I'm not really sure what to do in this game any more?

Arreyanne · September 2015

Dagoth_Rac wrote: »

I know they want to push people to buy the DLC, but the XP in the base game is now unbelievably awful. I**SNIPPd.

The XP in the Base game has always been awful.

I played closed beta and 90 days after release and stopped due the excess amount of boring the game was while leveling.

I do not mean the content as per se the fights, but the sheer number of quest to get a level.

The base game has to have the worst leveling curve in MMO history even Vanilla WoW wasn't as bad as ESO. Maybe some older games such Everquest where worse but I didnt play that.

It should not take someone doing quest 8-15 hours to get to level 10-12. 4 maybe 5 hours at the most

So I watch Deltia's sewer grind video and think wow, actuall XP. OMG renew for a month. Finally get a VR character, Monday the sewer Skeevers go from 500 XP each to 22 XP thanks Zenimax.

Why is there only one way to level in this game?

Teiji · September 2015

Riko_Futatabi wrote: »

@Teiji - It's what frustrates me the most, knowing something is possible but is never realized.

This game still feels in a state of transition, but like you said it's not clear where it's going. This game does have potential, it's why I stopped playing another MMO to play this, I just hope this potential doesn't become a missed opportunity.

@Riko_Futatabi I hope so too, we've waited this long for an ES MMO, a bit more can't hurt.

Also with regards to Spell crafting; "A lot of exploration in this system, you get a spell that summon a ball you have to chase to find the various ancient doorways located all over the world."

So Ayelid ruins in Cyrodiil, secret doorways in Delves that already exist all over the world, dialogue NPCs have in towns which you can find through conversation [think using the Rumors option in Elder Scrolls & Fallout games] which lead to hints to the location of Spell crafting places , it could be done so well that many people would forego add-ons [Skyshards equivalent add-on for Spell crafting] in order to enjoy the experience as much as possible.

But that's just one thing out of many they could have on the table, jewel crafting? That's something else, additional weapon skill lines? Quests with the Fighters Guild where the reward is an area you play through for huge XP as you slew Daedra and so on in an optional solo instance, which scales up in difficulty [think Diablo scaling] depending on how many players in your party there is, a simple hoard mode in a single area where you increase the goodies you can purchase, this could be services or whatever through the Fighter's Guild, maybe even potions which increase the skill % XP modifier so whilst levelling alts and their skills, you can level those specifically faster with the same XP you earn.

Guild progression has always been something players look forward to, same with Daedric prince progression, opening up your own room within the Fighter's Guild, the Mages Guild, maybe even your own room within the Dark Brotherhood hideouts or even a portal to a place within the realm of one the Daedric princes or even factions like Dawnguard, Stendarr folks and so on, all areas could be filled with voiced NPCs and could be basic player housing, a room within a 'guild hall' or something else entirely.

This game can go beyond succeeding and be really, really great. It's just a matter of whether they choose to make it so.

Sensesfail13 · September 2015

Props to @SuraklinPrime excellent post.

@ZOS_GinaBruno This forum post.

I would still appreciate an answer on the post I made to you in the developer discussion thread. It can not be that hard to revert the changes, we desperately need the way the game was and tweaks not an entire overhaul. I am totally with the OP on this I am having trouble even logging into the game, it has given me a lot of reading time but I enjoyed this game until IC and I enjoyed spending time in tamriel as well. And its not IC itself its the total overhaul of combat. Although I am mainly effected by the changes to tanking in a large way this patch overall was just too much taken away from the main players of the game.

There are many great constructive posts all over the forums asking for better changes, CHANGE THIS GAME FOR THE BETTER GIVE US BACK WHAT WE WANT TO PLAY.

Inactive Account · September 2015

Pangnirtung wrote: »

A big part of the appeal of MMOs is moving towards acquiring equipment and experience.

This update has killed that fun aspect of it at least for me.

When there is a game mechanism like the champion point system which, if you have enough points into, negates 25% or more of any nerf that happens there is noone that can denigh that the game is unballanced. It can be debated, yes, but it cannot be denied.

Inactive Account · September 2015

Majic wrote: »

Do What You Must

I got off the bus a couple of months ago when ZOS announced VR16. It has since been impossible to shake the feeling that ESO is more like an early access game whose basic features are constantly being shifted around than a viable virtual world worthy of a major time investment.

It's too bad, because ESO has so much going for it, including rich lore, unique combat mechanics and exceptionally beautiful graphics, but they are undermined by a growing penchant for haphazard and capricious changes to core game systems. It's like keeping money in a bank that randomly changes your account balance from week to week.

I'm hopeful that ZOS will follow through with some of its longer-term initiatives, like getting rid of the veteran ranks, because I won't be coming back until those are gone. Having pointlessly chased shifting level caps in other games, I won't be doing it again here.

Deciding what to do when a game is in the condition that currently afflicts ESO isn't easy. When we play games like these, we pour a lot of our time, energy and soul into them, meet other players, make friends, form guilds and share good times and bad together. Throwing up our hands and walking away after doing so much isn't just a practical decision, but an emotional one.

It's not my place to decide for someone else what to do, or even make strong recommendations, really, so I'm just offering my perspective as a dormant player who happens to have stopped by today to check in before taking the next step of uninstalling the game client to make room for other things.

As such a player, I advise against relying on unrealistic expectations about how quickly the game will change. It takes time to turn a big ship like ESO around, and though big changes can indeed happen overnight, far more often they must take place gradually over several months. And that's assuming a commitment to making them actually exists, and persists throughout the long, hard road to bringing them to fruition.

I also advise maintaining a positive outlook and "keeping an eye on this space", so to speak. ESO has gone through some very difficult times, and it's not clear that the worst is yet over. However, it still has many exceptional qualities, and still has immense potential -- if ZOS proves able to unleash it.

That's what I'm hoping for, and I'm willing to wait and see how it goes. Until then, there's plenty of other things to do, and plenty of other places in which to do them.

Whatever your choices, and those of anyone reading this, I wish you happiness and fulfillment, wherever your path may take you.

I have unsubed, and uninstalled, but damn you make some good points.

Although, I am still highly sceptical about what items are being offered in the cash shop, yes I said it, the CASH shop.
To many in game items are becoming so rare that spending real money is close to becoming the only way to get these items.

As well, I think Zos needs to rethink who they have leading some of the various development teams.
We are not suppossd to name names, but the guy on the far leff of the last eso live broadcast needs to go.

Tavore1138 · September 2015

Part of me is deeply cynical and feels ZOS devs are simply not interested in listening to anyone outside the chosen few (you know the ones I mean who get name checked every other live show and actually get replies to their posts on the forums etc.). Sadly that chosen few are long term expert MMO players and their needs and wants do not mesh closely with my needs and wants (nor, I suspect, those of many others).

If that is true then they will keep gating content and creating systems that are exclusive rather than inclusive - long term that means either a dead MMO or a just about sustainable niche MMO with little to no dev support.

The other part hopes that they will actually climb down from their ivory towers and realise that while this latest content has great potential it has a number of things that are negative and a number of, hopefully, unintended consequences that make the base game less appealing or rewarding to anyone VR15 or higher.

If so then maybe they will pull it back enough to keep the game fun until more content drops.

As a side note...

Another couple of hours trying to enjoy IC this morning and while one can go out and do dailies solo and just roll around cooperatively with random people when bigger targets suggest themselves the toxic PvP of objective camping is omnipresent.

An example - in the temple district event I saw 4 or 5 of my alliance taking on the event so I joined in to help out (even though it rewards 0xp for even boss kills if you have already done it... really ZOS???). It's not an easy fight for a smallish group but we had it down to 20%, everyone showing some damage etc... and a group from another alliance roll in, ignore the boss and wipe the injured players and then do not even finish the event but simply roll back out again. I don't know about the rest of the guys fighting but I had about 20--30 stones max 'cos I'm coming to expect this behaviour when doing the dailies so it can't really haver been rewarding for them in terms of loot.

Toxic behaviour caused by a toxic piece of design - I have been PvPing for ages in this game and I have never had cause to feel such rage and hate for other players as with stuff like this. It is griefing pure and simple - but people are griefing because the design rewards that behaviour, the devs have created a system that is designed to make us hate each other more. And anyone deliberately bringing more hate into this world of ours is truly twisted.

Normally at that point I'd go and calm down with a crafting ruin or two, but even that is now frustrating with the lack of XP or useful materials to be gathered so I come here and rage a bit instead.

BalticBlues · September 2015

Our entire family enjoyed TESO for long.
You could feel the love they poured into the game.

There was something in it for everybody:
light and darkness, crafting and looting, wit and sobriety, PVE and PVP, the game was diverse.

However, now it feels like all we get in the future is gloom and doom.
The IC is toxic, its all about killing and stealing, crafting seems futile,
smart PVP seems futile, PVE is forced into PVP enduring gankers, and so on.

Next probably comes even more gloom and doom with orks, thieves and assassins. Nothing against something of this content, but all together points onesided into the dark aspects of TES. It's as if they've asked a 14-year old boy what he would like to have in the game. For this target audience the perspectives certainly look great, but the women in our family see nothing at all coming what they appreciate in a TES game.

TES is not only about a fighting experience, it is also about a spiritual experience.

From this concept, TESO somewhere must have taken a bad exit, and now the games rides through the dark fields of old-school MMO, Diablo and COD. Suitable for a certain target audience, but not much anymore for TES players like us. Too sad.

Elsonso · September 2015

.

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

- Announce Orsinium Information NOW, make it clear that it will be aimed primarily at solo players and that the crafting mats for VR15/16 will be available in the usual manner once it is live. By all means stick a dungeon, a trial and even a 1v1 PvP arena in to give some love to everyone BUT solo players have had ZERO new content since launch.

They won't release Orsinium information early, even if they have decided what that information is and it is too late to change it. I suppose they could drop us little bits about it that they have not decided upon to gauge player response. It is against their culture to be too open and they would probably suffer serious medical complications should they try.

I think that they need to end the PVP DLC, PVE DLC, GROUP DLC UNGROUPED DLC thinking, and so do we. All of the DLC should cater to PVE and PVE on some level and should be friendly to both grouped and ungrouped players. Maybe not all in the same places, and maybe not all mixed together, but there should be something there for everyone. In roughly equal measure. That might mean that some players cannot do everything, but there should be enough for people to do, even if they are unwilling to partake in all parts of the DLC. It might be too late for Orsinium because that has to be almost done by now, but maybe for future DLC.

Imperial City is a location in Cyrodiil, a mixed PVP/PVE zone that is designed with group play in mind. Except for the PVE group dungeons and the lack of PVP objectives, I think we got what we should have been expecting from a DLC city in the center of Cyrodiil. All other objections appear to be opinions about tuning, and ZOS opinion matters most.

Outside of the Imperial City is really nothing but meaningless crafting grind. I guess this should be expected, although I do wish they had not gone so far with the grind.

As for "crafting mats for VR15/16" being available "in the usual manner", I don't think that is something that is going to happen. The drop rate for the glass materials may change and they will introduce the Motifs in the Crown Store, but what happens in the Imperial City stays in the Imperial City. People might consider Motifs in the Crown Store to be "the usual manner". Each DLC will have to retain unique opportunities and loot. If you do not partake in the paid portion of the DLC, you do not participate in the opportunities afforded by it and you do not (directly) get the loot from it.

ZOS finding unique opportunities and loot for every DLC zone in order to get people to buy the DLC is going to fun to watch.

Tavore1138 · September 2015

lordrichter wrote: »

.

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

- Announce Orsinium Information NOW, make it clear that it will be aimed primarily at solo players and that the crafting mats for VR15/16 will be available in the usual manner once it is live. By all means stick a dungeon, a trial and even a 1v1 PvP arena in to give some love to everyone BUT solo players have had ZERO new content since launch.

They won't release Orsinium information early, even if they have decided what that information is and it is too late to change it. I suppose they could drop us little bits about it that they have not decided upon to gauge player response. It is against their culture to be too open and they would probably suffer serious medical complications should they try.

I think that they need to end the PVP DLC, PVE DLC, GROUP DLC UNGROUPED DLC thinking, and so do we. All of the DLC should cater to PVE and PVE on some level and should be friendly to both grouped and ungrouped players. Maybe not all in the same places, and maybe not all mixed together, but there should be something there for everyone. That might mean that some players cannot do everything, but there should be enough for people to do, even if they are unwilling to partake in all parts of the DLC. It might be too late for Orsinium because that has to be almost done by now, but maybe for future DLC.

Imperial City is a location in Cyrodiil, a mixed PVP/PVE zone that is designed with group play in mind. Except for the PVE group dungeons and the lack of PVP objectives, I think we got what we should have been expecting from a DLC city in the center of Cyrodiil. All other objections appear to be opinions about tuning, and ZOS opinion matters most.

Outside of the Imperial City is really nothing but meaningless crafting grind. I guess this should be expected, although I do wish they had not gone so far with the grind.

As for "crafting mats for VR15/16" being available "in the usual manner", I don't think that is something that is going to happen. The drop rate for the glass materials may change and they will introduce the Motifs in the Crown Store, but what happens in the Imperial City stays in the Imperial City. People might consider Motifs in the Crown Store to be "the usual manner". Each DLC will have to retain unique opportunities and loot. If you do not partake in the paid portion of the DLC, you do not participate in the opportunities afforded by it and you do not get the loot from it.

ZOS finding unique opportunities and loot for every DLC zone in order to get people to buy the DLC is going to fun to watch.

I suspect you'll be watching that 'fun' on your own if they play the same crafting tricks with the next release. For many players the ability to craft gear in a self-sufficient way is an important part of play, it was also something that the devs promised to support - simply making IC the only place you could gather the new tiers of material would have been acceptable and understandable... locking them behind a specific type of play style is breaking their word and personally I have little time for those who can't stand by their won promises. P.S. don't care about motifs.

Frankly if the gameplay locked behind a relatively low cost of 2,500 crowns (or free for me as a subscriber) is not good enough to entice people in due to it being fun after over a year of development then someone should be getting serious questions from their boss about their ability to develop games people want to play.

If they have to resort to gimmicks and barriers to get us to buy IC then it is not a very good DLC to begin with - and having played it a bit I'm leaning towards that conclusion.

I think you are mistaken in that every release needs to have something for all intermixed - since if you read any of several dozen threads it is the intermixing of play styles (i.e being 'forced' to do X to be able to do Y) that is causing most of the anger and disappointment being expressed here and on other ESO forums about this release.

This release has taken the fun and progression out of a lot of play styles simply to feed a DLC that should have been good enough to stand on it's own which is why hearing somew positive news about Orsinium before my sub expires might be the only thing to keep me on board. Reading around I am far from being alone in that feeling.

Faulgor · September 2015

Have to disagree 100%. For the first time in a year there's something else to do besides feeding horses.

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

Crafting is now dead because running routes feels less worthwhile when you get no XP and you can't craft anything to use from most of the mats anyway.

Crafting has never been more alive. I collect Voidstone/Nightwood/Voidbloom/Shadowhide every day now to do my writs for the glass fragments, and every VR15/16 drop feels like an accomplishment because it adds up to the materials for VR16 gear. Previously I would throw all white gear into the NPC vendor, it was all just trash. Finally loot has gotten some value.

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

Dungeons may be harder by 2 levels but other than that they are the same - I guess there are the two new ones to learn but that is not going to keep me busy for that long.

Well I can tell you two new dungeons are a heck of a lot better than NOTHING for a whole year. Even the old ones are worth running again for new sets and decraftable loot.

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

'Real' PvP is dead as far as I can see.

I don't know, I see a lot of keep flips and fights going on when I look at the map. Never participated a lot in Cyrodiil PvP, though, so I suppose there could be made some further improvements.

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

PvP in IC is not the thrilling small scale skirmishing that we had been promised because big groups are in harvesting the mobs so you need to run in big groups or just avoid the big groups.

I've had all kinds of encounters in IC so far. Yes, the zergs are annoying, but there are ways to escape and I just blame myself for dying in a blob of yellow or red.

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

Soloing IC is a pain, possible but more effort than 4 or 8 or 12 stones is worth, especially if run over by a group soon after. Mobs are too close together to allow a solo player the necessary manoeuvrability to stay mobile without pulling other groups and with the cost increase to survival skills like dodge and break free it becomes harder to cope with 2 or 3 mobs who hit pretty hard.

While Soloing IC is pretty easy on my magicka Templar - that's not what the zone is designed for. It's much more enjoyable in a small group, and feels like the first true public dungeon in the game.
And pulling the mobs so you don't overwhelm yourself while solo is exactly part of the challenge.

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

The gear we're supposed to be grinding for just ain't that cool for the effort involved.

The PvP sets I will agree are a bit boring, but everything else seems great to me, even the changed crafted sets. I love my new Kagrenac's Hope. I haven't had any luck yet in getting one of the new dropped sets, but a lot of them seem pretty interesting.

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

The 1,000+ bits of leather and metal I need to craft just one set of VR16 gear just don't seem worth the effort of repetitive mob killing in the hope they drop something I can refine for a single piece.

Well if it's not worth the effort to you then go ahead and craft VR15 instead. That's what it's there for.
I'm not a hardcore gamer by any means, but the new mats are much faster to acquire than I previously thought. I have well over 100 Rubedite ingots now, almost enough for a VR16 cuirass - only a few days after the release of the update. This is absolutely fine considering this is supposed to be endgame gear. Finally we have something to work for, being able to make endgame gear at level 42 or somesuch was awfully pointless.

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

Nowhere fun to actually play gives enough XP to get CP anymore (so they solved that problem by accident). I'm sure there are some group grind spots still out there but that sort of repetitive grinding is dull dull dull.

IC overall feels kinda okay-ish for exp if you're not too focused on it, but the lack of viable grind spots is something I have brought up long before this update. The problem is that they designed a system that necessitates grinding, but offer absolutely no areas of the game where this is the intended gameplay.

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

It's like instead of setting me a target to reach to get good gear and xp - instead everything is just too far out of reach to be worth pursuing and so playing at all starts to feel like a waste of time...

My feeling is contrary as previously, everything was too easy and there was nothing worth pursuing. So I just logged in to feed my horses.

+++++++++++++++++++++++

Riko_Futatabi wrote: »

@Teiji - It's what frustrates me the most, knowing something is possible but is never realized.

This game still feels in a state of transition, but like you said it's not clear where it's going. This game does have potential, it's why I stopped playing another MMO to play this, I just hope this potential doesn't become a missed opportunity.

It will be all more clear once Veteran Ranks are removed. This is the great transition ESO has been going through since shortly after PC release, and it still isn't complete. The whole game will be brought together much more, including the removal of rank restrictions to content and faction barriers for PvE grouping. What's more, the change in payment model and console release have delayed progress in this transition, so it feels even more drawn out than it actually is.

Elsonso · September 2015

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

I suspect you'll be watching that 'fun' on your own if they play the same crafting tricks with the next release. For many players the ability to craft gear in a self-sufficient way is an important part of play, it was also something that the devs promised to support - simply making IC the only place you could gather the new tiers of material would have been acceptable and understandable... locking them behind a specific type of play style is breaking their word and personally I have little time for those who can't stand by their won promises. P.S. don't care about motifs.

Frankly if the gameplay locked behind a relatively low cost of 2,500 crowns (or free for me as a subscriber) is not good enough to entice people in due to it being fun after over a year of development then someone should be getting serious questions from their boss about their ability to develop games people want to play.

If they have to resort to gimmicks and barriers to get us to buy IC then it is not a very good DLC to begin with - and having played it a bit I'm leaning towards that conclusion.

I think you are mistaken in that every release needs to have something for all intermixed - since if you read any of several dozen threads it is the intermixing of play styles (i.e being 'forced' to do X to be able to do Y) that is causing most of the anger and disappointment being expressed here and on other ESO forums about this release.

This release has taken the fun and progression out of a lot of play styles simply to feed a DLC that should have been good enough to stand on it's own which is why hearing somew positive news about Orsinium before my sub expires might be the only thing to keep me on board. Reading around I am far from being alone in that feeling.

One of the things that annoys me is the mindset that if a particularly aspect of the game does not directly target the interests of the player with pin point precision, the game is a failure. I know you did not say that, but you are on that road and seem to be happy with that destination.

I see no reason to think that Imperial City is a failure, or ever will be a failure. Quite the opposite, this is the most exciting thing to happen in the game since April 2014. It encompasses more play styles than any other thing added to the game since launch. I doubt that anyone's job is at risk.

Imperial City is group oriented mixed PVP/PVE play. It offers PVE group dungeons, PVE targets, in an open world PVP atmosphere, while still providing some room for ungrouped play. In this respect, it fits in well with Cyrodiil, which is also a group oriented mixed PVP/PVE space with open world PVP and PVE targets and opportunities. For as much as solo and PVE-only players might want Imperial City to be something more friendly to their style of play, it isn't and it shouldn't be.

The Veteran System screws up everything related to DLC. I'm sorry, but while flashy new content is nice and is what the players want, they really need to take care of critical business. It is annoying to me on several levels that they have not focused on releasing the removal of the Veteran Ranks. For as long as they exist, the issue of the max level gear locked behind an optional DLC will plague the game.

I hope that this all ends with Imperial City, but Orsinium is probably too far down the path to change. While I will not go as far as to say it is 100% likely that there will be VR 17 and VR 18 leveling, gear, and crafting locked behind the Orsinium DLC, it is still pretty likely. While the Imperial City crafting will remain locked behind the DLC, the max level gear drive will move to the Orc territory and those players will abandon Imperial City overnight. People afraid to enter Imperial City for max level gear need only wait for Orsinium. That is my prediction.

One thing that players will absolutely need to come to terms with is that crafting and sets, whether they are Veteran Ranked or not, will always include a component that is locked behind the DLC. If a player does not purchase access to the DLC, they will be forever blocked from access. More than that, ZOS can put this material behind any sort of play style. There may be some sets and crafting materials that are only available to group play, only PVE, or only PVP. Players that want this should expect to play the game to get it, and that may include something they do not want to do.

sadownik · September 2015

Faulgor wrote: »

It will be all more clear once Veteran Ranks are removed. This is the great transition ESO has been going through since shortly after PC release, and it still isn't complete. The whole game will be brought together much more, including the removal of rank restrictions to content and faction barriers for PvE grouping. What's more, the change in payment model and console release have delayed progress in this transition, so it feels even more drawn out than it actually is.

I wish this was true, but with every month and every veteran rank added i am more and more certain that vet ranks are here to stay. See, those who hated that implementation simply leave, those who stay are getting accustomed to the attribute points they got and artificial feeling of beeing better than lower ranks. So after Orsinium in which im 99 % sure 2 more vet ranks will be added, they will say "oh we wanted to remove them but majority of the playerbase was against it", mark my words.

Tavore1138 · September 2015

lordrichter wrote: »

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

I suspect you'll be watching that 'fun' on your own if they play the same crafting tricks with the next release. For many players the ability to craft gear in a self-sufficient way is an important part of play, it was also something that the devs promised to support - simply making IC the only place you could gather the new tiers of material would have been acceptable and understandable... locking them behind a specific type of play style is breaking their word and personally I have little time for those who can't stand by their won promises. P.S. don't care about motifs.

Frankly if the gameplay locked behind a relatively low cost of 2,500 crowns (or free for me as a subscriber) is not good enough to entice people in due to it being fun after over a year of development then someone should be getting serious questions from their boss about their ability to develop games people want to play.

If they have to resort to gimmicks and barriers to get us to buy IC then it is not a very good DLC to begin with - and having played it a bit I'm leaning towards that conclusion.

I think you are mistaken in that every release needs to have something for all intermixed - since if you read any of several dozen threads it is the intermixing of play styles (i.e being 'forced' to do X to be able to do Y) that is causing most of the anger and disappointment being expressed here and on other ESO forums about this release.

This release has taken the fun and progression out of a lot of play styles simply to feed a DLC that should have been good enough to stand on it's own which is why hearing somew positive news about Orsinium before my sub expires might be the only thing to keep me on board. Reading around I am far from being alone in that feeling.

One of the things that annoys me is the mindset that if a particularly aspect of the game does not directly target the interests of the player with pin point precision, the game is a failure. I know you did not say that, but you are on that road and seem to be happy with that destination.

I see no reason to think that Imperial City is a failure, or ever will be a failure. Quite the opposite, this is the most exciting thing to happen in the game since April 2014. It encompasses more play styles than any other thing added to the game since launch. I doubt that anyone's job is at risk.

Imperial City is group oriented mixed PVP/PVE play. It offers PVE group dungeons, PVE targets, in an open world PVP atmosphere, while still providing some room for ungrouped play. In this respect, it fits in well with Cyrodiil, which is also a group oriented mixed PVP/PVE space with open world PVP and PVE targets and opportunities. For as much as solo and PVE-only players might want Imperial City to be something more friendly to their style of play, it isn't and it shouldn't be.

The Veteran System screws up everything related to DLC. I'm sorry, but while flashy new content is nice and is what the players want, they really need to take care of critical business. It is annoying to me on several levels that they have not focused on releasing the removal of the Veteran Ranks. For as long as they exist, the issue of the max level gear locked behind an optional DLC will plague the game.

I hope that this all ends with Imperial City, but Orsinium is probably too far down the path to change. While I will not go as far as to say it is 100% likely that there will be VR 17 and VR 18 leveling, gear, and crafting locked behind the Orsinium DLC, it is still pretty likely. While the Imperial City crafting will remain locked behind the DLC, the max level gear drive will move to the Orc territory and those players will abandon Imperial City overnight. People afraid to enter Imperial City for max level gear need only wait for Orsinium. That is my prediction.

One thing that players will absolutely need to come to terms with is that crafting and sets, whether they are Veteran Ranked or not, will always include a component that is locked behind the DLC. If a player does not purchase access to the DLC, they will be forever blocked from access. More than that, ZOS can put this material behind any sort of play style. There may be some sets and crafting materials that are only available to group play, only PVE, or only PVP. Players that want this should expect to play the game to get it, and that may include something they do not want to do.

I really am not expecting it to be targetted at me specifically - my whole pleasure in this game, despite bugs and lag and so on, has been in the ability to do diverse things as and when I feel like doing them AND getting progress/reward from doing all of them.

My problem with this release is that it seems to have taken the sparkle out of most of the things I have enjoyed without adding something of equal pleasure in return.

I have no problem doing varied content to get gear, in fact I enjoy the variety - I've trialed for my Vicious Serpent pieces, I've PvP'd for Ravager, Morag and Shadow Walker and I've researched and crafted to make my own custom sets - all in gold with gold enchants from my own efforts.

For me, and it is a personal thing of course, IC is setting boundaries around what I can do - if I want crafting waters or ingots or leather or wood or runes... IC, if I want new sets... IC, if I want to find any players to PvP against... IC, if I want XP to get CP... IC, if I want to do new quests (and get stabbed while doing them)... IC...

Seeing the theme yet? The choice has gone for me as I perceive it.

That being said I am glad you still find pleasure in it.

@Faulgor A lot of the difference in your actual play experience regarding mob groups can be summed up in the words 'Magicka' & 'Templar'... my templar alt can also spam puncturing strikes and lay out AOE damage while self healing like a boss but it's not my thing TBH - my main is a stamina NB so with the mass nerfs to stamina regen and with not being able to use dodge or block any more in a fight against multiple mobs combat is sort of less fluid and fun for me right now - that is amply covered in other threads so I did not mention it here.

I still collect stuff but one of my relaxing pleasures while watching TV with my wife was simply running collection routes in The Rift 3 or 4 times to gather a bunch of materials and also enough relatively easy XP to get a CP for the day - I can't do that now and I think, oddly, that is one of the things that hurts most. If Orsinium opens up the ability to harvest crafting ingredients again it will be a game saver for me - after a day at work I had come to enjoy the relaxation of running through well done scenery just doing my thing...

However I really don't begrudge you that you are enjoying the new changes, I'm just explaining why I am not - telling me why you are is unlikely to make me suddenly find the fun again just as telling you why I am not probably won't make you have less fun (at least I hope not).

As with any thread here the secret hope is that maybe some dev might actually read it and go 'You know he's got a point and we'll throw it into the melting pot for the next set of changes'.

Morimizo · September 2015

lordrichter wrote: »

More than that, ZOS can put this material behind any sort of play style. There may be some sets and crafting materials that are only available to group play, only PVE, or only PVP.

Perhaps someone could enlighten me, but what "endgame" gear is locked behind PVE solo-able at the moment? Are there unique sets in Public Dungeons, or Delves, or Dolmens, that people actually hunt for and use? It would be fair if there were, but I'm not sure of any loot but substandard blue uniques that are non-setpiece.

Tavore1138 · September 2015

Morimizo wrote: »

lordrichter wrote: »

More than that, ZOS can put this material behind any sort of play style. There may be some sets and crafting materials that are only available to group play, only PVE, or only PVP.

Perhaps someone could enlighten me, but what "endgame" gear is locked behind PVE solo-able at the moment? Are there unique sets in Public Dungeons, or Delves, or Dolmens, that people actually hunt for and use? It would be fair if there were, but I'm not sure of any loot but substandard blue uniques that are non-setpiece.

Can't think of any - both my PvP and PvE load outs currently consist of either PvP set drop, PvP AP buys or crafted sets.

LiquidZ · September 2015

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

Mobs are too close together to allow a solo player the necessary manoeuvrability to stay mobile without pulling other groups and with the cost increase to survival skills like dodge and break free it becomes harder to cope with 2 or 3 mobs who hit pretty hard.

I agree with that. However I'm still fairly new to the game so I'm still finding a ton of stuff to do.

Digiman · September 2015

nimander99 wrote: »

Think about it. The only content that has been added to the game since launch has been group or pvp related content... yet I think its safe to say that the majority of the player base play solo and group occasionally... maybe not the forum warriors who'll troll me for this comment, but; C'est la vie

Your actually correct. The current content isn't just forcing you into grouping with players but forced into a larger group.

I don't like craglorn because it required 3 other players to complete that is essentially now dead because of the new IC tier. The progress for gear with the stones seemed like a good idea, but ZoS never thought about adding stuff to detract from zerging.

Zergs get survival and domination a great feeling of victory even if they get nothing out of it.

My advice to ZoS is to start working on dailies without forcing players into waiting on forming groups and for IC to weapons and barricades set up to smash players grouped up together.

If ZoS can't do that and your solution is gating you failed this content patch.

It would be nice if there was a zone for single player quests while they waited on groups being formed so it doesn't feel like your sitting on your ass waiting.