteed to always gain atleast 3 ultimate/s but if you manage to exceed that amount you will get the higher amount.

Axyredo · October 2015

The 1.5 dynamic ultimate generation

I know so many people that would comeback to this game if they changed it back to 1.5 dynamic. The ultimate generation should have never been changed.

Nafirian · October 2015

A dynamic ultimate generation system, but not the 1.5 one (develop)

Dynamic ult gen plox ZOS Theres like 10 threads about dynamic ult gen just plox ;____;

Ignore my vote clicked wrong button._.

Nafirian · October 2015

A dynamic ultimate generation system, but not the 1.5 one (develop)

Rook_Master wrote: »

1.5 Ult Generation was completely broken, and this thread is simply DKs getting nostalgic about dropping Standards every 10 seconds.

Not Really dynamic ult gen made it so small groups could wipe the big grps everyone gains static ult so smaller grps of better coordinnated players find itr harder to wipe the rofl zergs that exist

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

IxSTALKERxI wrote: »

So I was just reading through the comments and I see people discussing how broken spamming ultimates was back in the day and that was their reasoning for voting for the current system...

We do not want the old system back so we can spam ultimates, we want it back because it felt natural and rewarding. As I said earlier the current system feels like a chore is sooo boring and predictable with everyone gaining ultimate at the same rate no matter what they do. It leads to gimmicky playstyles like holding block in the middle of the field or dodge rolling around until your meteor is ready. If you don't have a ranged weapon you have to adapt your playstyle to gain ultimate.

If a system comes back similar to 1.5 it doesn't have to be an 'ulti spam fest'. Balance it so we don't get ultimate too fast.

If that is what you really want, and its not just certain DK/NB ultimate builds that could achieve infinite resources or near unkillability due to insane ultimate generation rate, then the only way to do it is to bring back 1.5 but.
REMOVE all clas based skills and passives that affect ultimate. No more infinate resource DK builds from Battle Roar. No more permabat sorcs with 15% ult reduction and former emp passives on top of that.

People that want dynamic ult generation: would you give up all your class ult related passives to get it?

If not, then its is just DK/NB facetank nostalgia.

Yes i would but can we haz old negate back plz

Tankqull · October 2015

A dynamic ultimate generation system, but not the 1.5 one (develop)

the current system extended by semi dynamic aproach - 1 additional Ulti for every attack aimed at you.

that way outnumbered players do gain more ulti but not at an idiotic rate as in the previous dynamic system.
the big advantage aswell is that groups relying on singeltarget dmg can exclude their enemys from huhge chunks of ulti by doing singletarget dmg instead of spamming aoes...