Glitch: Channeled spells and abilities should channel. No Cancel.

mistermutiny89 · August 2015

Hello and welcome to perhaps the most over talked about or least spoken of glitch and exploit in ESO; (Personally I haven't seen posts on this because I am a consoler and I haven't been sitting on this forum my whole life) animation canceling for abilties that take 1 second or more to cast!!! We all know they exist. We all know it's cheating yet even the best ESO youtubers (like Deltia and Sypher: double bracket you guys are amazing but...) use this exploit whilst arguing that champion points are op. Why are they using these exploits? Because Zenimax allows them!!

Let's look at "instant" cast abilties that don't actually insta cast like the ability BLOCK. If an enemy in PVE casts uppercut I ask you all to try blocking a millisecond before the attack hits you. Guess what? Your block will fail. I've tried and tested this with every weapon and build. You must block for the entire time the ability is casting. Now let's picture a pvper casting this ability five times in 2 seconds. He or she presses cast plus light attack then cast and light attack and cast and light attack and cast Etc etc quickly in that time. You've just spent a heap of stamina blocking this ability five times in two seconds plus you are still taking 40 per cent of the attack's damage.

You've just cast the strongest single damage attack with cc in your arsenal 5 times in a little over two to three seconds when each attack should take you over a second each cast. To prove this form of cheating exists I implore everyone test their bows with lethal arrow, two handers with uppercut and its morphs on an enemy. Watch as the enemy literally stands there still alive with its health bar at a high percentage not doing anything five seconds after your onslaught before it finally realizes the damage you've done to it. Not even the enemy can calculate the damage you've done until many seconds later.

That's a glitch!!! That's cheating.

This is coming from a solo pve'er who doesn't pvp unless I absolutely need to. In which case I will use my damage over time then animation cancel moves that state "instant" casts that don't actually insta cast because the kill is real and doesn't force a glitch.

My point is channeled casts should be channeled casts. They do higher damage than instant casts and usually cc. If Zenimax doesn't feel like doing that then perhaps such skills and abilities should do lower damage with a higher cost.

Facts, math, standard. Simple.

Forestd16b14_ESO · August 2015

Yes channel cast should actually take time to sue and animation cancel and block casting need to be removed this has been said over and over so many times. But saddly I IMO don't think it's gonna be removed and or fixed any time soon since as you said some of the "youtubers" and or "Streamers" use it alot and as we all know ZoS tends to listen to them more than the actual community.

Who knows maybe ZoS will listen to the community (finally) instead of the "streamers" and remove it but again doubt it.

mistermutiny89 · August 2015

Forestd16b14_ESO wrote: »

Yes channel cast should actually take time to sue and animation cancel and block casting need to be removed this has been said over and over so many times. But saddly I IMO don't think it's gonna be removed and or fixed any time soon since as you said some of the "youtubers" and or "Streamers" use it alot and as we all know ZoS tends to listen to them more than the actual community.

Who knows maybe ZoS will listen to the community (finally) instead of the "streamers" and remove it but again doubt it.

Thanks mate. I was expecting the first comment to be a five star comment to state I'm a noob and useless at this game. I'm aware weaving with abilties stated above does the highest dps, in fact all my builds thrive on killing the enemy as quickly as possible but this particular glitch doesn't make me feel like I've killed the enemy at all. It's just odd and not satisfying at all. So I will NOT do it. Especially in PVP.

Whilst Zenimax is perfecting gameplay this needs to be addressed!

Sypher · August 2015

mistermutiny89 wrote: »

animation canceling for abilties that take 1 second or more to cast!!! We all know they exist.

Not true. Any animation that has a cast time can NOT be animation cancelled. Ex: Crystal Fragments, Uppercut, Magicka detonation.

mistermutiny89 wrote: »

Why are they using these exploits? Because Zenimax allows them!!

Now, normal animation cancelling is not an exploit and has been confirmed by Zenimax. Light attack animation cancelling, dodge roll cancelling, weapon swap, etc. All create extra layers of combat for us to have a smooth PvP experience. While being useful, it isn't 100% necessary to be competitive in PvP.

mistermutiny89 wrote: »

Let's look at "instant" cast abilties that don't actually insta cast like the ability BLOCK. If an enemy in PVE casts uppercut I ask you all to try blocking a millisecond before the attack hits you. Guess what? Your block will fail. I've tried and tested this with every weapon and build. You must block for the entire time the ability is casting. Now let's picture a pvper casting this ability five times in 2 seconds. He or she presses cast plus light attack then cast and light attack and cast and light attack and cast Etc etc quickly in that time. You've just spent a heap of stamina blocking this ability five times in two seconds plus you are still taking 40 per cent of the attack's damage.

Not true, this might be attributed to your ping. You do NOT have to block the entire duration of the cast. Also, going back to our original point, you can NOT cancel anything with a cast time.

Also, popular myth states that animation cancelling allows you to cast abilities faster. This is NOT true, it merely allows to cancel instant cast abilities to do things such as, block, dodge, bash. You can't cast an ability like the DK's Flame Lash "faster" by animation cancelling. You're still subject to the global cool down on all abilities.

I've been playing this game for a long time and know how the system works. There is nothing wrong with animation cancelling and there are no exploits being done. Most of your post by the way has many false statements that I have thoroughly tested through out my time on this game.

I recommend Lefty Lucy's in depth video on animation cancelling to educate yourself on the topic.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BLZzGoPp9Ug

Please don't take my post aggressively I merely want you to understand how animation canceling works, many people who don't know exactly what it is assume it's glitching/exploiting. Just want the public to understand what it actually is

ahstin2001nub18_ESO · August 2015

yeah, from all i have seen is animation cancelling is NOT an exploit, and while i think its a nonsense way of playing (typically more work than ill be willing to do in a game) i would hate the game to NOT have this effect. i have played games without "animation cancelling" and it SUCKS!!! i can not emphasis that enough. think of any situation in this, a reactive game, where you are using an ability and realize you must do something else, like block. but you can't block because of animation; so you die, and your group dies. wow thats fun for all of 0 seconds. after a few times this happens, you will be here saying "stop the animations, let us play through them"

again, i am speaking from experience. PVPers that use this are probably gonna be a PVPer that kills me regardless; PVEers that use this, are willing to work harder at a game than me. either way, i think its a neutral situation. i couldn't care less what those to classes of players do, just what i can do with what i got.

i also question the true effect they have, as opposed to just gearing up, and collecting CPs. it does have a net result, but i don't think its the power behind anything as much as gear, CPs, skills (player and character), and simply just quicker reaction time.

Funkopotamus · August 2015

Man Anyone HERE remember the Animation Canceling in Asherons Call?

ACs Get it? have been in games from the beginning of MMO's. The ones here in ESO are harmless. If you think that just because a guy AC's is the only reason you lost a PVP fight then you need to rethink you gaming choice. ESO's AC is nothing!

SkinnyDG · August 2015

Lol

mistermutiny89 · August 2015

@sypher thanks for the post mate. I completely over used the term animation canceling.. My main irk was channeled moves like uppercut, lethal arrow and frags being cast much quicker than the tool tip states HOWEVER I do not have all the add-ons you have. When I test out say lethal arrow on a world boss after the first cast I can cast perhaps 8-9 lethal arrows in 4 seconds then the enemy freezes up and dies four seconds later without getting to reach me..

If the damage has still been delivered at 1second intervals then I'm okay with that. But that's not being shown on my screen. Anyway to Change pings on Xbox ONE and if so what settings?

leepalmer95 · August 2015

Sypher wrote: »

mistermutiny89 wrote: »

animation canceling for abilties that take 1 second or more to cast!!! We all know they exist.

Not true. Any animation that has a cast time can NOT be animation cancelled. Ex: Crystal Fragments, Uppercut, Magicka detonation.

mistermutiny89 wrote: »

Why are they using these exploits? Because Zenimax allows them!!

Now, normal animation cancelling is not an exploit and has been confirmed by Zenimax. Light attack animation cancelling, dodge roll cancelling, weapon swap, etc. All create extra layers of combat for us to have a smooth PvP experience. While being useful, it isn't 100% necessary to be competitive in PvP.

mistermutiny89 wrote: »

Let's look at "instant" cast abilties that don't actually insta cast like the ability BLOCK. If an enemy in PVE casts uppercut I ask you all to try blocking a millisecond before the attack hits you. Guess what? Your block will fail. I've tried and tested this with every weapon and build. You must block for the entire time the ability is casting. Now let's picture a pvper casting this ability five times in 2 seconds. He or she presses cast plus light attack then cast and light attack and cast and light attack and cast Etc etc quickly in that time. You've just spent a heap of stamina blocking this ability five times in two seconds plus you are still taking 40 per cent of the attack's damage.

Not true, this might be attributed to your ping. You do NOT have to block the entire duration of the cast. Also, going back to our original point, you can NOT cancel anything with a cast time.

Also, popular myth states that animation cancelling allows you to cast abilities faster. This is NOT true, it merely allows to cancel instant cast abilities to do things such as, block, dodge, bash. You can't cast an ability like the DK's Flame Lash "faster" by animation cancelling. You're still subject to the global cool down on all abilities.

I've been playing this game for a long time and know how the system works. There is nothing wrong with animation cancelling and there are no exploits being done. Most of your post by the way has many false statements that I have thoroughly tested through out my time on this game.

I recommend Lefty Lucy's in depth video on animation cancelling to educate yourself on the topic.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BLZzGoPp9Ug

Please don't take my post aggressively I merely want you to understand how animation canceling works, many people who don't know exactly what it is assume it's glitching/exploiting. Just want the public to understand what it actually is

Hmm what about when you stop the Wrecking blow animation with a heavy attack? isn't that considered an animation cancel for a skill with a cast time?

E.g. Starts wb about .5 seconds later when your character pulls his sword down you hold heavy attack, your character will stop the wb animation and charge a heavy attack, mid way through the charge the mob or person will get hit by the cancelled wb and then immediately get hit by the heavy attack.

Sypher · August 2015

leepalmer95 wrote: »

Sypher wrote: »

mistermutiny89 wrote: »

animation canceling for abilties that take 1 second or more to cast!!! We all know they exist.

Not true. Any animation that has a cast time can NOT be animation cancelled. Ex: Crystal Fragments, Uppercut, Magicka detonation.

mistermutiny89 wrote: »

Why are they using these exploits? Because Zenimax allows them!!

Now, normal animation cancelling is not an exploit and has been confirmed by Zenimax. Light attack animation cancelling, dodge roll cancelling, weapon swap, etc. All create extra layers of combat for us to have a smooth PvP experience. While being useful, it isn't 100% necessary to be competitive in PvP.

mistermutiny89 wrote: »

Let's look at "instant" cast abilties that don't actually insta cast like the ability BLOCK. If an enemy in PVE casts uppercut I ask you all to try blocking a millisecond before the attack hits you. Guess what? Your block will fail. I've tried and tested this with every weapon and build. You must block for the entire time the ability is casting. Now let's picture a pvper casting this ability five times in 2 seconds. He or she presses cast plus light attack then cast and light attack and cast and light attack and cast Etc etc quickly in that time. You've just spent a heap of stamina blocking this ability five times in two seconds plus you are still taking 40 per cent of the attack's damage.

Not true, this might be attributed to your ping. You do NOT have to block the entire duration of the cast. Also, going back to our original point, you can NOT cancel anything with a cast time.

Also, popular myth states that animation cancelling allows you to cast abilities faster. This is NOT true, it merely allows to cancel instant cast abilities to do things such as, block, dodge, bash. You can't cast an ability like the DK's Flame Lash "faster" by animation cancelling. You're still subject to the global cool down on all abilities.

I've been playing this game for a long time and know how the system works. There is nothing wrong with animation cancelling and there are no exploits being done. Most of your post by the way has many false statements that I have thoroughly tested through out my time on this game.

I recommend Lefty Lucy's in depth video on animation cancelling to educate yourself on the topic.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=BLZzGoPp9Ug

Please don't take my post aggressively I merely want you to understand how animation canceling works, many people who don't know exactly what it is assume it's glitching/exploiting. Just want the public to understand what it actually is

Hmm what about when you stop the Wrecking blow animation with a heavy attack? isn't that considered an animation cancel for a skill with a cast time?

E.g. Starts wb about .5 seconds later when your character pulls his sword down you hold heavy attack, your character will stop the wb animation and charge a heavy attack, mid way through the charge the mob or person will get hit by the cancelled wb and then immediately get hit by the heavy attack.

You can cancel a heavy attack with a wrecking blow, not the other way around. I've tested this.

mistermutiny89 wrote: »

@sypher thanks for the post mate. I completely over used the term animation canceling.. My main irk was channeled moves like uppercut, lethal arrow and frags being cast much quicker than the tool tip states HOWEVER I do not have all the add-ons you have. When I test out say lethal arrow on a world boss after the first cast I can cast perhaps 8-9 lethal arrows in 4 seconds then the enemy freezes up and dies four seconds later without getting to reach me..

If the damage has still been delivered at 1second intervals then I'm okay with that. But that's not being shown on my screen. Anyway to Change pings on Xbox ONE and if so what settings?

This honestly sounds like it could be attributed to your ping/lag, can you post video evidence by chance? Or let me know exactly what you're doing and I'll mimic it/record it and post my results here.

mistermutiny89 · August 2015

@sypher My process (that I've stopped using because I felt I was cheating and it looked glitchy) for something like lethal arrow cancel is letting the first cast cast all the way then hit light attack and cast light attack and cast as quickly as possible whilst still keeping the same rhythm. Try testing this out on a daedroth around your level from the furthest possible distance. You must also be standing still through this process however. After speed casting lethal arrow for a time the daedroth just stops moving forward then you hear all the snipe "whistle/torpedo" sounds all play one after the other then after a few more seconds the daedroth drops dead.

I hope that makes some sort of sense and paints a good enough picture. To me it looks like I've cast double the damage in half the time and I generally thought this was a usual thing in pvp and PVE leading to my point of making sure these skills actually have a 1.1 second cool down. I'm very open to the fact I may be wrong but it could just be lag. I'm on the European Server as an Australian player. When playing war frame for Xbox one the eu server worked better than the AU but gave me in game ping options. I don't see such settings in ESO.

Thanks again for listening!

Itoq · August 2015

You can cancel the WB animation with bash after the forward swing starts and still have the skill go through.

But, I don't think that, under normal game play, animation cancelling WB buys you much - then again I have only slotted WB on a V4 so far without a lot of CP or testing (ie. I don't have much into bash or heavy attack damage.)

kendellking_chaosb14_ESO · August 2015

No reason not to use it it's cheap, abs bs but the Devs back it so use it