ESO PVE difficulty so easy it's frustrating [Video included]

spoqster · March 2015

So, I'll be honest. I love this game. I think they did an awesome job with 1.6 (despite some obvious raised eyebrows about the choice for a vertical CS) and I am really eager to spend some more time in Tamriel.

BUT

I really don't understand why they made the PVE content so absurdly easy now. I get that you need to offer a game that works for everyone and all that. I am fine with that. But seriously, the people who are so bad at this game that they consider the current difficulty challenging are not going to shell out $$ in the Crown Store anyway. It won't help ZOS to get 10% more casuals in if 50% of the potential customers are going to stop playing.

Here is a video to illustrate what I mean:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gvMHY8Ko-18

https://youtu.be/gvMHY8Ko-18

I myself enjoy rolling alts (besides doing the great endgame content on my main) and this experience of playing the game again will easily have me investing many more hours into the game. I'm fine with not earning CP while questing with an alt. But currently I try to skip as much content as possible in order to be purposefully under-leveled. Making the content so easy makes people spend LESS time in the game and makes them skip content, instead of having them spend more time.

ZOS, if you really want to allow players to level their alts quickly, just offer an instant lvl 50 gem in the Crown Store that unlocks once you have beaten Molag Bal with one character, but don't destroy the wonderful gameplay experience you have created. Please bring the difficulty setting back to what it was at launch, or at least increase the difficulty of some of the side quests and delves and mark them as 'elite'. That way more experienced players can solo the elite stuff and others have to group up or come back later.

UPDATE

Here is a video of me running Coldharbour content with another alt. This includes groups and mini bosses at my level. It is NOT my intention to show off in any kind of way. I am not under the impression that I am doing anything special in this video. This is all very, very common L2P, that every player should know when they hit lvl 45. I've got a few CP bonuses that I list in the video, but other than that I am running naked and under the same conditions that apply to any other player of the same level. I apologize for the bad quality, my PC does not paly well at playing and record at the same time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=y9M5i2E2cSo

https://youtu.be/y9M5i2E2cSo

smokes · March 2015

video doesn't work

spoqster · March 2015

yeah, dunno why. trying to figure it out.

spoqster · March 2015

the video works, but the embedding doesn't for some reason.

fromtesonlineb16_ESO · March 2015

spoqster wrote: »

So, I'll be honest. I love this game. I think they did an awesome job with 1.6 (despite some obvious raised eyebrows about the choice for a vertical CS) and I am really eager to spend some more time in Tamriel.

BUT

I really don't understand why they made the PVE content so absurdly easy now. I get that you need to offer a game that works for everyone and all that. I am fine with that. But seriously, the people who are so bad at this game that they consider the current difficulty challenging are not going to shell out $$ in the Crown Store anyway. It won't help ZOS to get 10% more casuals

Literally stopped reading right there .. the moment someone say casuals is a discussion about difficulty I just know they have nothing to say I want to hear, it'll just be the stereotypical 'lolcasualz' attitude.

bellanca6561n · March 2015

Point taken, spoqster

You could really use the addon BugEater. It dumps those error messages into your chat buffer.

spoqster · March 2015

fromtesonlineb16_ESO wrote: »

spoqster wrote: »

So, I'll be honest. I love this game. I think they did an awesome job with 1.6 (despite some obvious raised eyebrows about the choice for a vertical CS) and I am really eager to spend some more time in Tamriel.

BUT

I really don't understand why they made the PVE content so absurdly easy now. I get that you need to offer a game that works for everyone and all that. I am fine with that. But seriously, the people who are so bad at this game that they consider the current difficulty challenging are not going to shell out $$ in the Crown Store anyway. It won't help ZOS to get 10% more casuals

Literally stopped reading right there .. the moment someone say casuals is a discussion about difficulty I just know they have nothing to say I want to hear, it'll just be the stereotypical 'lolcasualz' attitude.

How should I call it then?

drackonir · March 2015

common pattern nowadays:

- spend hours in internet looking for the best build, rotations, etc
- PVE to easy
- complain

Levelling an alt seems easy to me as well, but only because i know much about the game mechanics. Casual player who just started this game will still find plenty of challenging situations.

derek.simon00ub17_ESO · March 2015

Worst complaint i have ever seen. you should be thanking the nine u aren't forced to grind out these quests at a painstaking rate because questing is the ONLY efficient real way to level anymore. That being said, if anything pve should be made even easier, because of the fact zenimax is forcing every player to do their poorly written, lore confounding, over marketed quests. This is honestly a pathetic complaint. Level 4 characters to vr 14 and come back to me.

Razzak · March 2015

Agree with @OP.
I came back after a month, made a new char and found questing to be excruciatingly unchallenging. I also understand the game should be focused to the largest possible player base. But who are those players that found previous 1-50 PVE difficult?
I see players like OP, several levels bellow NPCs, fighting them without much problem. And who or what does that help? It will only make people level faster, get to the end game much sooner and *** about the lack of end game content more.
I would imagine ZOS would want to make leveling to end game last longer, since there is no new content on horizon.

smokes · March 2015

all your video displayed is that you understand how knockdowns, bleeds and moving out of the way works.

not that the difficulty is too easy...

you also kinda wanna be able to kill 1 mob as a sorc that quickly, otherwise in larger packs you'll have issues. that mob was also a light armor caster, as opposed to a heavy armor sword and board.

i've not played any early content since picking the game back up last week, so i cannot really comment on any difficulty changes, only what i observed in the video and i'd say you are playing as intended and rightfully kicking butt.

got a video of Vs 3 mobs in a range of armor?
solo'd a dolmen?
killed an elite guard?
solo'd a delve?
solo'd a group delve?

i dont think difficulty of overworld mobs was ever really intended to be difficult - except maybe in vet areas. quest mobs like the fighters guild and mages guild mini bosses - they're supposed to be tricky. but even those i think were nerfed a bit due to outcries of OP.

but if you're blasting through things like group delves in practically no armor, with no downtime, without losing much health, then yea, i'd say it's probably a little undertuned. but as i say, without recent experience of my own to call upon, i can only really comment on what i saw in the video, which tbh, wasn't a lot.

Takhistis · March 2015

I'll say the same I always say in threads like this:
It's easy for you
You're familiar with it
You're not everyone
As a new player a month ago I was extremely struggling trying to get used to it
Stop thinking about how you and your friends who are used to this have an easy time
Also think about how others experience it

aco5712 · March 2015

1-50 grind imo could have its difficulty raised slightly but i really think the vet zones need to be buffed to close to the level at launch. One your vr1 you should know enough of your character to deal with harder mobs. If someone can solo a full dungeon in one pull then you know the pve is too easy.

lolo_01b16_ESO · March 2015

Allthough I'd love to have the challenging mages and fighters guild quests back we encounterd during the beta I can understand that the first zones are made so that every new player can complete them without dieing a lot.
But later the game should become more difficult. At the moment most of my alts are stuck at v1 because questing is still so easy that it is boring and you can't underlevel anymore to make it challenging again.

derek.simon00ub17_ESO · March 2015

Expanding on last post because i'm simply infuriated by the agreement in this post: Way too many npcs in a given area, no de-aggro's for any class=guaranteed death for accidental overpull, coupled with overpriced undervalued soulgems. And yes, to not only agree with but also expand on smokes post... Your video was completely unsubstantial.. Way to take out a group of 3 npc's.. OP.. you do realize there is about 200 hours of questing from start to finish.. Your essentially asking for the exact same content, except more... Please drowned this post in negativity people. It needs it

michael_bimson · March 2015

Rather than setting one level of difficulty for all, we should be promoting for ZOS to implement difficulty options for players in PvE. A simple little slider that allows you to downscale yourself (or upscale if in content that is already scaled but too difficult) to set your own level of challenge. There are plenty of players that want a more taxing experience, there are plenty of players who find the current level taxing enough, there are plenty that find some circumstances too difficult. The only way to satisfy all players is to give over control of the difficulty to the player.

Atirez · March 2015

Yes to soloing a Dolmen, granted they are 2 levels below me - but still.

I also think this game is very easy, I would definitely prefer a challenge.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AKsrzvkbseg

spoqster · March 2015

derek.simon00ub17_ESO wrote: »

Worst complaint i have ever seen. you should be thanking the nine u aren't forced to grind out these quests at a painstaking rate because questing is the ONLY efficient real way to level anymore. That being said, if anything pve should be made even easier, because of the fact zenimax is forcing every player to do their poorly written, lore confounding, over marketed quests. This is honestly a pathetic complaint. Level 4 characters to vr 14 and come back to me.

You're mounting the horse from the wrong end. We shouldn't be required to "level" them for PVP. Either use a system similar to that in GW2 or offer some kind of insta-level 50 gem in the Crown Store for those who have done it before.

But nerfing the content, so that it is easier to grind helps no one. It still not helps the players who want to get to endgame quickly, because instead of ultimatively absurdly annoying, it's still absurdly annoying, and at the same time it destroys the game for the PVEers.

spoqster · March 2015

drackonir wrote: »

common pattern nowadays:

- spend hours in internet looking for the best build, rotations, etc
- PVE to easy
- complain

Levelling an alt seems easy to me as well, but only because i know much about the game mechanics. Casual player who just started this game will still find plenty of challenging situations.

Not true. I am here since beta. This has nothing to do with my build. I wouldn't call it a "build" at lvl 10 anyway. They made the game significantly easier since beta.

spoqster · March 2015

smokes wrote: »

all your video displayed is that you understand how knockdowns, bleeds and moving out of the way works.

not that the difficulty is too easy...

you also kinda wanna be able to kill 1 mob as a sorc that quickly, otherwise in larger packs you'll have issues. that mob was also a light armor caster, as opposed to a heavy armor sword and board.

i've not played any early content since picking the game back up last week, so i cannot really comment on any difficulty changes, only what i observed in the video and i'd say you are playing as intended and rightfully kicking butt.

got a video of Vs 3 mobs in a range of armor?
solo'd a dolmen?
killed an elite guard?
solo'd a delve?
solo'd a group delve?

i dont think difficulty of overworld mobs was ever really intended to be difficult - except maybe in vet areas. quest mobs like the fighters guild and mages guild mini bosses - they're supposed to be tricky. but even those i think were nerfed a bit due to outcries of OP.

but if you're blasting through things like group delves in practically no armor, with no downtime, without losing much health, then yea, i'd say it's probably a little undertuned. but as i say, without recent experience of my own to call upon, i can only really comment on what i saw in the video, which tbh, wasn't a lot.

I've soloed so many dolmens with my main, soloed much of Craglorn before 1.6, I am cutting through Coldharbor with my DK like a knife through warm butter, I played through the whole main quest with my DK and was bored to tears. Before that I recorded a vid of doing one of the main quest missions where I was fighting a boss that was not even close to being a challenge. I could make more videos for you, but these babies take time, and that I don't have much at the moment.

Palidon · March 2015

Either the complaints are it's too hard, or the complaint is it's too easy. Just play the game already. You are also overlooking that many complainers saying it's too easy are seasoned ESO players who have leveled more than one character and are well versed in the game mechanics of combat, armor and build combinations, blocking and dodging etc. Those make a big difference in any encounter.

Slurg · March 2015

For the people who find content too easy, why not just run it naked with a bad build that includes terrible skills and weapons for your character? When I start finding myself having too easy of a time I like to put a new random skill or two I haven't tried on my bar to level it, maybe a new weapon. Who knows, they might turn out to be useful later after the next round of nerfs and buffs and then I'll be glad I leveled them. But some people find the content challenging enough as it is so I think it shouldn't be increased in difficulty across the board. Maybe a difficulty slider would be appropriate down the road if something like that would work in an MMO.

smokes · March 2015

watching your dolmen video just shows you know wtf you are doing and running a solid solo build - i wouldn't say that makes the content too easy, i'd say that makes you a bit pro

/pat on back
/well done

you've gotta appreciate people coming into this game with no clue, who will die countless times to things you would call trivial - like moving out of stuff on the ground, blocking, countering, correct spell usage and weapon swapping to maximise ability and resource use.

if you attempted that same dolmen with a 2H+bow build, or a different class, it'd probably make it a bit trickier - but even i remember how OP templars with resto/flamestaff build were, i doubt that much has changed.

it's the versatility of the class that makes solo'ing stuff a lot easier, but no everyone is going to be rolling that class and that build - but then again, you probably purposefully went with that build and class specifically for solo'ing stuff.

so please stop calling for buffs, experience nerfs content, you have that experience, others dont. (for earlier content at least, i'm perfectly fine with the challenge increasing as people hit higher levels of the game, as you'd expect it to be more difficult, but you still have to account for class and build balance - from the looks of it though, a mob HP buff would probably help)

if new players were all up in here calling for nerfs, i'd be supportive. but i dispute your personal PoV as biased.

i mean have you seen how easy early level mobs in WoW are these days? you could literally emote at them and they'd die. the only mobs even worthy of calling slightly challenging are the rare elites. edit* ESO is still challenging in comparison

sadownik · March 2015

Game is way too easy for me - im vet 1 and thought that vet content will be challenging - nope. I understand that people want it to be easy to be able pass that hudreds of quests fluently but for me its a horid bore.

bellanca6561n · March 2015

fromtesonlineb16_ESO wrote: »

spoqster wrote: »

So, I'll be honest. I love this game. I think they did an awesome job with 1.6 (despite some obvious raised eyebrows about the choice for a vertical CS) and I am really eager to spend some more time in Tamriel.

BUT

I really don't understand why they made the PVE content so absurdly easy now. I get that you need to offer a game that works for everyone and all that. I am fine with that. But seriously, the people who are so bad at this game that they consider the current difficulty challenging are not going to shell out $$ in the Crown Store anyway. It won't help ZOS to get 10% more casuals

Literally stopped reading right there .. the moment someone say casuals is a discussion about difficulty I just know they have nothing to say I want to hear, it'll just be the stereotypical 'lolcasualz' attitude.

So he had you at hello?

Such short fuses....such hostility.

eliisra · March 2015

Slurg wrote: »

For the people who find content too easy, why not just run it naked with a bad build that includes terrible skills and weapons for your character?

I use to do that with easy console games, I tried stoner builds. But this is a multiple player game, no one else is going to gimp themselves just because you do. They stay god-mode. That leaves you at disadvantage.

When questing, delving, grinding, doing dolmens or bosses, there can be some major competition on. Reason for that is stuff dying to fast, combined with to many players and to little enemies. It's enough with 2 more guys doing the same thing and everything is zerged down in seconds. That's how weak mobs are right now v.s. players. Removal of soft caps and lowbie alts with 90+ CP, made it even worse.

You dont need a decent build to beat enemies, you need it to beat other players to get the exp or complete the quest in reasonable time. I mean good luck doing a dolmen naked when there's others around, you wont even get exp or loot from the last boss

Cuyler · March 2015

@spoqster I'm wondering are you using your champion points for this lowbie?

RainfeatherUK · March 2015

The naked comments are hilarious, since yes, some of us can run regular content (non dungeon etc) with a naked character and roll an area. Hell some dynamics are so lolworthy you can do it naked and without any skills at all. Just roll about swinging auto and perhaps the occasional heavy.

As i've posted elsewhere, stuff for casuals is fine. For those people who arent casual though, yeah we need something too. Acting like the big man and essentially saying 'dont offend the casuals' is just apologetic bullcrap. Because everyone should be considered not just the casuals, and a good many of us arent..casuaL

I wouldnt say im a casual hater they bring in revenue like anyone, but certainly those people who dedicate time to the game and put alot into it should get something that at least acknowldeges their dedication. So yeah, some more challenging stuff would be nice.

As for playing gimp builds to artificially create difficulty? lol what a disrespectful fob off. Dont make me slap you.

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · March 2015

Level 1-50 is supposed to be easy.

danno8 · March 2015

Imagine a level 10 NB, Dual Wield and Bow with virtually no healing abilities or shields going full stamina melee taking on 3 or more mobs.

The game needs to make levels 1-50 easy enough for ALL starter builds that don't come into their own until much later in the game. Some classes and builds start the game waaaaaaay ahead of others in the survivability department.

fromtesonlineb16_ESO · March 2015

aco5712 wrote: »

1-50 grind imo could have its difficulty raised slightly but i really think the vet zones need to be buffed to close to the level at launch

Because taking 2 mins to kill a trash group of 3 over-world is a fun thing to do, right?

And you statement about pulling an entire dungeon in one pull is of course ludicrous for any spec on-level.