State of the DK, 1.7

Armitas · September 2015

After successive and never ending nerfs, and changes to core game mechanics, the DK has really fallen behind and needs serious repair. We were anticipating that we would be repaired in 1.7 but instead of that happening we got a few more nerfs, problems were made worse, and some problems were just ignored.

State of the DK

Ardent Flame.

Fiery Grip. Due to the change to Y axis this skill is unreliable as a gap closer or a tanking mechanic. Sometimes it just will not work when it should work. When it does work it's disorienting because you don't know if you will come to the target or the target will come to you. We need 1 morph to pull and 1 to gap close.
Inferno - It still shows 20% crit when it's actually 10%. It's basically a clone of Magelight with a small difference, you can either hit something with a small fire ball every 5 seconds or have 7% max magicka and 2% magicka recovery. A class skill should always be better, but I'm better off taking ML if I have high magicka and Inferno if I have low magicka.
Inferno - Sea of Flames - The chance that the measly fire ball every 5 seconds will get a killing blow is too slim, the amount of magicka it can give seems to have been written in 1.5 before the inflated stats. It's not a valualbe or even a noticable morph.
Kindling - The nerf to secondary effect proc chance has really made this a wasted passive. 66% more burning isn't helpful when the chance to apply burning is so low.

Draconic Power

Hardened Armor - The tiny shield on this skill, plus the 50% shield nerf, plus the overflow bug that includes a chanec to crit makes this morph actually harmful. The Shield will blow quickly and any remaining damage left over after the shield will hit at 0% mitigation and can crit. So all the armor that is applied from this skill is penetrated by the overflow bug.
Dragon Blood - Due the 50% healing nerf this skill is a dangerous heal. To get any heal output at all you have to fall below execute range. With the 50% heal nerf you have to be near dead to get anything out of it. It's a terrible heal right now because it's completely ineffective till you are at 1 shot range.
Dragon Blood - Green dragon blood - With Tripots the stamina recovery on this is useless. I would like majors to provide minors if a major is already active. So if a tripots has been consumed and you pop GDB it should give you a minor stamina recovery.
Elder Dragon - The health recovery works and gives you a nice hot, but in PvP it's reduced to 50% by any disease. In PvE you survive by mitigation and a healer, not health recovery. It's just not broadly useful, I'd like to see health recovery made useful or this passive made useful.

Earthen Heart

Corrosive Armor - This needs to actually penetrate armor, not just physical mitigation. There is no reason to make an ultimate so divisive between stamina and magicka builds.
Obsidian Shard - I would not use this to heal someone, I would use healing ward if I needed to save them. It doesn't heal for much, even less at 50% healing, it does less damage than the other morph and the situation where the guy next to enemy X would need this tiny heal and the enemy CC'd are limited. I really don't know why this exists. It is incomplete.
Molten Weapons - This is a bad execute in PvP as it requires a cast, a GCD, then a fully charged heavy attack which can just be dodge rolled, blocked, healed out of execute range, or you can get CC'd while casting it. There is too much hassle and things that can go wrong here for an execute. It completely ignores the entire purpose of an execute. In PvE the full heavy requirement gives you wasted seconds. If you are charging your heavy attack and have to dodge roll, then you lost the buff entirely when you release the shot. If you have 2 seconds remaining but need 3 seconds to finish a heavy attack then 2 seconds of the skill have just been wasted. There is no reason for this skill to be so complicated and restrictive. It is a good skill in theory but terrible in application. Again too much hassle and too many things that can go wrong that undermine the duration.
Obsidian Shield - Due to the 50% shield nerf, and the overflow bug this is a detriment to both you and your group. Because the shield is small, and the damage is small from the damage nerf it is now even more likely that you will have a tiny shield left that the overflow bug will take advantage of. Lets say you cast obsidian shield on your group and they are hit for a 1,900 aoe leaving about 100 left on the shield applied to your group. Then a prox det goes off and hits the entire group penetrating all of their mitigation and with a chance to crit. It is a complete detriment to both you and your group. You cannot safely cast this in a group. The skills is dead, gone, ruined.
Battle roar - Should reference your highest stat for the replenishment. We don't have straight recovery on a DK, this is our resource management tool. Making it based on each stat individually leaves you in a magicka build not getting enough stamina, or a stamina build not getting enough magicka from it. If I'm in a magicka build I will more likely need stamina, not my primary stat. You had the right idea, just make it based on the highest stat.

This thread is open so add anything I missed or if you have better thoughts on them, or any disagreements please list them below.

Armitas · September 2015

---No one is saying the DK is bad, or that there are not builds that can do really well. All that is being said is that there are specific skills that are falling behind, due to neglect or mechanic changes. --

With obsidian shield as a detriment I'd almost rather the shield be removed and replaced with a different kind of defense. For example Major spell defense, or Major physical resist (Not both), dodge chance (which doesn't really fit the animation), or crit reduction. I prefer the damage shield, but so long as the overflow bug exists it's just not viable on the group.

The explosion on frag shield is really not that powerful so I would like to see that either increased or replaced with an offensive buff like minor crit chance, or minor crit damage for the group.

Among other things we are a buff class so I would really like this ability to be restored. I picked this class for that very reason and I really hate seeing that fall away progressively through 1.6 and 1.7.

I would also like to add a replacement suggestion for Fiery Grip that Panda made on the PTS.

Yonkit wrote: »

Fire Torrent - Encase yourself in flames and flash to your enemy, knocking them down and stunning them for 2s. Deals 2k fire damage at base value, same cost as chains. Same range as every other charge/teleport, 24m. (Think of it as bolt escape for Dks, but it's fire instead of lightning, and requires a target. It would fall under a teleport ability and and not a charge.)

drzycki_ESO · September 2015

Thank you for the information, Armitas. I haven't gotten to play since the new patch so I had no idea. Now I'm a very sad DK.

Armitas, what is your build? Do you have it posted anywhere?

Thecapeo · September 2015

I don't know if you've seen some of the Stam DK build videos lately but they are crushing people right now. Nigh unkillable with great damage. I've seen some of the well known pvpers predicting in a month, after more people adopt similar builds, you'll be seeing a lot of nerf DK threads again.

Armitas · September 2015

Thecapeo wrote: »

I don't know if you've seen some of the Stam DK build videos lately but they are crushing people right now. Nigh unkillable with great damage. I've seen some of the well known pvpers predicting in a month, after more people adopt similar builds, you'll be seeing a lot of nerf DK threads again.

Other than the change to battle roar there was nothing added for stamina DK's in 1.7 that I can recall. Everyone is scattering for new builds and blazing new trails so the DK may turn up with something new. If they do turn out to be on top it will be due to variables independent to the class, which will leave these same skills in the same state.

Thecapeo · September 2015

From what I've seen and read, and I've only been playing this game since it dropped on PS4 so I wouldn't say my observations are all that reliable, it's coming down to the fact that the 50% cut in damage is a huge boon to the DKs already inherent tankiness. All the builds I've seen are sword and board but the second bar varies. And I know your down on Obsidian Shield but people are spamming it to keep stam up through Helping Hands.

aco5712 · September 2015

You need to just find a build for 1.7. The stam DK is a monster now as a tank and you can just turn around and lay some nice dps and I have actually 3 shot people with a tank build in this new update magicka DK needs more tweaking to achieve something and is harder to play but kodi posted a nice DK video If you need ideas.

Armitas · September 2015

I have a magicka build for 1.7. These are just a list of skills that have fallen behind, been neglected, or just broken.

Yonkit · September 2015

"Armitas I think it's pretty clear that ZoS hardly listens to feedback, constructive or not, when it comes to Templars or Dragonknights, I called it on the PTS before it went to Live, and after playing around for a few hours on Live I can't do it... I just can't. The absurdity of this blanket nerf is beyond me, on so many levels. Healing wasn't an issue, it was NEVER, an issue, damage wasn't an issue, it was never an issue, being able to stack so many broken abilities was an issue. Magelight, bam 20% more damage, rally, bam 20% more damage, grab thief stone, bam, crit damage, roll a khajiit, bam, sneak damage, camo hunter, bam more damage.

Now, they fixed the magelight thing, which stopped the excessive 20k+ Snipes, next, they should've looked into fixing Nirnhoned and toning down crystal frags, then, they could've arguably done the hardest and looked at wrecking blow. Which due to it's nature, is very broke, letting you charge a heavy attack during it, break the global cool-down, land both at the same time, and then be able to immediately cast another ability and have all 3 land, quite literally, half a second apart.

But nope.

Sorc Shields OP - Blanket Damage Shield Nerf
Stam Damage OP - Blanket Damage Nerf
Templar Healing OP - Blanket Healing Nerf

This Patch, is a monument, to the absurd laziness of the Combat/PvP department."

- Panda244

Corrupted_Soul · September 2015

Yonkit wrote: »

"Armitas I think it's pretty clear that ZoS hardly listens to feedback, constructive or not, when it comes to Templars or Dragonknights, I called it on the PTS before it went to Live, and after playing around for a few hours on Live I can't do it... I just can't. The absurdity of this blanket nerf is beyond me, on so many levels. Healing wasn't an issue, it was NEVER, an issue, damage wasn't an issue, it was never an issue, being able to stack so many broken abilities was an issue. Magelight, bam 20% more damage, rally, bam 20% more damage, grab thief stone, bam, crit damage, roll a khajiit, bam, sneak damage, camo hunter, bam more damage.

Now, they fixed the magelight thing, which stopped the excessive 20k+ Snipes, next, they should've looked into fixing Nirnhoned and toning down crystal frags, then, they could've arguably done the hardest and looked at wrecking blow. Which due to it's nature, is very broke, letting you charge a heavy attack during it, break the global cool-down, land both at the same time, and then be able to immediately cast another ability and have all 3 land, quite literally, half a second apart.

But nope.

Sorc Shields OP - Blanket Damage Shield Nerf
Stam Damage OP - Blanket Damage Nerf
Templar Healing OP - Blanket Healing Nerf

This Patch, is a monument, to the absurd laziness of the Combat/PvP department."

- Panda244

You sir, have the right idea. +rep

Yonkit · September 2015

Corrupted_Soul wrote: »

Yonkit wrote: »

"Armitas I think it's pretty clear that ZoS hardly listens to feedback, constructive or not, when it comes to Templars or Dragonknights, I called it on the PTS before it went to Live, and after playing around for a few hours on Live I can't do it... I just can't. The absurdity of this blanket nerf is beyond me, on so many levels. Healing wasn't an issue, it was NEVER, an issue, damage wasn't an issue, it was never an issue, being able to stack so many broken abilities was an issue. Magelight, bam 20% more damage, rally, bam 20% more damage, grab thief stone, bam, crit damage, roll a khajiit, bam, sneak damage, camo hunter, bam more damage.

Now, they fixed the magelight thing, which stopped the excessive 20k+ Snipes, next, they should've looked into fixing Nirnhoned and toning down crystal frags, then, they could've arguably done the hardest and looked at wrecking blow. Which due to it's nature, is very broke, letting you charge a heavy attack during it, break the global cool-down, land both at the same time, and then be able to immediately cast another ability and have all 3 land, quite literally, half a second apart.

But nope.

Sorc Shields OP - Blanket Damage Shield Nerf
Stam Damage OP - Blanket Damage Nerf
Templar Healing OP - Blanket Healing Nerf

This Patch, is a monument, to the absurd laziness of the Combat/PvP department."

- Panda244

You sir, have the right idea. +rep

Just relaying what Panda thinks as he can't post for himself, though we're generally on the same page when it comes to where DKs and Templars are currently, and that would be a landfill atm.

hardcore_gmr · September 2015

In order to not get banned for saying what I really think of this players incoherent ramblings, I will leave this here and let people decide for themselves.....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uDDJ8igYPjE

Please don't listen to bad players, explain why they are bad players, they like crabs in a bucket seek to bring the rest of us down with them

hardcore_gmr · September 2015

I didn't want to leave my magicka brethren out either so......

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uoJfkCiZ8VY

Your welcome!

Armitas · September 2015

hardcore_gmr wrote: »

In order to not get banned for saying what I really think of this players incoherent ramblings, I will leave this here and let people decide for themselves.....

Thanks. I decided that you didn't bother reading the thread before posting.

hardcore_gmr · September 2015

Armitas wrote: »

hardcore_gmr wrote: »

In order to not get banned for saying what I really think of this players incoherent ramblings, I will leave this here and let people decide for themselves.....

Thanks. I decided that you didn't bother reading the thread before posting.

actually quite the contrary I read your entire post which is why I posted the videos to show that you didn't know what you were talking about. Both videos show a dragon knight in the current patch not only wrecking face but using a large majority of the skills you claimed to be bad. I only pointed out that sometimes it is not the skills that are to blame but merely bad players. feel free to elaborate how any of that point is not perfectly visually represented from the videos I posted.

SkylarkAU · September 2015

The tankiness combined with the sustain of the 1.7 DK makes it possibly the best pressure/heavy hitter class in pvp right now. I really don't know why people are banging on like a bucket of hand grenades about how bad it is - I haven't touched my main since 1.7 dropped.

Yonkit · September 2015

hardcore_gmr wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

hardcore_gmr wrote: »

In order to not get banned for saying what I really think of this players incoherent ramblings, I will leave this here and let people decide for themselves.....

Thanks. I decided that you didn't bother reading the thread before posting.

actually quite the contrary I read your entire post which is why I posted the videos to show that you didn't know what you were talking about. Both videos show a dragon knight in the current patch not only wrecking face but using a large majority of the skills you claimed to be bad. I only pointed out that sometimes it is not the skills that are to blame but merely bad players. feel free to elaborate how any of that point is not perfectly visually represented from the videos I posted.

Because what's not perfectly visually represented in that video is coming in contact with any other skilled players which would result in you getting your ass handed to you because you have no viable heal outside of Blessing Of Protection, and even that is debatable, or a never ending draw, which is an issue outside the DK/Templar issue.

You're obviously someone that knows nothing about the class issues brought up in this thread so I kindly advise you to go search the forums for these issues, brought up on numerous occasions, both in PTS forums and on Live forums, over the course of the last two and a half, to three months.

Coming to the forums, linking two videos which proves nothing, and making your case, is like showing up to court on charge of murder, showing the judge your police badge, and acting like it means something.

As far as the personal jab at Armitas goes.

"In order to not get banned for saying what I really think of this players incoherent ramblings..."

This is completely off topic and also against the forum rules if I'm not mistaken, @ZOS_AlanG If you could confirm or deny this.

Lastly, we're trying to have a civil conversation here on this thread about the issues underlying the DK class, while some issues are not just inherently involved with DKs, most are. So please, take your personal jabs, and know-it-all attitude and leave.

Cyrediath · September 2015

I can't believe it. Do people still want buff to DK?

Stamina 2h/1h-s DK Builds are the best for 1v1 pvp situation right now and for pve, magicka dk does the best dps and still people want zenimax to buff dk.. bravo.. I can't believe you guys....

hardcore_gmr · September 2015

Yonkit wrote: »

hardcore_gmr wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

hardcore_gmr wrote: »

In order to not get banned for saying what I really think of this players incoherent ramblings, I will leave this here and let people decide for themselves.....

Thanks. I decided that you didn't bother reading the thread before posting.

actually quite the contrary I read your entire post which is why I posted the videos to show that you didn't know what you were talking about. Both videos show a dragon knight in the current patch not only wrecking face but using a large majority of the skills you claimed to be bad. I only pointed out that sometimes it is not the skills that are to blame but merely bad players. feel free to elaborate how any of that point is not perfectly visually represented from the videos I posted.

Because what's not perfectly visually represented in that video is coming in contact with any other skilled players which would result in you getting your ass handed to you because you have no viable heal outside of Blessing Of Protection, and even that is debatable, or a never ending draw, which is an issue outside the DK/Templar issue.

You're obviously someone that knows nothing about the class issues brought up in this thread so I kindly advise you to go search the forums for these issues, brought up on numerous occasions, both in PTS forums and on Live forums, over the course of the last two and a half, to three months.

Coming to the forums, linking two videos which proves nothing, and making your case, is like showing up to court on charge of murder, showing the judge your police badge, and acting like it means something.

As far as the personal jab at Armitas goes.

"In order to not get banned for saying what I really think of this players incoherent ramblings..."

This is completely off topic and also against the forum rules if I'm not mistaken, @ZOS_AlanG If you could confirm or deny this.

Lastly, we're trying to have a civil conversation here on this thread about the issues underlying the DK class, while some issues are not just inherently involved with DKs, most are. So please, take your personal jabs, and know-it-all attitude and leave.

He wrote a giant wall of text which he assumed I did not read, I took into consideration his point and rather than respond with a equally giant wall of text I simply showed him he was wrong. Its cool that you agree with him, I respectfully do not. This is called a dialogue, you say something, I say something in response, we may or may not see eye to eye but we make our points with evidence and proof. now I showed you video of excellent play using the very skills you claim broken, I challenge you to show me those skills used by an equally skilled player function in any way as the OP described and then we can have a real conversation. Until then you are speaking specifically to your own play experience, to which I respond "must be user error"

As far as the incoherent ramblings comment, I did not say what I really thought which if I did would indeed be in violation of forum rules. But if I must err on the side of political correctness, let me state that his entire block of text is inconsistent with the visually proof that was provided, the many players who still very effectively play the DK class, or simply what ZoS has determined from its own deliberations. there is nothing wrong with the skills he mentioned, and by effect if there is nothing wrong with the class skills then by default, the responsibility for poor play must fall to the player instead.

I get it, its never the players fault, there must be something wrong with the class, something better about other classes, too many CP, too much nerf....etc....etc .....it could never be the fault of the player. if must all submit to this line of thinking to be considered apart of the conversation (as you put it) then it is clear that every class needs to have the request of its weaker players honored and we should see longer invisible times for nightblade, harder hitting stamina abilities for sorcs, more overall damage for Templars, just to name a few of the more obscene request encountered on these forums.

But I will honor your request to leave your thread alone, clearly you intended this thread to be a complaint thread that would garner the changes you laid forth and someone like me coming here to display any proof/evidence/claim to the contrary that your claims of broken skills are off base must put a damper on more players getting their pitchforks. So I will leave, because if being apart of this civil conversation means I have to accept the unproven opinion of another then I don't think I want to be here. Good day

*drops mic*

MrGrimey · September 2015

Stam DK is #1 for pvp and actually overpowered, check out Scribes build and see how he beat every one of sypher's classes

This is really a L2p issue

Armitas · September 2015

hardcore_gmr wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

hardcore_gmr wrote: »

In order to not get banned for saying what I really think of this players incoherent ramblings, I will leave this here and let people decide for themselves.....

Thanks. I decided that you didn't bother reading the thread before posting.

actually quite the contrary I read your entire post which is why I posted the videos to show that you didn't know what you were talking about. Both videos show a dragon knight in the current patch not only wrecking face but using a large majority of the skills you claimed to be bad. I only pointed out that sometimes it is not the skills that are to blame but merely bad players. feel free to elaborate how any of that point is not perfectly visually represented from the videos I posted.

Oh so you posted build videos on a thread listing specifically broken skills, wrong tooltips, and underpowerd skills for what reason again?

I never said they could not "wreck face", it's a list of skills that have fallen behind. If you would like to challenge one of the things I posted do so because those videos certainly do not. I even asked you to do so in the thread you claimed to have read, but we all know you skimmed through.

Armitas · September 2015

MrGrimey wrote: »

This is really a L2p issue

Apparently Reading is more of an issue lately.

Armitas · September 2015

hardcore_gmr wrote: »

Yonkit wrote: »

hardcore_gmr wrote: »

Armitas wrote: »

hardcore_gmr wrote: »

In order to not get banned for saying what I really think of this players incoherent ramblings, I will leave this here and let people decide for themselves.....

Thanks. I decided that you didn't bother reading the thread before posting.

actually quite the contrary I read your entire post which is why I posted the videos to show that you didn't know what you were talking about. Both videos show a dragon knight in the current patch not only wrecking face but using a large majority of the skills you claimed to be bad. I only pointed out that sometimes it is not the skills that are to blame but merely bad players. feel free to elaborate how any of that point is not perfectly visually represented from the videos I posted.

Because what's not perfectly visually represented in that video is coming in contact with any other skilled players which would result in you getting your ass handed to you because you have no viable heal outside of Blessing Of Protection, and even that is debatable, or a never ending draw, which is an issue outside the DK/Templar issue.

You're obviously someone that knows nothing about the class issues brought up in this thread so I kindly advise you to go search the forums for these issues, brought up on numerous occasions, both in PTS forums and on Live forums, over the course of the last two and a half, to three months.

Coming to the forums, linking two videos which proves nothing, and making your case, is like showing up to court on charge of murder, showing the judge your police badge, and acting like it means something.

As far as the personal jab at Armitas goes.

"In order to not get banned for saying what I really think of this players incoherent ramblings..."

This is completely off topic and also against the forum rules if I'm not mistaken, @ZOS_AlanG If you could confirm or deny this.

Lastly, we're trying to have a civil conversation here on this thread about the issues underlying the DK class, while some issues are not just inherently involved with DKs, most are. So please, take your personal jabs, and know-it-all attitude and leave.

He wrote a giant wall of text which he assumed I did not read, I took into consideration his point and rather than respond with a equally giant wall of text I simply showed him he was wrong. Its cool that you agree with him, I respectfully do not. This is called a dialogue, you say something, I say something in response, we may or may not see eye to eye but we make our points with evidence and proof. now I showed you video of excellent play using the very skills you claim broken, I challenge you to show me those skills used by an equally skilled player function in any way as the OP described and then we can have a real conversation. Until then you are speaking specifically to your own play experience, to which I respond "must be user error"

*drops mic*

Except that you are not engaged in a dialogue. Instead you said yourself that you were incapable of doing so without getting banned, so you posted videos that make no reference to the specific issues listed. If you are not capable of dialogue then you really have no business in this thread.

Thanks, leave the mic there on the ground, i'll have some one wipe it off later.

Armitas · September 2015

drzycki_ESO wrote: »

Thank you for the information, Armitas. I haven't gotten to play since the new patch so I had no idea. Now I'm a very sad DK.

Armitas, what is your build? Do you have it posted anywhere?

I'm going to wait till I get all the mats to make it before I post it, but basically I'm reaching the mitigation cap in 5 light. I'm going to use mist form and other earthen heart abilities to juggle stamina instead of igneous due to it's potential to actually make you take more damage. I was at 45% mitigation in 1.6 and with the change to light armor I can reach 50%.

zornyan · September 2015

So let's get this straight.

Op complains about skills he thinks are broken

People post videos to show 'broken' skills working

Op says skills are broken, ignoring that DK'S Are probably the most powerful pvp class, so if they made all these skills 'fixed' like the op suggests DK's would be even more OP.

Templars have dozens of broken skills, hell my biting jabs is supposed to do 4 hits or damage, yet it only does one, a few of our skills got nerfed in this patch too.

Sorcerers have had a direct couple of hits with this patch, and with the possibility of no shield stacking/critable Shields are going to be hit hard again.

NBs have had to switch to magika, so stams have had a hit too. As has the glass cannon build due to needed more survivability.

So let's forget ALL of these then, and just focus on making the current most powerful class, even more powerful.

Rylana · September 2015

MrGrimey wrote: »

Stam DK is #1 for pvp and actually overpowered, check out Scribes build and see how he beat every one of sypher's classes

This is really a L2p issue

You guys really need to stop nuthugging on a couple of youtube champs and realize one build does not work for all players.

Not does it work for all situations.

Guarantee if you used someone elses build/style youd fail it hard

So shush mate. Learn to make your own stuff, stop copying others and thinking it makes you pro. Ive looked at all of the posted builds - Sribes, Kodi, Lefty, and they do not fit the role I play at all. They are soloer builds, they would need heavy tweaking if not complete refits to match what I, for example, do as a DK.

So again, just because someone you think is omfgawesomesaucefamouslol posted something on the internet, it doesnt make it good or better than something else.

Here is a good question for you, champ. What does Sribes build or video do for a group? Where anywhere in the skillset or setup does it lend any benefit whatsoever to even a smallman 4-6 man group?

None. But its a good soloer/duel build ill give it that. But from what I saw, complete and utter garbage for group synergy. O_o No offense to him, his role and niche is his own. But it would have no place in a 4-6man group.

Armitas · September 2015

zornyan wrote: »

So let's get this straight.

Op complains about skills he thinks are broken

People post videos to show 'broken' skills working

Those videos were not designed as a response to my thread. Those videos are a selection of all the positive outcomes of the author. They don't prove anything nor specifically address the specific problems I listed. If any of you want to actually engage the items listed please do so, but these videos ABSOLUTELY do not. The videos are not a logical counter to what I posted, they are the product of one persons laziness to make a comprehensive reply and their inability to convey their thoughts without getting banned.

Rylana · September 2015

Summary - dont post any 1v1 videos/builds to try to convince anyone that DK is okay, because it is not.

Theres a heck of a lot more a DK needs to be able to do than fight ONE player at a time.

Rylana · September 2015

aco5712 wrote: »

You need to just find a build for 1.7. The stam DK is a monster now as a tank and you can just turn around and lay some nice dps and I have actually 3 shot people with a tank build in this new update magicka DK needs more tweaking to achieve something and is harder to play but kodi posted a nice DK video If you need ideas.

I do see some benefit to Kodi's setup and how he runs things, but the problem with his build generally, and indeed all recent posted builds is the following:

- DK used to be group SUPPORTIVE strong, and solo decent
- DK now is group DEPENDANT, and solo strong, its basically switched roles with the nightblade entirely, only the nightblade never needed help in the first place.

What does this mean? You can either build DK to run solo wrecking face, which is fine, but not have any purpose to your group, or you can build for group synergy and then be completely dependent on outside heals to survive.

Either way, its put the DK in a bad place. Self sustain is/was the hallmark of the class, the one thing that set it apart as a staple of a strong group. Now? There is nothing a DK can do that another class doesnt do better.

There is no longer a purpose to be a dragonknight. Fully 1/4 of the game's class diversity has been gutted and left to die.

Outside of soloer/duel builds and completely group oriented and thus dependant builds, there is no role for one. The only reason Kodi's build even works the way it does is because hes been recently a very solo or two man esque player. it wouldnt be a very good group stack build really, actually it might be kind of bad for group, if im honest. But maybe he swaps things around and does it different, who knows, youd have to ask him.

I see what hes doing in his vids and it immediately makes the think of the guy we have to turn around to go back and rez somewhere because he tried to take on way more than he could handle and go separated from everyone else. *shrug*

Then again he knows his limits, has honed his craft. Perhaps for him it would work. Now copy that template onto someone just picking it up thinking its godmode, and watch them fall flat and be raged at in TS for being 100 miles away from everyone because they thought they were godmode and learned real quick they just suck. Tis the reason I hate blind fanboyism.

I dont disagree, stam DK is very good right now. Magicka DK (which is what almost everything Armitas posted about is dependent on being reliable to function effectively) is really hurting.

drzycki_ESO · September 2015

Rylana wrote: »

MrGrimey wrote: »

Stam DK is #1 for pvp and actually overpowered, check out Scribes build and see how he beat every one of sypher's classes

This is really a L2p issue

You guys really need to stop nuthugging on a couple of youtube champs and realize one build does not work for all players.

Not does it work for all situations.

Guarantee if you used someone elses build/style youd fail it hard

So shush mate. Learn to make your own stuff, stop copying others and thinking it makes you pro. Ive looked at all of the posted builds - Sribes, Kodi, Lefty, and they do not fit the role I play at all. They are soloer builds, they would need heavy tweaking if not complete refits to match what I, for example, do as a DK.

So again, just because someone you think is omfgawesomesaucefamouslol posted something on the internet, it doesnt make it good or better than something else.

Here is a good question for you, champ. What does Sribes build or video do for a group? Where anywhere in the skillset or setup does it lend any benefit whatsoever to even a smallman 4-6 man group?

None. But its a good soloer/duel build ill give it that. But from what I saw, complete and utter garbage for group synergy. O_o No offense to him, his role and niche is his own. But it would have no place in a 4-6man group.

This. I am never solo and never dual. I am ALWAYS in a group so as Rylana said, their setup wouldn't work for players like us.

Edit: I am particularly interested in the Obsidian Shield overflow bug. Has this been tested recently to see if it has been fixed?

"Obsidian Shield - Due to the 50% shield nerf, and the overflow bug this is a detriment to both you and your group. Because the shield is small, and the damage is small from the damage nerf it is now even more likely that you will have a tiny shield left that the overflow bug will take advantage of. Lets say you cast obsidian shield on your group and they are hit for a 1,900 aoe leaving about 100 left on the shield applied to your group. Then a prox det goes off and hits the entire group penetrating all of their mitigation and with a chance to crit. It is a complete detriment to both you and your group. You cannot safely cast this in a group. The skills is dead, gone, ruined."

Sensesfail13 · September 2015

@Armitas Trolls will be trolls man, I havent posted because I didnt feel much needed to be added. I have been fairly vocal about my opinions about this patch and the status of the DK for the last year and this post was well made. Its sad that you get bad players and bad people on your thread that was totally constructive and civil to begin with @hardcore_gmr you, my friend, are bad and you should feel bad.

Rylana wrote: »

Summary - dont post any 1v1 videos/builds to try to convince anyone that DK is okay, because it is not.

Theres a heck of a lot more a DK needs to be able to do than fight ONE player at a time.

Not often I agree with you but in this case I could not agree with you more, thanks for the post.