Why no spears? They're daggers on sticks.

BullNetch · September 2015

You have four one-handed weapon types. daggers, swords, maces, and axes.
You have three two-handed weapon types. swords, maces, and axes.

Twin blade and talent skill line buffs daggers with increased weapon crit.
Heavy weapons would buff spears with the increased weapon crit

UrQuan · September 2015

The explanation that I heard back shortly after launch was that spear animations are boring. I disagree and present this as proof:

https://youtu.be/QS2IYyywZMs

QuebraRegra · September 2015

I like this...

Why not have a difference in weapon performance (dagger faster than a sword with less damage, axe more dmg but slower than a sword, etc.). A spear should have greater range. Maybe change the block efficiency of one weapon versus another... A bow should have the weakest block.

BullNetch · September 2015

UrQuan wrote: »

The explanation that I heard back shortly after launch was that spear animations are boring. I disagree and present this as proof:
https://youtu.be/QS2IYyywZMs

The spear animations are in the game. Aedric spear.

DKs have the whip animation, if they ever added chain whips.

Asherons_Call · September 2015

Because it would be a unique animation that isn't already coded in game (swords, staves, bows). If they added spear they might as well add halberd and other types of long range melee

IKilled007 · September 2015

BullNetch wrote: »

You have four one-handed weapon types. daggers, swords, maces, and axes.
You have three two-handed weapon types. swords, maces, and axes.

Twin blade and talent skill line buffs daggers with increased weapon crit.
Heavy weapons would buff spears with the increased weapon crit

You forgot "bow".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mahTGNIk4q4

AfkNinja · September 2015

I would love for them to add spears as a two hand weapon. Javelins as one hand would be nice too, and unarmed while we are at it.

RizaHawkeye · September 2015

I've been waiting for this thread since I joined this forum .. and wow ... here it is.

TheShadowScout · September 2015

The problem with just adding spear to two-handed it a difference in animation. The current 2H weapons are all mid-reach bashing/slashing weapons, whereas a spear is more of a long-reach thrusting weapon. Sure, a spear can be used to slash, and there are more polearms... but the basic fact remains, spears wouldn't work well with the current 2H skills and animations.

What -would- be awesome was if they added a completely new "polearm" skill line... reusing some of the aedric spear animations (the jabs, the charge and the radial sweep at least) with maybe a few added ones to bring something like the feeling of posted fight to ESO... and yes, I totally would respec and use it for one of my nightblades, just for the "Red Viper" feel alone

And then they could add all the different polearms from history as racial styles... bosmer spears, dwemer halberds, breton glaives, dunmer spetums, ancient elf partisans, imperial pikes, daedric war scythes, nord lochabers, maormer tridents, redguard fauchaeds, argonian billhooks, barbaric poleaxes, altmer ranseur, khajiit monk's spade, orsimer voulges, primal pitchforks, akaviri naginata, etc...

Spottswoode · September 2015

UrQuan wrote: »

The explanation that I heard back shortly after launch was that spear animations are boring. I disagree and present this as proof:
https://youtu.be/QS2IYyywZMs

Actual spear fighting is more like using a spear in Dark Souls. This kind of flying spear crap is wuxia. In general, anything you see on TV and in movies is fake martial arts. (Unless it's MMA. That's very real.) If you're ok with flippantly non-realistic combat (not that we teeter on hyper-realism around here) then we can have flying spear fu.

UrQuan · September 2015

Spottswoode wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

The explanation that I heard back shortly after launch was that spear animations are boring. I disagree and present this as proof:
https://youtu.be/QS2IYyywZMs

Actual spear fighting is more like using a spear in Dark Souls. This kind of flying spear crap is wuxia. In general, anything you see on TV and in movies is fake martial arts. (Unless it's MMA. That's very real.) If you're ok with flippantly non-realistic combat (not that we teeter on hyper-realism around here) then we can have flying spear fu.

The skill lines are full of unrealistic animations that are there because they look cool... Like the animation for Steel Tornado, or Critical Charge, etc. So yeah, flippantly non-realistic combat is the name of the game as long as it follows the Rule of Cool.

Spottswoode · September 2015

Spear fu it is.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sTJRX-Kwj2M

QuebraRegra · September 2015

what about the "spear set for charge" technique (think boar spear). The whole combat system could use some work, with combat synergies (get 6 or more sword&board players together and make a Roman "turtle":

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Testudo_formation

Also what about siege towers, mantlets, ladders, etc?

UrQuan · September 2015

QuebraRegra wrote: »

what about the "spear set for charge" technique (think boar spear). The whole combat system could use some work, with combat synergies (get 6 or more sword&board players together and make a Roman "turtle":

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Testudo_formation

Also what about siege towers, mantlets, ladders, etc?

Formations like the testudo and the phalanx were very effective in their times (as long as you had disciplined troops - and especially if your enemy was undisciplined), and they're pretty darn cool, but they'd be really boring in a game like this. I mean, you gather a bunch of friends and all slowly move in the same direction without breaking your tight formation... You could add bonuses that would make them effective and viable combat options, but I don't see how you could make them fun.

Siege towers, mantlets, and ladders could be cool additions to Cyrodiil though.

mrskinskull · September 2015

BullNetch wrote: »

You have four one-handed weapon types. daggers, swords, maces, and axes.
You have three two-handed weapon types. swords, maces, and axes.

Twin blade and talent skill line buffs daggers with increased weapon crit.
Heavy weapons would buff spears with the increased weapon crit

Let me guess, you are a morrowind fan.

Me too.

Spears!
Please.

My imperial needs one to defend the empire.

RizaHawkeye · September 2015

UrQuan wrote: »

Spottswoode wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

The explanation that I heard back shortly after launch was that spear animations are boring. I disagree and present this as proof:
https://youtu.be/QS2IYyywZMs

Actual spear fighting is more like using a spear in Dark Souls. This kind of flying spear crap is wuxia. In general, anything you see on TV and in movies is fake martial arts. (Unless it's MMA. That's very real.) If you're ok with flippantly non-realistic combat (not that we teeter on hyper-realism around here) then we can have flying spear fu.

The skill lines are full of unrealistic animations that are there because they look cool... Like the animation for Steel Tornado, or Critical Charge, etc. So yeah, flippantly non-realistic combat is the name of the game as long as it follows the Rule of Cool.

Or my favorite Flurry ... when you're using axes or blunt weapons. It just looks ... silly.

UrQuan · September 2015

RizaHawkeye wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

Spottswoode wrote: »

UrQuan wrote: »

The explanation that I heard back shortly after launch was that spear animations are boring. I disagree and present this as proof:
https://youtu.be/QS2IYyywZMs

Actual spear fighting is more like using a spear in Dark Souls. This kind of flying spear crap is wuxia. In general, anything you see on TV and in movies is fake martial arts. (Unless it's MMA. That's very real.) If you're ok with flippantly non-realistic combat (not that we teeter on hyper-realism around here) then we can have flying spear fu.

The skill lines are full of unrealistic animations that are there because they look cool... Like the animation for Steel Tornado, or Critical Charge, etc. So yeah, flippantly non-realistic combat is the name of the game as long as it follows the Rule of Cool.

Or my favorite Flurry ... when you're using axes or blunt weapons. It just looks ... silly.

Not quite as silly as stabbing with a bow... which you get to do in the Fighter's Guild questline if you pick a bow as the prismatic weapon!

QuebraRegra · September 2015

UrQuan wrote: »

QuebraRegra wrote: »

what about the "spear set for charge" technique (think boar spear). The whole combat system could use some work, with combat synergies (get 6 or more sword&board players together and make a Roman "turtle":

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Testudo_formation

Also what about siege towers, mantlets, ladders, etc?

Formations like the testudo and the phalanx were very effective in their times (as long as you had disciplined troops - and especially if your enemy was undisciplined), and they're pretty darn cool, but they'd be really boring in a game like this. I mean, you gather a bunch of friends and all slowly move in the same direction without breaking your tight formation... You could add bonuses that would make them effective and viable combat options, but I don't see how you could make them fun.

Siege towers, mantlets, and ladders could be cool additions to Cyrodiil though.

I consider the whole damn CAMPAIGN thing to really be a huge and interesting experiment into "human nature". It'd be great to see if you could get people to play as a cohesive group if there were visible bonuses or a unique function from doing so. Perhaps forming the turtle could be alot like activating a synergy when nearby a player who initiates the formation... perhaps straying too far from the formation could would cause it to break and loose the bonus... Maybe the bonus could be greater with more people involved in the formation?

Imagine a scroll run with the scroll encased in the "turtle", or moving through the front door or postern in turtle formation? It would require good group leadership, which is something I don't think this game rewards. Sorry for strying from the topic, but what about group leader evaluations (while in a group you could rate a leader with 1-5 stars, which would be visible in a campaign listing)?

Paazhahdrimaak · September 2015

Spears!!!!! Yes I've missed them since Morrowind! Spears were so much fun.

TheShadowScout · September 2015

RizaHawkeye wrote: »

Or my favorite Flurry ... when you're using axes or blunt weapons. It just looks ... silly.

Actually... many maces have a nice big spike on their tip, with that flurry looks all right again. Axes though... meh...

The same issue arised with puncture and its morphs in the one-handed and shield line...

But be that as it may, I really would love to see a polearm skill line for all our spearing needs!

Bherdani · September 2015

Asherons_Call wrote: »

Because it would be a unique animation that isn't already coded in game (swords, staves, bows). If they added spear they might as well add halberd and other types of long range melee

Actually... there are two fighters guild members sparring with spears out front of the guild hall in Skywatch. I like to sit and watch and think about how ONE day, zos'll use those animations for good....

BullNetch · September 2015

Asherons_Call wrote: »

Because it would be a unique animation that isn't already coded in game (swords, staves, bows). If they added spear they might as well add halberd and other types of long range melee

Then just polearms. The type would change based on crafting style. Spear, halberd.

TheShadowScout wrote: »

The problem with just adding spear to two-handed it a difference in animation. The current 2H weapons are all mid-reach bashing/slashing weapons, whereas a spear is more of a long-reach thrusting weapon. Sure, a spear can be used to slash, and there are more polearms... but the basic fact remains, spears wouldn't work well with the current 2H skills and animations.

What -would- be awesome was if they added a completely new "polearm" skill line... reusing some of the aedric spear animations (the jabs, the charge and the radial sweep at least) with maybe a few added ones to bring something like the feeling of posted fight to ESO... and yes, I totally would respec and use it for one of my nightblades, just for the "Red Viper" feel alone
And then they could add all the different polearms from history as racial styles... bosmer spears, dwemer halberds, breton glaives, dunmer spetums, ancient elf partisans, imperial pikes, daedric war scythes, nord lochabers, maormer tridents, redguard fauchaeds, argonian billhooks, barbaric poleaxes, altmer ranseur, khajiit monk's spade, orsimer voulges, primal pitchforks, akaviri naginata, etc...

this

All in for polearms with the style of the polearm being cosmetic, dependent on the motif.

BullNetch · September 2015

IKilled007 wrote: »

BullNetch wrote: »

You have four one-handed weapon types. daggers, swords, maces, and axes.
You have three two-handed weapon types. swords, maces, and axes.

Twin blade and talent skill line buffs daggers with increased weapon crit.
Heavy weapons would buff spears with the increased weapon crit

You forgot "bow".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mahTGNIk4q4

The ranged stamina weapon. Let's see...

How about the crossbow? corroded bolts. Eat the disease damage.

Then give magicka users the chakrams from Kingdoms of Amalur.

NGP · September 2015

Because that would be ugly. I want one integrated, not tying some random object on a stick.

NGP · September 2015

BullNetch wrote: »

IKilled007 wrote: »

BullNetch wrote: »

You have four one-handed weapon types. daggers, swords, maces, and axes.
You have three two-handed weapon types. swords, maces, and axes.

Twin blade and talent skill line buffs daggers with increased weapon crit.
Heavy weapons would buff spears with the increased weapon crit

You forgot "bow".

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mahTGNIk4q4

The ranged stamina weapon. Let's see...

How about the crossbow? corroded bolts. Eat the disease damage.

Then give magicka users the chakrams from Kingdoms of Amalur.

I would like to have dual crossbow too.

NGP · September 2015

Bherdani wrote: »

Asherons_Call wrote: »

Because it would be a unique animation that isn't already coded in game (swords, staves, bows). If they added spear they might as well add halberd and other types of long range melee

Actually... there are two fighters guild members sparring with spears out front of the guild hall in Skywatch. I like to sit and watch and think about how ONE day, zos'll use those animations for good....

Where? Can we attack them to see how they react?

UltimaJoe777 · September 2015

Spears would only be possible due to being in a past Elder Scrolls game. Things from other games... Wouldn't get my hopes up.

The counter excuse against Spears though would be the Templar's Aedric Spear.

UrQuan · September 2015

NGP wrote: »

Because that would be ugly. I want one integrated, not tying some random object on a stick.

What about, like, a scorpion tied to a stick. I feel like that would be pretty scary and bad-ass.

sagitter · September 2015

QuebraRegra wrote: »

I like this...

Why not have a difference in weapon performance (dagger faster than a sword with less damage, axe more dmg but slower than a sword, etc.). A spear should have greater range. Maybe change the block efficiency of one weapon versus another... A bow should have the weakest block.

Or, would be cool also, changing the performance of the skill and the animation, like for example, destrution staff skills they change name and utility with different staff types, why is it not the same for weapons type and skills? The animation of flurry with 2 hammers is kind of meh.

TheShadowScout · September 2015

BullNetch wrote: »

How about the crossbow?
...

The thread was about spears, otherwise I#d have clamored for adding crossbows as additional option to the "bow" skill line. (possibly renaming this one "marksmanship") Maybe with more armor penetration, but longer reload time? The skills however would fit a crossbow just as well...