Please let Trueflame be a Real PvP Campaign

PainfulFAFA · October 2015

hammayolettuce wrote: »

Well it's 4am est only 4 hours from maintnance and EP has capped the entire map. Nothing new here. I wish Zos would take down Cyrodiil during maintenances so that no scoring would be added. Thank you EP for staying your classy selves for so long.

Pretty much the most important thing in this thread considering whats it's about.
And we all know who does this. Cant blame the zerglings now, most of them stayed in Azuras
Gentlemen agreement out the window lol

6am and theyre still at it doing what they do best. PvWing lol

Ishammael · October 2015

PainfulFAFA wrote: »

hammayolettuce wrote: »

Well it's 4am est only 4 hours from maintnance and EP has capped the entire map. Nothing new here. I wish Zos would take down Cyrodiil during maintenances so that no scoring would be added. Thank you EP for staying your classy selves for so long.

Pretty much the most important thing in this thread considering whats it's about.
And we all know who does this. Cant blame the zerglings now, most of them stayed in Azuras
Gentlemen agreement out the window lol

6am and theyre still at it doing what they do best. PvWing lol

That is kinda depressing... Gonna have to pvdoor to get all that back. Sigh. Couldn't y'all have left the home keeps?

kevlarto_ESO · October 2015

hammayolettuce wrote: »

Well it's 4am est only 4 hours from maintnance and EP has capped the entire map. Nothing new here. I wish Zos would take down Cyrodiil during maintenances so that no scoring would be added. Thank you EP for staying your classy selves for so long.

I agree when the game is offline, points should not keep ticking.

Anazasi · October 2015

Rohaus wrote: »

Does AD and EP really need more people out in Cyrodiil on TF? Been playing on TF for a few weeks now and all I ever see is a Sea of Red and Yellow... That is until AD hands over Emp to EP and vice verse... Does EP and AD even fight each other on TF?

are you from another dimension?

Anazasi · October 2015

Rylana wrote: »

Over 100 AD at ash 20 minutes ago

yeah no.

maybe you should keep your horde on Azuras? I'm just saying the you mass we mass you mass we mass. You want small group fights you should bring small groups.

Ghostbane · October 2015

Pied Pug Piper of AD -- 10,000 Crowns
Equip this costume and gain a lengthy entourage! Any AD faction player not in your group within a 1000m radius will be drawn to you, and follow you as you seek your objective. Be warned! This may cause QQ.

Ishammael · October 2015

Ghostbane wrote: »

Pied Pug Piper of AD -- 10,000 Crowns
Equip this costume and gain a lengthy entourage! Any AD faction player not in your group within a 1000m radius will be drawn to you, and follow you as you seek your objective. Be warned! This may cause QQ.

"Only wearable at Fare farm"

Anazasi · October 2015

Amazing if you look at this image SNu posted you see AD scrolls gone DC scrolls gone but whats happening at BB and BM oh yeah NIGHT CAP PTS advantage.

Ghostbane · October 2015

Ishammael wrote: »

Ghostbane wrote: »

Pied Pug Piper of AD -- 10,000 Crowns
Equip this costume and gain a lengthy entourage! Any AD faction player not in your group within a 1000m radius will be drawn to you, and follow you as you seek your objective. Be warned! This may cause QQ.

"Only wearable at Fare farm"

That would be a considerable nerf indeed, but it doesn't have 'Dragonknight' in its title, so we will be waiting a while.

Recremen · October 2015

Francis_Toliver wrote: »

Recremen wrote: »

Hi, concerned citizen here. We PvPers have been trying to lock down campaigns where we can get real fights in with each other. The 30-day campaigns, especially Trueflame, in my experience, have been having very solid and very steady PvP fights in Overland Cyro. If you want to farm materials, fight in the city, or do other such things, pretty pretty please go to a different campaign. Otherwise you are taking up population slots that could be going to people interested in actual PvP and that faction becomes uncompetitive. When that happens the other factions get bored and come into the sewers to zerg the PvE crowd. Please be a part of the solution.

Hahahahaha. You're so funny. Two accounts with 16 characters. I have people pve adventuring and skyshard hunting every campaign from every alliance. Sorry my friend but your pvp concerns mean as little to me as my pve concerns mean to you.

I think I can safely say that applies to most pve players. If they didn't want pve in Cyrodiil the wouldn't have put quests and skyshards there.

How about this, every pvp player in the game leave a percentage of the campaigns free from pvp players equal the the percentage of pve players that play the game. Then pve players will stay out of those campaigns that are designated pvp only. That sounds fair. Now all you have to do is get zos to agree. lol.

Wow, you really made my day! I laughed all morning! Almost as good as the guy that asked people to leave the dungeon he was farming so they didn't interfere with his work <snicker>. True story, this guy really did this in zone chat. Sooooo funny! We laughed and laughed. At least you know what company you are in now. Right up there with that guy! lol.

@Francis_Toliver Sweety no, your one character isn't going to affect the population significantly no matter what campaign you grab your skyshards from. This is to address groups and guilds looking to do PvE farms in Imperial City. If you don't know why it's in everyone's interest to figure out which PvP campaigns are going to be treated as the competitive ones, however, I'd be glad to inform you!

For PvP people, it means that there will actually be good, enjoyable fights on even terms, which is kind of the purpose of PvP.

For PvEers, it means you get campaigns with minimal risk of getting ganked or run over by a large group on its way to the next PvP objective. There will always be a few people fighting on any given campaign, but it's far lower-risk and easier to queue for than trying to hop into a competitive campaign, where you'll have a long line of people waiting to get in and plenty of gankers looking for easy targets (that's you!).

I'm not sure why you think I don't care about your PvE progress or why you'd go out of your way to mock me, it all seems overly hostile/formed from a persecution complex, but I'm sure you can see the logic in staying out of a campaign where the other two thirds of the population are actively trying to kill you.

Rylana · October 2015

Anazasi wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Over 100 AD at ash 20 minutes ago

yeah no.

maybe you should keep your horde on Azuras? I'm just saying the you mass we mass you mass we mass. You want small group fights you should bring small groups.

ad is the faction that abandoned azuras because it got too hard

so just lump em all into trueflame, yeah that will go over well

Seraph702 · October 2015

Lots of L2P issues here it seems.... AD Zergs EP Zergs DC Zergs and All 3 factions are responsible for the fact that they get PvGated. Stop QQing.

-Unruh

DaveMoeDee · October 2015

Francis_Toliver wrote: »

Recremen wrote: »

Hi, concerned citizen here. We PvPers have been trying to lock down campaigns where we can get real fights in with each other. The 30-day campaigns, especially Trueflame, in my experience, have been having very solid and very steady PvP fights in Overland Cyro. If you want to farm materials, fight in the city, or do other such things, pretty pretty please go to a different campaign. Otherwise you are taking up population slots that could be going to people interested in actual PvP and that faction becomes uncompetitive. When that happens the other factions get bored and come into the sewers to zerg the PvE crowd. Please be a part of the solution.

Hahahahaha. You're so funny. Two accounts with 16 characters. I have people pve adventuring and skyshard hunting every campaign from every alliance. Sorry my friend but your pvp concerns mean as little to me as my pve concerns mean to you.

I think I can safely say that applies to most pve players. If they didn't want pve in Cyrodiil the wouldn't have put quests and skyshards there.

As someone who is often only in Cyrodiil for the daily quests, they should probably have a campaign with no PvE quests and no shards. That would reduce the chances of pop lock due to people uninterested in PvP.

JDar · October 2015

Look AD on TF runs in big groups. Most of the Hello Kitty groups you see are large in number and yet smaller groups like K hole are somewhat evenly matched with us because they are all top players with excellent leads. I have been on the other side of things but right now I am HK. We have a lot of players who haven't got their Alliance War skill lines maxed out yet. And have forty CP only. And then there are EP groups that are all maxed out, all gold gear, etc., and run in large numbers. It is what it is. Run what you brung.

In some sense AD is rebuilding. A lot of our best guilds, leaders and players either re-rolled DC or left the game entirely. Once Hello Kitty gets to the point where everyone has proxy det and knows what to do when we see 24 5 star EP players bearing down on us we will probably move on and find smaller guilds but for now we will roll deep. Because we do it for Queen Ayrenn.

Goodnght ESO

LazyLewis · October 2015

JDar wrote: »

Look AD on TF runs in big groups. Most of the Hello Kitty groups you see are large in number and yet smaller groups like K hole are somewhat evenly matched with us because they are all top players with excellent leads. I have been on the other side of things but right now I am HK. We have a lot of players who haven't got their Alliance War skill lines maxed out yet. And have forty CP only. And then there are EP groups that are all maxed out, all gold gear, etc., and run in large numbers. It is what it is. Run what you brung.

In some sense AD is rebuilding. A lot of our best guilds, leaders and players either re-rolled DC or left the game entirely. Once Hello Kitty gets to the point where everyone has proxy det and knows what to do when we see 24 5 star EP players bearing down on us we will probably move on and find smaller guilds but for now we will roll deep. Because we do it for Queen Ayrenn.

Goodnght ESO

K Hole for life

thank you JDar

newtinmpls · October 2015

Recremen wrote: »

I'm not sure why you think I don't care about your PvE progress or why you'd go out of your way to mock me, it all seems overly hostile/formed from a persecution complex, but I'm sure you can see the logic in staying out of a campaign where the other two thirds of the population are actively trying to kill you.

Several points here.

1-I think he was merely saying the same thing that @phairdon pointed out earlier, that between poplocks and "you have a character from another alliance in this campaign" most PvE'ers get in where they can.

2-No matter where any PvE'er goes, there will be plenty of people trying to kill him or her, then promptly teabag and/or mock him or her. PvE'ers generally get quite rudely treated by many PvP'ers, apparently in response to not being skilled at a play-style they don't choose. So a threat that 'someone will want to kill you' - when has someone NOT wanted to kill them?
.

Cody · October 2015

Rohaus wrote: »

Does AD and EP really need more people out in Cyrodiil on TF? Been playing on TF for a few weeks now and all I ever see is a Sea of Red and Yellow... That is until AD hands over Emp to EP and vice verse... Does EP and AD even fight each other on TF?

we do. I fight AD more than DC

Alucardo · October 2015

Anazasi wrote: »

Amazing if you look at this image SNu posted you see AD scrolls gone DC scrolls gone but whats happening at BB and BM oh yeah NIGHT CAP PTS advantage.

Wow, that looks really similar to the map I'm seeing right now. I wake up to this every morning, but today I opened it, then logged off.

Manoekin · October 2015

Alucardo wrote: »

Anazasi wrote: »

Amazing if you look at this image SNu posted you see AD scrolls gone DC scrolls gone but whats happening at BB and BM oh yeah NIGHT CAP PTS advantage.

Wow, that looks really similar to the map I'm seeing right now. I wake up to this every morning, but today I opened it, then logged off.

That looks more like EP capping things though.

Recremen · October 2015

newtinmpls wrote: »

Recremen wrote: »

I'm not sure why you think I don't care about your PvE progress or why you'd go out of your way to mock me, it all seems overly hostile/formed from a persecution complex, but I'm sure you can see the logic in staying out of a campaign where the other two thirds of the population are actively trying to kill you.

Several points here.

1-I think he was merely saying the same thing that @phairdon pointed out earlier, that between poplocks and "you have a character from another alliance in this campaign" most PvE'ers get in where they can.

2-No matter where any PvE'er goes, there will be plenty of people trying to kill him or her, then promptly teabag and/or mock him or her. PvE'ers generally get quite rudely treated by many PvP'ers, apparently in response to not being skilled at a play-style they don't choose. So a threat that 'someone will want to kill you' - when has someone NOT wanted to kill them?
.

PvP and PvE populations are not really evenly distributed though, it has been this way for a while. There is a huge difference between a server with 1 or 2 bars all the way around and a poplocked server half full of PvP guilds actively looking for PvP. If nothing else, it's a much better idea to not home in a 30-day campaign if you're just looking to PvE when there are 7 or even 14-day campaigns that will let you switch around more frequently. Also, PvEers don't get singled out for poor treatment, that's just jerk PvPers being jerks. Unless someone implemented an icon next to player names that indicates whether or not they're a PvP player, nobody can tell the difference and any fears of persecution are completely unfounded. Heck, most of the time in Imperial City the people teabagging you are going to be other PvE players high on the fact that they beat up "those other obviously PvP players who tried to gank them."

newtinmpls · October 2015

My understanding is that the point of having both guest and home is that if one has too long a wait to be practical, ideally the other would be available. For those of us who regularly play multiple characters in multiple alliances, in order to accept your suggestion of "7-day only" campaigns, there would need to be 6 of them.

And that's completely aside from the vet vs non-vet question.

Currently as far as I can tell, there are 3 7-day setups, with only one campaign each. There is one non-vet, and there are two thirty day vet campaigns. So your idea isn't going to work.

As for PvE'ers not getting singled out for poor treatment - until you have attempted to PvE in a PvP zone, tried to "stay out of the way", tried to avoid combat, interfering and such like, and gotten ganked while questing, or while exploring in both Cyrodiil and IC, especially while turning in quests in Cyrodiil, gotten rage-mails and 'get out of here Carebear' comments in-game and in-forum ..... well clearly you don't experience it so you can't accurately speak to it.

If you don't do any of those behaviors, thanks. Wish there were more folks like that.

Again - I'd love to have the option to "wave a white flag" be disabled from attacking/PvPing, and be disabled from being ganked and go about my business. ZoS hasn't provided that.

Pretty much the only repeating quests in the game are in PvP zones, so long term, those who like to quest will end up there at least some of the time. And most likely meet up with unkind folks waiting to gank them.
.

Francis_Toliver · October 2015

Recremen wrote: »

newtinmpls wrote: »

Recremen wrote: »

I'm not sure why you think I don't care about your PvE progress or why you'd go out of your way to mock me, it all seems overly hostile/formed from a persecution complex, but I'm sure you can see the logic in staying out of a campaign where the other two thirds of the population are actively trying to kill you.

Several points here.

1-I think he was merely saying the same thing that @phairdon pointed out earlier, that between poplocks and "you have a character from another alliance in this campaign" most PvE'ers get in where they can.

2-No matter where any PvE'er goes, there will be plenty of people trying to kill him or her, then promptly teabag and/or mock him or her. PvE'ers generally get quite rudely treated by many PvP'ers, apparently in response to not being skilled at a play-style they don't choose. So a threat that 'someone will want to kill you' - when has someone NOT wanted to kill them?
.

PvP and PvE populations are not really evenly distributed though, it has been this way for a while. There is a huge difference between a server with 1 or 2 bars all the way around and a poplocked server half full of PvP guilds actively looking for PvP. If nothing else, it's a much better idea to not home in a 30-day campaign if you're just looking to PvE when there are 7 or even 14-day campaigns that will let you switch around more frequently. Also, PvEers don't get singled out for poor treatment, that's just jerk PvPers being jerks. Unless someone implemented an icon next to player names that indicates whether or not they're a PvP player, nobody can tell the difference and any fears of persecution are completely unfounded. Heck, most of the time in Imperial City the people teabagging you are going to be other PvE players high on the fact that they beat up "those other obviously PvP players who tried to gank them."

OK, since you seem to think your suggestion be taken seriously I will stop laughing and try to answer in a serious manner.

First, people go to campaigns that their friends can get into and that they can get into. Usually in a disorganized fashion and often with different folks different nights. They don't think about or care about your pvping experience. They don't care about getting killed as they will get killed in whatever campaign they enter. They don't (by and large) tea bag people as the experience of bullying is usually one of the reasons they don't pvp. They go haphazardly and do the things they want to do because campaigns don't mean anything to them and they give little or no thought to pvpers except a general dislike.

This will not stop. They don't care what you have to say because mostly they don't like pvpers (because of their experience with them) and even listening to you (much less giving your considered opinion the required energy needed to act on it) is more bother then they (by and large) care to give.

This will not change.

If you want to effect a pvp exclusive campaign you would be better served trying to convince ZOS to do it (good luck with that!) then to appeal to people that don't like you ("you" being pvpers) and don't care about your concerns.

Like the fellow that wanted all the pve people to leave "his" dungeon so he could continue to grind (and who got laughed at), you fail to understand with what little regard you pvpers are held by most pveers. Not all of them (I quite like most pvpers I've met, but then I pvp as well as pve). The egocentric request to leave a dungeon is funny. The remarkably egocentric request to leave an entire campaign? That is fricking hilarious!

I hope you see why (from a pve'ers point of view) a certain level of mocking was required. Please feel free to mock back

Alucardo · October 2015

"Francis_Toliver wrote: »

First, people go to campaigns that their friends can get into and that they can get into. Usually in a disorganized fashion and often with different folks different nights. They don't think about or care about your pvping experience. They don't care about getting killed as they will get killed in whatever campaign they enter. They don't (by and large) tea bag people as the experience of bullying is usually one of the reasons they don't pvp. They go haphazardly and do the things they want to do because campaigns don't mean anything to them and they give little or no thought to pvpers except a general dislike.

I don't care about your pve experience but I enjoy fighting, so does that mean I can go to Glenumbra, Auridon, Stonefalls and kill everyone?

"Francis_Toliver wrote: »

This will not stop. They don't care what you have to say because mostly they don't like pvpers (because of their experience with them) and even listening to you (much less giving your considered opinion the required energy needed to act on it) is more bother then they (by and large) care to give.

I got moaned at the other night for killing a group of 4 PvErs in Bruma. She whispered me and said something like, "stop killing us ur in a pve area". I get told to stop killing people in CYRODIIL and you guys don't like us? Okay.

"Francis_Toliver wrote: »

If you want to effect a pvp exclusive campaign you would be better served trying to convince ZOS to do it (good luck with that!) then to appeal to people that don't like you ("you" being pvpers) and don't care about your concerns.

We need this. The tension between carebears and pvpers is only going to get worse. This thread is testament to that.

"Francis_Toliver wrote: »

Like the fellow that wanted all the pve people to leave "his" dungeon so he could continue to grind (and who got laughed at), you fail to understand with what little regard you pvpers are held by most pveers. Not all of them (I quite like most pvpers I've met, but then I pvp as well as pve). The egocentric request to leave a dungeon is funny. The remarkably egocentric request to leave an entire campaign? That is fricking hilarious!

I hope you see why (from a pve'ers point of view) a certain level of mocking was required. Please feel free to mock back

Please don't compare the dungeon guy with the OP. The dungeon guy was a selfish fool, but being as there are other campaigns with identical layouts I don't see the problem if he's only asking nicely, and even offering solutions- not just telling people to go away.

"Francis_Toliver wrote: »

I hope you see why (from a pve'ers point of view) a certain level of mocking was required. Please feel free to mock back

We're not that petty.

Ghostbane · October 2015

newtinmpls · October 2015

Alucardo wrote: »

The tension between carebears and pvpers is only going to get worse. This thread is testament to that.

True. Sigh.

Although, it appears that you did not understand the point that @Francis_Toliver was trying to make. I'll quote him:

"Francis_Toliver wrote: »

Like the fellow that wanted all the pve people to leave "his" dungeon so he could continue to grind (and who got laughed at), you fail to understand with what little regard you pvpers are held by most pveers. Not all of them (I quite like most pvpers I've met, but then I pvp as well as pve). The egocentric request to leave a dungeon is funny. The remarkably egocentric request to leave an entire campaign? That is fricking hilarious!

This thread has many undercurrents, and from both the PvP and PvE perspective, one big one is "please (other type of player) go away". And this is not possible.

Cyrodiil is not "PvP only"; and it's not "PvE only". It's got forts, keeps (the PvP part) and delves and quests and skyshards (PvE) and there are quite a few folks who do (and enjoy to one extent or another) both types of activities. So it's not .... reasonable for any one "type" of player to expect the other "type" will not be there.

Alucardo wrote: »

Please don't compare the dungeon guy with the OP. The dungeon guy was a selfish fool, but being as there are other campaigns with identical layouts I don't see the problem if he's only asking nicely, and even offering solutions- not just telling people to go away.

"Several other campaigns"?. As both myself and others have pointed out - in order for PvE'ers to "go away" to an entirely different Cyrodiil area where they could meet up with other friends and guildies, there would have to be at least 6 "other" campaigns (so that they could account for all the "you have a character from an opposing alliance" problems and actually meet up with friends.

What with the total number of campaigns only being 6 (and ignoring the fact that one of them is non-vet), what you are asking is literally not possible. So no, you are not offering a solution. What you suggest isn't possible. So my first suggestion if you are going to make a suggestion is to make one that actually could happen.

Hence:

"Francis_Toliver wrote: »

I hope you see why (from a pve'ers point of view) a certain level of mocking was required. Please feel free to mock back

newtinmpls · October 2015

Recremen wrote: »

Also, PvEers don't get singled out for poor treatment, that's just jerk PvPers being jerks. Unless someone implemented an icon next to player names that indicates whether or not they're a PvP player, nobody can tell the difference and any fears of persecution are completely unfounded.

I didn't find this comment believable. Then I noted that a subsequent poster confirmed my suspicions.

Alucardo wrote: »

I got moaned at the other night for killing a group of 4 PvErs in Bruma. She whispered me and said something like, "stop killing us ur in a pve area". I get told to stop killing people in CYRODIIL and you guys don't like us? Okay.

Bruma is one of the quest hub areas in Cyrodiil. It is a place that folks who like questing and exploring can reasonably be expected to be found. It is not a keep, or a resource or a fort, so despite being in a "PvP" zone, it is not unreasonable to think of it as an area more oriented to PvE than PvP.

Note I'm not saying that Bruma "Is" PvE only - all of Cyrodiil is clearly PvP enabled. What I am saying is that there are areas within Cyrodiil that are more oriented one way or the other. Theoretically the PvPers could concentrate on PvP focused areas and PvE'ers could concentrate on more PvE focused areas. It doesn't appear to be playing out that way.

And when a group of folks are doing nothing but attempting quests - which are individually rewarded. Unlike chests, or resources - there are inherently "always enough to go around". So the PvP gankers are ganking merely because they choose easy targets. Not because they have to, or because the PvE questers are competitive in any way.

Recremen · October 2015

newtinmpls wrote: »

My understanding is that the point of having both guest and home is that if one has too long a wait to be practical, ideally the other would be available. For those of us who regularly play multiple characters in multiple alliances, in order to accept your suggestion of "7-day only" campaigns, there would need to be 6 of them.

And that's completely aside from the vet vs non-vet question.

Currently as far as I can tell, there are 3 7-day setups, with only one campaign each. There is one non-vet, and there are two thirty day vet campaigns. So your idea isn't going to work.

As for PvE'ers not getting singled out for poor treatment - until you have attempted to PvE in a PvP zone, tried to "stay out of the way", tried to avoid combat, interfering and such like, and gotten ganked while questing, or while exploring in both Cyrodiil and IC, especially while turning in quests in Cyrodiil, gotten rage-mails and 'get out of here Carebear' comments in-game and in-forum ..... well clearly you don't experience it so you can't accurately speak to it.

If you don't do any of those behaviors, thanks. Wish there were more folks like that.

Again - I'd love to have the option to "wave a white flag" be disabled from attacking/PvPing, and be disabled from being ganked and go about my business. ZoS hasn't provided that.

Pretty much the only repeating quests in the game are in PvP zones, so long term, those who like to quest will end up there at least some of the time. And most likely meet up with unkind folks waiting to gank them.
.

I mean if you have multiple characters on multiple alliances and really play them all, you're probably not even contributing to the problem in the first place? I think you're confusing your own behavior with that of the majority of the PvE population, when in fact yours is probably more of an outlier. Most players don't dedicate significant amounts of time to a huge number of characters across different alliances, so this is a much simpler request for most people. I'd hardly begrudge a single person who's alt hopping every half hour, you probably wouldn't even make it through the queue for Trueflame before you had to switch. ;-)

I have done all the PvE things in the PvP zones, but I did it on campaigns that weren't locked for my faction. Heck, I've even done big RP events in PvP, but again, not where my faction was poplocked. If someone sees you running around on a busy campaign, they're not going to think you're just out for a PvE stroll, they're going to think you're off to a PvP objective or gank spot or siege location, and any attempt to "stay out of the way" is going to be seen as PvP maneuvering. They can't track your name and movement patterns and remember "oh yes, they have never hurt me and are not a threat". And if you're out "exploring" or what have you, as I said before, you are probably getting ganked by another PvE player. Minus the few butthurt ganking types who send "carebear" tells and police the streets of Chorrol like some messed up neighborhood watch, most of the people you run into in Overland Cyro PvE areas are going to be other PvE players.

Imperial City is even worse in terms of PvE players butting heads and then getting upset about "the enemy zerg". It's been over a month since Imperial City launch, and Imperial City has no good PvP objectives, so we've all moved back to Overland. Any zergs folks are running into now are PvE groups, who apparently secretly do like bombing each other.

Recremen · October 2015

newtinmpls wrote: »

Recremen wrote: »

Also, PvEers don't get singled out for poor treatment, that's just jerk PvPers being jerks. Unless someone implemented an icon next to player names that indicates whether or not they're a PvP player, nobody can tell the difference and any fears of persecution are completely unfounded.

I didn't find this comment believable. Then I noted that a subsequent poster confirmed my suspicions.

Alucardo wrote: »

I got moaned at the other night for killing a group of 4 PvErs in Bruma. She whispered me and said something like, "stop killing us ur in a pve area". I get told to stop killing people in CYRODIIL and you guys don't like us? Okay.

Bruma is one of the quest hub areas in Cyrodiil. It is a place that folks who like questing and exploring can reasonably be expected to be found. It is not a keep, or a resource or a fort, so despite being in a "PvP" zone, it is not unreasonable to think of it as an area more oriented to PvE than PvP.

Note I'm not saying that Bruma "Is" PvE only - all of Cyrodiil is clearly PvP enabled. What I am saying is that there are areas within Cyrodiil that are more oriented one way or the other. Theoretically the PvPers could concentrate on PvP focused areas and PvE'ers could concentrate on more PvE focused areas. It doesn't appear to be playing out that way.

And when a group of folks are doing nothing but attempting quests - which are individually rewarded. Unlike chests, or resources - there are inherently "always enough to go around". So the PvP gankers are ganking merely because they choose easy targets. Not because they have to, or because the PvE questers are competitive in any way.

But here you're conflating the actions of a very small subset of PvPers (gankers, and at that, PvE gankers) with the entire set of PvPers. I'm not saying that ganking doesn't happen or that there aren't a few folks out to spoil your fun, I'm saying that most of us are not out to get you. If you see a 24-person stealth bomb in Bruma or Chorral or wherever just chilling out for days and waiting for nubs, feel free to call me a liar, but that is not what a typical PvPer is doing with their life.

eventide03b14a_ESO · October 2015

All campaigns should have been gated or none. This half-assed approach was the stupidest form of pandering they ever did.

Recremen · October 2015

Francis_Toliver wrote: »

Recremen wrote: »

newtinmpls wrote: »

Recremen wrote: »

I'm not sure why you think I don't care about your PvE progress or why you'd go out of your way to mock me, it all seems overly hostile/formed from a persecution complex, but I'm sure you can see the logic in staying out of a campaign where the other two thirds of the population are actively trying to kill you.

Several points here.

1-I think he was merely saying the same thing that @phairdon pointed out earlier, that between poplocks and "you have a character from another alliance in this campaign" most PvE'ers get in where they can.

2-No matter where any PvE'er goes, there will be plenty of people trying to kill him or her, then promptly teabag and/or mock him or her. PvE'ers generally get quite rudely treated by many PvP'ers, apparently in response to not being skilled at a play-style they don't choose. So a threat that 'someone will want to kill you' - when has someone NOT wanted to kill them?
.

PvP and PvE populations are not really evenly distributed though, it has been this way for a while. There is a huge difference between a server with 1 or 2 bars all the way around and a poplocked server half full of PvP guilds actively looking for PvP. If nothing else, it's a much better idea to not home in a 30-day campaign if you're just looking to PvE when there are 7 or even 14-day campaigns that will let you switch around more frequently. Also, PvEers don't get singled out for poor treatment, that's just jerk PvPers being jerks. Unless someone implemented an icon next to player names that indicates whether or not they're a PvP player, nobody can tell the difference and any fears of persecution are completely unfounded. Heck, most of the time in Imperial City the people teabagging you are going to be other PvE players high on the fact that they beat up "those other obviously PvP players who tried to gank them."

OK, since you seem to think your suggestion be taken seriously I will stop laughing and try to answer in a serious manner.

First, people go to campaigns that their friends can get into and that they can get into. Usually in a disorganized fashion and often with different folks different nights. They don't think about or care about your pvping experience. They don't care about getting killed as they will get killed in whatever campaign they enter. They don't (by and large) tea bag people as the experience of bullying is usually one of the reasons they don't pvp. They go haphazardly and do the things they want to do because campaigns don't mean anything to them and they give little or no thought to pvpers except a general dislike.

This will not stop. They don't care what you have to say because mostly they don't like pvpers (because of their experience with them) and even listening to you (much less giving your considered opinion the required energy needed to act on it) is more bother then they (by and large) care to give.

This will not change.

If you want to effect a pvp exclusive campaign you would be better served trying to convince ZOS to do it (good luck with that!) then to appeal to people that don't like you ("you" being pvpers) and don't care about your concerns.

Like the fellow that wanted all the pve people to leave "his" dungeon so he could continue to grind (and who got laughed at), you fail to understand with what little regard you pvpers are held by most pveers. Not all of them (I quite like most pvpers I've met, but then I pvp as well as pve). The egocentric request to leave a dungeon is funny. The remarkably egocentric request to leave an entire campaign? That is fricking hilarious!

I hope you see why (from a pve'ers point of view) a certain level of mocking was required. Please feel free to mock back

You keep saying that "this won't stop, that won't change", but I think you entirely underestimate how understanding and reasonable most people are. You're also saying that most PvE types dislike PvPers, but that also has not been observed. Every PvE guild I've been with in this game has been entirely accepting of PvPers, and in fact some of them like to do both, a little bit. You might be conflating your own opinion with that of an entire group.

More to the point, though, I've observed a lot of Overland Cyro fighting in both the 30-day campaigns and nobody trying to group up for sewer grinds during primetime, I've observed that my own PvE guilds have now been grouping up in Haderus and Chillrend instead of Trueflame, and so I conclude that people are in fact leaving the 30-day campaigns to the PvP dogs. Go figure, a mutually beneficial arrangement proves to be swiftly adopted by a generally rational populace.

And no, I'm still not seeing the point of mocking or namecalling, and I certainly don't feel inclined to do it myself. What was that about not liking bullying?