Will Imperial City and full Justice be included in Tamriel Unlimited?

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · January 2015

Slurg wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Slurg wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Ommamar wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

Slurg wrote: »

Sounds like the answer is, this will be the first DLC package.

Id be shocked if the imperial city is in the first DLC. Since all development seems to have been put on hold to code the whole cash shop thing we probably will be looking at Christmas 2015 before the Imperial city comes out.

So this huge update they are putting on PTS next week isn't development?

This "huge" update has no new zones. No new pvp areas. Nothing but a system noone asked for and noone wanted. Also 1.6 has been done for some time they just waited till the f2p announcement. We could have had this back in November but they lied to us for months.

I would bet that they've also had developers working on Imperial City and other new zones in the background while they worked out the details of B2P so they will be ready to start cranking out new areas as DLC on a regular schedule after the game goes B2P.

Id bet you believe in the eastern bunny and santa too. They havent been working on any pvp zones. I bet you all the gold i have you dont see the imperial city until december or maybe next year.

Who said anything about PVP zones? We know of plans for Imperial City and new PVE zones at this point. Unless you have some extra special insider info to share.

Once they start getting cash for DLCs from those console players, we'll be seeing new content regularly. ZOS likes making money.

You can send your gold to me but I've already got way more than I can spend since all the new stuff is going to the cash shop.

The imperial city is a pvp zone...

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · January 2015

Spartacus_Mills wrote: »

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO wrote: »

This "huge" update has no new zones. No new pvp areas. Nothing but a system noone asked for and noone wanted. Also 1.6 has been done for some time they just waited till the f2p announcement. We could have had this back in November but they lied to us for months.

You sure about that? As far as I can tell, it was only implemented because of player feedback about the Veteran System being the worst thing in the history of gaming ever. Not that I mind either way as it happens, but VR outrage seemed to be pretty huge to me, and Champions' System approval has been much higher, based on how we think it'll work anyway.

I never talked to a single person in the game who cared. Everyone liked vet ranks. We dont want WoW skill trees this game was supposed to be different. Whats next? An auction house?

jamesharv2005ub17_ESO · January 2015

You guys simply havent been through this before. LOTRO did the same thing. Promised more frequent updates etc. Fact is not only did they not put out any updates for almost 6 months after the switch but they went from around 300,000 players to under 100k players within a year.

Content is going to come slower. Those videos you saw mean nothing. They have been showing those since before the game came out. Those areas have been put on hold to program the b2p switch. Why do you think 1.6 has been delayed for months? Once they put this new system in it will be so fubar they will spend the next 6 months trying to fix it. THEN they will add new zones.

Stonesthrow · January 2015

fromtesonlineb16_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

We'll get into all the details about DLC in the future when we're ready to fully discuss it.

Translation: of course they'll be DLC so we can maximise profits by selling to players that which previously we implicitly stated would be free.

Free?

Oh, you mean free with the sub we were paying?

Gotcha.

Ommamar · January 2015

So I guess you haven't played the past TES games as the constellation system is very much a part of character builds. They just adapted it to fit this representation it has nothing to do with WoW.

Oh and to answer the question in the title: No it won't be TU will be sold with content up to 1.6. I suspect there will be patches that will immediately need to be downloaded.

EJRose83 · January 2015

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Tamriel Unlimited is going to include all content from Updates 1-6, which includes the Champion System and the PvE component of the Justice System. We're not quite ready to discuss the exact details of what future DLC will contain, but Tamriel Unlimited will be everything up to Update 6.

Ugh, it sounds like you guys are going to pitch Justice PvP as DLC. I would strongly advise against that! It just reeks of something SWTOR would do. Justice PVP should be included for free as a part of the update six package, despite not being included in that particular update. It's an integral part of the Justice System and shouldn't be pay gated in my opinion.

Charge players for substantial DLC packages, not an extension of what will otherwise be a free system. Please, please, please don't nickel and dime us for stupid stuff like this.

Psychobunni · January 2015

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Tamriel Unlimited is going to include all content from Updates 1-6, which includes the Champion System and the PvE component of the Justice System. We're not quite ready to discuss the exact details of what future DLC will contain, but Tamriel Unlimited will be everything up to Update 6.

You know, I truly wanted some Mod showing (mostly to clean out multiple same topic threads) but this answer leads me to believe that receiving new content without "extra" cost will not be a subscriber bonus after initial launch of TU. Which will make subs pointless to all but eye candy shoppers and simply won't maintain the game in a state that keeps fresh content and players coming. More depressing than if it were ignored.

fromtesonlineb16_ESO · January 2015

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

We're not quite ready to discuss the exact details of what future DLC will contain

Translation: we know our plans are going to *** off a large number of those who believed the content was part of the game they'd already paid for so we're not talking about it until the dust settles from the bombshell we just dropped.

Perphection · January 2015

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

We'll get into all the details about DLC in the future when we're ready to fully discuss it.

You can't be serious with this... Are you really going to make Imperial City DLC? The lack of improvement to PvP, and countless failed patches are what caused so many of the games players to leave in the first place.

How can you expect players to return to the game, THEN purchase a DLC for content that should have been in the game from the start and expect them to trust that you didn't create another "lighting patch". Remember, you're trying to get players to come back to the game, not draw them in realize they have to pay for something they want to try and then have them dismiss the game all over again.

TL;DR - ZOS has a terrible track record with patching, if they expect players to come back and pay for Imperial city, and trust them.. they're out of their mind.

LonePirate · January 2015

ZOS refuses to talk about PTS content they are turning over within the next week and people here expect them to discuss DLC content which may be months away from release?

We're as dumb as they are unresponsive!

Rammi · January 2015

Perphection wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

We'll get into all the details about DLC in the future when we're ready to fully discuss it.

You can't be serious with this... Are you really going to make Imperial City DLC? The lack of improvement to PvP, and countless failed patches are what caused so many of the games players to leave in the first place.

How can you expect players to return to the game, THEN purchase a DLC for content that should have been in the game from the start and expect them to trust that you didn't create another "lighting patch". Remember, you're trying to get players to come back to the game, not draw them in realize they have to pay for something they want to try and then have them dismiss the game all over again.

TL;DR - ZOS has a terrible track record with patching, if they expect players to come back and pay for Imperial city, and trust them.. they're out of their mind.

Sorry what are you complaining about?

If you pay for the sub like you would have had to without the new model you get access to Imperial City!!!

Seriously people stop being so emotional!!

Vikestart · January 2015

fromtesonlineb16_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

We'll get into all the details about DLC in the future when we're ready to fully discuss it.

Translation: of course they'll be DLC so we can maximise profits by selling to players that which previously we implicitly stated would be free.

Uhhhh, it was never going to be free.

Had the game stayed Pay-to-Play, you would have had to pay 15 USD every month to access it.

It won't be any different now, you'll just have a second option. You can either continue to pay the subscription to get universal DLC access, which is basically the same thing as before, or you can buy the DLC separately.

There's really no difference in the amount of money you have to pay.

AaronMB · January 2015

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

We'll get into all the details about DLC in the future when we're ready to fully discuss it.

Mind blown.

/facepalm

Curragraigue · January 2015

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Tamriel Unlimited is going to include all content from Updates 1-6, which includes the Champion System and the PvE component of the Justice System. We're not quite ready to discuss the exact details of what future DLC will contain, but Tamriel Unlimited will be everything up to Update 6.

Does that mean you will be changing over from VR in update 6 now or that you will be releasing Tamriel Unlimited with VR and then patching it later? Seems a bit strange to not include 7 with the final change to the complete Champion System. Can you please clarify @ZOS_GinaBruno‌

Rhakon · January 2015

PvP players supported the game since the the start in april last year!
Pvp players did not get one single update, you cant even buy rank 14 pvp-bags...

PvP players want to use the new payment system with dlc and would have to pay twice for long promised content.

IC should be included for every player who had a sub before the B2P system!

greedy or fair ?

ZOS will decide, i hope with fairness and right.

Enodoc · January 2015

Spartacus_Mills wrote: »

For instance, what happens if your alliance wins access to Imperial City but only 10% of your alliance has the DLC? Or will there be separate campaigns for those with Imperial City DLC and those without it? I hope not, as I doubt many people with the DLC will join the non-DLC servers, and currently it's the one place where anyone can actually meet up with anyone else.

This is the reason I think it would be very hard to make Imperial City a paid DLC. They said already that once you have purchased DLC content like Wrothgar, you can go there straight away and it will scale to your level. Neither of those things will work for IC. You can't go there straight away if your alliance doesn't own their home keeps. Conversely, as you said, say only 10% of people have the DLC - then only 10% of the people that worked towards getting IC access can get in; the other 90% are left twiddling their thumbs as they can't get into what they just unlocked.

TL;DR: Imperial City would just not work as DLC, IMO.

Similarly, Justice PvP should not be paid DLC, as it's a part of the Justice System and the Justice System is part of the Tamriel Unlimited base game. The only reason the PvP part isn't in yet is because they shifted the PvE part forwards.

Bouvin · January 2015

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Tamriel Unlimited is going to include all content from Updates 1-6, which includes the Champion System and the PvE component of the Justice System. We're not quite ready to discuss the exact details of what future DLC will contain, but Tamriel Unlimited will be everything up to Update 6.

So basically, we are going to give people part of the system we have been hyping for months, then make them buy the other half.

Since the Justice System is an open world system, wouldn't you agree the whole Justice system should be included with the core game?

I can understand making people buy zones, as that fits the DLC model. But buying "mechanics"? That's a little ridiculous.

BoloBoffin · January 2015

Enodoc wrote: »

Spartacus_Mills wrote: »

For instance, what happens if your alliance wins access to Imperial City but only 10% of your alliance has the DLC? Or will there be separate campaigns for those with Imperial City DLC and those without it? I hope not, as I doubt many people with the DLC will join the non-DLC servers, and currently it's the one place where anyone can actually meet up with anyone else.

This is the reason I think it would be very hard to make Imperial City a paid DLC. They said already that once you have purchased DLC content like Wrothgar, you can go there straight away and it will scale to your level. Neither of those things will work for IC. You can't go there straight away if your alliance doesn't own their home keeps. Conversely, as you said, say only 10% of people have the DLC - then only 10% of the people that worked towards getting IC access can get in; the other 90% are left twiddling their thumbs as they can't get into what they just unlocked.

TL;DR: Imperial City would just not work as DLC, IMO.

Similarly, Justice PvP should not be paid DLC, as it's a part of the Justice System and the Justice System is part of the Tamriel Unlimited base game. The only reason the PvP part isn't in yet is because they shifted the PvE part forwards.

This is the kind of thinking I was hoping to see in this thread.

I don't think it's too much to ask what TU will consist of exactly. It's going to be here in less than two months. I understand it's a very volatile time right now. But less information to my mind makes it more so. I recognize that employees can only say what they've been given permission to say, however. I hope Gina and the others aren't taking the angst home.

I respectfully disagree that IC wouldn't work as DLC. Free players still will have plenty to do in Cyrodiil, and the impact of ESO+/DLC purchasers heading into the city once it becomes available would be a powerful incentive for free players to buy the content or subscribe. There will be some uneasy times within alliances when free players won't want to go for that last home keep because the paying players will disappear (though you get the buff, so it would be cutting off your nose to spite your face). But those things will work themselves out.

For people upset about having to pay for this content, I have to wonder what game you've been playing all this time. Every bit of content right now is behind a pay wall. Every pixel of content right now, we have to maintain a subscription to access. What changes after TU is that people get to access a whole lot of content for less money with the option to access more by paying more, either through subscription or outright purchase. That changes my experience as a subscriber how exactly?

Hmm, thinking out loud: maybe IC is included in TU, but free TU players have to use the campable sewer entrances while subs and owners get to use freshly repaired and gated bridges? And guilds would be the way to encourage alliance cooperation - the sub and owner members would go clear out the camps for their free TU guildmates. OK, speculation over.

Tankqull · January 2015

Bouvin wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Tamriel Unlimited is going to include all content from Updates 1-6, which includes the Champion System and the PvE component of the Justice System. We're not quite ready to discuss the exact details of what future DLC will contain, but Tamriel Unlimited will be everything up to Update 6.

So basically, we are going to give people part of the system we have been hyping for months, then make them buy the other half.

Since the Justice System is an open world system, wouldn't you agree the whole Justice system should be included with the core game?

I can understand making people buy zones, as that fits the DLC model. But buying "mechanics"? That's a little ridiculous.

just from the PR fiasko that would arise by selling a game on colsole for full price values and additionally implementing several mandatory DLCs on top of that i highly doubt that we will see any DLCs this year until autumn/winter. as they cant have their revenues killed by bad console sales thx to horrible pre/re-views with this issue as a prime reason for the bad PR.
on the other hand they cant set the PC version on a complete halt for 7-8 months aswell.

BoloBoffin · January 2015

Bouvin wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Tamriel Unlimited is going to include all content from Updates 1-6, which includes the Champion System and the PvE component of the Justice System. We're not quite ready to discuss the exact details of what future DLC will contain, but Tamriel Unlimited will be everything up to Update 6.

So basically, we are going to give people part of the system we have been hyping for months, then make them buy the other half.

Since the Justice System is an open world system, wouldn't you agree the whole Justice system should be included with the core game?

I can understand making people buy zones, as that fits the DLC model. But buying "mechanics"? That's a little ridiculous.

I have to buy the new content now! It's called a subscription. If I don't pay the subscription, I lose access to everything now. On March 17, people who buy the box get access to the TU content permanently. I get access to TU content permanently.

There are parts of the Justice system that are beyond mechanics: the Enforcer headquarters where you redeem your quests, specifically. Do you think the hinted-at Dark Brotherhood won't be open world as well? That won't be TU content.

Bloodfang · January 2015

Just to clear some things out:

- This is not a F2P Model
- This is also not a 100% B2P Model, More of a hybrid between P2P/B2P
- If you paid Sub before, why stop now? It won't change anything.

- Justice System PvP part -> WILL be DLC
- Imperial City -> WILL be DLC
- Champion System phase 4 -> WON'T be DLC

Why the need to feel so entitled? If you are paying a sub, continue to do so.
You will be getting every DLC for "Free". Just like you were getting all the Updates for "Free".

You people need to change your mindset, this game isn't aiming at 100% B2P Model. If you want future content be prepared for the P2P Model. Just like you were doing so far. More people pay for the sub, more updates we'll get -> + that puts less focus on the cash shop.

BoloBoffin · January 2015

Thanks, @Bloodfang. I think Gina's statement about not talking future DLC was more directed at my Dark Brotherhood and Blades speculation.

NotSo · January 2015

Sorry, I read "Will the Imperial city be full of Justice?" and I said yes.

Bloodfang · January 2015

@BoloBoffin‌,

It's pretty obvious. Most of the things after Update 6 will be DLCs.
Champion System won't be, because it's a change to the progression system anyway -> therefore Improvement / fix.

Also things like Provisioning Revamp, if that was added to the game after 1.6, it wouldn't be a DLC either -> Word Revamp says much.

About Thieves and Dark Brotherhood Guild though, expect them being a DLC. There isn't a reason why they shouldn't be. ZOS needs as many reasons as they can get to throw at us, so we can keep subbed.

Korah_Eaglecry · January 2015

Rook_Master wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

Tamriel Unlimited is going to include all content from Updates 1-6, which includes the Champion System and the PvE component of the Justice System. We're not quite ready to discuss the exact details of what future DLC will contain, but Tamriel Unlimited will be everything up to Update 6.

Could you please confirm that Enforcer tabards will not be sold in the Crown Store?

Also, I feel like Imperial City was promised to subscribers a long time ago, can you confirm if that will be considered future DLC in the cash shop?

Im pretty sure anything else after 1.6 will be DLC.

Aevric · January 2015

jasonquigley646_ESO wrote: »

fromtesonlineb16_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

We'll get into all the details about DLC in the future when we're ready to fully discuss it.

Translation: of course they'll be DLC so we can maximise profits by selling to players that which previously we implicitly stated would be free.

And it won't matter if there is DLC if you are a subscriber, any content that releases during your subscription time is yours for the keeping. So get off the "Corporate Greed" bandwagon. You're not entitled to everything just because you think you are...especially if you're not paying for it.

If you don't pay for a subscription but choose to buy the DLC content as it's released, that content is yours. Forever. Well, at least until the game dies and the servers go away.
If you are a subscriber and someday in the future wish (be it months or years down the road) to cancel your subscription but continue to play ... you'll have NONE of the DLC zones/dungeons/etc. You'll have to buy all of it if you want to access it, even though you've been paying for your subscription all of that time.
Sounds like corporate greed to me.

Bloodfang · January 2015

Aevric wrote: »

jasonquigley646_ESO wrote: »

fromtesonlineb16_ESO wrote: »

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

We'll get into all the details about DLC in the future when we're ready to fully discuss it.

Translation: of course they'll be DLC so we can maximise profits by selling to players that which previously we implicitly stated would be free.

And it won't matter if there is DLC if you are a subscriber, any content that releases during your subscription time is yours for the keeping. So get off the "Corporate Greed" bandwagon. You're not entitled to everything just because you think you are...especially if you're not paying for it.

If you don't pay for a subscription but choose to buy the DLC content as it's released, that content is yours. Forever. Well, at least until the game dies and the servers go away.
If you are a subscriber and someday in the future wish (be it months or years down the road) to cancel your subscription but continue to play ... you'll have NONE of the DLC zones/dungeons/etc. You'll have to buy all of it if you want to access it, even though you've been paying for your subscription all of that time.
Sounds like corporate greed to me.

He is right though. Even if you are renting something for 13€ per month, you will still pay less than a guy who will be paying ~20-30€ per DLC monthly.

Also don't forget you are getting 1500 crowns per month as well, which means you will be eventually buying all the DLC packs for Free anyway (if you wish to do so).

Cody · January 2015

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

We'll get into all the details about DLC in the future when we're ready to fully discuss it.

so........ 2050?

Lionxoft · January 2015

ZOS_GinaBruno wrote: »

We'll get into all the details about DLC in the future when we're ready to fully discuss it.

Zenimax Online Studios has known about the plan since launch. Please don't blow smoke in our faces.

Rydik · January 2015

Interesting, they say if you buy "new location", you can go there and it will scale to your level, so people with different levels will go to different "new locations" with different levels scaling??? Hm, seems not good solution...