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Spellcrafting with Magic being Nerf'd
Area51Visitor
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I don't think I'll care about spell crafting when it comes out if it remains as weak as it is. Might have some cheap gimics / graphics but overall if it can't compete with stam attacks why would anyone use it?
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Olivierko✭✭✭I don't understand. You say that you won't be using spellcrafting yet it hasn't been revealed.
Who's to say that the roll dodge meta will remain once this gets released?
Some players prefer magica builds and that's it, besides, any setup is viable as long as it's played towards the strengths that it provides, at least in PVP.
I agree with the fact that stamina builds are far superior in general, that doesn't mean that magica based builds aren't competable, it all depends on who's playing, however the stamina builds are easier to master due to the current state of roll dodging.Addons: ★ Pointificator ★ Raidificator ★- Dar'diov ★ AvA 25 ★ Nightblade
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Exstazik✭✭✭✭
how about spells:Area51Visitor wrote: »I don't think I'll care about spell crafting when it comes out if it remains as weak as it is. Might have some cheap gimics / graphics but overall if it can't compete with stam attacks why would anyone use it?
1)debuff:if the player with this debuff will use skills it will hit for X for each skill that he used
2)CC:the target can't use stamina skills
3)Dispell:Remove all buffs from target
4)"Cat eye" see stealths enemies
5)"summon ice cloak." depends on spelldmg and mana it will slow target which will near you (5m) up to totaly freeze for 5 sec
and etc.etc.etc
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PBpsy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭What the ?
Magicka still kicks all kinds of snips.
... even on a NB.ESO forums achievementsProud fanboiElitist jerkTrollHaterFan of icontested(rainbow colors granted)3 -
lathbury✭✭✭✭✭
✭yeah dk casters still the go to dps as well for a lot of guilds leaderboards confirm that.1 -
Area51Visitor✭✭✭yeah dk casters still the go to dps as well for a lot of guilds leaderboards confirm that.
Still though...the max spell damage gets is about 3K if you're lucky. Stam, 4K... the average high end stam set places most peeps around 10-15K dps (low/high ends)...while spell remains around 5-10K (low to high) with even the best sets available. There's no argument spells are weaker...
That said... I do just fine...hover around a 20 kdr about 200 kills an evening after work not even using the min/max set. I'd love to, however, be able to use a max set if said set was competitive with stamina based gear...especially if I could remain healer and be a viable DPS. Unfortunately, there's no way to balance the two when there will always be someone who can do 5-10K more dps simply using stam.
An alternative would be to allow resto attacks and class skills to be optionally scaled off stam. Then it'd be a no brainer.
Individually, as a ganker, any set is fine. In group, I have to step down position simply because I love magic, but want the group to have max damage. If spell crafting contains group CCs, snares, buffs or debuffs, I may reconsider my position...my guess, is they don't plan to implement any more of those because so many of them already failed.Edited by Area51Visitor on June 16, 2015 1:58AM0 -
arena25✭✭✭✭✭Area51Visitor wrote: »yeah dk casters still the go to dps as well for a lot of guilds leaderboards confirm that.
Still though...the max spell damage gets is about 3K if you're lucky. Stam, 4K... the average high end stam set places most peeps around 10-15K dps (low/high ends)...while spell remains around 5-10K (low to high) with even the best sets available. There's no argument spells are weaker...
That said... I do just fine...hover around a 20 kdr about 200 kills an evening after work not even using the min/max set. I'd love to, however, be able to use a max set if said set was competitive with stamina based gear...especially if I could remain healer and be a viable DPS. Unfortunately, there's no way to balance the two when there will always be someone who can do 5-10K more dps simply using stam.
An alternative would be to allow resto attacks and class skills to be optionally scaled off stam. Then it'd be a no brainer.
I like the idea, but then that would make healers a little OP...If you can't handle the heat...stay out of the kitchen!0 -
SIN-X✭✭✭Area51Visitor wrote: »yeah dk casters still the go to dps as well for a lot of guilds leaderboards confirm that.
Still though...the max spell damage gets is about 3K if you're lucky. Stam, 4K... the average high end stam set places most peeps around 10-15K dps (low/high ends)...while spell remains around 5-10K (low to high) with even the best sets available. There's no argument spells are weaker...
That said... I do just fine...hover around a 20 kdr about 200 kills an evening after work not even using the min/max set. I'd love to, however, be able to use a max set if said set was competitive with stamina based gear...especially if I could remain healer and be a viable DPS. Unfortunately, there's no way to balance the two when there will always be someone who can do 5-10K more dps simply using stam.
An alternative would be to allow resto attacks and class skills to be optionally scaled off stam. Then it'd be a no brainer.
Individually, as a ganker, any set is fine. In group, I have to step down position simply because I love magic, but want the group to have max damage. If spell crafting contains group CCs, snares, buffs or debuffs, I may reconsider my position...my guess, is they don't plan to implement any more of those because so many of them already failed.
Maybe you don't have that gear you think you have...my sorc pulls an easy 12-16k in trials and dks 15-20 magic builds......X-SINISTER-X v14 NB
"DEATH WAITS IN THE DARK"0 -
Area51Visitor✭✭✭"I like the idea, but then that would make healers a little OP..."
Perhaps...but I feel the same thing has been said from the beginning of the game without real viable tests. What all the complaints did was make templars the weakest DPS in the game for nearly a year, and caused NBs, Sorcs, and especially DKs to be overpowered dps and self healers, since shield stacking, dragon blood, and siphon attacks heal nearly as well, and sometimes better than templars could themselves (individually...depending on peoples experience / build). Stam finally balanced that to some extent but left healers/pure magic required users behind. In group, to heal healers have to stack their entire bar with nothing but healing skills; they don't have time to DPS simply because they are too busy healing. It's not possible to heal, and dps at the same time... just as it's not possible to tank and dps at the same time...but most tanks have the option to DPS with stam-based builds. What it would allow healers to do, is have an option to either heal, or DPS with a magic based build / spec...whereas they don't now.
If OP means a person can heal themselves, and DPS...then DKs should have had dragon blood removed a long time ago :P
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SIN-X✭✭✭TBH if this game makes it another year to include imp city and the dlc I will be impressedX-SINISTER-X v14 NB
"DEATH WAITS IN THE DARK"2 -
ThisOnePosts✭✭✭✭✭Spell-crafting is one of the most highly anticipated things ESO has lined up (hopefully). Close this thread, it's blasphemy!0 -
Gabriel_Froste✭✭✭Spellcrafting would create too many problems. Just like displaying your character's name on consoles.Please Refer to my Blacksmith Manual
Rambling Anti-Manual Manual1 -
Area51Visitor✭✭✭...Maybe you don't have that gear you think you have...my sorc pulls an easy 12-16k in trials and dks 15-20 magic builds......[/quote]
Maybe...pretty much the max set templates have been set for some time now though... and FTC and everything else is a joke...simply tweaking a single number in the code can change someone's DPS by whatever they want. Until there's an honest way to review DPS, saying you have a certain DPS is like saying the sum of all even numbers can be calculated using a set of primes... sure...we tested it to as far as we can count, but it's still not provable.0 -
Area51Visitor✭✭✭
Well... it's on it's way.Gabriel_Froste wrote: »Spellcrafting would create too many problems. Just like displaying your character's name on consoles.
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SIN-X✭✭✭well w/e makes you feel better... I am not a great player and don't feel the need to lie about my dps but feel free to idk watch videos and such...hell even deltia can hit 14k on his sorcX-SINISTER-X v14 NB
"DEATH WAITS IN THE DARK"0 -
Area51Visitor✭✭✭well w/e makes you feel better... I am not a great player and don't feel the need to lie about my dps but feel free to idk watch videos and such...hell even deltia can hit 14k on his sorc
lol...poor deltia... like a beatin dog, but everyone still drops his name... with that weave though... you would be hitting 15-20K dps had you switched to a stam buildEdited by Area51Visitor on June 16, 2015 2:21AM0 -
ThisOnePosts✭✭✭✭✭Spells are not nerfed with the proper gear. I'd say things are about as balanced as they have been between Magicka and Stamina than they have been since launch. While yes Stam builds can achieve some sick DPS atm, Spell builds CAN SPAM MUCH more than Stam if we are talking about long fights. I'd say they are pretty equal and 2 of my VR14s are spell-based, 1 is stam based, another is hybrid just for kicks (although has both full spell and stam gear when I need to run Trials, DSA, etc.. on that char).0
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Area51Visitor✭✭✭ViciousWayz wrote: »Spells are not nerfed with the proper gear. I'd say things are about as balanced as they have been between Magicka and Stamina than they have been since launch. While yes Stam builds can achieve some sick DPS atm, Spell builds CAN SPAM MUCH more than Stam if we are talking about long fights. I'd say they are pretty equal and 2 of my VR14s are spell-based, 1 is stam based, another is hybrid just for kicks (although has both full spell and stam gear when I need to run Trials, DSA, etc.. on that char).
Obviously I disagree and so did much of the population when they switched to stam. No one grinds for fun. Look at the rest of the empty zones for proof. Had magic remained viable less would have changed...people are too lazy. I've watched tons of posts of stam vs mag dps and stam wins every time.Edited by Area51Visitor on June 16, 2015 2:24AM1 -
Soulshine✭✭✭✭✭
✭Area51Visitor wrote: »"I like the idea, but then that would make healers a little OP..."
Perhaps...but I feel the same thing has been said from the beginning of the game without real viable tests. What all the complaints did was make templars the weakest DPS in the game for nearly a year, and caused NBs, Sorcs, and especially DKs to be overpowered dps and self healers, since shield stacking, dragon blood, and siphon attacks heal nearly as well, and sometimes better than templars could themselves (individually...depending on peoples experience / build). Stam finally balanced that to some extent but left healers/pure magic required users behind. In group, to heal healers have to stack their entire bar with nothing but healing skills; they don't have time to DPS simply because they are too busy healing. It's not possible to heal, and dps at the same time... just as it's not possible to tank and dps at the same time...but most tanks have the option to DPS with stam-based builds. What it would allow healers to do, is have an option to either heal, or DPS with a magic based build / spec...whereas they don't now.
If OP means a person can heal themselves, and DPS...then DKs should have had dragon blood removed a long time ago :P
Wa?? O.o I don't know what kind of healers you have been running with but any healer worth their salt, especially a Templar, will absolutely be at bare minimum contributing DPS along with heals. You cannot effectively make a strong team for competitive numbers in vet 4 man content without all four members of the team contributing DPS in spades, let alone doing so in 12 man trials at the right moments. I have been main healing in this game since beta and do not ever just roll with only heals on my bars. I add DPS at every possible moment and find as a result I spend far less time healing when that happens as everything dies that much faster and therefore damage to the group is at a minimum.0 -
MornaBaine✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Area51Visitor wrote: »
Well... it's on it's way.Gabriel_Froste wrote: »Spellcrafting would create too many problems. Just like displaying your character's name on consoles.
Are you new here? Because we've all heard this before.PAWS (Positively Against Wrip-off Stuff) - Say No to Crown Crates!0 -
Area51Visitor✭✭✭MornaBaine wrote: »Area51Visitor wrote: »
Well... it's on it's way.Gabriel_Froste wrote: »Spellcrafting would create too many problems. Just like displaying your character's name on consoles.
Are you new here? Because we've all heard this before.
bahaha... i see what you did there.0 -
Area51Visitor✭✭✭Area51Visitor wrote: »"I like the idea, but then that would make healers a little OP..."
Perhaps...but I feel the same thing has been said from the beginning of the game without real viable tests. What all the complaints did was make templars the weakest DPS in the game for nearly a year, and caused NBs, Sorcs, and especially DKs to be overpowered dps and self healers, since shield stacking, dragon blood, and siphon attacks heal nearly as well, and sometimes better than templars could themselves (individually...depending on peoples experience / build). Stam finally balanced that to some extent but left healers/pure magic required users behind. In group, to heal healers have to stack their entire bar with nothing but healing skills; they don't have time to DPS simply because they are too busy healing. It's not possible to heal, and dps at the same time... just as it's not possible to tank and dps at the same time...but most tanks have the option to DPS with stam-based builds. What it would allow healers to do, is have an option to either heal, or DPS with a magic based build / spec...whereas they don't now.
If OP means a person can heal themselves, and DPS...then DKs should have had dragon blood removed a long time ago :P
Wa?? O.o I don't know what kind of healers you have been running with but any healer worth their salt, especially a Templar, will absolutely be at bare minimum contributing DPS along with heals. You cannot effectively make a strong team for competitive numbers in vet 4 man content without all four members of the team contributing DPS in spades, let alone doing so in 12 man trials at the right moments. I have been main healing in this game since beta and do not ever just roll with only heals on my bars. I add DPS at every possible moment and find as a result I spend far less time healing when that happens as everything dies that much faster and therefore damage to the group is at a minimum.
...Should have said DPS worth mentioning... trust me...the DPS you contribute, isn't, and shouldn't have been worth writing "home" about lol... JK
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Soulshine✭✭✭✭✭
✭Area51Visitor wrote: »Area51Visitor wrote: »"I like the idea, but then that would make healers a little OP..."
Perhaps...but I feel the same thing has been said from the beginning of the game without real viable tests. What all the complaints did was make templars the weakest DPS in the game for nearly a year, and caused NBs, Sorcs, and especially DKs to be overpowered dps and self healers, since shield stacking, dragon blood, and siphon attacks heal nearly as well, and sometimes better than templars could themselves (individually...depending on peoples experience / build). Stam finally balanced that to some extent but left healers/pure magic required users behind. In group, to heal healers have to stack their entire bar with nothing but healing skills; they don't have time to DPS simply because they are too busy healing. It's not possible to heal, and dps at the same time... just as it's not possible to tank and dps at the same time...but most tanks have the option to DPS with stam-based builds. What it would allow healers to do, is have an option to either heal, or DPS with a magic based build / spec...whereas they don't now.
If OP means a person can heal themselves, and DPS...then DKs should have had dragon blood removed a long time ago :P
Wa?? O.o I don't know what kind of healers you have been running with but any healer worth their salt, especially a Templar, will absolutely be at bare minimum contributing DPS along with heals. You cannot effectively make a strong team for competitive numbers in vet 4 man content without all four members of the team contributing DPS in spades, let alone doing so in 12 man trials at the right moments. I have been main healing in this game since beta and do not ever just roll with only heals on my bars. I add DPS at every possible moment and find as a result I spend far less time healing when that happens as everything dies that much faster and therefore damage to the group is at a minimum.
...Should have said DPS worth mentioning... trust me...the DPS you contribute, isn't, and shouldn't have been worth writing "home" about lol... JK
You confuse clear explanation of well known, standard, group requirements with "bragging" about DPS. Healing is not about just waving Healing Springs and sitting on your duff.2 -
Area51Visitor✭✭✭Area51Visitor wrote: »Area51Visitor wrote: »"I like the idea, but then that would make healers a little OP..."
Perhaps...but I feel the same thing has been said from the beginning of the game without real viable tests. What all the complaints did was make templars the weakest DPS in the game for nearly a year, and caused NBs, Sorcs, and especially DKs to be overpowered dps and self healers, since shield stacking, dragon blood, and siphon attacks heal nearly as well, and sometimes better than templars could themselves (individually...depending on peoples experience / build). Stam finally balanced that to some extent but left healers/pure magic required users behind. In group, to heal healers have to stack their entire bar with nothing but healing skills; they don't have time to DPS simply because they are too busy healing. It's not possible to heal, and dps at the same time... just as it's not possible to tank and dps at the same time...but most tanks have the option to DPS with stam-based builds. What it would allow healers to do, is have an option to either heal, or DPS with a magic based build / spec...whereas they don't now.
If OP means a person can heal themselves, and DPS...then DKs should have had dragon blood removed a long time ago :P
Wa?? O.o I don't know what kind of healers you have been running with but any healer worth their salt, especially a Templar, will absolutely be at bare minimum contributing DPS along with heals. You cannot effectively make a strong team for competitive numbers in vet 4 man content without all four members of the team contributing DPS in spades, let alone doing so in 12 man trials at the right moments. I have been main healing in this game since beta and do not ever just roll with only heals on my bars. I add DPS at every possible moment and find as a result I spend far less time healing when that happens as everything dies that much faster and therefore damage to the group is at a minimum.
...Should have said DPS worth mentioning... trust me...the DPS you contribute, isn't, and shouldn't have been worth writing "home" about lol... JK
You confuse clear explanation of well known, standard, group requirements with "bragging" about DPS. Healing is not about just waving Healing Springs and sitting on your duff.
I agree...it definitely is not, though the technicalities of healing is slightly off topic. Point was making is that if you're going to straight DPS with a magic build you are handicapping your group...because a stam-based good dps player would put out more damage. Since healers, for example, have to be (or should be) light-armored magic based peeps...they are naturally disadvantaged to play any other roll just as other users who prefer magic are often left out of lead groups because most know that stam its the biznizz.Edited by Area51Visitor on June 16, 2015 2:51AM0 -
Soulshine✭✭✭✭✭
✭Area51Visitor wrote: »Area51Visitor wrote: »Area51Visitor wrote: »"I like the idea, but then that would make healers a little OP..."
Perhaps...but I feel the same thing has been said from the beginning of the game without real viable tests. What all the complaints did was make templars the weakest DPS in the game for nearly a year, and caused NBs, Sorcs, and especially DKs to be overpowered dps and self healers, since shield stacking, dragon blood, and siphon attacks heal nearly as well, and sometimes better than templars could themselves (individually...depending on peoples experience / build). Stam finally balanced that to some extent but left healers/pure magic required users behind. In group, to heal healers have to stack their entire bar with nothing but healing skills; they don't have time to DPS simply because they are too busy healing. It's not possible to heal, and dps at the same time... just as it's not possible to tank and dps at the same time...but most tanks have the option to DPS with stam-based builds. What it would allow healers to do, is have an option to either heal, or DPS with a magic based build / spec...whereas they don't now.
If OP means a person can heal themselves, and DPS...then DKs should have had dragon blood removed a long time ago :P
Wa?? O.o I don't know what kind of healers you have been running with but any healer worth their salt, especially a Templar, will absolutely be at bare minimum contributing DPS along with heals. You cannot effectively make a strong team for competitive numbers in vet 4 man content without all four members of the team contributing DPS in spades, let alone doing so in 12 man trials at the right moments. I have been main healing in this game since beta and do not ever just roll with only heals on my bars. I add DPS at every possible moment and find as a result I spend far less time healing when that happens as everything dies that much faster and therefore damage to the group is at a minimum.
...Should have said DPS worth mentioning... trust me...the DPS you contribute, isn't, and shouldn't have been worth writing "home" about lol... JK
You confuse clear explanation of well known, standard, group requirements with "bragging" about DPS. Healing is not about just waving Healing Springs and sitting on your duff.
I agree...it definitely is not, though the technicalities of healing is slightly off topic.
The "technicalities" according to you are that it "is not possible to heal and DPS at the same time" - a misguided view at best.
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Area51Visitor✭✭✭"...The "technicalities" according to you are that it "is not possible to heal and DPS at the same time" - a misguided view at best...."
You missed much of the point
I think you want to make an argument concerning healing and dps being viable. GO FOR IT man! I'm in 100% agreement. Make the argument in another forum post though, please... I'd like to keep this one on topic.Edited by Area51Visitor on June 16, 2015 2:59AM0 -
Soulshine✭✭✭✭✭
✭Area51Visitor wrote: »"...The "technicalities" according to you are that it "is not possible to heal and DPS at the same time" - a misguided view at best...."
You missed much of the point
I think you want to make an argument concerning healing and dps being viable. GO FOR IT man! I'm in 100% agreement. Make the argument in another forum post though, please... I'd like to keep this one on topic.
You brought it up - dont expect people to not respond to the point.0
