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Altmer 9% Combat Mana Regen vs Breton 3% Cheaper Spells

SaxonyBeach
Can anyone with level 50 experience comment on which would be more valuable?

If it varies for a pure caster vs spell support of melee or archery please elaborate!
  • Covet
    Covet
    Soul Shriven
    I don't think either would be a saving grace. The racial bonuses are so small that they really wouldn't make a difference. There are also softcaps. Example. My imperial templar (what?!?! why would you make an imperial templar!?!?!) mana regen is at it's softcap. I have a ring and neck that give mana regen. But the amount it gives is over that cap. So I took a 50% hit to the mana regen on the neck.

    A 9% bonus to mana regen at this point really would be 4 1/2% Yippy! It's super easy to hit caps these racial bonuses are just 'flavor'. 3% reduced cost of spells means what, I'll be able to cast 1/2 of a spell more before I run out of mana? Think about it. Pick what race you want. These bonuses are not game changing.
  • Corithna
    Corithna
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    @SaxonyBeach‌

    There are different factors that contribute to this question. First is the point distribution for your resources, Second is the armor type that you've chosen, third would of course be the various bonus stats on the specific set of armor/weapon/jewelry that you've managed to acquire. As was rightly pointed out in the above post how close you are to the soft cap will also affect how this decision would play out.

    So the best consideration I could give is a matter of priorities in the form of how you build your character. For a pure caster build the first cap to shoot for would be regen up to but not exceeding cap. Next, yup you guessed it, resource cost reduction. Only once you have enough of the previous either through skills or gear do you start to build up your spell power. While a high spell power build is great for burst damage in PvP, for longer raid fights staying power and consistent casting are key.

    So in the end, both are perfectly viable for a pure cast build but they do change the exact layout of how you end up building your gear from a numeric perspective. I hope that helps you out and offers up some insight. And so happy casting!
    Edited by Corithna on March 31, 2014 11:58PM
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  • Invisioblack
    Invisioblack
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    Covet wrote: »
    I don't think either would be a saving grace. The racial bonuses are so small that they really wouldn't make a difference. There are also softcaps. Example. My imperial templar (what?!?! why would you make an imperial templar!?!?!) mana regen is at it's softcap. I have a ring and neck that give mana regen. But the amount it gives is over that cap. So I took a 50% hit to the mana regen on the neck.

    A 9% bonus to mana regen at this point really would be 4 1/2% Yippy! It's super easy to hit caps these racial bonuses are just 'flavor'. 3% reduced cost of spells means what, I'll be able to cast 1/2 of a spell more before I run out of mana? Think about it. Pick what race you want. These bonuses are not game changing.

    Numerically speaking - a 3% reduction in cost is effectively a 3% increase in Max Magika without the added regen to go with it (regen appears to be partially based on pool size).

    a 9% increase in regen is not much at lower levels - but at higher levels it could be significant. especially if you want to boost something else with your skill lines and still hit the cap - perhaps wearing Medium or Heavy Armor?

    Basically this means a Breton and an Altmer will have different build styles... The Altmer is more likely to not be in Light Armor...

    This gives each race a unique look and feel - since the best way to utelize each race is different. I am playing an Imperial Nightblade and I spend most of my points in Magika because there is a pssive that increases my stamina regen every time I cast a class spell which allows me to spam my bow line repeatedly. I am working on becoming a vampire to increase my Magika regen.

    It is about deciding what you want to do - and how you want to get there.
  • strelnikov
    I found that during beta, as a Breton, Restoration staff since level 1 (chosen at coldharbor), I had a pile of mana. Played in pvp and pve and at 24 never having picked up anything but a restoration staff. I had the regen and mana pool that let me heal effectively.

    The key is using all of the tools you're given. The passives for light armor, the passives for restoration, the passives for class, the passives for guild, even the world skills have passives.
  • TheVindelator
    TheVindelator
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    Does anyone know how the altmer +4% to elemental damage factors in? Is that something that softcaps affect later too? Or is that it's own stat?
  • Feidam
    Feidam
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    Does anyone know how the altmer +4% to elemental damage factors in? Is that something that softcaps affect later too? Or is that it's own stat?

    The bonus damage via passives and racials does not currently soft cap. Neither does the ability to reduce magicka/stamina cost
  • SaxonyBeach
    Even if there are soft caps you could still compare them in itemization terms. Is 3% reduced spell cost = 9% mana regen in terms of itemization? I am honestly asking because I don't know. I'm assuming you would base this off of the crafting of equivilant tier/level gear.
  • Zaldoras
    Zaldoras
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    Honestly, it's so close I won't even argue one is better than the other. I say go for whichever one is more visually pleasing to you. I did choose Breton partly because of the extra spell resistance and magicka cost reduction though, but also because I do like playing the "human" race and as said elsewhere, you can make up any shortfalls with equipment.
  • fantom
    fantom
    Numerically speaking - a 3% reduction in cost is effectively a 3% increase in Max Magika without the added regen to go with it (regen appears to be partially based on pool size).

    Lmao no it isn't. It's a *** more than 3% of one mana pool. (Hint: regen)

    That being said, enchants on jewelry are flexible enough that it doesn't matter what race you pick. Altmer will have 1 more reduced magicka cost enchant and Breton will have 1 more macigka regen enchant.

    In the end it will balance out.
  • ZurinArctus
    ZurinArctus
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    It's very easy to hit attribute caps, I wouldn't worry about those racial passives.

    Some others like status effects, or procs on the other hand, are nice!
  • adamrussell52_ESO
    adamrussell52_ESO
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    Well, theres a cap on regen but I dont think you can cap cost reduction.
  • robertbmilesb14_ESO
    Well, theres a cap on regen but I dont think you can cap cost reduction.

    And the Altmer can use jewelry to make up the 3% Bretons have or Bretons use regen magicka jewelry. *Echo what has already been said*

    Really these become more beneficial when you're not using Light Armor as a mainstay.
  • Drekor
    Drekor
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    Well, theres a cap on regen but I dont think you can cap cost reduction.

    And the Altmer can use jewelry to make up the 3% Bretons have or Bretons use regen magicka jewelry. *Echo what has already been said*

    Really these become more beneficial when you're not using Light Armor as a mainstay.
    Not true, in most cases with no regen gear you'll hit the regen soft cap greatly reducing any benefit you get from trying to add more.
  • Lenthas
    Lenthas
    The regen can be easily hit as mentioned, but cost reduction are a whole other matter, they also are limited, but are far more rare, and 3% does sounds small, but it easily and perfectly complements other reductions as well.

    No way near game changing, but just more.. useful, like racials that give more healing recieved, etc, raw stat increase (outside of health)+ regen racials help you diversify your gear, by not stacking so much of X stat and putting on health for example.
  • Criselli
    Criselli
    The cost reduction does not softcap. Stuff like regen does softcap and it used to bea 3:1 ratio once passing that softcap, but that may have changed.
    Edited by Criselli on April 25, 2014 12:19PM
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  • zgrssd
    zgrssd
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    The main difference is that Combat Regen might run into the Softcap, while Cost reduction has no such softcap (as far as we know off).
    Personally I prefer using Cost reduction and Damage/Crit Increases over Regeneraion boosts.

    If your gamestyle/equipment already runs into the Mana Regen softcap then the Altmer bonus would be slighly less helpfull then it's pure value indicates. That does not mean it is inherently less usefull then the Breton Cost recdution, just that the value is slightly less big. And it is already small compared to light armor passives.
    Edited by zgrssd on April 26, 2014 8:05AM
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  • loudent
    loudent
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    I don't know if there is a cost reduction cap of any kind. If that is true then the cost reduction is superior.
  • Crescent
    Crescent
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    Something else to consider is that if you're not using light armor, that spell resist is incredibly useful from Bretons. Caster mobs in veteran ranks hit so, so hard with spells if you don't have light armor passives, that it will really benefit plate and leather using bretons.
  • janschuetteb16_ESO
    There is no cap on cost reduction. At last no cap that can curently be reached:
    youtube.com/watch?v=pwaUsfecHEE
  • fiftypercentgrey
    fiftypercentgrey
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    the breton seems to be more versatile. the altmer +%dmg bonus on elemental dmg (except fire) is rather specific while the breton boni are always useful.

    the cheaper spells seem to be better, too. there are lots of ways to boost mana regen (items, food, mundus, lots of skills) and fewer/rarer ways to reduce spell cost. So its easier to raise mana regen than it is to raise the costreduce-stat.

    for me it was the looks :smiley: I dont like the altmer-yellow. bosmer-brown is nice, dunmer bluegrey is ok but the altmer-yellow just doesnt look right for me.
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  • The_Sadist
    The_Sadist
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    I have a Dunmer and Altmer Sorcerer, honestly the difference is barely noticeable.

    In terms of Breton v Altmer, I'd go Altmer for Sorcerer (Endless / Mage's Fury and Elemental Ring) and Breton for Templar. I'll probably make a third Breton Sorcerer for lols.. but either are good.
    Edited by The_Sadist on June 11, 2014 12:10PM
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  • Jeddahwe
    Jeddahwe
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    Wouldn't Imperial have the highest Magicka or at least the same amount as Breton/Elf? Since you would put 49 HP for Breton/Elf but only 33 for Imperial and the rest in Magicka?
  • Stannum
    Stannum
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    IMHO it depends on build. In case of light armour builds which caps mana regen reduse spell cost will be more usefull. In heavy builds may be more useful will be mana regen.
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  • milesrodneymcneely2_ESO
    milesrodneymcneely2_ESO
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    I'm running a PvP gank build with the following on my primary bar (using twin daggers): Impale, Dark Cloak, Ambush, Surprise Attack, and Swallow Soul, with Soul Assault as my ultimate. I'm in full Medium armor.

    It's designed to blow up single targets that have wandered too far from the herd. Mwuahahahaha!

    Anyway, I have a VR 6 Altmer with this build, and have been leveling a Breton (he's at 26) just to see what the difference is.

    If I were interested in eking out every scrap of statistic efficiency that I could from this build, which do you guys think would work better?

    Or should I be playing another race?

    Lore-wise I'm kind of partial to High Elves and Orcs, but I can come up with a backstory for anything.

    At VR12, which race do y'all think will make this build shine the most? Thanks in advance!

    :)
    Edited by milesrodneymcneely2_ESO on August 8, 2014 6:46PM
  • Still_Mind
    Still_Mind
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    Covet wrote: »
    I don't think either would be a saving grace. The racial bonuses are so small that they really wouldn't make a difference. There are also softcaps. Example. My imperial templar (what?!?! why would you make an imperial templar!?!?!) mana regen is at it's softcap. I have a ring and neck that give mana regen. But the amount it gives is over that cap. So I took a 50% hit to the mana regen on the neck.

    A 9% bonus to mana regen at this point really would be 4 1/2% Yippy! It's super easy to hit caps these racial bonuses are just 'flavor'. 3% reduced cost of spells means what, I'll be able to cast 1/2 of a spell more before I run out of mana? Think about it. Pick what race you want. These bonuses are not game changing.

    Off-topic, but Red Diamond+Sweep=cheeseloads of healing :)

    On-topic, like others have mentioned, 3% cost reduction isn't subject to caps, and therefore, better in the long run. But, if you're an offensive, Elemental damage-heavy caster, Altmer do have an advantage in this department.
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  • poltida
    poltida
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    Caps are going to be history soon, i eould consider the spell resist before the magika cost on the breton. I had in mind that the Altmer would be more offensife and breton more defensive mage builds , both both can do just fine on the other roles as well
  • Father
    Father
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    For Role Play I would take Breton so I can make it as short as possible.

    If you want the best overall dmg with magicka builds I would pick Altmer for the elemental synergy specialy with crushing shock.
    Even for Role Play I picked my Altmer sorc and named it "Fist of Thalmor", made it wear dark blue / gold light armor, really looks cool :smile:
  • eliisra
    eliisra
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    It's very easy to soft cap magicka recovery. You get it from a multitude of armor sets, enchants and passively from slotting certain skills. This while cost reduction has no cap and is harder to obtain since it only comes from jewellery enchant + 5 piece bonuses.

    If you want slightly better sustained and prefer class skills or maybe healing, Breton is nice. Altmer on the other hand is better for elemental based dps and Destruction Staff. Dunmer has more edge in PvP, since extra stamina + fire resist is highly useful for a caster in Cyrodiil.

    But all these races have great magicka passive bonuses, so it doesn't matter that awfully much if you go Dunmer, Altmer or Breton for a caster build.

    You will only notice an actual difference if you pick a race with passives mainly boosting stamina attributes, for example Bosmer - than go for a caster build. Will take more effort to soft cap your magicka pool and also find spare points for nice health, if you pick a race with wrong attribute bonuses.
  • Father
    Father
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    Who told you that Cost reduction has no cap?? it has softcap of 30 cost reduction. you can test it yourself while using 3 cost reduction jewelry :<
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