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How to stop dying in PvP?

Kumagoro
Kumagoro
Soul Shriven
Ok so I have been playing ESO for a week or 2, got to lvl 29 and started to spend a lot of time in Cyrodiil non-vet campaign. After some practice I found myself pretty effective at siege, counter-siege and party vs party.

The problem is that as soon as I get in face-to-face combat I turn into a mudcrab. Not the Cyrodiil vet rank 5 mudcrab, but rather Khenarthi's Roost oneshot critter.

I could suggest that I am playing a weak class, but I often get pwned with exactly same skills which don't do any actual damage when I am using them myself (eg. Snipe).
I could think that I am too lowlvl but again I am 29 and I still get killed by lvls 20-25 a lot.
And the most annoying thing is that my disables, like snares, disorientation or knockback just do not work most of the time. And when someone decides to kill me I do not get out of stun till my hp runs out.

Because of all that I can't stop having a feeling that there is something very important about ESO PvP mechanics that I am not aware of (and 100% of my enemies are). I am eager to learn, so could some expirienced players please enlighten me on that matter? Links to any usefull guides are much appreciated too (google didn't yield any for me).

P.S. In case that matters, I'm khajiit nightblade archer, so my main skill lines are bow+medium armor. Also I use Path of darkness from Shadow skill line to chase/escape, Cripple from Syphon for ganks and Consuming Darkness as an ultimate. The other 3 slots are usually occupied with Venom Arrow, Draining Shot and Snipe.
  • Lukeh Shadyvale
    Lukeh Shadyvale
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    Archers should not be in 1v1's really you guys should be on the side lines offering support.
    Unless your ganking then you can sneak, wait and blast them down. Increase your max stamina and weapon power to increase the damage output from the stamina skills that comes out of your bow.
    Lukeh Shadyvale | V14 Bosmer Templar | Ebonheart Pact | EU Nowhere
    Cyrodiil is only good for fishing.
  • Cody
    Cody
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    If you are an archer and want to also be able to 1v1/join in the battles head on, make your secondary weapon a melee weapon. I for example use DW axes when people get close, and I do rather well(and this is against enemies from level 10 all the way to VR14)

    Many players also use perma block builds. These types of players make heavy use of the block and cast mechanic, giving them both high offense and high defense. Your disorients, stuns, and whatever else, may not be working due to perma block builds, as blocking keeps you from getting stunned. Now, with the snares, idk why your snares would not be working. I seem to recall being snared whether I am blocking or not.

    What is your build exactly? what class? I may be able to help, as I have extensive experience as an archer in ESO(played one since beta)
    Edited by Cody on January 11, 2015 12:37AM
  • Kumagoro
    Kumagoro
    Soul Shriven
    Thank for replies guys!
    @Lukeh
    Hmm I am used to more soloish and less supportish archers in other rpgs and mmos I played. I still have a hope that ESO char build system may let me find something more survivable than what I have at the moment.

    @Cody
    1) Does 'perma block' mean anything but keeping right mouse button pressed whenever possible? Does that work without shield (with a bow, for example)?
    2) I thought my build was pretty much described in the last paragraph of first post. Does it miss any info you need to give more detailed advice?
    3) Yeah I considered lvling dual wield or 1h+shield as a close combat secondary but wanted to lvlup bow enough for snipe hoping that it will make my PvP life easier somehow. Well it did not.
    Edited by Kumagoro on January 11, 2015 12:49AM
  • Eglath
    Eglath
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    Sadly as lvl 29 you will be getting one-shotted most of the time, if not you will run out or resources to do anything in no time. Your best chance is as you mentioned sit on siege, and try to lvl up. You'll start getting competitive around vet7-8.
    • As ppl above me mentioned NB archer is supposed to stay behind front lines, or gank ppl on horses, those types of builds don't have much survivabilty.
    • And perma block means holding right mouse button all the time, since you can block-cast, which means use your abilities while blocking. It reduces dmg you take, and makes you immune to most ccs. Except for NB fear, consider lvling this skill (it's shadow skill line if I recall correctly)
    • next thing is impenetrable trait on your armor, it reduces chance you will be critcally hit, which is huge part of staying alive in cyro (I know some ppl run without it, but it helps).
    • If you want to stay alive for longer in face-to-face ecnounters try run magic NB build. But sniper is viable choice too.
    Vinyamar - AD vr14 sorc RANK: 30
    RAGE Core
    Abandoned Legion Officer
  • Satiar
    Satiar
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    Kumagoro wrote: »
    Ok so I have been playing ESO for a week or 2, got to lvl 29 and started to spend a lot of time in Cyrodiil non-vet campaign. After some practice I found myself pretty effective at siege, counter-siege and party vs party.

    The problem is that as soon as I get in face-to-face combat I turn into a mudcrab. Not the Cyrodiil vet rank 5 mudcrab, but rather Khenarthi's Roost oneshot critter.

    I could suggest that I am playing a weak class, but I often get pwned with exactly same skills which don't do any actual damage when I am using them myself (eg. Snipe).
    I could think that I am too lowlvl but again I am 29 and I still get killed by lvls 20-25 a lot.
    And the most annoying thing is that my disables, like snares, disorientation or knockback just do not work most of the time. And when someone decides to kill me I do not get out of stun till my hp runs out.

    Because of all that I can't stop having a feeling that there is something very important about ESO PvP mechanics that I am not aware of (and 100% of my enemies are). I am eager to learn, so could some expirienced players please enlighten me on that matter? Links to any usefull guides are much appreciated too (google didn't yield any for me).

    P.S. In case that matters, I'm khajiit nightblade archer, so my main skill lines are bow+medium armor. Also I use Path of darkness from Shadow skill line to chase/escape, Cripple from Syphon for ganks and Consuming Darkness as an ultimate. The other 3 slots are usually occupied with Venom Arrow, Draining Shot and Snipe.

    As a stamina Nightblade who's done pretty much every build imaginable, I've come to realize that defense is more important than offense. These days I only have 2 offensive skills on any given bar, the rest dedicated to sustain and CC. Smart opponents have to be worn down, they generally know how to handle glass cannons.

    As for specifics I've gotta say it's just a lot of learning. I do great things my build, others who try it don't, and maybe I do worse than them with theirs. The number one way to get better at Pvp in this game is playing it, figuring out how you want to play it and than making that work.

    I will say, there are trade offs. Building towards ganking means you sacrifice the things that make you a strong 1v1 player. Eventually you'll need to decide if you like being that guy in the shadows or not, because most of the good ones I know in the game either kill in 10 seconds or just flat out run.



    Vehemence -- Commander and Raid Lead -- Tri-faction PvP
    Knights Paravant -- Co-GM and Raid Lead -- AD Greyhost



  • Cody
    Cody
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    Kumagoro wrote: »
    Thank for replies guys!
    @Lukeh
    Hmm I am used to more soloish and less supportish archers in other rpgs and mmos I played. I still have a hope that ESO char build system may let me find something more survivable than what I have at the moment.

    @Cody
    1) Does 'perma block' mean anything but keeping right mouse button pressed whenever possible? Does that work without shield (with a bow, for example)?
    2) I thought my build was pretty much described in the last paragraph of first post. Does it miss any info you need to give more detailed advice?
    3) Yeah I considered lvling dual wield or 1h+shield as a close combat secondary but wanted to lvlup bow enough for snipe hoping that it will make my PvP life easier somehow. Well it did not.

    1. Perma block is holding down block the entire battle while using your abilities. This is possible because of block casting, which allows players to use certain abilities while blocking. It's best done with a shield. Staves can do it with crushing shock, bows... not so well. Mainly due to the fact the main damage ability, snipe, is a channeled ability, and is therefore not able to be block casted.

    2. Yes your build is described in the last paragraph. I just did not read it for whatever stupid reason I had in my head at the time. Path of darkness is pure garbage: do not use it, same with cripple. I know many NBs use it, but it is not very helpful overall. Instead, use Aspect of fear, which is one of the best CCs in the game. Another ability you should look into using is mark target if you are a ganker, as it allows you to do major damage against your enemies. combined with snipe, you will do MASSIVE amounts of damage.

    3. As for your secondary: if you choose to go Shield or DW for your secondary, then there will be no need to use draining shot, as you will switch to a melee weapon when enemies get close. So if you go the above mentioned route, replace draining shot with another ability. My build is:

    Bar1: Siphoning strikes, shades, mark target, focused aim, venom arrow. This is my bow line.
    Bar2: Impale, siphoning strikes(morph I use is siphoning attacks) aspect of fear, rapid strikes, and Sparks. This is my DW line.

    Attributes: 0 points into magicka, 20 points into health, 42 points into stamina.

    I do relatively well with this build. I am not saying you should copy this build, this is just something for you to go off of. You could also go all LA with a magicka build, but based on your post, you want to go medium armor stamina build. If that's what you want to do, then do it. You don't have to use a magicka build if you don't want to. you can be successful without one.

    Last thing, GET A MELEE WEAPON AS YOUR SECONDARY. you will be better off for it.
  • Kumagoro
    Kumagoro
    Soul Shriven
    @‌Cody
    Thanks for advice, I will definately try aspect of terror then.

    But what do you use as an ultimate? For me it was one of the most tough choices made in game and in the end I picked consuming darkness just because it reduces damage taken by allies while assaulting/defending keeps. Still not sure it was completely right decision.
  • kentackis
    kentackis
    Soul Shriven
    At the moment the ultimate choice is ok. For secondary melee bar i would suggest soul harvest. Eventually you should get fighters guild ultimate for bow bar as it increases weapon damage.
  • Cody
    Cody
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    Kumagoro wrote: »
    @‌Cody
    Thanks for advice, I will definately try aspect of terror then.

    But what do you use as an ultimate? For me it was one of the most tough choices made in game and in the end I picked consuming darkness just because it reduces damage taken by allies while assaulting/defending keeps. Still not sure it was completely right decision.

    My ultimates change based on what im doing with my character. For PvE I use Veil of blades(morph of consuming darkness) for PvP I use incapacitating strikes(morph of deathstroke) this morph knocks targets down that have more health than you. This has saved my butt on multiple occasions, and got me very close to killing some very good players(I will kill you someday Vanus. lol. I got close, and I will finish the job at some point)

    Like kentackis said, any ultimate is a good choice, as NBs have very good ultimates. the fighters guild ultimate is also a good choice.

    Try these ultimates out and find what works best for you. If consuming darkness does not work for you, then try another ultimate.
  • Sharee
    Sharee
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    Kumagoro wrote: »
    And when someone decides to kill me I do not get out of stun till my hp runs out.

    Because of all that I can't stop having a feeling that there is something very important about ESO PvP mechanics that I am not aware of

    You can use the ability 'break free' at any time to remove the stun(and fear, and knockdown, ans sleep...) from yourself. Default keybind for it is pressing right and left mouse buttons together(same as bashing), but you can map it to any key. It consumes a lot of stamina by default.
  • Kumagoro
    Kumagoro
    Soul Shriven
    Sharee wrote: »
    You can use the ability 'break free' at any time to remove the stun(and fear, and knockdown, ans sleep...) from yourself.

    Wow, thanks. I was sure that I could only break free when UI shows up hint for doing that. If it works for any disable, that really explains A LOT.
  • Eglath
    Eglath
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    Kumagoro wrote: »
    Sharee wrote: »
    You can use the ability 'break free' at any time to remove the stun(and fear, and knockdown, ans sleep...) from yourself.

    Wow, thanks. I was sure that I could only break free when UI shows up hint for doing that. If it works for any disable, that really explains A LOT.


    You can break free any time and any cc providing you have enough stamina to do it, and it costs a lot of it. Generally ppl tend to break every cc on them, but sometimes it's worth to wait one that waste stam.
    Vinyamar - AD vr14 sorc RANK: 30
    RAGE Core
    Abandoned Legion Officer
  • Anazasi
    Anazasi
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    Block.
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