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This is EXACTLY when the LFG tool became obsolete.
Alphashado
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Patch 1.5.2. November 3rd, 2014. The introduction of Dungeon scaling. http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/en/discussion/137773/patch-notes-v1-5-2
Grouping and Grouping Tools
1. Created an entirely new backend system for the Grouping Tools to help you get into groups much faster.
2. When searching for Dungeons, Veteran Dungeons, and Dragonstar Arena, the group will only form once a full group is found.
3. When searching for a medium sized Trial, a group will only form once 8 members of required roles are found. The system will continue to search for more player characters once the group is formed.
4. Added the location “All” for Activity Types (Dungeon, Veteran Dungeons and Trials). This will allow you to group for any of these activities that you meet the minimum requirements for.
5. The activities will scale to the group leader.
6. The grouping tool will place you in a group within five levels or ranks of each other.
It wasn't great before that, but it was much better than it is now. Even as a DPS, you would find a group in roughly 30 mins or less during peak hours, and keep in mind that November of last year was arguably the lowest game population because it was before the Champion System was even introduced.
The current LFG tool may work for some, but it doesn't work for most of us and it isn't due to population or lack of use. The changes listed above broke it and it hasn't been the same since.
Perhaps this reminder can help ZOS pinpoint where it went wrong.
Edited by Alphashado on March 20, 2015 2:42AM Grouping and Grouping Tools
1. Created an entirely new backend system for the Grouping Tools to help you get into groups much faster.
2. When searching for Dungeons, Veteran Dungeons, and Dragonstar Arena, the group will only form once a full group is found.
3. When searching for a medium sized Trial, a group will only form once 8 members of required roles are found. The system will continue to search for more player characters once the group is formed.
4. Added the location “All” for Activity Types (Dungeon, Veteran Dungeons and Trials). This will allow you to group for any of these activities that you meet the minimum requirements for.
5. The activities will scale to the group leader.
6. The grouping tool will place you in a group within five levels or ranks of each other.
It wasn't great before that, but it was much better than it is now. Even as a DPS, you would find a group in roughly 30 mins or less during peak hours, and keep in mind that November of last year was arguably the lowest game population because it was before the Champion System was even introduced.
The current LFG tool may work for some, but it doesn't work for most of us and it isn't due to population or lack of use. The changes listed above broke it and it hasn't been the same since.
Perhaps this reminder can help ZOS pinpoint where it went wrong.
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runagate✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭I think it went obsolete for good and mentally fit players when they first tried using it, encountered the awful players that don't even bother to try to play when then rage quit after blaming it on the rest of the group.
I've heard some scary, scary stories about "tanks" with no taunt, just carrying one dagger... *shudder*
I won't even pug. I make friends with friendly and talented people and play with them. Course, there's also a couple guilds I know you're well aware of that will never call people out on their behavior and/or wrecking group pledges or Trials or such and so the halfway decent people in said guilds need to try to use the LFG tool or spam in zone for pugs.
Sad thing is, whether one meets good and/or talented people to hang out with is pretty much just blind luck.5 -
Alphashado✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I think it went obsolete for good and mentally fit players when they first tried using it, encountered the awful players that don't even bother to try to play when then rage quit after blaming it on the rest of the group.
I've heard some scary, scary stories about "tanks" with no taunt, just carrying one dagger... *shudder*
I won't even pug. I make friends with friendly and talented people and play with them. Course, there's also a couple guilds I know you're well aware of that will never call people out on their behavior and/or wrecking group pledges or Trials or such and so the halfway decent people in said guilds need to try to use the LFG tool or spam in zone for pugs.
Sad thing is, whether one meets good and/or talented people to hang out with is pretty much just blind luck.
Indeed. Though I don't mind explaining fights to people and dying a few times as long as people are friendly. That is the key for me. I've found myself in some fabulous pugs. Plus many people, myself included, work strange schedules and would appreciate at least the opportunity to be able to find a group for the pledge etc during off-peak hours. I can certainly understand why you don't prefer pugs, but friends and guildies are sometimes hard to come by as you mentioned.
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runagate✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭Anyone who's ever played with me knows I'm perfectly happy to explain anything or help (unless and until I discover they're bad people, which happens less and less admittedly).
I wish the LFG tool were somehow hooked to something like guild/friends list. I assume those that are muted don't get put into your queue. I always have trouble with the 100 person limit on both ignores and friends, though.2 -
Rissq✭Long ago, I had great experiences with the group finder. I mean they're PuGs, you can't get pretentious about it.
But you're right, those patch notes are a very convincing reason why the group finding tool is now broken. What was nice about how the system was on release was that you could join it, get maybe 2 or 3 of you in a group. And then ask around in chat for the 4th. The game doesn't have the population to support a system that only groups together full groups. Especially now that there's level scaling.5 -
Alphashado✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Long ago, I had great experiences with the group finder. I mean they're PuGs, you can't get pretentious about it.
But you're right, those patch notes are a very convincing reason why the group finding tool is now broken. What was nice about how the system was on release was that you could join it, get maybe 2 or 3 of you in a group. And then ask around in chat for the 4th. The game doesn't have the population to support a system that only groups together full groups. Especially now that there's level scaling.
I agree. That might have been the straw that broke the Camel's back. At least when you got grouped up with one or two other people, you knew what you needed and it was easier to find that role. "Just need a tank for SC and good to go" is MUCH better than "LFG for SC". And you could go about your business while in que rather than having to sit in a lvl 20 zone with nothing to do while staring blankly at zone chat waiting for an opportunity to fill a spot.
Edited by Alphashado on March 20, 2015 5:32AM0 -
Messy1✭✭✭✭✭
✭I think it went obsolete for good and mentally fit players when they first tried using it, encountered the awful players that don't even bother to try to play when then rage quit after blaming it on the rest of the group.
I've heard some scary, scary stories about "tanks" with no taunt, just carrying one dagger... *shudder*
I won't even pug. I make friends with friendly and talented people and play with them. Course, there's also a couple guilds I know you're well aware of that will never call people out on their behavior and/or wrecking group pledges or Trials or such and so the halfway decent people in said guilds need to try to use the LFG tool or spam in zone for pugs.
Sad thing is, whether one meets good and/or talented people to hang out with is pretty much just blind luck.
I will still PUG, and it is easy to figure out how effective someone will be after a few mins in the dungeon. Yeah intially LFG pairs you with some very flakey people some of whom don't understand the concept of the trinity roles (tank dps healer) then when people have made friends and got a little more savvy with the game they just don't use the grouping tool anymore. It's kind of cool that the culture of the game has made the grouping tool obsolete. If I were ZOS I would just take out the grouping tool and hope that solves lag in Cyrodil . . .0 -
Ashigaru✭✭✭✭At low lvls i dont care if people are bad, i expect it and when i sit in the search for 4 hours or more that tells me something is jacked up in a bad way. I am not a proponent of a LFG tool at all but i have tried to use it and i have had very little lick, i have better luck watching zone chat when people are asking for someone. But yes i wish they would fix it no matter if people are good or bad when you get a group it needs to be working properly one way or another.0 -
Audigy✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I assume most players in ESO simply put don't care about dungeons. Its not a typical ES feature to rush leaderboards. Players want to explore and see new monsters, encounter hard challenges and not compete for the next Usain Bold award.
Besides that, those who do dungeons are usually very elite in their mind as we see already in this thread, so that a casual just doesn't want to encounter those "prove your worth" people and therefore simply put doesn't queue or only with friends.
The tool is one thing, the target group another, but Elitism and harassment play a huge part as well, players just don't want those rude people in their groups, so they just skip anything where they could encounter them.Edited by Audigy on March 20, 2015 6:31AM0 -
It isn't due to player culture that the grouping tool is no longer used by most vet players anymore... It is because they noticed it simply does not work. I used it most of the time (when it was working) and i have to say the groups weren't any worse than what you get by just grabbing a few people in zones. And if people prefer that way of grouping, why don't let them be? I don't tell you to go use the group finder tool instead of spamming the zone chat every 3-5 seconds like some people tend to do.2
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Ashigaru✭✭✭✭I assume most players in ESO simply put don't care about dungeons. Its not a typical ES feature to rush leaderboards. Players want to explore and see new monsters, encounter hard challenges and not compete for the next Usain Bold award.
Besides that, those who do dungeons are usually very elite in their mind as we see already in this thread, so that a casual just doesn't want to encounter those "prove your worth" people and therefore simply put doesn't queue or only with friends.
The tool is one thing, the target group another, but Elitism and harassment play a huge part as well, players just don't want those rude people in their groups, so they just skip anything where they could encounter them.
Its not about trials or leader boards, some people do like to run dungeons to break the boredom of questing or grindging, there is a feature in the game that should work and it doesnt. Besides most of the people that care about leader boards run pre-mades anyway so that argument is moot.
Judging people because they like to run dungeons is making you sound like your a casual rper (see i can do it also lol) which is fine with me i dont care how you like to play but this is a feature in the game that is supposed to get people to group and its broken, and by the way its not just for dungeons you can use it for just finding a group period, some people dont enjoy sitting by themselves talking in character and they prefer to group with people.1 -
Alphashado✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I assume most players in ESO simply put don't care about dungeons. Its not a typical ES feature to rush leaderboards. Players want to explore and see new monsters, encounter hard challenges and not compete for the next Usain Bold award.
Go sit in any faction's level 20 zone and watch zone chat. Then come back and tell us people in ESO don't care about dungeons.Besides that, those who do dungeons are usually very elite in their mind as we see already in this thread, so that a casual just doesn't want to encounter those "prove your worth" people and therefore simply put doesn't queue or only with friends.
Lumping everyone that likes to run dungeons into this catagory is preposterous. Dungeons, just like any other facet of an MMO, consists of every type of personality you can imagine. The description you use to write off everyone that enjoys a group dungeon is just silly.The tool is one thing, the target group another, but Elitism and harassment play a huge part as well, players just don't want those rude people in their groups, so they just skip anything where they could encounter them.
They might as well go back to Skyrim then, because you encounter all of that in every facet of every MMO. Even RPers have elitism, exclusion, and harassment.
The LFG tool is busted. It most certainly is NOT neglected because people have given up on dungeons. This game is plum full of people that are eager and willing.... and frustrated because they have to sit in a level 20 zone and watch chat in order to find a group for the daily quests.
Edited by Alphashado on March 20, 2015 7:35AM0