Dueling Videos Feedback - How many of you actually want to see them?

LegendaryMage · May 2015

Hi all,

Sadly I do not see a lot of people making dueling videos and I've been trying to go to NA to spectate some fights but usually the time difference is a problem. On EU we have frequent duels but I am yet to see some top players recording any, which is a shame. I would really like to make a few more videos, but I would first like to hear what people would like to see and in what way.

If you would like to watch dueling videos between top players duking it out in a fair 1v1 fight, could you please tell me:

- How long do you think your 'attention' span would be? Is it 2 minutes, 5 minutes, 10 minutes? How many 'minutes' before you say it's a boring fight and would recommend editing it out and cutting it shorter?

- Do you have any special wishes in terms of seeing any particular matchups such as 'sorcerer vs stamina nightblade', or 'sorcerer vs classic magica dragonknight', or do you just enjoy 'whatever' as long as the players are at the top of their game?

- Overall, would you prefer a longer video with full fights (cherry picked, ones that don't go over 5 minutes let's say) and the video lasting around 15-20 minutes, or maybe a shorter video of 5-6 minutes with only 'highlights' and mostly fight endings (let's say last 15-20 seconds or so)?

If you could take a few moments and answer these questions, then maybe more of us could make some nice movies for you to enjoy in your free time or when you're unable to play.

Thanks for taking the time to comment!

Maulkin · May 2015

I'll be honest I have generally short attention span when it comes to dueling videos.

There's a reason for this. If the duels are a mismatch because one player is vastly superior to the other in terms skill, gear, or both then I don't find the video of value, it's a walkover. On the other hand, if the players are of equal skill then the fights end up taking 10m + which means I started getting tired of watching.

It's certainly "edge of your seat" stuff when you're involved in it, because you know 1 mistake means you're dead, but without the adrenaline that generates, watching two people slug it out over 10m can be pretty boring.

I am however very interested in seeing the builds and play style that people come up with. Every player has a strategy on how to land some burst damage and how to mitigate incoming damage and it's interesting (to me) to see this strategy unfold. You can see elements you can add to your build and try things out.

I would say, for me 3'-4' per fight is what I would be able to watch. I'm interested in seeing all the different match-ups from different classes-builds. I would also be happy with the last 2' of a 10' fight.

Erock25 · May 2015

For me I think dueling videos need to come with commentary on what you're doing and why and what you think the other guy is doing to try to counter you. Any fight over 2 minutes needs to be just the last 2 minutes of the fight.

vortexman11 · May 2015

As long as possible, because I love having a dueling/PvP video playing on my second monitor as I play ESO

Ezareth · May 2015

I can't stand watching dueling videos any more than I can stand dueling. It just seems to artificial and not really PvP IMO.

Any fight that lasts over a few minutes starts to get too long and it's usually just two players with builds designed to counter each other constantly testing each other until there is a major mistake made.

I don't mind fighting good players in "The wild" where you have other players interrupting you on both sides or you're stuck with a less than optimal spec for the scenario. This is where the real enjoyment in videos comes for me.

Everyone has their own tastes though.

Maulkin · May 2015

Erock25 wrote: »

For me I think dueling videos need to come with commentary on what you're doing and why and what you think the other guy is doing to try to counter you. Any fight over 2 minutes needs to be just the last 2 minutes of the fight.

I agree with bolded part, it was quite nice to see in Jack Daniel's videos.

It's just that some players are not native English speakers so they might have confidence or language issues about putting their voice out there.

So if you take the very small amount of duelists and then you remove the vast majority that don't record & edit video, then remove from that the ones that don't want to speak.... you probably end up with a grand total of 2-3 players that are willing to do that.

Cinbri · May 2015

Duels vs equal skilled players are long and long=boring. 2x2, 3x3 fights where people must not leave battle would be intersting to watch and participate.

pppontus · May 2015

Ezareth wrote: »

I can't stand watching dueling videos any more than I can stand dueling. It just seems to artificial and not really PvP IMO.

Any fight that lasts over a few minutes starts to get too long and it's usually just two players with builds designed to counter each other constantly testing each other until there is a major mistake made.

I don't mind fighting good players in "The wild" where you have other players interrupting you on both sides or you're stuck with a less than optimal spec for the scenario. This is where the real enjoyment in videos comes for me.

Everyone has their own tastes though.

^ Have to agree with this, for me dueling isn't really that interesting. I like good 1v1s in open world, where I can just leave when I get bored but organized dueling doesn't appeal to me and I'd not watch it. But that's just my opinion.

olsborg · May 2015

5-6 duels, just to see the build in action etc, after 5 duels or so its not as "exciting" anymore.
Wish I recorded my own stuff, but im too lazy.

2v2 or 3v3 team fights however, now thats fun to watch:)

Jitterbug · May 2015

Great question Mage.

The main issue I have with (all) PvP videos is the copyright free dance music that drowns out everything, and I'm not just complaining I have a point:

I think dueling videos could be both very informative and great entertainment if the maker of the video and perhaps even the counterpart in the duel sat down to comment on the video while they watched it together on skype or whatever.

I would totally watch that.

Same goes for PvP videos. I mean the first minute or two are fun to watch but having a Garageband loop hammering away while a 12 legendary BiS sorc is kiting lowbies becomes stale after a couple minutes imo.

Commentary, at least to me, is key.

Soulac · May 2015

I like duels or small-scale and even in ~10-12man groups I run slightly next to the group focusing healers and sieges as long as we don't rush to a flag or an enemy group.
Mostly I watch them to get new build ideas or even another tactics, also in 1vX you see places on the map you could use in your fight next time.

But I barely watch anything of a video if it's not recorded by a nightblade.. :P

Etaniel · May 2015

As said previously, the best thing you could do is comment on the fight, if you don't want to talk over it, you can put some pop up text in a corner explaining why you chose to do this or that move. But I would only expect that from an expert youtuber that makes videos every week you know ^^
Coming from a guy like you, I can just figure out by myself what you are using and why, and that's enough for me. Although the fact that you don't play the same class as me makes it a bit less interesting for me to watch

. But i'm sure it's great material for other sorcs who want to improve their gameplay !
Other than that, 5-6 min fight is probably the max I can handle before it gets boring.
Pick a moment in the fight where both of you are pretty much back to full ressource, and start it from there. Or maybe speed up the beginning until that moment just to show that it's been going on a while.

All in all i'm not that much into duels as a whole , for the same reasons @Ezareth mentionned, i'll just take part in it a bit every time I wanna try a new build. I figure if it does ok vs experienced duellers it'll be good ni open world !

LegendaryMage · May 2015

Alright, many excellent suggestions. I'm afraid I'm not a 'pro youtuber' like some other players and I don't have the capacity to call it out blow by blow (that would be great I agree), text could do it maybe but it's going to take away a lot of attention from the match, so how about something short like this:

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/169515/legendary-mage-v14-sorcerer-dueling-session-part-2

I've edited most fights into 'short versions', moved much closer to the endings etc. Would you say this is alright in terms of simple editing?

Edit: Making the link clickable.

Rylana · May 2015

This game kinda sucks for video making. The combat system in general is so simple that almost every duel looks cookie cutter and the same. No offense to any duelers, you have to work with the same mechanics as the rest of us.

Not really a fan of videos/streaming in this game in general, it just looks hokey. I rarely watch any videos. I chalk the awkwardness up to the limited UI and animation canceling. Most of the time abilities just lump together, the flow of the battle becomes more of watching which buttons are being hit vs watching what the characters themselves are doing.

Without the flytexts from addons, most of the time anyone watching these vids would have zero clue what is actually happening.

So no, I dont watch them anymore, nor do I plan to in the near future. Not through any fault of any of you or yours though, but because vids of this game just do my head in.

Also any video over 3-4 minutes is a no-go. If i want to watch the game for that long, ill just log in O_o if you know what im sayin.

Sacadon · May 2015

always enjoy them and do watch them too.

Jitterbug · May 2015

Rylana wrote: »

This game kinda sucks for video making. The combat system in general is so simple that almost every duel looks cookie cutter and the same. No offense to any duelers, you have to work with the same mechanics as the rest of us.

Not really a fan of videos/streaming in this game in general, it just looks hokey. I rarely watch any videos. I chalk the awkwardness up to the limited UI and animation canceling. Most of the time abilities just lump together, the flow of the battle becomes more of watching which buttons are being hit vs watching what the characters themselves are doing.

Without the flytexts from addons, most of the time anyone watching these vids would have zero clue what is actually happening.

So no, I dont watch them anymore, nor do I plan to in the near future. Not through any fault of any of you or yours though, but because vids of this game just do my head in.

Also any video over 3-4 minutes is a no-go. If i want to watch the game for that long, ill just log in O_o if you know what im sayin.

I respectfully disagree, I find many of the videos entertaining and some of them downright awesome.
I will concede however that many of them are way too long. 3 minutes should be tops, but if the ESO Live show is anything to go by nothing in this game moves fast :-P

Jbugz97 · May 2015

@TheBull
posted a video the other day 1v1 the was pretty cool and fun to watch with commentary

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/166809/sunshine-presents-lord-nasher-vs-ninja-san

Erock25 · May 2015

Jbugz97 wrote: »

@TheBull
posted a video the other day 1v1 the was pretty cool and fun to watch with commentary

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/166809/sunshine-presents-lord-nasher-vs-ninja-san

Yep for sure enjoyed hearing the commentary.

Lhorion · May 2015

I want to see duel-videos!

Cody · May 2015

dueling and "regular" PvP, both require different builds and mindsets. I myself dont care about dueling, so I usually dont watch them.

Dazin93 · May 2015

I would rather watch a Mayweather vs. Pacquiao rematch than an ESO dueling video.

Snit · May 2015

They're only useful if there is commentary. The fights themselves hold little intrinsic interest, but I'll watch videos by good players if I can learn from them.

LegendaryMage · May 2015

Cody wrote: »

dueling and "regular" PvP, both require different builds and mindsets. I myself dont care about dueling, so I usually dont watch them.

What about duels where a player is running the same build for absolutely everything? For example, you can see in my dueling videos that I run the same setup as in open pvp video where I have some outnumbered fights.

Soulac · May 2015

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Cody wrote: »

dueling and "regular" PvP, both require different builds and mindsets. I myself dont care about dueling, so I usually dont watch them.

What about duels where a player is running the same build for absolutely everything? For example, you can see in my dueling videos that I run the same setup as in open pvp video where I have some outnumbered fights.

Yap, I use the same build for group play, grind, small scale and duels.. Too lazy to change my build everytime I want to do something else..

Jitterbug · May 2015

Soulac wrote: »

LegendaryMage wrote: »

Cody wrote: »

dueling and "regular" PvP, both require different builds and mindsets. I myself dont care about dueling, so I usually dont watch them.

What about duels where a player is running the same build for absolutely everything? For example, you can see in my dueling videos that I run the same setup as in open pvp video where I have some outnumbered fights.

Yap, I use the same build for group play, grind, small scale and duels.. Too lazy to change my build everytime I want to do something else..

Agreed, which is why I'm so happy I finally hit vr14 so I never have to PvE again :-P