Enlightenment : 1CP every 24h enough?

gresiac · March 2015

ppl these days dont want to work anymore for something they want everything free and easy lol

if some of you played DARK AGE OF CAMELOT go play it and tell me what grinding something is all about
this champion system is nothing

randolphbenoit · March 2015

Why not give 3 CP (1 Mage, 1 Warrior and 1 Thief) vs 1 CP...

10 years for heavy players 100 years for everyone else lol

Snit · March 2015

I'd be happy with 10 or 11 per week, in semi-casual play. "Maxxing" it is an illusion, as most specs find little value in many of the stars. Between that and diminishing returns, you're closing in on your practical max somewhere around 1,000 points.

Two years to hit that seems reasonable to me.

Blud · March 2015

kelly.medleyb14_ESO wrote: »

ElliottXO wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Fine with the fix, but also glad that ZOS gave me 70 days worth of progress through the system for having a maxed out character.

They actually took 630 CP away from you.

^ Surprising how many of these people still don't get this... then again maybe it's not.

the 1 cp per day of enlightenment is a temporary change I expect it to go up when they fix the exploits and roll people back.

Has there ever been a precedent in this game of something being nerfed (for whatever reason) and then being increased again?

technohic · March 2015

gresiac wrote: »

ppl these days dont want to work anymore for something they want everything free and easy lol

if some of you played DARK AGE OF CAMELOT go play it and tell me what grinding something is all about
this champion system is nothing

It's not really work. It's just a time investment. In that, there is only so much I want to invest in a video game and I am ok with finding myself a bit in lower standing than someone who spends a lot more time, but it also needs to be competitive or I won't bother at all.

EDIT: to go along with that, time investment needs to be somewhat equal to each activity being done otherwise you make people feel forced into a specific one, such as grinding. Right now; there is a great lack of ability to make progress in Leveling a sub-50 alt, PvP, dungeon raids/trials, justice system, crafting. all are way behind questing in VR which is then also way lower than just grinding.

Merlin13KAGL · March 2015

Is your concern about rate of gain, or about rate of catching up?

If it's the second, increasing enlightenment for those with limited play time till only make the gap bigger, not smaller, unless they cap daily rates.

If you have an hour to play and you aren't maxing your enlightenment now, you'll not max it even more with that same hour compared to someone that will get full enlightenment benefit in addition to the remaining XP's they already get.

Making it happen faster means capped faster, means out of progression faster.

I don't believe enlightenment is the issue here.

DisgracefulMind · March 2015

I earned 4 CPs last night in PvP. Not sure how or why, but I did. Sooooo perhaps it's not all that bad? Idk.

Erock25 · March 2015

1 enlightened CP per day is just right. Please don't forget that you can still earn more than 1CP per day, if you have the time. You gotta keep the casuals in the running with the play-all-dayers.

AlnilamE · March 2015

I actually think 1CP a day of enlightenment is great.

With ability of banking up to 3 days, it allows me to earn 1CP during the week (or maybe less depending on game time) and then actually do other stuff if I feel like it. That way I'm not feeling like I'm missing out if I don't quest/do other XP earning things for 4 hours, and I can work on crafting or alts if I want (or earn more XP if that's what I feel like).

And the people who are in a hurry to earn more CP can keep grinding/questing if that's what they'd like to do and just earn it at the normal XP rate.

ElliottXO wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Fine with the fix, but also glad that ZOS gave me 70 days worth of progress through the system for having a maxed out character.

They actually took 630 CP away from you.

I call bull on that. I've done a couple of pledges since 1.6, with a build that's not entirely optimized yet (I don't know if I want the stam morphs or not), and I don't feel they are any more difficult than they were before.

I even did vCoH for the first time yesterday, and I don't think I could have finished that before 1.6.

I have 74 CP so far (as a person with work/life/family and other in-game interests).

MissBizz · March 2015

I am fine with 1 CP per day.

To me, I understood this system was not intended to be maxxed out immediately. It is just supposed to be a little blip in the background that gave you a smile when you happened to get one. As well, I DO understand it gives susbstantial power increases, and is much more "vertical" than "horizontal" progression, so I DO understand why people want to max the system out.

Remember on the PTS they said "we gave 3600 CP to play with, but remember, the content is not scaled to this and will be really easy". Well, they have not released any content... so if people start getting CP too fast.. everything will be ridiculously easy.

Thanks for reading my non-competitive, casual, PvE only biased opinion.

Skjoldur · March 2015

kelly.medleyb14_ESO wrote: »

ElliottXO wrote: »

Samadhi wrote: »

Fine with the fix, but also glad that ZOS gave me 70 days worth of progress through the system for having a maxed out character.

They actually took 630 CP away from you.

^ Surprising how many of these people still don't get this... then again maybe it's not.

the 1 cp per day of enlightenment is a temporary change I expect it to go up when they fix the exploits and roll people back.

This was never said or written...

Valnas · March 2015

the should halve the whole damn system (just gut it at 50 pts in, keep the max benefit 50% of total). Then let people gain to a cap that is manageable instead of waiting to deal with the problem later.

nerevarine1138 · March 2015

Snit wrote: »

I'd be happy with 10 or 11 per week, in semi-casual play. "Maxxing" it is an illusion, as most specs find little value in many of the stars. Between that and diminishing returns, you're closing in on your practical max somewhere around 1,000 points.

Two years to hit that seems reasonable to me.

Exactly. Maxing out your CP is an utterly ludicrous goal. The only benefit that it offers is that it completely removes the kind of people who only play games as some ridiculous measuring contest from the playing field. They can busy themselves finding the latest exploits and grind spots while the majority of players enjoy the game.

Emma_Overload · March 2015

1 CP per day is horrible.... I'd be amazed if I'm still playing this game in 10 years!

10 CP/day would give all of us a much more reasonable time frame to reach max level.

Alphashado · March 2015

I am fine with this. I work 50+ hours per week and I have been very concerned lately that I am going to slowly and steadily fall way behind my friends and guild mates in progression. I certainly understand why people that play 4-10 hours per day would feel ripped off here, but from my personal perspective, this will allow me to stay competitive.

I had already come to terms with the fact that if I fell too far behind everyone else simply because I have a job, that I was going to start planning on finding another game.

Erock25 · March 2015

Emma_Eunjung wrote: »

1 CP per day is horrible.... I'd be amazed if I'm still playing this game in 10 years!

10 CP/day would give all of us a much more reasonable time frame to reach max level.

You do realize it is only a 1cp/day cap on ENLIGHTENMENT? Feel free to grind 10 CP a day if you have the time.

Folkb · March 2015

randolphbenoit wrote: »

Why not give 3 CP (1 Mage, 1 Warrior and 1 Thief) vs 1 CP...

10 years for heavy players 100 years for everyone else lol

I like this idea of 3 CP.

1. It makes sense

2. it's a good middle ground for questers vs grinders.

psufan5 · March 2015

The changes they are making are baffling.

Nebthet78 · March 2015

randolphbenoit wrote: »

Why not give 3 CP (1 Mage, 1 Warrior and 1 Thief) vs 1 CP...

10 years for heavy players 100 years for everyone else lol

I said the same thing in another thread.

3 CP/DAY, only gained WHILE enlightened, one for each tree would be fair for every one and makes sense for the progression of your characters. If you are not enlightened, then you don't gain CP.

It took me over and hour to gain 1 CP while enlightened. And that was through grinding (I was also working on gaining a certain dropped armor set for an ALT at the same time, otherwise I hate grinding, so boring).

Had I not been grinding, it would have taken me over 4+hrs while still enlightened to gain the same 1 CP, just by doing normal questing. There is something seriously wrong with that.

For a casual player, 3CP per day actually allows you to feel like you are making progress and the choices you make actually impact your character, instead of feeling like the whole CP thing is a crappy never ending grindfest.

IMO, this is more of an advantage to casuals who don't really grind, but do in fact like to kill all the enemies on the field when they are questing.

Changing the system slightly, so that you only gain CP while enlightened, to the max of 3CP/Day would also allow players to grind out what they need daily for a few hours if they want, and then go back to playing PVE or PVP like normal. It will also keep other player from exploiting the system and allows semi-dedicated casuals to "keep up" relatively well with other hardcore players.

Castielle · March 2015

I have to agree that this change is literally crappy

Why regulate how much a player can do? If they want to play all day and max their champion points let them! Now it feels like you just want us to log in every day for years and play for 30 minutes like every other F2P game out there...

Cas

Nonamesbutmineub17_ESO · March 2015

So you could only get 365 champion points per year now if you played every day because no one likes grinding for 4 hours+ to earn one champion point. It would take you around 2 years to get your character to where they where in v1.5 and about 3-4 years to max the champion system if you played a lot. Sounds like a lazy attempt to keep people playing their game for a long amount of time without having to produce much content, maybe until the console release at least. I think with 1 CP per day people will eventually get bored of the grinding and find a new game even if they are getting rid of subscriptions the game won't be that much fun after max level.

Personofsecrets · March 2015

I enlightened cp a day is way too low. Think about it, 10 years of play with just enlightened cp at 1 cp a day.

Erock25 · March 2015

This thread is blowing my mind. Four CP a day is WAY too much. People who get multiple hours every day to play will reach the 1000's WAY WAY too soon compared to casuals.

Slurg · March 2015

Erock25 wrote: »

This thread is blowing my mind. Four CP a day is WAY too much. People who get multiple hours every day to play will reach the 1000's WAY WAY too soon compared to casuals.

I agree it's way too much for casuals and I think the decision depends on which customers ZOS is trying to cater to. If they want casuals to spend all their limited daily play time grinding to the daily enlightenment cap then they will set the number higher. The vast majority of people with a full time job and family obligations won't get 4 CP daily unless they grind. Or if they don't sleep. You just don't get that much XP questing or doing other activities in the space of an hour or two. But if they want to encourage casuals to do things other than grind points the daily limit will be lower because that way, they won't be wasting their daily enlightenment. Because if you're an efficient person, you're not going to want to leave that on the table.

Other people are just going to grind as many points as possible, all the time, enlightened or unenlightened. Those people are not casual players. If ZOS is catering to the hardcore players, it would be in their best interests to up the daily cap so that group can advance as far as possible in a short amount of time to be competitive with each other and top the leaderboards.

Whatever they do, there will definitely be a gap between the people who play 12 hours a day and the people who play 12 hours a week. I think they do have to make a choice though about which group they want to make happy (hint, it will depend on who they get the most money from), because I don't see a solution that will please everyone.

firewatch · March 2015

I consider myself a pretty average gamer. I have a job and family and devote a reasonable amount of time to gaming. I figure I can earn close to 300k XP/day, or 1.5 CP/day with the enlightenment bonus. That's 547 CP a year plus the 70 I received up front for a total of 617 CP in the first year. That's enough to open up the 100 point passive in two of the three minor constellations in every major constellation. At that rate, I will be able to open all nine of the 100 point passives a little over half way through the second year. After that, the diminishing returns of each point will be small enough that the continued progress will have minimal benefit and the CP will mostly be applied to areas that are not that helpful to my build. I think most people will have pretty fully developed characters after a couple years of champion points even though they are nowhere near maxing out all of the points. If you only earned 1 CP a day and your received the 70 CP up front, it would take you 2.27 years to open all of the 100 points passives.

So my question to everyone is, do you think 1.5 to 2.25 years is too long to open all the passives and have a pretty well developed character?

AlnilamE · March 2015

firewatch wrote: »

I consider myself a pretty average gamer. I have a job and family and devote a reasonable amount of time to gaming. I figure I can earn close to 300k XP/day, or 1.5 CP/day with the enlightenment bonus. That's 547 CP a year plus the 70 I received up front for a total of 617 CP in the first year. That's enough to open up the 100 point passive in two of the three minor constellations in every major constellation. At that rate, I will be able to open all nine of the 100 point passives a little over half way through the second year. After that, the diminishing returns of each point will be small enough that the continued progress will have minimal benefit and the CP will mostly be applied to areas that are not that helpful to my build. I think most people will have pretty fully developed characters after a couple years of champion points even though they are nowhere near maxing out all of the points. If you only earned 1 CP a day and your received the 70 CP up front, it would take you 2.27 years to open all of the 100 points passives.

So my question to everyone is, do you think 1.5 to 2.25 years is too long to open all the passives and have a pretty well developed character?

Nope. That sounds pretty reasonable to me, actually.

Rev Rielle · March 2015

Brasseurfb16_ESO wrote: »

Rev Rielle wrote: »

1 CP a day enlightenment is quite good I think, and more importantly is more in line with what the developers said the system was going to be like: Something that's long term. Yet people refuse to try to understand this in their rush to be 'the best' or whatever. It's beyond confusing why some of the player base can't get their heads around it: It's not a difficult concept at all.

Something that's long term is something very relative depending who you are speaking to. If your average person needs 1 hour to collect 1CP, with the current enlightenment bonus it means you would need approximatively 5 hours to collect 2CPs a day. Most casual players don't play 5 hours a day, and most people just don't play 5 hours straight. So we are speaking about 10 years + to even get close to CP cap if you play casualy every single days and about 5 years + if you dedicate 5 hours of your play time per day.

I totaly understand the concept, but wow! About 10 years of dayly dedication for an average joe... This is really hardcore!

Yes, though I think there's nothing inherently wrong with it being 'hardcore', but I'd just prefer to use 'long term'.
The problem is that players don't understand the CP system and what it is there for. They're thinking of it as a leveling system or some other mechanic to be 'maxed out as quickly as possible', and that is the exact opposite of what it is designed for.

The CP system was never meant to be the focus for players, but rather just something that ticks along in the background whilst they're actually playing the game. And that's Zenimax's own words, not mine. People have problems because they compare the CP system to levels, or Alternative Advancement or some other relatively short-term mechanic found in other MMOs, and that's just simply wrong. The developers could not have explained it any more clearly than they had in the various ESO Live broadcasts. Many players are just choosing to keep they head in the sand regarding it, and what's worse, complain about it on the forums.

nimander99 · March 2015

I'm sure someone has already broken this down but ill do it myself, anyhooser...

4/day = 900 days to hit 3600 CP which = 2.47 years

1/day = 3600 days to hit 3600 CP which = 9.86 years

This is so absurd its astounding.

I personally think 4 CP worth of enlightenment per day is totally legit, it is also quite possible I will play this game for 10 years but to expect that commitment is counter-intuitive.

And to the argument that you just aren't supposed to pay attention to the Champion System it just happens when it happens... all I can say is that's flawed logic. You get a nice DING when you get your E-buff and a cool sound occurs when you earn a CP, the constellation wheel is beautiful and fun to use, (not to mention it's character progression) there is NOTHING ignorable about this system! Nor was it ever MEANT to be ignored...

Livvy · March 2015

How is it that the enlightenment cooldown timer is going to work? Do you have to wait 24 hours from the expiration of your last enlightenment? If so, I would personally find that really annoying to have to try to schedule my play time around the next time I will be enlightened. I'd much rather see you given one point's worth of enlightenment each day to be used at any point during that day. For example if your enlightenment got refreshed at 1am like the pledges, you could use it at 1am and then just not receive anymore till it resets at 1am the next day. But if I wanted to play during an afternoon or early evening because that's whey I could play, I could use it then too.

Yesterday, I got no enlightenment. Sorry if this has already been answered/discussed, but I didn't see it anywhere. I know it's not working correctly right now for some, but was just wondering the way in which is it supposed to work when it is working correctly.

Audigy · March 2015

I don't know about all of this, but to me the whole Enlightenment system is kind of weird. To me the system should be based on how long someone has been offline and not how much XP he gathered.

Lets say, someone doesn't play for a month then he should very well be Enlighten for the next month and if someone didn't play for 10 hours, then just for those.

It doesn't help Casuals at all if the Enlightenment system is based on 1 or 4 CP a day. The only people that benefit from it are the hardcore gamers, as they will play anyways and gain CPs, be it with or without the bonus.

But if someone now doesn't play for a month and comes back, then he still only has 1 CP worth of bonus and this doesn't seem to be fair at all.

ZO needs to make Enlightenment based on days offline and not XP gathered.