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I should not be limited to choosing templar if I want to be a healer.
Rioht
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First off I love this game, and have been a huge advocate from day 1 beta. However it saddens me to see specific roles being tied to a particular class or race.
I have always enjoyed playing support roles in games, particularly MMO's. As such I was ecstatic to hear about ZoS's philosophy of "play the way you want". To me this meant that I should be able to play any kind of role regardless of what race/class I was, as long as I focused my time and resources towards building my character to fulfill that role.
This is not happening for healers.
As a sorcerer, I have 2 options to becoming a healer.
A.) Re-roll as a templar
B.) Disregard my (or any class other than templars) inability to sufficiently heal my group and become a detrimental team member. That is, should I ever even get accepted into a group as a healer once they realize I am not a templar.
ZoS, please rethink the way that the healing skills work for each class and allow anyone who works hard enough to be a viable healer in all forms of endgame content regardless of what class they have chosen.
I have always enjoyed playing support roles in games, particularly MMO's. As such I was ecstatic to hear about ZoS's philosophy of "play the way you want". To me this meant that I should be able to play any kind of role regardless of what race/class I was, as long as I focused my time and resources towards building my character to fulfill that role.
This is not happening for healers.
As a sorcerer, I have 2 options to becoming a healer.
A.) Re-roll as a templar
B.) Disregard my (or any class other than templars) inability to sufficiently heal my group and become a detrimental team member. That is, should I ever even get accepted into a group as a healer once they realize I am not a templar.
ZoS, please rethink the way that the healing skills work for each class and allow anyone who works hard enough to be a viable healer in all forms of endgame content regardless of what class they have chosen.
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BBSooner✭✭✭✭✭
✭Hopefully spellcrafting will give other classes flexibility enough to have a burst heal or a healing ultimate - which is really what templar have over other classes. It will take some balancing though, the rate templar eat magicka could put them behind compared to sorc.Edited by BBSooner on January 8, 2015 7:56PM4 -
Gorthax✭✭✭✭✭
✭and now you will be flamed for saying "play the way you want" people on this game like to say you cant. They also like to say if you want to then prepare to suck. I have seen many good healers. Even some outperform templars. NB healers are AMAZING11 -
Gorthax✭✭✭✭✭
✭Also, Sorcs make very good healers! Purge from the alliance war skill tree (more coslty than purify), healing ward, rapid regen, combat prayer, grand healing. All that plus spell crit and weapon damage make heals good. Add crit surge for bonus weapon damage (or the other morph). You can do it!
I was with a vr7 sorc who healed for us on a vr12 scaled pledge and we never died. It is possible. Just get healing gear
In 1.6 though it will change from weapon damage to spell damage.5 -
Roselle✭✭✭✭Templar healer is easier? Yes. Healing is limited to the Templar class? No.
I like healing in general and I've been working on a Nightblade healer. It's quite fun actually, and definitely possible.
This one was rekt by Zenimax11 -
Bloodfang✭✭✭✭✭You can "play as you want", as long as you stay away from the "min-maxers" and all other "elitists".Edited by Bloodfang on January 8, 2015 8:09PM23 -
timidobserver✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭It is definitely true that non-Templar healers have a bit of a wall. You can heal in general PVE Content, but generally a Templar is desired for endgame content.V16 Uriel Stormblessed EP Magicka Templar(main)
V16 Derelict Vagabond EP Stamina DK
V16 Redacted Ep Stam Sorc
V16 Insolent EP Magicka Sorc(retired)
V16 Jed I Nyte EP Stamina NB(retired)0 -
Pathfinder✭✭✭There are also plenty of sets that will boost resto heals.Main
Malfahri del Sol Imperial Templar (stamplar *new respec) PC/NA/Trueflame1 -
Shunravi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Would you like to come and heal me in an instance sometime?
EDIT: I promise not to stand in fire too much Edited by Shunravi on January 8, 2015 8:09PMThis one has an eloquent and well thought out response to tha... Ooh sweetroll!3 -
Rezzy64✭✭✭The only thing limiting your healing to the Templar class is your sense of creativity and the group of elitists who believe that cookie cutting outweighs the importance of skill.
Do whatever you want and don't give up on it.
My sister plays a Sorcerer Healer, and although she jokes around during pledges and trials that all blame should be directed at her simply because she's the healer, she's actually probably the most efficient Healer within our guild.
Her ability to manage all of her resources alongside of knowing what heals and buffs need to be applied easily prove that her skill as a healer outweigh the fact that her build as a healer are not optimal.5 -
Natjur✭✭✭✭✭
✭Any class can do any role, but players 'think' they should be for set roles but you can pull off any role (just not as well as others)
I have one of each class.
My dk does every roll except Healing
My templar does every roll (but not the best at dps but still ok)
My sorc makes a really good tank and healer
My NB...... well I have retired that one except for PVP
and in patch 1.6 everything changesEdited by Natjur on January 8, 2015 8:26PM0 -
Rioht✭✭✭The only thing limiting your healing to the Templar class is your sense of creativity and the group of elitists who believe that cookie cutting outweighs the importance of skill.
Do whatever you want and don't give up on it.
My sister plays a Sorcerer Healer, and although she jokes around during pledges and trials that all blame should be directed at her simply because she's the healer, she's actually probably the most efficient Healer within our guild.
Her ability to manage all of her resources alongside of knowing what heals and buffs need to be applied easily prove that her skill as a healer outweigh the fact that her build as a healer are not optimal.
Glad to hear it has some viability with skill/management. Out of curiosity, how effective is she during trials?0 -
Rioht✭✭✭Hopefully spellcrafting will give other classes flexibility enough to have a burst heal or a healing ultimate - which is really what templar have over other classes. It will take some balancing though, the rate templar eat magicka could put them behind compared to sorc.
I almost forgot about spellcrafting. hopefully something comes of it! 0 -
Rioht✭✭✭Also, Sorcs make very good healers! Purge from the alliance war skill tree (more coslty than purify), healing ward, rapid regen, combat prayer, grand healing. All that plus spell crit and weapon damage make heals good. Add crit surge for bonus weapon damage (or the other morph). You can do it!
I was with a vr7 sorc who healed for us on a vr12 scaled pledge and we never died. It is possible. Just get healing gear
In 1.6 though it will change from weapon damage to spell damage.
I am not to concerned with healing for dungeons, I know it is definitely viable with the correct build/gear.
Trials on the other hand...0 -
Shunravi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Also, Sorcs make very good healers! Purge from the alliance war skill tree (more coslty than purify), healing ward, rapid regen, combat prayer, grand healing. All that plus spell crit and weapon damage make heals good. Add crit surge for bonus weapon damage (or the other morph). You can do it!
I was with a vr7 sorc who healed for us on a vr12 scaled pledge and we never died. It is possible. Just get healing gear
In 1.6 though it will change from weapon damage to spell damage.
I am not to concerned with healing for dungeons, I know it is definitely viable with the correct build/gear.
Trials on the other hand...
Meh, that's mostly healing springs spam, maybe some rapid regen or mutatgen. At least in AA and HRC. Unless people are making tons of mistakes...This one has an eloquent and well thought out response to tha... Ooh sweetroll!2 -
kewl✭✭✭✭✭
✭I've played every class and tried them in multiple rolls. DK is the weakest healer, Templar is the strongest. But all classes can heal. Anyone that kicks you for not being a Templar healer is not worth running with.
Trials might be the exception. However, a non Templar should be considered for off healing.0 -
s7732425ub17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Actually...
If you look at the Vet DSA leaderboards, there are some groups that have run without a Templar. This means that you do not have to be a Templar to heal the hardest content in the game.
Also, there are some non-Templar Trials healers. Healing is very easy when everyone stacks, and most Trial bosses are killed by stacking.
Really the only thing that other classes lack is Breath of Life. Resto staff healing ward/ward ally is a substitute for this. It's not as good, but it will work in most cases. As a healer, the most important thing is preventing two-hit kills. Group members die only when they get hit by two big hits in a row without heals in between. For example, say that a boss hits someone with a heavy attack for 2k damage. The player is stunned and is unable to avoid a ground AOE attack that hits for 2k damage as well. The player will die unless there is a big heal between the first and second damage ticks.6 -
Dymence✭✭✭✭✭
✭You can do any content in this game with any combination of classes. Except for veteran dragonstar arena and sanctum ophidia.
I'm often healing vet pledges for instance with a nightblade or a sorcerer, simply because there's an overflow of DD's and I have to either tank or heal instead of playing my primary role.
This makes it very easy to form groups since I can always fill any role, and it makes me wonder why others have not done the same.
Of course, you need the appropriate skill and knowledge to pull it off, but it's actually really simple.Edited by Dymence on January 8, 2015 8:40PM4 -
LtCrunch✭✭✭✭✭
✭If you want to be a healer all classes can do it just fine, but only if you're willing to make it work. They all have their strong points and weak points for a supprt/healing role.
Templar gets a healing tree with skills and passive dedicated to healing effectiveness, but they lack any really good resource management and outside of healing they have very little group utility.
Nightblade lacks a dedicated healing tree(though they do have two ultimates with massive heals) but they have absolutely amazing resource management. They also have the ability to deal damage and heal at the same time with abilities like funnel health, refreshing paths, and sap essence. Let's not forget they also have an escape mechanic in shadow cloak.
Sorcerer also lacks a dedicated healing tree, but they have some great CC options that will help keep key enemies off of allies and reduce incoming damage on them. They have a good resource management tool in dark exchange. They also have the best escape mechanic in the game with bolt escape.
Dragonknights have no dedicated healing tree, they lack any good resource management tools and will need to rely heavily on spell symmetry from the Mage's Guild skill line. That being said they do have some good group support tools. A group damage buff, a group damage shield(w/ a morph that increases healing power by 30%) and the magma shell synergy which grants them 85% of their max health as a damage shield.
If you work towards it any class can make a good healer, it's all about how much effort you're willing to put into it.NerdSauce GamingLaughs-At-Wounds - Sap tanking since 03/30/14ßrandalf - Light armor tanking since 03/03/15Brandalf Beer-Belly - Tanking drunk since 12/30/161 -
Shunravi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭Wifeaggro13 wrote: »
Why? Because the word 'sorc' describes mages in other games? In TES, a sorcerer is a heavily armored conjurer. ZOS seems to be basing the class more off the TES version than any other media's version.This one has an eloquent and well thought out response to tha... Ooh sweetroll!1 -
Rioht✭✭✭s7732425ub17_ESO wrote: »Actually...
If you look at the Vet DSA leaderboards, there are some groups that have run without a Templar. This means that you do not have to be a Templar to heal the hardest content in the game.
Also, there are some non-Templar Trials healers. Healing is very easy when everyone stacks, and most Trial bosses are killed by stacking.
Really the only thing that other classes lack is Breath of Life. Resto staff healing ward/ward ally is a substitute for this. It's not as good, but it will work in most cases. As a healer, the most important thing is preventing two-hit kills. Group members die only when they get hit by two big hits in a row without heals in between. For example, say that a boss hits someone with a heavy attack for 2k damage. The player is stunned and is unable to avoid a ground AOE attack that hits for 2k damage as well. The player will die unless there is a big heal between the first and second damage ticks.
Awesome, thanks for the info!
Think im gonna stick with my sorc as my healer and see if I can figure it out 0 -
Rezzy64✭✭✭Glad to hear it has some viability with skill/management. Out of curiosity, how effective is she during trials?
She does pretty well for herself, lately when I've participated in some of the VET Dungeons and when I've watched her play on her Twitch Stream, she has her time management down pretty well which has been an issue I've seen with other players (buffing at the right time for specific players swapping between focus for Tanks versus DPS).
I've seen her have a few resource issues however, I can definitely admit that her group (whether I was involved or not) tends to fall apart once her magic depletes and generally she has a hard time recovering that resource, I personally think she has too much health and not as much magic invested attribute points. Most of the time though she only has this issue (from what I've seen) with bosses that either entrap players (frequent grasping of players and temporary futility) or that use Negation magic (Silence).
I'm not fully aware of her exact active/passive skill build, but I'll try asking her about it and see if anything interesting within the build sticks out like a sore thumb. (Unique skills outside of optimal builds...etc.)0 -
Cuyler✭✭✭✭✭
✭The resto staff skills work fine, the issue is players need to be in area of influence. Templars have the high HPS "smart" heals for when it's not time to stack. Grand healing just need to be made as a "smart" heal and not AOE.Guild: STACK n BURN (gm) PC - NA
CP 810 18 Maxed Characters:
"How hard can u guar?" - Rafishul[/spoiler]1 -
Shunravi✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭s7732425ub17_ESO wrote: »Actually...
If you look at the Vet DSA leaderboards, there are some groups that have run without a Templar. This means that you do not have to be a Templar to heal the hardest content in the game.
Also, there are some non-Templar Trials healers. Healing is very easy when everyone stacks, and most Trial bosses are killed by stacking.
Really the only thing that other classes lack is Breath of Life. Resto staff healing ward/ward ally is a substitute for this. It's not as good, but it will work in most cases. As a healer, the most important thing is preventing two-hit kills. Group members die only when they get hit by two big hits in a row without heals in between. For example, say that a boss hits someone with a heavy attack for 2k damage. The player is stunned and is unable to avoid a ground AOE attack that hits for 2k damage as well. The player will die unless there is a big heal between the first and second damage ticks.
Actually, it seems like sorc heals are preferred for speedruns. At least in DSA.Edited by Shunravi on January 8, 2015 8:47PMThis one has an eloquent and well thought out response to tha... Ooh sweetroll!0 -
yodased✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Templars have the ability to remove negative effects and to have a heal on a dps bar and also have direct targeted heals that aren't logic based.
This gives them the advantage in the heal game, but doesn't exclude any other class from healing.
I've healed everything except SO on my Main (DK) and noone has complained to me.
Maybe because I'm the guild leader though...Tl;dr really weigh the fun you have in game vs the business practices you are supporting.6
