Would you like to be able to change your character's race?

MornaBaine · December 2014

WhiskyBob wrote: »

Wing wrote: »

AshySamurai wrote: »

Well, this poll shows that most players don't like this idea. Maybe we stop now?

actually it shows that most forumites don't like the idea, and if you frequent the forum you are a more dedicated player then the average (as you actually care to visit the forum)
most players don't frequent the forums (or lurk) and if you sent an in game pole asking "would you like the option to change your race?" most would probably say yes as its a win win, there not taking anything from you, as well as most casual players do not comprehend the supposed negatives of said choice.

Then make such a poll. Or are we basing on assumption now?

Race change is a *** idea. "This month we nerfed dunmer racials but buffed some orc racials", Dunmers suddenly become Orcs.
"Well, Orcs are OP now so we nerf them but this month we are buffing Khajit"
Former Dunmer, now Orc suddenly becomes Khajit.

And so on.
You picked a race - stick with it or roll a new character how hard is that?

Amusingly your example shows exactly why we SHOULD be allowed to have race changes. If I choose a race BECAUSE I like that race's perks, then ZOS yanks them out from under me and changes them, THEY CHANGED MY RACE. So there's no reason -I- should not be able to change my race.

SteveCampsOut · December 2014

MornaBaine wrote: »

WhiskyBob wrote: »

Then make such a poll. Or are we basing on assumption now?

Race change is a *** idea. "This month we nerfed dunmer racials but buffed some orc racials", Dunmers suddenly become Orcs.
"Well, Orcs are OP now so we nerf them but this month we are buffing Khajit"
Former Dunmer, now Orc suddenly becomes Khajit.

And so on.
You picked a race - stick with it or roll a new character how hard is that?

Amusingly your example shows exactly why we SHOULD be allowed to have race changes. If I choose a race BECAUSE I like that race's perks, then ZOS yanks them out from under me and changes them, THEY CHANGED MY RACE. So there's no reason -I- should not be able to change my race.

Ok, how about they only allow it when they make major changes to a race's passives like they do when they allow attribute and skill point respecs for free? I could agree to this, but as a fly by night choice that's always available, I see no reason for it.

Gidorick · December 2014

Look... no other TES game has allowed this to be done POST character creation (without accessing the underlying tools of the game)... so no. Let's keep this as is and let people just re-roll.

Maybe add a dialog box in character creation

"Are you sure you want to be (insert race here)? This cannot be changed later."

Dekkameron · December 2014

My rather obvious Orsimer character such as "Vragnora gra-Dushnikh" might be a strange name for a Altmer for example.

SteveCampsOut · December 2014

My character, Grumpy Kahjiti, would be a funny name for an Altmer Elf!

hutchinsonhatch · December 2014

Medakon wrote: »

I have nothing against if my the guild suddenly says "every damage dealer swap breton if you wanna come raids", because it would be fun to be the best guild in game in trial time. If you don't wanna be the best player and max then simply find another guild that suits you beter, lots of normal pve guilds out there.

Wow, that sounds like an admirable environment to be in.

hutchinsonhatch · December 2014

Argantis_Dragonheart wrote: »

31% The question should be though, "Are you likely to leave the game if..." Because that would give ZoS a better idea of how to keep subs happy. Many way want the change but be willing to stay without it, or not want it but be willing to stay with it.

The other option is to leave if things like this get implemented. If I wanted crap like this, I could play Neverwinter.

Evergnar · December 2014

There have to be some choices in game that are permanent. Ones that define your character. I personally never want to see race or class changes.

Argantis_Dragonheart · December 2014

Evergnar wrote: »

There have to be some choices in game that are permanent. Ones that define your character. I personally never want to see race or class changes.

Those choices should be made in quest dialogues not the skin you wear. I would agree in a stand alone game, but MMO games should not work like this. There are too many balance changes not to mention that people sometimes just want to make a change. The insane grind in this game for level and achievements makes rerolling pretty non viable for most people with a life or a job, certainly for people with both.

When people compare ESO to TES it is apples to oranges. A 40-120 hour play through compared to a game that never ends and people play for years. The ability for a character to be able to morph and change as the players tastes change on the life cycle of the game is very important to subscriber retention.

bertenburnyb16_ESO · December 2014

if they'd add that FOTM builds would include race changes and every patch with changes making a certain race better, causing 80% of the players being said race, no tnx, some choises do matter

Argantis_Dragonheart · December 2014

hutchinsonhatch wrote: »

Argantis_Dragonheart wrote: »

31% The question should be though, "Are you likely to leave the game if..." Because that would give ZoS a better idea of how to keep subs happy. Many way want the change but be willing to stay without it, or not want it but be willing to stay with it.

The other option is to leave if things like this get implemented. If I wanted crap like this, I could play Neverwinter.

If only they could do a poll on how many have already left. Numbers can be spun or doctored in many ways. The 52/34 split is based on 84 votes... With such a small sample size there is no way to use this to argue one way or the other. Honestly this poll is pretty much moot. The one good thing is that it has brought to attention an issue that is a very passionate one for many customers.

Heishi · December 2014

Medakon wrote: »

Whats the different advantage from making a new character with correct race and changing race instantly? Nothing.. it just take more time to make a new one, so I still don't see a problem why this shouldnt be allowed. The people who say no is either a pvp dragonknight player with correct race they wanna be or a roleplayer. Elder scrolls is MENT TP PLAY HOW YOU LIKE, NOT HOW OTHERS WANT YOU TO STICK WITH HOW YOU MESSED UP WITH 6 MONTHS AGO WHEN THE GAME WAS NEW BECAUSE THEY DIDNT MESS UP RACE AND PICK LETS SAY ARGONIAN OR NORD INSTEAD OF A BETER RACE TO GET ADVANTAGE OVER YOU. I refuse to make a new character just to make a race change, this shoulndt even be a payment option, it should be implementen ingame so lets say you pay 5k ingame to swap race. How can this be pay to win when nobody is paying irl gold for it and everyone have access?

Geting tierd of all these pvp'ers and roleplayers who bother to stop me from having a good time ingame and let me play how I like. got 90% ancivment clear and have emperor title, and maxed all skills and level. ofc I wont delete him and start a new character cuz because some 13yo old kid who does pvp or 40year old guy tells me I cant swap race and need to create new character.

I'm not an RP'er, do PvP, or 40y/o and I still say no

Now I DO think we should be able to change our appearance, but not our entire race. You talk about getting 90% of the achievements and whatnot. You probably should have known LONG before you made it that far into the game whether or not your chosen race was going to work for you. I could even see gender change more tolerable than race.

If you did make it that far into the game and didn't realize you didn't want to play that race, barring very rare circumstances like wanting to join an RP guild that only allows a certain race, it's really your own fault.

"Play how you like" isn't all inclusive like people seem to think. If you want to play a pink dremora riding a unicorn who farts rainbows while you attack with cotton candy and god mode on, it's not going to happen. You "play how you like" within the scope and limitations of the game.

"Play how you like" doesn't mean getting things handed to you either. If you want to play a different race, you are entirely capable of doing that, but you have to work for it. If you want to be a max level naked nord, you can do it.

I made a monk character once for a while to have laughs. Was he particularly strong, no, but I knew that going in and accepted it as a trade off to play how I wanted. He competently held up in PvE but I wouldn't try to PvP with him or anything (not that I do anyway)

hutchinsonhatch · December 2014

Argantis_Dragonheart wrote: »

hutchinsonhatch wrote: »

Argantis_Dragonheart wrote: »

31% The question should be though, "Are you likely to leave the game if..." Because that would give ZoS a better idea of how to keep subs happy. Many way want the change but be willing to stay without it, or not want it but be willing to stay with it.

The other option is to leave if things like this get implemented. If I wanted crap like this, I could play Neverwinter.

If only they could do a poll on how many have already left. Numbers can be spun or doctored in many ways. The 52/34 split is based on 84 votes... With such a small sample size there is no way to use this to argue one way or the other. Honestly this poll is pretty much moot. The one good thing is that it has brought to attention an issue that is a very passionate one for many customers.

Well, to be honest, such a number isn't of any interest to me. Personally, I was looking forward to ESO and made the decision to buy and try it long before release. I knew, I should wait right after release until the "zerg" has already left and the first ironings had taken place. I never, ever buy a game on release since 2006, when Gothic 3 was released.

I look at it that way: The people who left fall into just a small number of categories...
... the ones, that actually didn't like ESO compared to the single-player experience
... the ones, that constantly hop onto the new ship until they "beat the game"
... the ones, who are too impatient to committ themselves and stick to it

It was perfectly clear to me that ESO will not be released in a "finished and polished" state and that the developers will have to be granted time to steady the ship. That has never been different from just any MMO I played since I set foot onto Tyria in 2006, but the audiences have changed in a very significant way.

Evergnar · December 2014

Argantis_Dragonheart wrote: »

Evergnar wrote: »

There have to be some choices in game that are permanent. Ones that define your character. I personally never want to see race or class changes.

Those choices should be made in quest dialogues not the skin you wear. I would agree in a stand alone game, but MMO games should not work like this. There are too many balance changes not to mention that people sometimes just want to make a change. The insane grind in this game for level and achievements makes rerolling pretty non viable for most people with a life or a job, certainly for people with both.

When people compare ESO to TES it is apples to oranges. A 40-120 hour play through compared to a game that never ends and people play for years. The ability for a character to be able to morph and change as the players tastes change on the life cycle of the game is very important to subscriber retention.

In that case why even bother with character creator in the beginning. You could just be whatever you want whenever you want. Everybody would just roll with the flavor of the month for the optimal build and we'd all be the same.

reften · December 2014

Do wish I could change my character's height though

Argantis_Dragonheart · December 2014

hutchinsonhatch wrote: »

Well, to be honest, such a number isn't of any interest to me. Personally, I was looking forward to ESO and made the decision to buy and try it long before release. I knew, I should wait right after release until the "zerg" has already left and the first ironings had taken place. I never, ever buy a game on release since 2006, when Gothic 3 was released.

I look at it that way: The people who left fall into just a small number of categories...
... the ones, that actually didn't like ESO compared to the single-player experience
... the ones, that constantly hop onto the new ship until they "beat the game"
... the ones, who are too impatient to committ themselves and stick to it

It was perfectly clear to me that ESO will not be released in a "finished and polished" state and that the developers will have to be granted time to steady the ship. That has never been different from just any MMO I played since I set foot onto Tyria in 2006, but the audiences have changed in a very significant way.

I too have been around for a long time. You can see that I have my one year anniversary. I was on the forums pre launch, played the betas, and have been in many MMO games. I have either run or been an officer in guilds in UO, WoW, SWtOR, DDO, LotRO, and Neverwinter. These guilds have been across the spectrum in scope, from small family and friend guilds, too role play guilds, to massive PvP and PvE game content / achievement and raid guilds. I have a lot of experience in the MMO arena, and the people, including myself that have been in my guild have mostly similar backgrounds. Being a 30+ age guild we just tend to get experienced players.

I feel that you are making a lot of false assumptions on why players leave and it is certainly not the case for the players that I personally know who have left. Most of them were hardcore TES and sub based payment model fans. Many have left not because of where the game started, but where it has gone since then. From my experience most players love the game pre-VR, ZoS knows this too, just look at how many accounts are lost once a character hits VR. Look at the nerfs to VR experience required, and look at the popularity of VR grind groups like burials, towers, and anomalies. I give credit to ZoS for trying to address and change it, at least they are aware and trying. They do listen, and that is one reason why I continue to sub in 6 month chunks. I am here, and I am committed to the people who chose me to lead them. I am not making these observations out of any selfish agenda. I am making these observations for love of the game. Because ZoS is losing good people and customers. These are not the typical me too, game hoppers and steam babies.

We started out guild with 50 in launch, the majority of that pre-launch. Sinnce we wanted to limit our guild to 60-80 members to have a close knit community of people who actually know and care about each other. We started our guild with a core of about 15 who came from another game. These 15 are fiercely loyal and we have only lost 1 or 2 of them along the way. We also have a core of about 5-10 who have added to that in ESO. The remaining 30 or so we are looking for has been a constant exercise in futility. Only two other times have I played a game and found it so hard to maintain guild this early on. Those were DDO and SWtOR. Both games that wanted to be sub based but went free to play along with massive overhauls to keep them afloat while they continued development.

I have a friend who started a guild with 98 members soon after launch. There are less then 10 who still log in and play. The people who have left should alarm ZoS because it is not a healthy indicator. Just the fact that ESO has been featured on Steam sales so soon is another indicator. Good games do not need to deploy such tactics to draw people in. Good ones live on word of mouth and go viral all on their own. I seen this same transition with SWtOR and Bioware, a company who makes great stand along games that had a hard learning curve in the MMO genera. ZoS can choose to be stubborn about the MMO community, and limit their profits and potential for ESO. Or they can be open minded and embrace the challenge and rise to the occasion to make ESO something more than a niche game in the market. I actually think they will fall somewhere in the middle, and I am pretty okay with that. It is just a matter of how much pain, and how much time, it takes them to get there. Luckily, there is already much evidence that they will do it faster, and better than Bioware did. Because they do listen to the community and react to it.

We, all of us here, have brought to them the issue. Now they have to decide on an upside and downside of the issue. How many players will they gain or lose if they had a way to do racial changes? How many players will they retain or gain if things stay status quo? I think it is obvious what most of us think. No need to rehash those arguments here. Honestly I wish they would just institute some way of getting metrics to find the real answers instead of relying on the vocal minority. Though they would do well to learn from others who have already paved a path of success in the MMO arena. To take a look at what made those companies so successful and ask themselves if there is not a way to apply that knowledge to their model in a way that does not compromise the true heart of what they envisioned ESO to be.

Argantis_Dragonheart · December 2014

bertenburnyb16_ESO wrote: »

if they'd add that FOTM builds would include race changes and every patch with changes making a certain race better, causing 80% of the players being said race, no tnx, some choises do matter

Flavor of the month don't happen if you have a limiting factor, like a lock out. If someone can only change their race once every six or twelve months this would hardly be the case. Or if the resource cost in game is so expensive that the average player can only pay the cost once every six to twelve months then that takes care of it too. Not to mention that it could be a huge resource sink to help fight over inflation in the game economy.

Edit: Seems like a win / win for the players that do and don't want it to implement it with a sever cost tied into it. Also healthy for the game economy.

Zorrashi · December 2014

I'm all for changing physical appearance after creation, but I am very much against race changes. I don't support it imply because I don't want to see something along these lines: "the X race have better radials, let me switch to that race."

I would maybe allow there to be a race change if passives were locked out and inaccessible/unusable for that character. Cosmetic changes, at least, are harmless, even if they do go against certain philosophies regarding the importance of choice.

MornaBaine · December 2014

Zorrashi wrote: »

I'm all for changing physical appearance after creation, but I am very much against race changes. I don't support it imply because I don't want to see something along these lines: "the X race have better radials, let me switch to that race."

I would maybe allow there to be a race change if passives were locked out and inaccessible/unusable for that character. Cosmetic changes, at least, are harmless, even if they do go against certain philosophies regarding the importance of choice.

I get what you are saying here. Here's the problem for me though...ZOS feels free to change stuff on us all the time. So the character you built using a specific race, choosing a specific build and gear for them.... ZOS can and WILL come in and change it ALL on you any time they want to. Then what? Remember when they nerfed the hell out of the Night Silence set? NO ONE got the gold they put into those sets back. ZOS totally screws players over ALL THE TIME. Now maybe sometimes that's necessary as they need to "fix" something they screwed up in the first place. But, that being the case, PLAYERS need to have the freedom to make changes as well in reaction to that and to help compensate for the way ZOS regularly shafts players with changes.

Tonturri · December 2014

There has been a small bump on my Khajiit's forehead since forever. It is attached to a particular hairstyle. Said hairstyle...also happens to be the only khajiit hairstyle I actually like.

At the very least, I expect a barber/appearance chance.

As for race changes - I would be perfectly happy to have race changes with a 6month cooldown, + coin cost + maybe lose a champion point or something. Lose AP too.

I'm all for changing physical appearance after creation, but I am very much against race changes. I don't support it imply because I don't want to see something along these lines: "the X race have better radials, let me switch to that race."

I won't lay claim to having exact numbers, but those types of people don't make up all of the game. Out of the 5 guilds I'm in, two of them - the trade and raiding - would ever make use of a race change for racial bonus purposes. Opposing race changes just because one section of the playerbase would 'abuse' it seems...meh. Even so, what's wrong with them wanting to min/max? Racial bonuses don't boost your character all that much. See a little further down for numbers.

Back to limitations. The time limit of 6 months would keep people from switching (quickly) to the FoTM. The coin, Champion point and AP cost would make it a somewhat difficult choice to be made regardless of the reason. NOT having it cost real-life currency would keep people from screeching at ZOS about how they keep changing the racials around just to make money.

Most all race change discussions I've seen have just been a back and forth of concern about FoTM people, choice should matter and...I'm probably missing something, but that is all I can think of.

I don't really see anyone arguing that it's absolutely impossible to have the feature with an acceptable set of limitations - it's just <this reason for not having it> and the conversation never moves beyond that.

A little bit dedicated specifically to the 'choices should matter'. I agree! But which choices? How much should they matter? That comes down to personal opinion. While I don't agree that race is a choice that should matter so much you need to spend weeks+ on a re-roll, I agree that race matters enough to impose time costs. Currently, to change my race I'd have to re-roll. Using my VR14 as an example - 30 days playtime. Speaking to any who'd say race should matter to the point I need to reroll - would you say that 30 days time spent, loss of map completion, gear, skill points, mind numbing boredom while leveling the new character/class I already have through zones I've already done, is an acceptable cost to accomplish the following...(using my sorcerer, LA, lightning staff, khajiit --> Dunmer )
1) Change the look of my character
2) Lose 6% crit, 30% health regen, and gain 6% stamina, 9% magicka, 7% increased fire damage? That's a gain of - 175.68 magicka, 69.9 stamina (teehee), and...uh, let's go with my Impulse skill for the fire thingy. 240 non crit, I'd gain 16.8 damage with a fire staff on the Impulse spell. If I even used it! I don't, just switched to lightning.

Seems a little too steep a price to me...30 days of my life for 245.58 in stats, and however much weapon/spell damage is equal to 16.8 damage?

Summary: Saying people must give up days of their life for minor stat gains and an appearance change (one of which doesn't effect you at all) is a really unreasonable. Please, let's move on from arguing over whether or not to have it, and start on the implementation. I'd be quite happy with a 6 month cooldown, 10k gold, 10k AP, 10 Champion points. Going under the '1 champion points = 1hr taken to get it', that is 10 hours, plus say...1 hr for 10k gold, 1 hr for 10k AP, for a total of 12 hours of your life. Half a day for an race-appearance-change and whatever little stat gains/losses come with it. I think that's enough to appease everyone.

As always, I can be subject to random bouts of 100%, pure TOTALLY WRONG. I also speak only for myself, etc etc. Thanks for reading!

Argantis_Dragonheart · December 2014

I agree, the change option should be there, for one simple reason. Regardless of what people say here, no one, or almost no one, is going to leave the game if they implement racial changes with a heavy cost. On the other hand, several will or have already left over the non flexibility in end game to morph your character into something you enjoy. If ZoS can wrap their mind about skill morphs, and even implement them into the game mechanics from the get go, why can they not understand the need for players, regardless of the reasons, to want to morph a character on deeper levels than that?

Personally I think the racial change should cost 100k gold, enough said. Since AP and time spend all end up boiling down to gold, if not directly then in opportunity cost, I am in favor of keeping it simple. Definitely it should NOT cost skill points or ability points. The basic structure of the character should stay in tact and the idea is to make it less insane than a re-roll. I personally never have been able to farm 10k gold in an hour. I know about the Spellscar in Craglorn and all that, but I just cannot do it. I do farm about 2-5k per hour with the things I do. So for me that would be a 20-40 hour time sink. And to me that is pretty realistic. Since I have a job and girlfriend I cannot live in the game. I would consider myself an average player and a good baseline for this. I can spend roughly 2-4 hours per night max on weeknights. I would say 14 hours during the week and 6 on Saturday is about normal for me, 20 hours a week. This means that it would take me 1-2 weeks to accomplish a racial change. Resource wise that is a lot of investment in time.

As far as combating flavor of the month, that will never happen. Ever notice how many emperors are DK Vampires? FotM will never, ever be combated. There will always be players that will do whatever it takes too be cool kids, running around Cyrodiil as the DK vamp in cloth with a shield and dagger. No matter what mathematical model ZoS implements, there will be max builds and 1337 players will find them and play them. Saying that min/maxing is bad is like saying that people who eat meat are bad. Different people enjoy different aspects of the game, and quite frankly, I find it very condescending and arrogant for someone to tell someone else how to play or enjoy the game. Who cares if people want to min/max and play a flavor of the month? How does that hurt the game in any way? There have been max builds since day one in this game. Early on everyone used a restoration staff. Now with adjustments to ZoS many are using two handers, bows, and destruction staves. So players changed their builds based on game balance adjustments. Now lets say that a player weent with being all magicka because stamina builds were not viable in the game at launch. So now they want to be a stamina build. What exactly is wrong with them wanting to be a race that enhances a stamina build versus a magicka one? How does that impact any other player in a negative way?

Anyone who is so dead set against racial changed because of FotM or "players should live with choices", even bad ones, or ones made without knowing better, or ones made based on a game that had different mechanics months ago that have changed due to development" is being very dictatorial and imposing their play style and viewpoints on others. News flash, there already are min/maxers, and there always will be, live with it. It does not effect you whatsoever, because you have the very same opportunity they do. By the way, I am and have been rerolling for months now, I have spent more time making new nightblades than I have playing my VR14, not because I want to min/max, but because I want to find a freaking nightblade that I enjoy playing and my racial choice does mean something. It dictates the entire flavor of the build. Right now I am playing the Orsimer that uses a two hander and bow while my Imperial and Redguard sit there and rot. The entire character is built around sprinting, and I love it. For PvE and PvE it is a very rare and fun build, totally viable, and completely not min/maxed. I even am going werewolf because I hate the cookie cutter vampire DK's. But most people are not me, most will not grind stubbornly until they find the right fit, most that I know have left because of the extreme and elitist nature of ESO and how much time is required to invest into the game just to find a character that they like to play or the ability to reinvent a character that they are bored of.

This issue is not about the flavor and realism of an online world. This issue is about customer satisfaction and retention. It is about the financial success and economic welfare of ESO years down the road. There is a reason why many MMO games allow fast character leveling, or the ability to start a character off new, at level 90 and only play through the new, latest content, when an expansion is released. It is because they know that it is a second chance to get a customer back. To make a kind and gentle re-entry into the game world. To give that game the ability to go from 6.5 million subs to back over 10 million. If ESO actually cares about their customers, including the ones that they have lost, systems like this are not optional in regards to the success of the game.

"Be resolute, fear no sacrifice and surmount every difficulty to win victory."
- Frandar Hunding (Tobias's dialogue in Redguard)

Argantis_Dragonheart · December 2014

MornaBaine wrote: »

WhiskyBob wrote: »

Wing wrote: »

AshySamurai wrote: »

Well, this poll shows that most players don't like this idea. Maybe we stop now?

actually it shows that most forumites don't like the idea, and if you frequent the forum you are a more dedicated player then the average (as you actually care to visit the forum)
most players don't frequent the forums (or lurk) and if you sent an in game pole asking "would you like the option to change your race?" most would probably say yes as its a win win, there not taking anything from you, as well as most casual players do not comprehend the supposed negatives of said choice.

Then make such a poll. Or are we basing on assumption now?

Race change is a *** idea. "This month we nerfed dunmer racials but buffed some orc racials", Dunmers suddenly become Orcs.
"Well, Orcs are OP now so we nerf them but this month we are buffing Khajit"
Former Dunmer, now Orc suddenly becomes Khajit.

And so on.
You picked a race - stick with it or roll a new character how hard is that?

Amusingly your example shows exactly why we SHOULD be allowed to have race changes. If I choose a race BECAUSE I like that race's perks, then ZOS yanks them out from under me and changes them, THEY CHANGED MY RACE. So there's no reason -I- should not be able to change my race.

Not to mention that if the dev team can actually balance racial traits this would never happen. So lets have a little faith in the dev team. I am pretty sure that they can eventually balance the racial traits. So this point then becomes moot. There no longer is a FotM argument against racial change.

Tonturri · December 2014

Not to mention that if the dev team can actually balance racial traits this would never happen. So lets have a little faith in the dev team. I am pretty sure that they can eventually balance the racial traits. So this point then becomes moot. There no longer is a FotM argument against racial change.

Pardon if I sound a little harsh

I don't think it as quite as simple as that. There -are- some blatantly bad racials that could use some help, yes, but what about the rest? A possibility is making all racials the same, but that's boring.

Otherwise, there -will- be inbalances in the racials. 3% extra magicka is better for some builds than 3% stamina, which ties racials into how builds are doing. Lookit the trouble they've been having with builds! In my opinion, you're being a little too optimistic - I don't think racials will ever be balanced to that point.
Imo, it'd be better to just adjust the racials as best they can - once - and then leave them be. Then have no RL $ for race changes. Not to mention that the 'fotm argument' is more of a statement than an argument. I always wonder '...so?' whenever it comes up. Argantis had a very nice paragraph in their post about this.

*Shameless little bump while rambling*

SRIBES · December 2014

ARE YOU *** KIDDING ME ANOTHER SWEET ROLL OPTION SO DISREPECTFUL...

Argantis_Dragonheart · December 2014

I mentioned something like this before, but not quite like this. They could easily balance racial traits by one of two means.

1) Provide a custom tree for racial traits so that players can select whatever they want. If they want a Breton with 12% health (currently Imperial), Increased Stealth (currently Bosmer / Khajiit), and Stamina Gain on melee hit (currently Redguard) who cares. Awesome more flexibility, more choices, and race is just a skin at that point.

or

2) Remove all combat aspects of racial traits. So there would just be XP skill line gain, possibly profession stuff added in place of combat stuff, and the pixels and artistic aspects of races.

Though with this some people will still get bored of looking at the same toon for years or possibly not like how certain armor looks on them.