Has ZOS given up on Cyrodiil/PvP?

SRIBES · December 2014

Zenimax, you have put little to no effort into PvP so far.
The only things remotely PvP like they have planned are The Imperial City and The Justice System. Brian wheeler even stated the imperial city is a PvE zone in PvP, so basically just a big ass town in which wr can farm gold. The Justice system is PvP in PvE, that means less players in Cyrodiil and more out of cyrodiil, as far as I am aware there is not even an incentive besides some measly bounty as a reward to play it. So a PvE zone in PvP and PvP in PvE, it should mainly be PvP in PvP. There isn't even a reward to be in cyrodiil at the moment besides AP which is worth nothing.

I'm actually looking forward to spell crafting and the champion system MORE than justice and imperial city.. I mean at least spell crafting and the champion system will change PvP so there will be more build diversity. The funny thing is champion points are gained as a set amount of XP you get after level 50, you gain XP fastest by doing PvE. You would know this if you watched the guild summit videos. As for spell crafting they said you will get the tablets from going into dungeons and such to retrieve spell tablets, more PvE. Let's not forget how bad the lag can be at times. They rarely even nerf or buff skills and when they do they seem to nerf it to much or buff it to much *COUGH.. BOLT ESCAPE AND SNIPE* . Zos seems to really only care about PvE. So that's why I ask the question, does zenimax even give a *** about PvP anymore? Well I shouldn't even say anymore because that would imply that they cared.

Galalin · December 2014

New lighting effects coming to PvP soon

SRIBES · December 2014

Galalin wrote: »

New lighting effects coming to PvP soon

Lmao

eliisra · December 2014

It's really frustrating and sad to witness. Seen this vicious circle in many mmorpg's.

1. Creators and developers completely ignores PvP, so PvP'ers start to leave.

2. PvP'ers become a minatory, due to lack of fixed and updates. So PvP gets even less updates and fixed, with arguments like "need to cater to the majority blah blah".

3. PvP is almost extinct.

I pretty much stopped PvP'ing myself in ESO. It's no fun any more. After 7 months, performance still sucks and always some game breaking crap ruining game play and balance (currently Snipe spam from every keep and corner of the map).

Teargrants · December 2014

I'm sure at some point in prehistory they cared. When you look at the details put into Cyrodiil's physical terrain, you can see how much effort was put into designing the map itself. Too bad that kind of quality and attention to detail didn't carry over to their QA and gameplay teams.

Voodoo · December 2014

well theres always hope the Imperial city is the start of something they can add alot too over the years. IE, Arena system with actual Coliseum style spectator viewing areas and other duelling events added to Imp. City.

Oughash · December 2014

Teargrants wrote: »

I'm sure at some point in prehistory they cared. When you look at the details put into Cyrodiil's physical terrain, you can see how much effort was put into designing the map itself. Too bad that kind of quality and attention to detail didn't carry over to their QA and gameplay teams.

I don't think I'm alone when I characterize ESO in the following way: Cyrodil is what sold me. I remember standing in stros m'kai in beta thinking to myself, "what the hell is this ***?" Then I got to Cyrodil and was utterly and completely sold. Cyrodil was (and still is) an amazing zone. Absolutely huge, beautifully crafted, with neat things to find.

But now we've played in Cyrodil for months. Most of the zone is utterly empty, which is an absolute shame.

Stream of consciousness suggestions:
1. Add extra objectives to fight over. For example, crops ford, Bruma, etc. allow the towns to contribute to alliance war points and change the quest rewards so that people actually want to do them.
2. Then add territory to "capture." Bonus features: will spread the player base, reduce lag, introduce novel fights in new territory.
3. Add new pvp only gear sets. With rank requirements. And unique appearances. Like every other game, ever.
4. Get rid of trash traits on pvp gear. I'm looking right at the light of Cyrodil set.
5. Let me buy anything with AP via guild stores.
6. Start adding a new objective with ever patch in a new place. Within a few patches Cyrodil will have new life.
7. Keeps should be unique. Capturing ash should be different than capturing roe than capturing brk.
8. Let the guild that "controls" a keep purchase upgrades with ap or gold. These upgrades should enable better defense, allow respawning, whatever. Guilds should care about the keep they control.
9. I literally could go on all night, so I'll stop here.

Thoughts?

rsciw · December 2014

Galalin wrote: »

New lighting effects coming to PvP soon

yap, soon every keep will be lit up as Farragut.

Cody · December 2014

sometimes i think that they really dont.

many issues that are a plague on PvP continue to remain in PvP. Lag, constant crashing, huge imbalance, both population and class/skill effectivness wise. letse see what else... oh there are quite a few...

block and casting...... buff servers...... exploits(it was ri

Ishammael wrote: »

Teargrants wrote: »

I'm sure at some point in prehistory they cared. When you look at the details put into Cyrodiil's physical terrain, you can see how much effort was put into designing the map itself. Too bad that kind of quality and attention to detail didn't carry over to their QA and gameplay teams.

I don't think I'm alone when I characterize ESO in the following way: Cyrodil is what sold me. I remember standing in stros m'kai in beta thinking to myself, "what the hell is this ***?" Then I got to Cyrodil and was utterly and completely sold. Cyrodil was (and still is) an amazing zone. Absolutely huge, beautifully crafted, with neat things to find.

But now we've played in Cyrodil for months. Most of the zone is utterly empty, which is an absolute shame.

Stream of consciousness suggestions:
1. Add extra objectives to fight over. For example, crops ford, Bruma, etc. allow the towns to contribute to alliance war points and change the quest rewards so that people actually want to do them.
2. Then add territory to "capture." Bonus features: will spread the player base, reduce lag, introduce novel fights in new territory.
3. Add new pvp only gear sets. With rank requirements. And unique appearances. Like every other game, ever.
4. Get rid of trash traits on pvp gear. I'm looking right at the light of Cyrodil set.
5. Let me buy anything with AP via guild stores.
6. Start adding a new objective with ever patch in a new place. Within a few patches Cyrodil will have new life.
7. Keeps should be unique. Capturing ash should be different than capturing roe than capturing brk.
8. Let the guild that "controls" a keep purchase upgrades with ap or gold. These upgrades should enable better defense, allow respawning, whatever. Guilds should care about the keep they control.
9. I literally could go on all night, so I'll stop here.

Thoughts?

when i watched the "unraveling" of ESO, all i cared about was PVP. i am a HUGE Oblivion fan, so cyrodill insantly caught my attention.

nowadays PvP is an absolute mess. thornblade is full of cheating, crashing, and h=HORRENDUS lag; and Azuras star, chillrend, and hedarus are merly buff servers. Blackwater blade is the only fun campaign(at least for me) right now, and even thats limtied because Dc never logs on anymore.

PvP needs some love. i am tired of seeing new and unneeded PvE zones. Craglorn was never needed to begin with. all the time and effort they put into craglorn could have been put into improving PvP. we already had 16 PvE zone. we did not need more PvE zones. Neither is wrothgar needed. it sounds nice, but its not needed. right now PvP needs the most attention. It is a hot mess right now and needs fixing.

OrangeTheCat · December 2014

Hey! You forgot the fourteen-f***ing-VR-Levels. And now no grind! So those of us stuck between vr levels can sit back, pay our money and wait for CS to hopefully save us.

Cody · December 2014

OrangeTheCat wrote: »

Hey! You forgot the fourteen-f***ing-VR-Levels. And now no grind! So those of us stuck between vr levels can sit back, pay our money and wait for CS to hopefully save us.

i despise the veteran rank system. its part of the reason PvP is such a hot mess. if ZOS would have kept the max level at 50, then the horrible rank imbalance would not be such an issue. level 50 is a level everyone can at some point reach. VR10-14 is not. and now with no grinds, it will be even worse. i hated the grinds, but now without them, everyone that is not VR10+ right now is pretty much f** unless they do the horrible veteran content. i played thru the vet content. it is absolutly dreadful. i dont blame people if they dont do it. i used to scold at people who skipped it, but having done it all...... *shiver* i sure as heck wont be doing it again with other characters! it took me all of my summer break to do the vet content: from the beginning of june all the way to early august.... and i played WAY above the average playtime most people play. imagine it for people that have to go to school(which i am right now, so i sure as heck cant do the vet content now) or work..... how will they ever keep up??

PvE once again hurts PvP. ZOS keeps on adding in more PvE zones and veteran ranks to the game. ZOS, PLEASE stop apeasing the elite crowd that power grinds everything in a week!!! forget those people for a bit!! fix the dang PvP b4 you lose half of your fanbase!!!!!!!

SRIBES · December 2014

Cody wrote: »

sometimes i think that they really dont.

many issues that are a plague on PvP continue to remain in PvP. Lag, constant crashing, huge imbalance, both population and class/skill effectivness wise. letse see what else... oh there are quite a few...

block and casting...... buff servers...... exploits(it was ri

Ishammael wrote: »

Teargrants wrote: »

I'm sure at some point in prehistory they cared. When you look at the details put into Cyrodiil's physical terrain, you can see how much effort was put into designing the map itself. Too bad that kind of quality and attention to detail didn't carry over to their QA and gameplay teams.

I don't think I'm alone when I characterize ESO in the following way: Cyrodil is what sold me. I remember standing in stros m'kai in beta thinking to myself, "what the hell is this ***?" Then I got to Cyrodil and was utterly and completely sold. Cyrodil was (and still is) an amazing zone. Absolutely huge, beautifully crafted, with neat things to find.

But now we've played in Cyrodil for months. Most of the zone is utterly empty, which is an absolute shame.

Stream of consciousness suggestions:
1. Add extra objectives to fight over. For example, crops ford, Bruma, etc. allow the towns to contribute to alliance war points and change the quest rewards so that people actually want to do them.
2. Then add territory to "capture." Bonus features: will spread the player base, reduce lag, introduce novel fights in new territory.
3. Add new pvp only gear sets. With rank requirements. And unique appearances. Like every other game, ever.
4. Get rid of trash traits on pvp gear. I'm looking right at the light of Cyrodil set.
5. Let me buy anything with AP via guild stores.
6. Start adding a new objective with ever patch in a new place. Within a few patches Cyrodil will have new life.
7. Keeps should be unique. Capturing ash should be different than capturing roe than capturing brk.
8. Let the guild that "controls" a keep purchase upgrades with ap or gold. These upgrades should enable better defense, allow respawning, whatever. Guilds should care about the keep they control.
9. I literally could go on all night, so I'll stop here.

Thoughts?

when i watched the "unraveling" of ESO, all i cared about was PVP. i am a HUGE Oblivion fan, so cyrodill insantly caught my attention.

nowadays PvP is an absolute mess. thornblade is full of cheating, crashing, and h=HORRENDUS lag; and Azuras star, chillrend, and hedarus are merly buff servers. Blackwater blade is the only fun campaign(at least for me) right now, and even thats limtied because Dc never logs on anymore.

PvP needs some love. i am tired of seeing new and unneeded PvE zones. Craglorn was never needed to begin with. all the time and effort they put into craglorn could have been put into improving PvP. we already had 16 PvE zone. we did not need more PvE zones. Neither is wrothgar needed. it sounds nice, but its not needed. right now PvP needs the most attention. It is a hot mess right now and needs fixing.

I think Craglorn was needed and so was dragonstar arena. PvE end game content is needed but they should at least split the updates up; PvE end game update + some nerfs/buffs and fluff content+bug fix. Then a PvP end game update + some nerfs/buffs and fluff content+ bug fix. Would keep both groups of people happy and balance the game. PvE is great and most of my hard core PvE friends and guilds are pretty happy with it as of now. Tons of group dungeons, trials, and an arena. That's a lot of content.. PvP is getting so *** boring and tiresome everyday logging in doing the same ***; Farm gold for tri pots since we can't make gold from PvP, Group with guild, Farm useless AP with guild in hopes one day AP will be worth something, leave group, 1vX for a bit, go farm again because out of gold for tri pots. The keeps LOOK the exact same and it's so bland. If they made them look different and added smaller scale PvP, a way to make gold by having fun in PvP, more places to find PvP, updated the landscape and made it look more Molag balish and updated the XP gained from kills, made AP useful, Dueling from 1v1 - 8v8 and be able to bet gold, artifacts, more things to take, added in super bad ass OP alliance rank 50 sets, and made it so guilds could purchase upgrades for keeps with AP + REGULAR buffs/nerfs along with spell crafting and the champion system I think I would be pretty damn happy and for a longgggg while with the PvP system. If things like this were added in every other patch and PvE content added in the other patch I think zos would be going in the right direction. It would add content in to try and not make us bored.

Yolokin_Swagonborn · December 2014

I know ZOS reads these forums but I think they either just take advice for PvP from the "general forums" where mainly PvE'rs post or they think us PvPers are all divided on what needs to be changed.

We are NOT divided. Yeah we disagree a bit on the details of skill or class ballance but for the most part, there are some major overarching issues that we all agree on.

If we were to have a List of Grievances for everyone that plays PvP, I think it would look something like this.

TOP 10 PROBLEMS IN PVP

Lag: (skill lag, weapon switch lag, door lag, zerg lag, pfx lag, lag lag)
Poor performance in PvP (crashes, lag, memory leaks) after EVERY patch that go unchecked for weeks/months.
Bugs in certain skills that either break the skill completely or make it exploitable that go unchecked for weeks/months
Incorrect tooltips, hidden cooldowns (i.e. templar charge), and ninja nerfs to abilities that are never acknowledged or fixed.
Lack of in game support for duels/battlegrounds/instant action/ way to fight your friends/guildmates i.e. no new purely PvP content since launch.
AoE caps (and other mechanics) that favor zergballs
Range vs. Melee imbalance (an oft-neglected subset of the magicka/stamina debate.
Lack of a true overarching balance paradigm between the classes. Inconsistent nerfs and buffs to certain classes or abilities in response to reactionary flameposts on the forums.
Long periods of neglect, followed by severe reactionary changes to PvP game mechanics.
Lack of a consistent or enforceable polity on "spirit of the game" issues such as trolling or "exploiting."

TL:DR PvP does not get remotely the same about of TLC that PvE does and it both kills morale and drives PvP'ers from the game.

If there is anything else you feel should be added to this list, please let me know.

Teargrants · December 2014

Need to add sound lag now, since the sound prioritization overhaul in 1.5.

serenenightmare · December 2014

Yeah, I don't know how much more pvpers can wait. A lot of good players have left already. Majority of my guildies are extremely tired of the issues.

I love this game a lot but the pvp is anything but lack luster.

Lettigall · December 2014

Some time ago one PvE player said that Cyrodiil is just a minigame, I laughed. Now I have to agree...

No new content in PvP since launch, just bug fixing... Give us new reasons to kill each other!

GorraShatan · December 2014

Am I the only one having fun in PvP still? Yah there are some issues, but the lag's improved a bit the last couple weeks, and it's still a blast.

KBKB · December 2014

Runescape bros, the answer to all your questions

serenenightmare · December 2014

GorraShatan wrote: »

Am I the only one having fun in PvP still? Yah there are some issues, but the lag's improved a bit the last couple weeks, and it's still a blast.

The only reason I'm still enjoying pvp is because of the people I play with. They make it worth it. I've also been doing pvp since launch so it is just getting more and more snore with each patch.

Each new patch breaks something...

Izanagi.Xiiib16_ESO · December 2014

Teargrants wrote: »

I'm sure at some point in prehistory they cared. When you look at the details put into Cyrodiil's physical terrain, you can see how much effort was put into designing the map itself. Too bad that kind of quality and attention to detail didn't carry over to their QA and gameplay teams.

DEE TICK is a QA so don't speak blasphemy. Seriously though QA can only report issues if the reported issues are not fixed not their fault.

Lava_Croft · December 2014

The best addition to PvP is the constant spam of PvE notifcations from people completing the Trials and what not. At least ZOS doesn't *** around when it comes to showing you what they think is the most important.

SRIBES · December 2014

Lava_Croft wrote: »

The best addition to PvP is the constant spam of PvE notifcations from people completing the Trials and what not. At least ZOS doesn't *** around when it comes to showing you what they think is the most important.

Yep

just goes goes to show my point that they seem to have given up on us PvP players and are trying to force us to PvE.

Cody · December 2014

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

I know ZOS reads these forums but I think they either just take advice for PvP from the "general forums" where mainly PvE'rs post or they think us PvPers are all divided on what needs to be changed.

We are NOT divided. Yeah we disagree a bit on the details of skill or class ballance but for the most part, there are some major overarching issues that we all agree on.

If we were to have a List of Grievances for everyone that plays PvP, I think it would look something like this.
TOP 10 PROBLEMS IN PVP

Lag: (skill lag, weapon switch lag, door lag, zerg lag, pfx lag, lag lag)

Poor performance in PvP (crashes, lag, memory leaks) after EVERY patch that go unchecked for weeks/months.

Bugs in certain skills that either break the skill completely or make it exploitable that go unchecked for weeks/months

Incorrect tooltips, hidden cooldowns (i.e. templar charge), and ninja nerfs to abilities that are never acknowledged or fixed.

Lack of in game support for duels/battlegrounds/instant action/ way to fight your friends/guildmates i.e. no new purely PvP content since launch.

AoE caps (and other mechanics) that favor zergballs

Range vs. Melee imbalance (an oft-neglected subset of the magicka/stamina debate.

Lack of a true overarching balance paradigm between the classes. Inconsistent nerfs and buffs to certain classes or abilities in response to reactionary flameposts on the forums.

Long periods of neglect, followed by severe reactionary changes to PvP game mechanics.

Lack of a consistent or enforceable polity on "spirit of the game" issues such as trolling or "exploiting."

TL:DR PvP does not get remotely the same about of TLC that PvE does and it both kills morale and drives PvP'ers from the game.

If there is anything else you feel should be added to this list, please let me know.

the defending of cheaters via the name and shame policy.

add that to the bucket list.

Valnas · December 2014

can we go back to before the lighting patch and try it all over again ?

JaJaLuka · December 2014

KBKB wrote: »

Runescape bros, the answer to all your questions

*shiver* can't do it. runescape is a terrible game.

Oughash · December 2014

Yolokin_Swagonborn wrote: »

I know ZOS reads these forums but I think they either just take advice for PvP from the "general forums" where mainly PvE'rs post or they think us PvPers are all divided on what needs to be changed.

We are NOT divided. Yeah we disagree a bit on the details of skill or class ballance but for the most part, there are some major overarching issues that we all agree on.

If we were to have a List of Grievances for everyone that plays PvP, I think it would look something like this.
TOP 10 PROBLEMS IN PVP

Lag: (skill lag, weapon switch lag, door lag, zerg lag, pfx lag, lag lag)

Poor performance in PvP (crashes, lag, memory leaks) after EVERY patch that go unchecked for weeks/months.

Bugs in certain skills that either break the skill completely or make it exploitable that go unchecked for weeks/months

Incorrect tooltips, hidden cooldowns (i.e. templar charge), and ninja nerfs to abilities that are never acknowledged or fixed.

Lack of in game support for duels/battlegrounds/instant action/ way to fight your friends/guildmates i.e. no new purely PvP content since launch.

AoE caps (and other mechanics) that favor zergballs

Range vs. Melee imbalance (an oft-neglected subset of the magicka/stamina debate.

Lack of a true overarching balance paradigm between the classes. Inconsistent nerfs and buffs to certain classes or abilities in response to reactionary flameposts on the forums.

Long periods of neglect, followed by severe reactionary changes to PvP game mechanics.

Lack of a consistent or enforceable polity on "spirit of the game" issues such as trolling or "exploiting."

TL:DR PvP does not get remotely the same about of TLC that PvE does and it both kills morale and drives PvP'ers from the game.

If there is anything else you feel should be added to this list, please let me know.

Re quoted for exposure and to signal agreement.

Azarul · December 2014

I believe they were not able to produce the PvP stability they hoped for and have switched their main focus to PvE and keeping subscriptions. This game was majorly advertised as the AvA being the "endgame" of ESO. People were asking if there was even going to have PvE it was so hyped. So yes there's no way AvA is receiving much attention with how slow changes and improvements are coming.

Cathexis · December 2014

Yes.

SRIBES · December 2014

Azarul wrote: »

I believe they were not able to produce the PvP stability they hoped for and have switched their main focus to PvE and keeping subscriptions. This game was majorly advertised as the AvA being the "endgame" of ESO. People were asking if there was even going to have PvE it was so hyped. So yes there's no way AvA is receiving much attention with how slow changes and improvements are coming.

I agree but I seriously think theu should slpit their time evenly; PvP update one month and PvE update the next. I LOVE PvE now that i'm slowly getting sick of PvP and that is purely due to the lack of updates. I think a balance between PvP and PvE every other update will be nice and for the most part keep everyone happy. Off topic but also it would be nice to have end game rewards like some kind of outfit or gear you would get for doing all the achivmets so fluff, end game incentives, buf fixes, and balancing + PvP/PvE content every patch would make almost all of the player base looking forward to new updates.

AlnilamE · December 2014

They are trying to work on the PvP issues. Just look at the patch notes each update. But the lag and crashes are a big issue, and apparently have more than one cause, so they are still working on it.

I do like some of the suggestions above (though now rewards for the worthy do award gold).

As they have found out, balancing PvP is a tricky issue and each change has repercussions, so they have been trying to move carefully. On top of that, getting the Imperial City ready is a huge undertaking. Not to mention that with the Justice System coming, there is going to be a manner of PvP outside of Cyrodiil.

So I don't think they've given up on PvP, but I think it's a more complicated problem than they anticipated, particularly the issue of class balance, because any changes also affect PvE players.

Lava_Croft wrote: »

The best addition to PvP is the constant spam of PvE notifcations from people completing the Trials and what not. At least ZOS doesn't *** around when it comes to showing you what they think is the most important.

Consider it payback for being notified every time someone drops a scroll or whenever the gate of Mnem is opened and closed. :-P

SRIBES · December 2014

AlnilamE wrote: »

They are trying to work on the PvP issues. Just look at the patch notes each update. But the lag and crashes are a big issue, and apparently have more than one cause, so they are still working on it.

I do like some of the suggestions above (though now rewards for the worthy do award gold).

As they have found out, balancing PvP is a tricky issue and each change has repercussions, so they have been trying to move carefully. On top of that, getting the Imperial City ready is a huge undertaking. Not to mention that with the Justice System coming, there is going to be a manner of PvP outside of Cyrodiil.

So I don't think they've given up on PvP, but I think it's a more complicated problem than they anticipated, particularly the issue of class balance, because any changes also affect PvE players.

Lava_Croft wrote: »

The best addition to PvP is the constant spam of PvE notifcations from people completing the Trials and what not. At least ZOS doesn't *** around when it comes to showing you what they think is the most important.

Consider it payback for being notified every time someone drops a scroll or whenever the gate of Mnem is opened and closed. :-P

I do look at the patch notes, tell me a time when there is more PvP updates than PvE updates in a patch and what actual PvP CONTENT they have put in since launch. I see your point but I don't ageee.