The grind issue

Calrid · April 2015

Now I personally am ok with grinding don't get me wrong, if you want to reach V14 and still be a newb with no real grasp of the game, because all you did was grind mobs endlessly, and the same mobs, and over and over again ad nauseum, that's fine by my it's your game you do what you want. However ESO has clearly stated and clearly acted to rid the game of grinding and encourage grouping over the grind mentality games like WoW etc.

My question is not should grinding exist, it always will, just like exploits always will and hackers all ways will and so on. If I can though get to the point what is the solution to all the bad feeling players have about not being able to just grind mobs, grind mats, and then grind grinding those mats to sell to grind players who want to grind more mats and sell to grind players and so on. Is there one a point to what they do, well that is not for me to say. But if I can get to another point, are we wise to antagonise these people? People do like to push a rock up a hill only for it to roll back again. The Sysiphus player is endemic in all MMOs.

A further point if I may if we deny the grinders the only thing that seems to make them happy in MMOs, are, we going to create a lot of ill will amongst said people. My last point, is it wise to antagonise people who want nothing more than to log on grind endlessly and not play the content in the game (yes I am well aware grinding is a means to an end), and then log off when they seem to make up such a large part of the game, if not a majority a very vocal minority. Like min maxers and grinders they are a big part of any game, should we persecute them? Should we give them a voice, what is the solution?

Calrid · April 2015

Make love not Warcraft or?

Pausekey · April 2015

Honestly, keep doing what you do. Lol what does it matter? Like you said people are going to do what they want, for whatever reason.

I have a VR14 DK, who has done almost every quest/dungeon/delve/dolmen in the entire game. Cadwell's silver and gold? Yep, did it.

I also have 4 more vet characters, and tbh I hate questing on every one of them. I grind because I don't want to do that nonsense ever again. One play through is enough for me. After that I want to experience other classes, not the same content again for 4 more times.

golfer.dub17_ESO · April 2015

Now I personally am ok with grinding don't get me wrong, if you want to reach V14 and still be a newb with no real grasp of the game, because all you did was grind mobs endlessly, and the same mobs, and over and over again ad nauseum, that's fine by my it's your game you do what you want.

Obviously everyone who grinds never bothered to play the game "legitimately". Obviously it's their first and only character they are grinding, and obviously they grind from level 1 to V14 with absolutely no stopping to do anything else in-between. And also obviously the game with five skill slots is so hard to grasp that you can't understand it unless you do every single last mundane side-quest. Because obviously you can't learn how to play just from the very first few quests, you have to do all the content.

My question is not should grinding exist, it always will, just like exploits always will and hackers all ways will and so on.

Because grinding is totally on the same level as exploiting. If grinding wasn't intended to be possible, then quests would give tons of xp and mobs would give absolutely zero xp.

My last point, is it wise to antagonise people who want nothing more than to log on grind endlessly and not play the content in the game (yes I am well aware grinding is a means to an end)

The best content is typically end-game content.

Should we give them a voice, what is the solution?

Solution to what? You didn't even define what the problem was, all you did was ramble about a large portion of the community.

Tavore1138 · April 2015

I only have one character that I have levelled to VR.

I levelled her from 1 to VR8 by playing through the content provided and enjoyed doing it. i ground for my last few levels because the content ran out.

Before 1.6/2.0 I was quite content doing some trials, some pledges, some writs, a fair bit of PvP... my only grind type activity was spending a few hours hunting for crafting materials to make my sets or make food, potions and runes.

Then ZOS decided I now need to get several thousand CP, the same XP as doing the VR levels over 100 times.

But they gave me no content in which to do it unless I wish to dump my character and create more.

Even if I create the full 8 chatacters and take them to VR14 there will still be over 92 full levelling grinds worth of XP if I want to get those CP.

So unless the content increases or unless you do not care about getting those CP to help you with PvP or veteran dungeons then grind is the future that ZOS have created.

Would I rather quest or do new dungeons to gain points? Well sure, but unless ZOS have an awful lof of content coming soon you'll see me spending a couple of hours a day grinding mobs to grab a CP or two until I get enough or I go insane and my wife has me committed.

Calrid · April 2015

golfer.dub17_ESO wrote: »

Now I personally am ok with grinding don't get me wrong, if you want to reach V14 and still be a newb with no real grasp of the game, because all you did was grind mobs endlessly, and the same mobs, and over and over again ad nauseum, that's fine by my it's your game you do what you want.

Obviously everyone who grinds never bothered to play the game "legitimately". Obviously it's their first and only character they are grinding, and obviously they grind from level 1 to V14 with absolutely no stopping to do anything else in-between. And also obviously the game with five skill slots is so hard to grasp that you can't understand it unless you do every single last mundane side-quest. Because obviously you can't learn how to play just from the very first few quests, you have to do all the content.

My question is not should grinding exist, it always will, just like exploits always will and hackers all ways will and so on.

Because grinding is totally on the same level as exploiting. If grinding wasn't intended to be possible, then quests would give tons of xp and mobs would give absolutely zero xp.

My last point, is it wise to antagonise people who want nothing more than to log on grind endlessly and not play the content in the game (yes I am well aware grinding is a means to an end)

The best content is typically end-game content.

Should we give them a voice, what is the solution?

Solution to what? You didn't even define what the problem was, all you did was ramble about a large portion of the community.

I did define it, are you sure you read the OP? Try reading it again, maybe it will sink in maybe not?

Couldn't hurt though.

Calrid · April 2015

SuraklinPrime wrote: »

I only have one character that I have levelled to VR.

I levelled her from 1 to VR8 by playing through the content provided and enjoyed doing it. i ground for my last few levels because the content ran out.

Before 1.6/2.0 I was quite content doing some trials, some pledges, some writs, a fair bit of PvP... my only grind type activity was spending a few hours hunting for crafting materials to make my sets or make food, potions and runes.

Then ZOS decided I now need to get several thousand CP, the same XP as doing the VR levels over 100 times.

But they gave me no content in which to do it unless I wish to dump my character and create more.

Even if I create the full 8 chatacters and take them to VR14 there will still be over 92 full levelling grinds worth of XP if I want to get those CP.

So unless the content increases or unless you do not care about getting those CP to help you with PvP or veteran dungeons then grind is the future that ZOS have created.

Would I rather quest or do new dungeons to gain points? Well sure, but unless ZOS have an awful lof of content coming soon you'll see me spending a couple of hours a day grinding mobs to grab a CP or two until I get enough or I go insane and my wife has me committed.

that's a very cogent and valid point, I agree once you have leveled one character or even two to v14 if there is no content that you haven't played endlessly what other choice do you have? No one wants to play the same content endlessly.

Calrid · April 2015

golfer.dub17_ESO wrote: »

Now I personally am ok with grinding don't get me wrong, if you want to reach V14 and still be a newb with no real grasp of the game, because all you did was grind mobs endlessly, and the same mobs, and over and over again ad nauseum, that's fine by my it's your game you do what you want.

Obviously everyone who grinds never bothered to play the game "legitimately". Obviously it's their first and only character they are grinding, and obviously they grind from level 1 to V14 with absolutely no stopping to do anything else in-between. And also obviously the game with five skill slots is so hard to grasp that you can't understand it unless you do every single last mundane side-quest. Because obviously you can't learn how to play just from the very first few quests, you have to do all the content.

My question is not should grinding exist, it always will, just like exploits always will and hackers all ways will and so on.

Because grinding is totally on the same level as exploiting. If grinding wasn't intended to be possible, then quests would give tons of xp and mobs would give absolutely zero xp.

My last point, is it wise to antagonise people who want nothing more than to log on grind endlessly and not play the content in the game (yes I am well aware grinding is a means to an end)

The best content is typically end-game content.

Should we give them a voice, what is the solution?

Solution to what? You didn't even define what the problem was, all you did was ramble about a large portion of the community.

I agree.

Calrid · April 2015

Damn I kinda messed up their I agree to all of the above except the last post sorry mine is a new keyboard and I keep pressing the wrong buttons, like a chimp. :S

Calrid · April 2015

Last point gah.

Calrid · April 2015

Pausekey wrote: »

Honestly, keep doing what you do. Lol what does it matter? Like you said people are going to do what they want, for whatever reason.

I have a VR14 DK, who has done almost every quest/dungeon/delve/dolmen in the entire game. Cadwell's silver and gold? Yep, did it.

I also have 4 more vet characters, and tbh I hate questing on every one of them. I grind because I don't want to do that nonsense ever again. One play through is enough for me. After that I want to experience other classes, not the same content again for 4 more times.

You seemed to have completely missed the point but ok.

helediron · April 2015

Then, what is your point? Several people have already asked it. You are ready to persecute people but you write very incoherently and vaguely. You should read your own OP.

ssewallb14_ESO · April 2015

The funny part being efficient grinding requires slightly more planning and skill than any solo content in this game.

Scamandros · April 2015

Grinding never hurt anyone until the Champion system arrived. The overworld grind spots were annoying if trying to complete things normally, but the instanced ones where you weren't disturbing anyone was fine. Vet ranks need to hurry up and go away, or be allowed to grind xp towards leveling but not CP

Khaldar · April 2015

Calrid wrote: »

Now I personally am ok with grinding don't get me wrong, if you want to reach V14 and still be a newb with no real grasp of the game, because all you did was grind mobs endlessly, and the same mobs, and over and over again ad nauseum, that's fine by my it's your game you do what you want. However ESO has clearly stated and clearly acted to rid the game of grinding and encourage grouping over the grind mentality games like WoW etc.

My question is not should grinding exist, it always will, just like exploits always will and hackers all ways will and so on. If I can though get to the point what is the solution to all the bad feeling players have about not being able to just grind mobs, grind mats, and then grind grinding those mats to sell to grind players who want to grind more mats and sell to grind players and so on. Is there one a point to what they do, well that is not for me to say. But if I can get to another point, are we wise to antagonise these people? People do like to push a rock up a hill only for it to roll back again. The Sysiphus player is endemic in all MMOs.

A further point if I may if we deny the grinders the only thing that seems to make them happy in MMOs, are, we going to create a lot of ill will amongst said people. My last point, is it wise to antagonise people who want nothing more than to log on grind endlessly and not play the content in the game (yes I am well aware grinding is a means to an end), and then log off when they seem to make up such a large part of the game, if not a majority a very vocal minority. Like min maxers and grinders they are a big part of any game, should we persecute them? Should we give them a voice, what is the solution?

Just because we grind does not mean we don't already have a vr14 (or a couple for that matter) that we quested through the boring as- Gold and Silver already. You are jumping to a lot of conclusions in your insult of those that grind. Many grinders have played every aspect of this game. They grind because they are bored with the questing they have already endured or they are farming for gold, decons, leveling a skill, reputations, etc... Think a little outside of your own box before you make assumptions.

Galalin · April 2015

The real questions are... why do you even care? What impact does it have on your gaming experience? And what exactly are your trying to achieve with this post?

It sounds more like a poorly written, self righteous, judgemental pile of crap for no apparent reason other than spout out your personal dislike for grinding.

In short...
Care to tell us the point of this topic?

What exactly your trying to achieve?

What point you are trying to make?

Added: i wonder how much time this kid spends flipping through the dictionary picking out words trying to sound educated...

Educated or not my friend ppl don't talk like that unless they are trying to convey that they are intellectually superior to others.

You can't teach stupid.... some ppl are just born with it

DK SCRUB OUT

DerpyShadowz · April 2015

Most, if not all of the players grinding hard are players who have played the content once, if not twice over and really cannot be bothered to play the content again, We just want to keep playing the end game content with a different class for a change of atmosphere and enjoyment. It was boring the 2nd time, it was literally just a grind in itself to run through a zone a day completing everything that you had already seen, That being said i haven't quested since you needed the old exp values to gain VR lvls, Its most likely 10x faster than it was by questing. But even then, at this moment grinding for CP is still something people want to have, People want the best characters they possible can to compete for endgame content, And the fastest way to do that is to grind. Grinding can actually be fun, in a way.

Calrid · April 2015

Galalin wrote: »

The real questions are... why do you even care? What impact does it have on your gaming experience? And what exactly are your trying to achieve with this post?

It sounds more like a poorly written, self righteous, judgemental pile of crap for no apparent reason other than spout out your personal dislike for grinding.

In short...
Care to tell us the point of this topic?

What exactly your trying to achieve?

What point you are trying to make?

Added: i wonder how much time this kid spends flipping through the dictionary picking out words trying to sound educated...

Educated or not my friend ppl don't talk like that unless they are trying to convey that they are intellectually superior to others.

You can't teach stupid.... some ppl are just born with it

DK SCRUB OUT

Frankly no. If you didn't get the point the first time, there's precious little use in trying to explain it to you as clearly you do not understand English well enough to grasp simple concepts, hence elaborating further would only confuse you more. So I will not trouble you further by forcing you to try to comprehend something you are clearly unable to.

Calrid · April 2015

Calrid wrote: »

Galalin wrote: »

The real questions are... why do you even care? What impact does it have on your gaming experience? And what exactly are your trying to achieve with this post?

It sounds more like a poorly written, self righteous, judgemental pile of crap for no apparent reason other than spout out your personal dislike for grinding.

In short...
Care to tell us the point of this topic?

What exactly your trying to achieve?

What point you are trying to make?

Added: i wonder how much time this kid spends flipping through the dictionary picking out words trying to sound educated...

Educated or not my friend ppl don't talk like that unless they are trying to convey that they are intellectually superior to others.

You can't teach stupid.... some ppl are just born with it

DK SCRUB OUT

Frankly no. If you didn't get the point the first time, there's precious little use in trying to explain it to you as clearly you do not understand English well enough to grasp simple concepts, hence elaborating further would only confuse you more. So I will not trouble you further by forcing you to try to comprehend something you are clearly unable to.

Oh and also stop trolling and flaming people it makes you sound like a massive hypocrite.

Valymer · April 2015

f it

Calrid · April 2015

Added: i wonder how much time this kid spends flipping through the dictionary picking out words trying to sound educated...

My erudition or my verbosity is hardly a reason for discussion, regardless of whether I am laconic or loquacious has little or no relevance to the topic vis a vis grinding nor does it per se in any way pertain to the prose.

pari persu the topic at hand I am quite confident in my assertions and quite capable of asking questions that lack an element of facecious sarcasm. What I will not however do is indulge you further, as I fear you are already ignominious enough. Hence facilitating you with more rope would in essence be simply an excuse to attach yourself to some hempen device for the moribund to swing on.

Calrid · April 2015

I am 42 I have a degree in biology and am studying physics, I read a lot of books, and for your information the above post was written off the top of my head as were all the others. Please can the trolling you sound like you are trying to get banned. Thankyou.

Calrid · April 2015

Khaldar wrote: »

Calrid wrote: »

Now I personally am ok with grinding don't get me wrong, if you want to reach V14 and still be a newb with no real grasp of the game, because all you did was grind mobs endlessly, and the same mobs, and over and over again ad nauseum, that's fine by my it's your game you do what you want. However ESO has clearly stated and clearly acted to rid the game of grinding and encourage grouping over the grind mentality games like WoW etc.

My question is not should grinding exist, it always will, just like exploits always will and hackers all ways will and so on. If I can though get to the point what is the solution to all the bad feeling players have about not being able to just grind mobs, grind mats, and then grind grinding those mats to sell to grind players who want to grind more mats and sell to grind players and so on. Is there one a point to what they do, well that is not for me to say. But if I can get to another point, are we wise to antagonise these people? People do like to push a rock up a hill only for it to roll back again. The Sysiphus player is endemic in all MMOs.

A further point if I may if we deny the grinders the only thing that seems to make them happy in MMOs, are, we going to create a lot of ill will amongst said people. My last point, is it wise to antagonise people who want nothing more than to log on grind endlessly and not play the content in the game (yes I am well aware grinding is a means to an end), and then log off when they seem to make up such a large part of the game, if not a majority a very vocal minority. Like min maxers and grinders they are a big part of any game, should we persecute them? Should we give them a voice, what is the solution?

Just because we grind does not mean we don't already have a vr14 (or a couple for that matter) that we quested through the boring as- Gold and Silver already. You are jumping to a lot of conclusions in your insult of those that grind. Many grinders have played every aspect of this game. They grind because they are bored with the questing they have already endured or they are farming for gold, decons, leveling a skill, reputations, etc... Think a little outside of your own box before you make assumptions.

Well for a start if you actually read the thread instead of just skimming the OP you would see that what you said was in fact completely superfluous.

Calrid · April 2015

Can people actually read the thread or at least a few posts, before they get up on their high horse or in their ivory tower. It's so much easier to discuss things when people are on the same page.

"Pride cometh before destruction and haughty spirit before the fall."

Some bible dude.

Calrid · April 2015

Valymer wrote: »

So basically you are saying that everyone should be forced to play the same way that you do?

Yes of course that is so exactly what I am saying your exactitude has created a singularity or point in space that is infinite.

Eveyone should be forced to play exactly like me is entirely the whole point of the original thread.

well done.

Calrid · April 2015

ok so maybe I am not entirely able to keep a facetious tone from my prose, my bad. lol

htoncic · April 2015

Well, to be fair, you did come off as being somewhat judgemental, throwing grinding in the same boat with exploiting and hacking. 'Should we persecute them?' LOL

Not to mention you were very rude to everyone who posted here, but you want a discussion? Are you in a bad mood today, what's going on?

Dre4dwolfb14_ESO · April 2015

There is like . . . no group content and the grouping system is terrible.
Im just going to grind to max lvl and go kill people in cyrodil or w.e the F its called, I don't get what people are on about.

If you kill grinding as a means to level, and force everyone to quest . . . the population would go to zero.
You wana know what a quest tells you to do?
"Go kill X amount of mobs"

You wana know what you do when you grind ?
"Go kill x amount of mobs"

No difference.

If quest XP was worth it . . . maybe. . . but it isnt.
I plan on just going back and plowing through w.e quests I need for points.

Dudis · April 2015

Troll OP? :P

1) Are you really saying you'll be a worse player if you grind instead of quest? How?
2) If anything you have MORE incentive to group while grinding than when questing.
3) People do not grind because it's fun, they do it because it's fast. I grind because i want to reach endgame and do what i actually enjoy quicker.

If questing or running group dungeons was the fastest way to level up, that's what i'd do instead - but it's not.

Calrid · April 2015

Dudis wrote: »

Troll OP? :P

1) Are you really saying you'll be a worse player if you grind instead of quest? How?
2) If anything you have MORE incentive to group while grinding than when questing.
3) People do not grind because it's fun, they do it because it's fast. I grind because i want to reach endgame and do what i actually enjoy quicker.

If questing or running group dungeons was the fastest way to level up, that's what i'd do instead - but it's not.

Tl;dr

Calrid · April 2015

Can people stop trolling or I will start using the report button. If you have nothing better to do than troll up this thread well that's your look out, but I am not even remotely going to acknowledge any further trolling so don't waste your time, is my advice.