Is it viable to be a decent 2H Tank/DPS?

Stelo · October 2015

My character is a VR1 Dragonknight that only uses a greatsword and heavy armor. My 1st skill bar is mostly AoE/CC and I switch it to a DPS setting whenever I'm running solo. 2nd skill bar is filled with only buffs like Igneous Weapons and Hardened Armor. So far my build has worked out quite well, but I feel I can do more to optimize this build. I'd try a sword & shield playstyle, but I never liked it. Same goes with medium armor. Would any pro players give me advice here?

tmathis · October 2015

I'm only VR6 currently but I run the same kind of build that you're thinking about.

For soloing and PVP I run 2H and when I'm grouped up for dungeons and such I switch to sword and board and just tank.

The biggest thing for me has been having/developing different sets of gear (think boost resistance/damage mitigation for tanking and then boost DPS/survivability for soloing) and skill bars for each situation.

So for dungeoning I'll have sword and shield on both bars with different combinations of CC/buffs/debuffs/taunts on the ability bars to tank effectively. Likewise, while I'm soloing I only really run my 2H bar with things like rally (momentum morph) for the damage buff, wrecking blow (uppercut morph), critical rush (critical charge morph) for covering distance, and other healing buffs or w/e.

Its worth checking around on the forums for some of the guides made by more experienced players (example for tanking as a DK: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/166731/pve-build-dragonknight-tank-outdated/p1), but so far for me this build has worked pretty well.

Stelo · October 2015

tmathis wrote: »

I'm only VR6 currently but I run the same kind of build that you're thinking about.

For soloing and PVP I run 2H and when I'm grouped up for dungeons and such I switch to sword and board and just tank.

The biggest thing for me has been having/developing different sets of gear (think boost resistance/damage mitigation for tanking and then boost DPS/survivability for soloing) and skill bars for each situation.

So for dungeoning I'll have sword and shield on both bars with different combinations of CC/buffs/debuffs/taunts on the ability bars to tank effectively. Likewise, while I'm soloing I only really run my 2H bar with things like rally (momentum morph) for the damage buff, wrecking blow (uppercut morph), critical rush (critical charge morph) for covering distance, and other healing buffs or w/e.

Its worth checking around on the forums for some of the guides made by more experienced players (example for tanking as a DK: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/166731/pve-build-dragonknight-tank-outdated/p1), but so far for me this build has worked pretty well.

I have no knowledge of any good gear sets, but currently I run Ashen Grip and its been working out pretty well. Although, I should get a set that has something to do with boost resistance/damage mitigation like you said. If not, I recommend making a craft-able set that has Reinforced traits on every single piece.

As for my skill bar, I'm thinking of making it AoE-DPS or single target DPS and a 2nd bar with an Executioner type set once the enemies reach below 50% health so I can pick them out easy enough while evenly distributing the CC/buffs/debuffs/taunt. That is of course, if I'm running solo and if I'm with a group then I'll stick to the current build I have.

Regarding the forums, I've been checking around and have yet to find a build where someone focused purely on 2H and Tanking even though most of what I've read is that it's not very viable. I'd still like to see someone who can pull it off.

tmathis · October 2015

For tanking I currently run 5/5 Hist bark (4 trait set) to get armor, health, and the x% chance to dodge attacks while blocking and then 4/5 Whitestrakes (4 trait set) for armor and health bonuses. 5/5 Whitestrakes grants a pretty good damage shield too, so just a matter of preference/situation. Once I get 5 traits on all heavy armor crafting I plan to look into Alessia's Bulwark as well for some armor bonuses.

List of all current armor sets that I reference pretty often:

http://elderscrollsonline.wiki.fextralife.com/Set+Bonus+Crafting+Locations

Some of the values are outdated since the update I think, but they are pretty close (they will also be lower if not Gold and V14 quality obviously, but they are still close).

Also, the Footman's set, which drops from Dragonstar Arena, is pretty standard for end game tanking and is something I'm shooting to get once I get to V13-14

Relevant link: http://elderscrollsonline.wiki.fextralife.com/Footman's+Fortune+Set

And yeah, I think it would be tough to tank without a shield just because of the extra armor and enchantment bonuses that might make or break a fight when you get to the later stages of say a boss fight when resource management starts getting difficult

Usara · October 2015

Depends where you want to tank

In solo content, anything can work as a DK ^^

Now group content...
Daily Veteran dungeons (Normal and Veteran mode) yes it can, but you will have to turn into a real tank and stop DPS on some encounters like vet Banished Cells HM, vet Crypt of Hearts HM, Vet CoA HM (I never did IC dungeons low scaled so I don't know how hard hit the bosses in vr1 IC Prison, but I guess they still hit hard ^^)

And even if you DPS, you are still required to take the aggro and resist the enemies attacks. Whatever your spec is, if you are the tank, that is your job.
That means wearing 5 heavy armor piece (for the passives), have a bar with a 1H weapon and a shield (again, with the passives) and have both taunts : a tank should first of all help the real DD do their jobs with the debuff from Pierce Armor, and should have the Undaunted taunt for distance/casters enemies, at least while you're still growing experience as a tank

The rest is up to you

I understand you want to be stamina speced with a big 2-handed weapon ^^
One of my friends who is a Tank/DD for quick dailies run with a 5 Heavy + 2 Medium armor pieces, 5 Hunding (craftable set) and Dreugh King (you don't have access to that set yet)

Now gear can be a bit of an issue at your level (because regearing every 2 vet levels - even with crafts - is quite expensive and I would not recommend it)
I guess you could have a vr1 set crafted, but wait until vr7-8 to craft a new one maybe ?
Hunding, Night Silence, Ashen Grip are craftable sets that comes to mind... Hist Bark too.

mklundub17_ESO · October 2015

You could get away with it in everything besides 2nd boss in white gold tower, IC prison, vDSA and trials -- everything else you don't need to block anything except heavy attacks if you're geared sufficiently.

On fights you have to block tank you'll want 1h/s, as well as absorb magicka and all 1h/s passives.

Stelo · October 2015

tmathis wrote: »

For tanking I currently run 5/5 Hist bark (4 trait set) to get armor, health, and the x% chance to dodge attacks while blocking and then 4/5 Whitestrakes (4 trait set) for armor and health bonuses. 5/5 Whitestrakes grants a pretty good damage shield too, so just a matter of preference/situation. Once I get 5 traits on all heavy armor crafting I plan to look into Alessia's Bulwark as well for some armor bonuses.

Thank you for this! I did some research on Whitestrake and Hist Bark. I preferred Hist Bark instead of the other. Having a damage shield below 30% HP may be good, but I'd rather not have my health go down that low all the time. My current set is a Superior version of Hist Bark!

So far I've been having smooth runs!

Usara wrote: »

And even if you DPS, you are still required to take the aggro and resist the enemies attacks. Whatever your spec is, if you are the tank, that is your job.
That means wearing 5 heavy armor piece (for the passives), have a bar with a 1H weapon and a shield (again, with the passives) and have both taunts : a tank should first of all help the real DD do their jobs with the debuff from Pierce Armor, and should have the Undaunted taunt for distance/casters enemies, at least while you're still growing experience as a tank :

Hmmm, I guess I really will have to switch to a sword and board lol. I'll have to start leveling those skills right away since I don't have a single point invested or unlocked in them. As for the tanking, I slot Inner Beast and Burning Breath along with Choking Talons. My runs are pretty smooth, but I must admit that compared to a REAL tank with a sword & board, I'm not much help. I was running Crypt of Hearts with another tank and he was doing his thing WAY better than me.

mklundub17_ESO wrote: »

You could get away with it in everything besides 2nd boss in white gold tower, IC prison, vDSA and trials -- everything else you don't need to block anything except heavy attacks if you're geared sufficiently.

On fights you have to block tank you'll want 1h/s, as well as absorb magicka and all 1h/s passives.

I figured as much. There were times when I had to block and it wasn't as effective as the REAL tank in my group who would just eat those hits without much damage.

mklundub17_ESO · October 2015

Yea, you could have gotten away with it more last patch but this patch not having stamina regen while blocking means you really have to have 1h/s for the passives and to cut down the cost of blocking. Shards and pots can only do so much.

Usara · October 2015

Stelo wrote: »

Hmmm, I guess I really will have to switch to a sword and board lol. I'll have to start leveling those skills right away since I don't have a single point invested or unlocked in them. As for the tanking, I slot Inner Beast and Burning Breath along with Choking Talons. My runs are pretty smooth, but I must admit that compared to a REAL tank with a sword & board, I'm not much help. I was running Crypt of Hearts with another tank and he was doing his thing WAY better than me.

Well, at least, you tried to figure things by yourself, and asked for advices, that's a good start to learn

It's okay, tanking is a lot of "trial and error" philosophy in my experience, and dailies is the best place to start !
But you'll see, with a bar with 1H+shield, your tanking on bosses will be much easier

Stelo · October 2015

mklundub17_ESO wrote: »

Yea, you could have gotten away with it more last patch but this patch not having stamina regen while blocking means you really have to have 1h/s for the passives and to cut down the cost of blocking. Shards and pots can only do so much.

Oh, so there's no stamina regen while blocking? That's awful!

No wonder my stamina gets drained almost always whenever I fight and most of my skills are magicka based.

Stelo · October 2015

Usara wrote: »

Well, at least, you tried to figure things by yourself, and asked for advices, that's a good start to learn
It's okay, tanking is a lot of "trial and error" philosophy in my experience, and dailies is the best place to start !
But you'll see, with a bar with 1H+shield, your tanking on bosses will be much easier

Yeah, I was asking on GameFAQs too, but I didn't get as much feedback as I did on here. I appreciate the tips!

For now I'll get my 1handed + shield skills leveled up and try one last time to maximize my 2H. I realized since I won't have block mitigation, I should offset that with a massive amount of HP/HP Regen. My play-style will need a bit of work too. Of course, if it doesn't work as expected then I'll just go ahead and switch to this. Thanks again!

UrQuan · October 2015

Yeah, you can't tank without a taunt, pure and simple. The main part of the tank's job is to hold aggro on the biggest threats, and to do that with even a little bit of reliability you need a taunt. At least 9 times out of 10 that means you want sword & shield for Puncture or one of its morphs. You can have that on one bar and a two-hander on the other bar if you want.

Of course, if you're really determined to tank using a two-hander on both bars, it is possible, but it's a lot harder as you'd need to rely entirely on Inner Fire (from the Undaunted skill line) or one of its morphs as your taunt. It's a useful taunt in some situations (particularly as it is ranged), but in most cases it's far less efficient than Puncture.

Personally when I'm tanking I use sword & board on both bars, but you don't have to do that.

Allyhoo811 · October 2015

UrQuan wrote: »

Yeah, you can't tank without a taunt, pure and simple. The main part of the tank's job is to hold aggro on the biggest threats, and to do that with even a little bit of reliability you need a taunt. At least 9 times out of 10 that means you want sword & shield for Puncture or one of its morphs. You can have that on one bar and a two-hander on the other bar if you want.

Of course, if you're really determined to tank using a two-hander on both bars, it is possible, but it's a lot harder as you'd need to rely entirely on Inner Fire (from the Undaunted skill line) or one of its morphs as your taunt. It's a useful taunt in some situations (particularly as it is ranged), but in most cases it's far less efficient than Puncture.

Personally when I'm tanking I use sword & board on both bars, but you don't have to do that.

This, so this. Please do not try to tank without a taunt.

Stelo · October 2015

UrQuan wrote: »

Yeah, you can't tank without a taunt, pure and simple. The main part of the tank's job is to hold aggro on the biggest threats, and to do that with even a little bit of reliability you need a taunt. At least 9 times out of 10 that means you want sword & shield for Puncture or one of its morphs. You can have that on one bar and a two-hander on the other bar if you want.

Of course, if you're really determined to tank using a two-hander on both bars, it is possible, but it's a lot harder as you'd need to rely entirely on Inner Fire (from the Undaunted skill line) or one of its morphs as your taunt. It's a useful taunt in some situations (particularly as it is ranged), but in most cases it's far less efficient than Puncture.

Personally when I'm tanking I use sword & board on both bars, but you don't have to do that.

That's what I try to do in most of the dungeons I run and its been going good so far. I'd use choking talons/burning breath/cleave the mobs while keeping Inner Beast refreshed on the boss. I do indeed take a lot of damage, but as long as I have an efficient healer then I'm perfectly fine.

As of right now I am VERY determined to tank using the two-hander. I know later on it will be less efficient once I get to the harder dungeons, but I'll try my best to optimize my build. If not, then at least I tried.

Hopefully it goes pretty well though.

Stelo · October 2015

Allyhoo811 wrote: »

This, so this. Please do not try to tank without a taunt.

Lol of course! It was kinda disappointing to find that I had only one taunt available. Still though, I'll just try to make the best out of it.