Unbiased Poll? Trader System, Improved Trader System, Personal Kiosks, Auction House, Something Else
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LIQUID741✭✭✭I know its too late and thanks for the effort anyways, but a poll I would like to see would just have the following points to make it easier to choose from.
1. Current system with forced guild membership to sell
2. Current system without guild membership to sell
3. Personal shop system like DAOC, SWG (housing, personal kiosks)
4. Global AH
Those I think are the basic 4 decisions we have, what do we want?
Is it a system that limits our trading abilities to guild memberships, or do we want to see this lifted? Are we completely against guild vendors and want personal ones? Do we not like the vendor idea and prefer an AH system?
Once we found out the results there, we should talk about the preferred system and how it should be implemented.
I did like the SWG/DAOC systems. You can pay the kiosk price or go to the location that it's for sale to avoid a "convience fee".Solid-Nightblade of AD1 -
System structure itself is fine, but the interface is god awful.
Kudos to the addon guys who are trying to make it work, but there are limits. ZOS really needs to step in and create a functional Guild Trader interface.0 -
desciviib14_ESO✭✭✭I very much like the fact that you made a real effort of a neutral poll. Something around 98% of the people making polls should take this as an example.
On topic: I actually like the personal kiosk idea very much, even though I see it as addition to the existing system.
Hence I voted "improved existing system", and this would be the improvement I would like to see.
This is what my vote represents ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^There is nothing here of interest to any nations; as a matter of fact, there is nothing here but people.1 -
gotgk✭✭As it is with many things, ZOS could take a page out of SWG's book on this one.
Every kiosk should allow you to /search/ for items globally, but in order to purchase an item, you have to go to whichever physical kiosk is actually holding the item.
Finding an amazing deal would still require that you race to (perhaps find?) the kiosk upon which your item is listed and purchase it before anyone else does.
The extent to which the global listing reveals the location is up for debate (zone, town, vendor name, etc).
This is assuming that ZOS is willing to compromise to some extent.Edited by gotgk on April 12, 2015 1:16AM0 -
Erock25✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭So only 32% want an auction house. That is a very low percentage, as I expected. Global auction house would be terrible for this game.You earned the 500 LOLs badge.
You received 500 LOLs. It ain't no fluke, you post great stuff and we're lucky to have you here. +50 points3 -
gotgk✭✭So only 32% want an auction house. That is a very low percentage, as I expected. Global auction house would be terrible for this game.
There are steps in between the kind of stuff we saw in WoW and opening up the system to at least include more /information/ about available goods and their prices and locations.
Good trade guilds would still be in demand if, for instance, searching for an item returned results for all of those items listed on public kiosks but none of those items listed on guild stores.
MMOs evolve-- if people hate the way the changes play, they can always be rolled back or changed again. If people will give ZOS credit for nothing else, they should at least acknowledge that they have listened to the community and acted upon the zeitgeist in vogue at any given time.0 -
MercyKilling✭✭✭✭✭They're not putting an AH in. This was stated yesterday on ESO live. No. Auction. House.
They also said "only subscription model" and that changed.pugyourself wrote: »Just like the last poll, 54% of respondents want to keep the current system. Slightly more than half of those who want the current system want to see improvements to it. Exactly the same as the last poll.
Really? Because it looks to me like only 21% want to keep the same thing that's going on now, while 71% want some form of something else.Edited by MercyKilling on April 12, 2015 1:30AMI am not spending a single penny on the game until changes are made to the game that I want to see.
1) Remove having to be in a guild to sell items to other players at a kiosk.
2) Cosmetic modding for armor and clothing.
3) Difficulty slider.
4) Fully customizable player housing that isn't tied to anything in the game other than having the correct resources and enough gold to build. Don't tie it to PvP, guild membership, or anything at all. Oh, make it instanced so as not to take up world map space, too. Zeni screwed this one up already.
Any /one/ of these things implemented would get me spending again, maybe even subbing.4 -
Audigy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭So only 32% want an auction house. That is a very low percentage, as I expected. Global auction house would be terrible for this game.
This thread isn't about AH´s, not sure why some people always come up with that argument.
What the OP tried to show is that an overwhelming majority of the people voting are unhappy with the current guild only trade system.
If they want an AH, personal kiosks or just access to those currently in the game remains to be seen.
Some people here suggested a couple of changes, like having a system similar to SWG or DAOC, maybe Ultima or just regional selling points, so that a player must actually travel to that city to buy.
I think its understandable that there are people who like things as they are, hey 25% are still 1/4 of us here. But to always tear down the polls with "AH this or AH that" isn't a good idea and only leads to silly fights
In my opinion, we all can agree that many are unhappy and want changes, how they could look like is a different story though.Edited by Audigy on April 12, 2015 1:35AM1 -
SteveCampsOut✭✭✭✭✭
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We can just as easily say 77% want to see a change.Edited by SteveCampsOut on April 12, 2015 2:17AM@ֆȶɛʋɛƈǟʍքֆօʊȶ⍟
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Growling Kahjiti CH782 Nightblade EP
One of Many Faces CH782 Sorcerer DC
Grumpasaurus Rex CH782 Warden DCGuildmaster of Pacrooti's Hirelings AD Based LGBT Friendly Guild.
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Stug-Grog M'God CH701 Templar DC
One With Many Faces CH701 Nightblade DC
Trixie Truskan CH701 Sorcerer EP
Grumpetasaurus Rex CH701 Warden EP1 -
Holycannoli✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Right now 33% want an AH and 30% want improvements to the current system. That's almost 2/3 who say the current system needs to be changed.
I agree, although my vote is for AH. Not a global AH but one for each faction.1 -
Iluvrien✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭MercyKilling wrote: »Really? Because it looks to me like only 21% want to keep the same thing that's going on now, while 71% want some form of something else.
Or you could say 50% (currently) want the current system or another form of this current system.
I voted for the latter, the "Improved Current Trader System" option. The system dynamics themselves are solid, but I would like to see the trading UI pretty much completely rewritten.
As such that isn't voting for a change of underlying mechanics as much as the structures sitting on top of those mechanics.1 -
SteveCampsOut✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I don't care what it is, as long as it makes people in zone chat shut up about wanting to sell their crap for outrageous prices.
Sadly that will never happen no matter what system they put into place.@ֆȶɛʋɛƈǟʍքֆօʊȶ⍟
Sanguine & Psijic Group Beta Tester.
NA Server:Steforax Soulstrong CH782 Sorcerer ADEU Server:
Grumpy Kahjiti CH782 Dragonknight AD
Rheticia Le Drakisius CH782 Nightblade DC
Razmuzan Thrasmas CH782 Templar EP
Sheenara Soulstrong CH782 Dragonknight DC
Erik Ramzey CH782 Nightblade AD
Growling Kahjiti CH782 Nightblade EP
One of Many Faces CH782 Sorcerer DC
Grumpasaurus Rex CH782 Warden DCGuildmaster of Pacrooti's Hirelings AD Based LGBT Friendly Guild.
Stefrex Souliss CH701 Sorcerer AD
Grumpy Kahjiti CH701 Dragonknight DC
Slithisi Ksissi CH701 Nightblade EP
Pokes-With-Fire CH701 Dragonknight AD
Josie-The-Pussi-Cat CH701 Templar AD
Stug-Grog M'God CH701 Templar DC
One With Many Faces CH701 Nightblade DC
Trixie Truskan CH701 Sorcerer EP
Grumpetasaurus Rex CH701 Warden EP0 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭So only 32% want an auction house. That is a very low percentage, as I expected. Global auction house would be terrible for this game.
I don't think anyone much wants a global auction house. Most auction house supporters want a faction-based one, but many critics of the present system just want it improved.
The really damning statistic is that only 18% want the present system to remain as it is.3 -
pugyourself✭✭✭✭So only 32% want an auction house. That is a very low percentage, as I expected. Global auction house would be terrible for this game.
I don't think anyone much wants a global auction house. Most auction house supporters want a faction-based one, but many critics of the present system just want it improved.
The really damning statistic is that only 18% want the present system to remain as it is.
Actually, in this poll, 48% want some form of the current system. Only 31% want an auction house. Not damning unless you want an auction house.0 -
Bloodfang✭✭✭✭✭Almost nobody ingame wants AH lol.
I see on these forums the same whiners everyday.Edited by Bloodfang on April 12, 2015 7:20PM0 -
Quintal✭✭✭Auction House? You want both Megaservers to burn?''Subscription fee means that we will offer players the game we set out to make, and the one that fans want to play. Going with any other model meant that we would have to make sacrifices and changes we weren't willing to make.''-Matt FirorNick Konkle no longer part of ZOSMaria Aliprando no longer part of ZOSPaul Sage no longer part of ZOS1 -
jircris11✭✭✭✭✭
✭I picked other, a friend and i where talking about a trade system that would not break eso lore. What about each major city having a form of "auction house" so to speak but it only has the goods available in that town. This way you STILL have to travel to other towns to see other types of merchandise. I do not ever wish for a full server wide AH that would just be silly. But a city based one could work.IGN: Ki'rah
Khajiit/Vampire
DC/AD faction/NA server.
RPer0 -
Gandrhulf_Harbard✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭pugyourself wrote: »So only 32% want an auction house. That is a very low percentage, as I expected. Global auction house would be terrible for this game.
I don't think anyone much wants a global auction house. Most auction house supporters want a faction-based one, but many critics of the present system just want it improved.
The really damning statistic is that only 18% want the present system to remain as it is.
Actually, in this poll, 48% want some form of the current system. Only 31% want an auction house. Not damning unless you want an auction house.
Why not be totally honest about the results and just take them as they are rather than choosing to lump them together in the manner most suited to support your argument?
What do they say then?
All The BestThose memories come back to haunt me, they haunt me like a curse.
Is a dream a lie if it don't come true, or is it something worse.2 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭pugyourself wrote: »So only 32% want an auction house. That is a very low percentage, as I expected. Global auction house would be terrible for this game.
I don't think anyone much wants a global auction house. Most auction house supporters want a faction-based one, but many critics of the present system just want it improved.
The really damning statistic is that only 18% want the present system to remain as it is.
Actually, in this poll, 48% want some form of the current system. Only 31% want an auction house. Not damning unless you want an auction house.
The fact that only 17% (as of my writing this) want the present system as it is seems the more damning of the two aspects. Critics of the present system are divided as to how to fix or replace it, that's only to be expected. The fact that such a small proportion want the present system to remain as it is, however, is a clear indication that something needs to be done about the present system.2 -
Tandor✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Almost nobody ingame wants AH lol.
I see on these forums the same whiners everyday.
The same argument can be said on both sides, I see the same people defending the present system every day too. However, this isn't about the few who make the comments, it's about the many others who have consistently voted to change the present system every time the issue has been raised over the past year. Even with those who vote for the present system, a clear majority of them vote every time to improve it.2 -
onlinegamer1✭✭✭✭✭
✭http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/164642/why-zos-reason-for-no-global-auction-house-is-not-valid
First, I have been a software developer, development lead and product designer for over 26 years. This means I have more experience than everyone at ZoS. I even have more experience than most of ZoS ESO devs have been alive, going by what age they appear to be in the videos they release. (They are young'uns!
)
Second, everything I am about to post can be Googled.
Third, If you think I "don't know what ESO's software stack is, so I can't possibly judge if something is possible or not without knowing how the ESO server code is written", you're simply wrong.
Lets get to it.
Any software can use more than 1 technology. I could have a client/server application (ESO) written on a certain stack (lets say C#, java, MySQL for example) and even build it into a proprietary "engine" (an MMORPG engine). That does NOT prohibit me from adding a specific game feature which uses a completely different technology than the main application, especially if that feature is what's referred to as "modular". i.e. if it doesn't really have to integrate very much with the rest of the software. For example, I could add (to the stack I just mentioned) a feature which uses a "PhP/JQuery/Node/MongoDB" stack, and integrate that into my UI pretty seamlessly.
Now that we've established that, no matter HOW ZoS has coded ESO, I could add anything I want, in any technology, to the ESO game client easily, no matter what technology it needs or what tech stack ESO already uses. Got that? OK.
Global Auction House: ZoS says its "not possible due to the load it would have because of the # of players (due to using single megaservers)"
I have two words for that claim: Bah. Loney.
Using a No-SQL DB I could code a global auction house for ESO that could support 50 million players, each posting 1,000 items for auction, and you could search it and post bids in less than 50 ms (milliseconds) for each database access. In other words, any number of players of ESO could use this AH with no lag whatsoever, even on a megaserver. Again, all of this can be Googled if you so desire.
Conclusion
ZoS's reason that a global AH isn't possible due to performance reasons (due to using megaservers) is not a valid reason. The only thing preventing ZoS from having a global AH is to want to provide one, and to be willing to design it with proper technology which they can plug into their game easily.
My Recommendation
I actually do not support "Auction Houses" (i.e. players post items with bid/buyout prices, other players bid on item until the auction expires, etc.) Instead, I support what ZoS already has for guild stores, which is a "store' concept, just at the global (game) level. Here are my rules for such "Player Stores" which any good MMORPG should have:
- Players list items for sale only (no bidding system at all).
- Rigid categorization helps scaling: i.e. "Swords", "Maces", "Heavy Chest Armor", "Light Boot Armor", "Necklaces", "Rings", etc.
-- No ability to browse/search across these categories (i.e. you have to search "Swords" for "Lightning" (for example), then search "Shields" for "Lightning", etc.) It puts a little more onus on the player to do multiple searches, but you could mitigate this by some good UI features like preserving the search term as players swap categories so they don't have to re-type it over and over, even preserving search terms across sessions. Also, lots of good pre-set filters like rarity, material, quality, etc.
- Game-enforced price caps based on rarity of items to control/eliminate market exploitation and inflation.
- Account-level posting caps to prevent overloading and exploitation (for example, 10 items max for sale at once, per account)1 -
DDemon✭✭✭✭Can ESO not just make it so players can approach guild traders and let their items be sold by it? This way the guild that owns the NPC gets the tax of it and popular guild trader locations will start becoming real trade hubs.0 -
DaveMoeDee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I think the complete disconnect between guild store placement and leveling in game is a shame. Low-level players only have a few stores to choose from while also being the easiest to exploit due to a lack of knowledge about value.
As noisy as chat is, you can expect that items people want to sell there are more likely to be level appropriate.0 -
Genomic✭✭✭✭✭Since only 17% are happy with the current system, could we perhaps get a comment from ZOS explaining their view on this? They've already said they have no intention to have a global AH (though intentions change) but I'd like to know if there are any planned changes to the current trading system, or if they'd consider removing the current guild restrictions.
Edited by Genomic on April 13, 2015 12:51AM1 -
kimboh✭✭✭✭An auction house would be convenient but, to be fair, I don't have any problems with the current system.
I rarely sell anything and when I want to buy something I always find it easily.Status: offline<l Cygnus X|VR14|Sorc l><| Romulus Prime|VR12|Temp |><| Qwoptus |lvl30|DK|><| DC|EU |>0 -
SteveCampsOut✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Since only 17% are happy with the current system, could we perhaps get a comment from ZOS explaining their view on this? They've already said they have no intention to have a global AH (though intentions change) but I'd like to know if there are any planned changes to the current trading system, or if they'd consider removing the current guild restrictions.
Everyone should know by now that ZOS is not in the habit of answering polls in their forums. You need to send your questions in during one of their live events. I didn't start this poll to get answers from ZOS, merely to shed light on how split the community is in what they want. I am neither for or against an AH because I've never played an MMO that had one. I wish I could have made the poll editable so that others could add their own options to vote on but it wasn't an option to the current software.@ֆȶɛʋɛƈǟʍքֆօʊȶ⍟
Sanguine & Psijic Group Beta Tester.
NA Server:Steforax Soulstrong CH782 Sorcerer ADEU Server:
Grumpy Kahjiti CH782 Dragonknight AD
Rheticia Le Drakisius CH782 Nightblade DC
Razmuzan Thrasmas CH782 Templar EP
Sheenara Soulstrong CH782 Dragonknight DC
Erik Ramzey CH782 Nightblade AD
Growling Kahjiti CH782 Nightblade EP
One of Many Faces CH782 Sorcerer DC
Grumpasaurus Rex CH782 Warden DCGuildmaster of Pacrooti's Hirelings AD Based LGBT Friendly Guild.
Stefrex Souliss CH701 Sorcerer AD
Grumpy Kahjiti CH701 Dragonknight DC
Slithisi Ksissi CH701 Nightblade EP
Pokes-With-Fire CH701 Dragonknight AD
Josie-The-Pussi-Cat CH701 Templar AD
Stug-Grog M'God CH701 Templar DC
One With Many Faces CH701 Nightblade DC
Trixie Truskan CH701 Sorcerer EP
Grumpetasaurus Rex CH701 Warden EP0 -
Gandrhulf_Harbard✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭pugyourself wrote: »So only 32% want an auction house. That is a very low percentage, as I expected. Global auction house would be terrible for this game.
I don't think anyone much wants a global auction house. Most auction house supporters want a faction-based one, but many critics of the present system just want it improved.
The really damning statistic is that only 18% want the present system to remain as it is.
Actually, in this poll, 48% want some form of the current system. Only 31% want an auction house. Not damning unless you want an auction house.
The fact that only 17% (as of my writing this) want the present system as it is seems the more damning of the two aspects. Critics of the present system are divided as to how to fix or replace it, that's only to be expected. The fact that such a small proportion want the present system to remain as it is, however, is a clear indication that something needs to be done about the present system.
This is the major issue.
Only 18% (currently) want things just they way they are now.
That's a massive blow to the idea that the current system works just fine.
Surely we can no settle into reasoned and reasonable debate about how to improve things.
Is a Global AH the answer? I don't think so, I think an AH should be limited to Faction.
But I'm not fully convinced an AH is necessary at all.
Significant improvements to the current system - as long as it includes a Trader For Hire for those not in a guild - is probably all that is needed.
But what is needed even more is an indication that ZoS even cares about their customers on this issue.
All The BestThose memories come back to haunt me, they haunt me like a curse.
Is a dream a lie if it don't come true, or is it something worse.2 -
Hagbard_OM✭✭✭Okay, for all of the "Only 17% of the population likes the current system!" people, I think we need some clarification. My understanding, when reading the poll options, was that both of the first two choices were supportive of the current system, hence the inclusion in both choices of the word "current."
I absolutely LOVE the current system, but I voted for option two because I do believe that it could use some improvement. For ideas on good possible improvements, check out this excellent thread: http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/163928/guild-improvements-master-list#latest .
That was what I had in mind when I voted.1
