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ESO+ 10% XP gain does not equal "pay to win"
KhajiitiLizard
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You level faster? Big deal, if you are a trash player you will still be trash no matter how fast you leveled. If ESO+ would give you buffs that effect gameplay like +10% to health or spell damage, etc. That would be pay to win. You could say that +10% XP would let you earn CP faster which you could use on buffs, but this XP gain will not magically make someone a better player.
I still have hope for this game and will continue to play.
Edited by KhajiitiLizard on January 22, 2015 2:03AM I still have hope for this game and will continue to play.
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rylixav✭✭✭So +10% XP isn't pay to win but, +10% health or damage would be? What?
You can make the exact same argument to defend +10% health or damage. "Well, good players will still beat bad players, so paying for extra damage isn't really pay to win." And that's why every single MMO that starts down the F2P road ends up selling pay to win eventually.Edited by rylixav on January 22, 2015 2:05AM10 -
Iago✭✭✭✭✭KhajiitiLizard wrote: »You level faster? Big deal, if you are a trash player you will still be trash no matter how fast you leveled. If ESO+ would give you buffs that effect gameplay like +10% to health or spell damage, etc. That would be pay to win. You could say that +10% XP would let you earn CP faster which you could use on buffs, but this XP gain will not magically make someone a better player.
I still have hope for this game and will continue to play.
It sure sounds like P2W to me, you pay you get better stuff, hence P2W and I give it 6 months to a year and tha cash shop will follow suitThat which we obtain to cheap we esteem to lightly, it is dearness only that gives everything its value.
-Thomas Pain2 -
Brittany_Joy✭✭✭✭10% exp boost is not P2W in MOBAs but in MMOs they can be. For example exp boosts are P2W if there is an achievement for world's first level X! (X=whatever)2 -
Freyar✭✭You're paying to progress at a faster rate than normal. You're paying for an advantage.
Not only that, but the design suggests that their leveling curve is messed up.6 -
ToRelax✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭The only problem I have with the exp boost is that you will get more champion points with it (unless they change that or didn't deem it necessary to tell us you actually don't get CP for the boost exp).
That does not make the game P2W, but it goes in the wrong direction already.DAGON - ALTADOON - CHIM - GHARTOK
The Covenant is broken. The Enemy has won...
Elo'dryel - Sorc - AR 50 - Hopesfire - EP EU2 -
Ohioastro✭✭✭✭If the cash shop doesn't produce enough income then you start finding more things in it.
Right now the subscription fee doesn't seem remotely worth it unless there is something that a player would actually need in the cash shop. e.g. you get 1500 "crowns" for 15 bucks a month. Either ZOS are fools or there is more to the cash shop than silly hats.1 -
KhajiitiLizard✭✭✭✭✭So +10% XP isn't pay to win but, +10% health or damage would be? What?
You can make the exact same argument to defend +10% health or damage. "Well, good players will still beat bad players, so paying for extra damage isn't really pay to win."
Think about it. This would not have much effect on PVP at all. All it really does is get you through PVE zones faster. Say you get 200xp from killing a mob. The XP bouns would give you 220xp. Really not that large.
To grind the 1,000,000 XP that vet ranks currently have you'd have to kill 5000 mobs to level up at 200xp per mob. At 220xp per mob you would still need to kill 4545 mobs.
Edited by KhajiitiLizard on January 22, 2015 2:12AM2 -
rylixav✭✭✭KhajiitiLizard wrote: »Think about it. This would not have much effect on PVP at all. All it really does is get you through PVE zones faster.
More experience grants more champion points which improve your stats, and those better stats give you an advantage in PVP.Edited by rylixav on January 22, 2015 2:16AM6 -
KhajiitiLizard✭✭✭✭✭Even if you could consistently grind a boss for like 10k xp each, you would need to kill it 100 times. At the 10% bonus you would need to kill it 90 times. So you may get to max level a day earlier than if you did not have ESO+. Hardly call that a huge advantage.1
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KhajiitiLizard✭✭✭✭✭KhajiitiLizard wrote: »Think about it. This would not have much effect on PVP at all. All it really does is get you through PVE zones faster.
More experience grants more champion points which improve your stats, and those better stats give you an advantage in PVP.
And most PVPers are max level anyway, so what?2 -
LonePirate✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭KhajiitiLizard wrote: »Think about it. This would not have much effect on PVP at all. All it really does is get you through PVE zones faster.
More experience grants more champion points which improve your stats, and those better stats give you an advantage in PVP.
Exactly! A faster rate of XP translates to a faster rate of CP which is definitely a P2Win situation in Cyrodiil.3 -
ToRelax✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭KhajiitiLizard wrote: »KhajiitiLizard wrote: »Think about it. This would not have much effect on PVP at all. All it really does is get you through PVE zones faster.
More experience grants more champion points which improve your stats, and those better stats give you an advantage in PVP.
And most PVPers are max level anyway, so what?
And what does that have to do with CP
? DAGON - ALTADOON - CHIM - GHARTOK
The Covenant is broken. The Enemy has won...
Elo'dryel - Sorc - AR 50 - Hopesfire - EP EU2 -
Xsorus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Anyone who thinks 10% xp bonus is Pay to Win is an idiot and shouldn't be taken seriously in the first place.
You guys have zero freakin understanding on what pay to win actually means...https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXpX7JMwRXtczc5GTrIYRIw
ESO and GW2 PvP videos8 -
NotSo✭✭✭✭Ok but hitting level 50 when my buddy is still level 45 is whatever. But throw in rings of mara and now I could be 10 levels ahead. (Still got my rings btw). Getting to level 50 faster is not what I would call winning, but it could definitely allow more time for other things.Edited by NotSo on January 22, 2015 2:22AMGar'Sol the Wanderer VR14 Khajiit Sorcerer Spellblade0 -
DDuke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭KhajiitiLizard wrote: »KhajiitiLizard wrote: »Think about it. This would not have much effect on PVP at all. All it really does is get you through PVE zones faster.
More experience grants more champion points which improve your stats, and those better stats give you an advantage in PVP.
And most PVPers are max level anyway, so what?
Oh my, you're a simple one
More Champion Points=Stronger Character
More XP for $$$->More Champion Points for $$$=P2W (the worst kind in fact)
Champion System is designed so that players cannot simply "max. it out" (it'd take approximately 2000 hours if I remember correctly).
I doubt you'll ever see a person who has maxed it out entirely, if they keep adding to it.4 -
OrphanHelgen✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭I am not in mood to read negative comments, so I just assume everyone are against you. But I agree with you 100%.PC, EU server, Ebonheart Pact
Finally a reason not to play League of Legends1 -
Iago✭✭✭✭✭KhajiitiLizard wrote: »KhajiitiLizard wrote: »Think about it. This would not have much effect on PVP at all. All it really does is get you through PVE zones faster.
More experience grants more champion points which improve your stats, and those better stats give you an advantage in PVP.
And most PVPers are max level anyway, so what?
Oh my, you're a simple one
More Champion Points=Stronger Character
More XP for $$$->More Champion Points for $$$=P2W (the worst kind in fact)
Champion System is designed so that players cannot simply "max. it out" (it'd take approximately 2000 hours if I remember correctly).
I doubt you'll ever see a person who has maxed it out entirely, if they keep adding to it.
Wait until they start selling CP in the cash shop, I bet it happens within a yearThat which we obtain to cheap we esteem to lightly, it is dearness only that gives everything its value.
-Thomas Pain1 -
KhajiitiLizard✭✭✭✭✭KhajiitiLizard wrote: »KhajiitiLizard wrote: »Think about it. This would not have much effect on PVP at all. All it really does is get you through PVE zones faster.
More experience grants more champion points which improve your stats, and those better stats give you an advantage in PVP.
And most PVPers are max level anyway, so what?
Oh my, you're a simple one
More Champion Points=Stronger Character
More XP for $$$->More Champion Points for $$$=P2W (the worst kind in fact)
Champion System is designed so that players cannot simply "max. it out" (it'd take approximately 2000 hours if I remember correctly).
I doubt you'll ever see a person who has maxed it out entirely, if they keep adding to it.
So you get that CP a day earlier. Not a huge advantage.2 -
rylixav✭✭✭KhajiitiLizard wrote: »And most PVPers are max level anyway, so what?
You really should try to avoid responding to posts, if you don't understand them.1 -
DDuke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭KhajiitiLizard wrote: »KhajiitiLizard wrote: »KhajiitiLizard wrote: »Think about it. This would not have much effect on PVP at all. All it really does is get you through PVE zones faster.
More experience grants more champion points which improve your stats, and those better stats give you an advantage in PVP.
And most PVPers are max level anyway, so what?
Oh my, you're a simple one
More Champion Points=Stronger Character
More XP for $$$->More Champion Points for $$$=P2W (the worst kind in fact)
Champion System is designed so that players cannot simply "max. it out" (it'd take approximately 2000 hours if I remember correctly).
I doubt you'll ever see a person who has maxed it out entirely, if they keep adding to it.
So you get that CP a day earlier. Not a huge advantage.
And how much is that after a week, or a year? I'll tell you: exactly 10% more than your opponents if you both play equal amounts of time with equal efficiency.
P2W.
Sigh... people these days.Edited by DDuke on January 22, 2015 2:31AM1 -
Djem✭✭✭Let's see here...
10% bonus to experience point gain (Okay, this is not pay to win)
10% bonus to crafting research
10% bonus to crafting inspiration gain
10% bonus to gold acquisitionGlarthir is crazy. Maybe harmless crazy, maybe not.
Dunmer Nightblade, Ebonheart Pact, EU PC Megaserver.1 -
DDuke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭KhajiitiLizard wrote: »KhajiitiLizard wrote: »Think about it. This would not have much effect on PVP at all. All it really does is get you through PVE zones faster.
More experience grants more champion points which improve your stats, and those better stats give you an advantage in PVP.
And most PVPers are max level anyway, so what?
Oh my, you're a simple one
More Champion Points=Stronger Character
More XP for $$$->More Champion Points for $$$=P2W (the worst kind in fact)
Champion System is designed so that players cannot simply "max. it out" (it'd take approximately 2000 hours if I remember correctly).
I doubt you'll ever see a person who has maxed it out entirely, if they keep adding to it.
Wait until they start selling CP in the cash shop, I bet it happens within a year
Things we'll see there at some point:- Undaunted Keys
- AP Boosters, XP Boosters, Crafting Boosters
- Inventory Slot Upgrades, Bank Slot Upgrades
- Gear Boxes
- Forward Camps
Calling it now. Please open this thread again in 2 years time.2 -
Iago✭✭✭✭✭Let's see here...
10% bonus to experience point gain (Okay, this is not pay to win)
10% bonus to crafting research
10% bonus to crafting inspiration gain
10% bonus to gold acquisition
Sounds like Pay to WinThat which we obtain to cheap we esteem to lightly, it is dearness only that gives everything its value.
-Thomas Pain0 -
Xsorus✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭KhajiitiLizard wrote: »KhajiitiLizard wrote: »KhajiitiLizard wrote: »Think about it. This would not have much effect on PVP at all. All it really does is get you through PVE zones faster.
More experience grants more champion points which improve your stats, and those better stats give you an advantage in PVP.
And most PVPers are max level anyway, so what?
Oh my, you're a simple one
More Champion Points=Stronger Character
More XP for $$$->More Champion Points for $$$=P2W (the worst kind in fact)
Champion System is designed so that players cannot simply "max. it out" (it'd take approximately 2000 hours if I remember correctly).
I doubt you'll ever see a person who has maxed it out entirely, if they keep adding to it.
So you get that CP a day earlier. Not a huge advantage.
And how much is that after a week, or a year? Are you familiar with the concept of compound interest?
Sigh... people these days.
If you both play the same amount, and do virtually the same thing, killing the exact same mobs ect ect or whatever....then its 10%..and will always be 10% till the end of time.
But since that's not possible...And someone who's not paying a subscription fee could play slightly more then someone paying for the game they could easily catch up.
Meaning its not Pay to Win....
You want to see Pay to Win, I invite you to head on over to this game called Allods Online..
https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCXpX7JMwRXtczc5GTrIYRIw
ESO and GW2 PvP videos1 -
ToRelax✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Let's see here...
10% bonus to experience point gain (Okay, this is not pay to win)
10% bonus to crafting research
10% bonus to crafting inspiration gain
10% bonus to gold acquisition
Ehh, srsly, I couldn't care less about research time or inspiration gain.
Gold is always nice to have but I am one poor PvPer anyway and still can may out all my stats.
For exp that does not work, it's a minimal difference but it is one and that is bad.DAGON - ALTADOON - CHIM - GHARTOK
The Covenant is broken. The Enemy has won...
Elo'dryel - Sorc - AR 50 - Hopesfire - EP EU0 -
Vikestart✭✭✭This doesn't worry me:
10% bonus to experience point gain
But this does:
10% bonus to gold acquisition0 -
Valen_Byte✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭KhajiitiLizard wrote: »Think about it. This would not have much effect on PVP at all. All it really does is get you through PVE zones faster.
More experience grants more champion points which improve your stats, and those better stats give you an advantage in PVP.
^^^ nailed it
***Dixon Kay MagDK FORMER EMPEROR***Deca Dix MagDK FORMER EMPORER***Valonious MagPlar FORMER EMPEROR***
GM of BYTE
MAY YOUR DEATHS BE SWIFT, AND YOUR LOAD SCREENS LONG.
And alien tears will fill for him, Pity’s long-broken urn, For his mourners will be outcast men, And outcasts always mourn1 -
DDuke✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »KhajiitiLizard wrote: »KhajiitiLizard wrote: »KhajiitiLizard wrote: »Think about it. This would not have much effect on PVP at all. All it really does is get you through PVE zones faster.
More experience grants more champion points which improve your stats, and those better stats give you an advantage in PVP.
And most PVPers are max level anyway, so what?
Oh my, you're a simple one
More Champion Points=Stronger Character
More XP for $$$->More Champion Points for $$$=P2W (the worst kind in fact)
Champion System is designed so that players cannot simply "max. it out" (it'd take approximately 2000 hours if I remember correctly).
I doubt you'll ever see a person who has maxed it out entirely, if they keep adding to it.
So you get that CP a day earlier. Not a huge advantage.
And how much is that after a week, or a year? Are you familiar with the concept of compound interest?
Sigh... people these days.
If you both play the same amount, and do virtually the same thing, killing the exact same mobs ect ect or whatever....then its 10%..and will always be 10% till the end of time.
But since that's not possible...And someone who's not paying a subscription fee could play slightly more then someone paying for the game they could easily catch up.
Meaning its not Pay to Win....
You want to see Pay to Win, I invite you to head on over to this game called Allods Online..
Yeah, you caught me before I edited my post :P
I blame tiredness... still, having someone with 10% more Champion Points than someone playing equal amounts of time with equal efficiency is wrong.
It's an advantage granted to the player with $$$, not the player with skill or dedication.1 -
Iago✭✭✭✭✭KhajiitiLizard wrote: »
No but it does give the Person paying an advantage over the B2P that does not take the Membership. This gives them an advantage period,meaning that advantage will carry on to all aspects of the game including PvP.
Hence Pay to WinThat which we obtain to cheap we esteem to lightly, it is dearness only that gives everything its value.
-Thomas Pain3