Alliance War rank should be account-wide for characters in the same faction

Isbilen · December 2014

It's a real motivation killer for rerolling a new character.

Edit: So some people seem to think that Alliance rank is comparable to your normal level. It's not comparable, because reaching VR14 takes only a couple of days, while the game has been out for over 8 months and not a single person has reached max Alliance rank yet.

ToRelax · December 2014

Shouldn't then Undaunted Rank be the same on all characters on the same faction as well?

I don't care really, just wanted to make sure no one forgets the PvEers. After all, ZOS won't care without a change to PvE anyway.

OrangeTheCat · December 2014

Why not also advance your new character all the way to v14? After all we did all the work on our first character and it took what seemed like a year.

Isbilen · December 2014

OrangeTheCat wrote: »

Why not also advance your new character all the way to v14? After all we did all the work on our first character and it took what seemed like a year.

Because reaching VR14 takes only a couple of days, and while the game has been out for over 8 months now not a single person has reached the highest Alliance rank yet.

Reverb · December 2014

And every new toon I roll should automatically be V14 with all gold gear and gold enchants. And a super fast horse. And 320 skill points. And a million each gold and ap. I worked for those things once, I shouldn't have to again, right?

/sarcasm

I disagree. I put in the time to earn each toon's alliance war rank, and I feel that's appeopriate. My new guy is but a Tyro on bwb, it would not be right to hand him rank 23 and be able to unlock combat frenzy, war horn, barrier and all the other goodies right away. I think the ranks should remain per-character. If that alone would prevent anyone from rerolling, so be it.

Isbilen · December 2014

Reverb wrote: »

And every new toon I roll should automatically be V14 with all gold gear and gold enchants. And a super fast horse. And 320 skill points. And a million each gold and ap. I worked for those things once, I shouldn't have to again, right?

Stop being a [snip], it's not comparable.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Cursing & Profanity]

Reverb · December 2014

Isbilen wrote: »

Reverb wrote: »

And every new toon I roll should automatically be V14 with all gold gear and gold enchants. And a super fast horse. And 320 skill points. And a million each gold and ap. I worked for those things once, I shouldn't have to again, right?

Stop being a [snip], it's not comparable.

How are these things incomparable? How do you propose justifying sharing one type of earning (alliance rank) but not others? Where do you draw your arbitrary line, and why?

[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]

Roechacca · December 2014

No

Isbilen · December 2014

Reverb wrote: »

How are these things incomparable? How do you propose justifying sharing one type of earning (alliance rank) but not others? Where do you draw your arbitrary line, and why?

So you think it's a good thing that you have to spend 2000+ hours per character in Cyrodiil to reach max level?

Junipus · December 2014

Reverb wrote: »

I disagree. I put in the time to earn each toon's alliance war rank, and I feel that's appeopriate. My new guy is but a Tyro on bwb, it would not be right to hand him rank 23 and be able to unlock combat frenzy, war horn, barrier and all the other goodies right away. I think the ranks should remain per-character. If that alone would prevent anyone from rerolling, so be it.

This.

If this wasn't the case then there's nothing stopping anyone from rerolling a DK with all the skill points available in PvP and just facerolling everyone with banners and talons thanks to the combat frenzy passive.

It's taken 2 months to reach combat frenzy 1 on my NB and it's felt a lot more rewarding than just coming straight out the box with an uber OP character.

Isbilen · December 2014

dap_robertb16_ESO wrote: »

If this wasn't the case then there's nothing stopping anyone from rerolling a DK with all the skill points available in PvP and just facerolling everyone with banners and talons thanks to the combat frenzy passive.

That's a good and fair point, but if it makes you feel any better I'm a Dragonknight trying to find motivation to play my recently created Sorcerer.

Reverb · December 2014

Isbilen wrote: »

Reverb wrote: »

How are these things incomparable? How do you propose justifying sharing one type of earning (alliance rank) but not others? Where do you draw your arbitrary line, and why?

So you think it's a good thing that you have to spend 2000+ hours per character in Cyrodiil to reach max level?

You haven't answered any of my questions, How do you propose justifying sharing one type of earning (alliance rank) but not others? You can aplly your question to any of the examples:

"So you think it's a good thing that you have to spend ___ hours per character in Cyrodiil to reach v14?"

"So you think it's a good thing that you have to spend 2000+ hours per character in Cyrodiil to earn a million gold?"

"So you think it's a good thing that you have to spend 2000+ hours per character in Cyrodiil to have the fastest horse possible?"

And on, and on, and on.

But to answer your question, yes - I think it's appropriate to have to re-earn alliance ranks for each character. I already said that.

Isbilen · December 2014

Reverb wrote: »

Isbilen wrote: »

Reverb wrote: »

How are these things incomparable? How do you propose justifying sharing one type of earning (alliance rank) but not others? Where do you draw your arbitrary line, and why?

So you think it's a good thing that you have to spend 2000+ hours per character in Cyrodiil to reach max level?

You haven't answered any of my questions, How do you propose justifying sharing one type of earning (alliance rank) but not others?

Because they simply aren't comparable.
- Gold gear is RNG from hirelings.
- Horse feeding is being changed with the champion system so that when you reroll you can level it twice as fast as now.
- Gold is already account-wide and is transferred between characters through your bank.
- Alliance Points are the same way. Buy whatever equipment you want and put it in your bank. Bind on Equip is account-bound, not character-bound.
- The skilll points take two or three days to regain. Many from the grind to 50, Skyshard hunting is fast and easy with a map addon, and the quests that award them don't really take much time either.

Compare this to the Alliance Rank. Like I've stated multiple times already, we are over 8 months in to the game, and no one has even reached max rank yet. It is a huge grind.

Junipus · December 2014

Isbilen wrote: »

dap_robertb16_ESO wrote: »

If this wasn't the case then there's nothing stopping anyone from rerolling a DK with all the skill points available in PvP and just facerolling everyone with banners and talons thanks to the combat frenzy passive.

That's a good and fair point, but if it makes you feel any better I'm a Dragonknight trying to find motivation to play my recently created Sorcerer.

I have a sorcerer as well that I've given up on leveling and is now my enchanter so you're not alone.

Depending on how you play (from what I've seen with your DK it's normally in group), getting to alliance war rank 6 abilities shouldn't take too long as the initial curve is very quick since they changed the AP gain rate. Also, reaching alliance war rank 10 abilities requires you to reach Centurion (or possibly Major) I believe, something relatively achievable with a month of group PvP bombing

eliisra · December 2014

ToRelax wrote: »

Shouldn't then Undaunted Rank be the same on all characters on the same faction as well?

I don't care really, just wanted to make sure no one forgets the PvEers. After all, ZOS won't care without a change to PvE anyway.

That's not the same thing really. Maxing out Undaunted takes a few weeks. Maxing out PvP skills and passives, takes e-centuries. It took me almost half a year of PvP'ing to get Alliance War level 10 on my templar, for example. Getting max rank in PvP would take me years.

It's even harder now after they removed camps and reduced the population cap. Gaining AP is way slower, most fights are over in a couple of minutes and you spend a lot of time riding. The days of 30-40k Dee Ticks are gone.

But I'll agree that more things should be account spread. Biased of course, since I have one of each class. Of course I want the whole shebang on all of them in terms of skills, PvP- and PvE passives and mounts.

I guess I'm a bit ambivalent about these things. For sure, it would be glorious for me personally with account bound War Ranks. But is it really wise to hand out Reach + Combat Frenzy 2 to lowbie alts? Than again Champion points will be account based, I assume those will bring even bigger advantages, or add more diversity between new and more established players.

s7732425ub17_ESO · December 2014

Total alliance points should be account wide, no matter the faction, and should be used for rank.

Alliance points obtained per character should be used to advance the alliance war skill line and gain skill points.

Kas · December 2014

i think entirely new rewards would be a great thing anyway. personally i would love it if there were two things: useful stuff (from possible PvP sets introduced in the future that would then be BoP to skills) that should be char-wide (and obtainable with a comparable amount of effort to whatever you do in PvE, undaunted, sanctum gear, weekly gear, whatever) and prestige (like your symbol) that could really be account wide.

Kaghei · December 2014

I just want the actual pvp rank account wide (prefect or whatever), i dont care about level 10 alliance war rank, its not a big grind, unlike the 20 million ap needed to reach 33.

Rylana · December 2014

AvA Ranks

Rylana - 20AD
Kailiana - 18AD
Minerva - 18AD
Lyzara - 14EP
Dannika - 12DC

So combined rank would be 31AD, 14EP, 12DC

I see only one outcome of this, all three of my AD toons would immediately unlock full assault/support lines which I have not earned on any one of them yet.

I dont feel I deserve that, on any char if I havent gotten it on one already. As much as I like to support quality of life upgrades for people with multiple alts, I cant support this idea, OP.

Isbilen · December 2014

Rylana wrote: »

A
I see only one outcome of this, all three of my AD toons would immediately unlock full assault/support lines which I have not earned on any one of them yet.

Like @s7732425ub17_ESO‌ mentioned above, the two can be separate. Total alliance points used for rank, and alliance points on a character basis used to advance the skill lines.

WRX · December 2014

Rylana wrote: »

AvA Ranks

Rylana - 20AD
Kailiana - 18AD
Minerva - 18AD
Lyzara - 14EP
Dannika - 12DC

So combined rank would be 31AD, 14EP, 12DC

I see only one outcome of this, all three of my AD toons would immediately unlock full assault/support lines which I have not earned on any one of them yet.

I dont feel I deserve that, on any char if I havent gotten it on one already. As much as I like to support quality of life upgrades for people with multiple alts, I cant support this idea, OP.

How it should work is the highest rank on your AD toon should be the rank for all your AD characters. And then until you either rank that character more, or the new toon passes your old one, then your rank increases. Not combined AP

themdogesbite · December 2014

Yes please, i would actually play other characters then.. Not to keen on getting up to general grade 2 again.

Cody · December 2014

Isbilen wrote: »

OrangeTheCat wrote: »

Why not also advance your new character all the way to v14? After all we did all the work on our first character and it took what seemed like a year.

Because reaching VR14 takes only a couple of days, and while the game has been out for over 8 months now not a single person has reached the highest Alliance rank yet.

it used to take a couple of days

no more craglorn grinds. Now people have to actually play the content.

terrible, i know.

asneakybanana · December 2014

How about this. What if your alliance rank was faction wide so like 24/50 or whatever you are would b for all the toons on one faction but your alliance level is based on each toon. So your level 1/10 for pvp skills and passives are bound to your toons.

Rylana · December 2014

WRX wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

AvA Ranks

Rylana - 20AD
Kailiana - 18AD
Minerva - 18AD
Lyzara - 14EP
Dannika - 12DC

So combined rank would be 31AD, 14EP, 12DC

I see only one outcome of this, all three of my AD toons would immediately unlock full assault/support lines which I have not earned on any one of them yet.

I dont feel I deserve that, on any char if I havent gotten it on one already. As much as I like to support quality of life upgrades for people with multiple alts, I cant support this idea, OP.

How it should work is the highest rank on your AD toon should be the rank for all your AD characters. And then until you either rank that character more, or the new toon passes your old one, then your rank increases. Not combined AP

Now that I could get behind, as long as its not additive. Even in my special circumstance where additive would benefit me, I can see how that would be a very bad things (say 8 alts all at alliance rank 10 or so, blame suddenly that "veteran" is a centurion, etc)

But if all my AD alts were effective AR20 like my main? Yeah I could roll with that.

s7732425ub17_ESO · December 2014

Cody wrote: »

Isbilen wrote: »

OrangeTheCat wrote: »

Why not also advance your new character all the way to v14? After all we did all the work on our first character and it took what seemed like a year.

Because reaching VR14 takes only a couple of days, and while the game has been out for over 8 months now not a single person has reached the highest Alliance rank yet.

it used to take a couple of days

no more craglorn grinds. Now people have to actually play the content.

terrible, i know.

Craglorn grinds still exist, bro. 500k-750k exp per hour solo in Spellscar.

Glory · December 2014

WRX wrote: »

How it should work is the highest rank on your AD toon should be the rank for all your AD characters. And then until you either rank that character more, or the new toon passes your old one, then your rank increases. Not combined AP

I agree with this. The current system doesn't encourage playing alternate characters, it encourages playing only one character.

Setting all ranks as the current highest rank would be a great way to implement a system where you progress as an account.

It's somewhat annoying to play for months on a character, and then feel like playing on an alt would be both starting over and wasting time that could be spent on a "main."