morvegil wrote: »

Joy_Division wrote: »

Posters said L2P because you OP sounded like you didn't know how to play. You can block just like the DK and there are many spells in the game that bypass scales.

As for your build, you are a glass cannon with little sustaining power. It will lose to any experienced 1 vs 1 player using any class that incorporates some sustain unless you gank them (and if they survive they still might win).

2h Block doesnt really do anything. I still take damage as i dont have any mitigation. If I sit and block like a DK i would just die.

Comments like are going to reinforce posts that tell you to L2P.

(setup-Rapid regen, immovable, shadow image) ambush, soul harvest, surprise attack x2, impale. This WILL not kill a DK like it would most other classes BUT it will get you ahead of the game. Most likely you will get them pretty low on HP, say 25% to 30% (depending on how much HP they have). All DK builds I have ever seen will immediately use GDB, pop a tri pot, and pop reflective scales. They will be back around 80%-90% HP. Sucks but that's DK's for you. At that point use shadow image again to get out of melee range and avoid talons. Use staff and staff alone (cripple if you want, just watch for the reflect) and wait for DK to inevitably use invasion. Be ready to dodge or use crippling grasp if his wings are gone to stop him in his tracks and continue using staff attacks (or funnel or crippling if he hasn't repopped wings). At this point he will be on you using talons and flame whip. By this time however his stamina should be low enough (from all the blocking) so he won't be able to break CC of your fear. Remember though, he is most likely block casting, meaning when you fear him he will still be blocking for a time. Wait for his shield to go down or try on next fear to time it when he puts his block down. Keep casting shadow image and getting some distance, bouncing back and forth like a sorc does with blink or whatever. Time your attacks well, if you screw up you wont get more than 1 chance to make up for it. If you just start spamming your skills you WILL run out of resources and he WILL block EVERYTHING and you will die. Consider any blocking you do as doing nothing because he will go through you like a hot knife through butter, hence limit the time you are in your (his) melee range.

that's my 2 cents.

Good comments. Like I said...im not having that many issues...besides basically being a glass canon. I was just wondering since DKs in certain situations are unbeatable...I was asking for advice.

So yes, everyone is "l2p"...and i didnt come to the forum to ask how to play and get a reponse "learn2play"...well kind of the reason i came here in the first place to see what other people are doing. Ive experimented with many builds. I just dont enjoy being a Skirt and stick NB....i prefer the more stealthy Medium armour and weapons.



Now I the lethal arrow is a very valid tactic and will continue to use that...as it is probably the most effective of ganking. Since the removal of FC's I have found the game more fun, as I can run out into Cyrodiil and nonstop gank horses.

The best part is when i kill a guy and he comes back ready and he keeps messaging "you [snip]...etc". Its like? Umm...this is what my class does...im not a selfhealing tank.


Now the really funny this is I have a DK friend who can sit and have like 5-8 guys beat on him for minutes while i snipe them off.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Cursing & Profanity]

Evergnar wrote: »

I think you kind of answered your own question in a way. Glass canon meets tank, tank wins especially when it is the strongest class in the game.

You also mentioned having no mitigation so if you really want to go with a more toe to toe approach play around some mitigation abilities and passive effects.

Thats what I thought. It doesnt hurt to pick brains though...maybe someone has found something we didnt think of.

I tank in light/medium armor as a NB it just takes skill and some opportunity. If you can get the jump on them it should work if your a 60/ 40 magicka/stamina. Use buffs and stamina attacks. If your a 40/60 you could do the same. If your a stacker and most of you are you just have to not be stacked in what they are stacked against.

Suntzu1414 wrote: »

Nice finisher for DK's is Soul Tether.

DK Blocking got you down, give Cripple a go...
(though i still have figure how Siphon -- which pulls energy--is projectile)??


Kill Well
ST

used to be the case but it seems it gets reflected now... and i didnt see any patch notes and from what i can see *visually* it travels along the ground ie. not projectile

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

@MiyaTheUnbroken‌ , I lol'ed so hard at the running part

The bottom line guys is this: if you're spec'ed for ganking you're not spec'ed for sustained 1v1 combat. It's a simple trade you chose to make. You either make a sustainable build or you make one with huge burst damage. If you choose the latter don't be surprised you can't outlast the former in open combat.

That said it is much harder to put a sustainable stamina build together, that is an issue with the current game's meta. On the other hand it's also hard to put a magicka burst build together too, unless you play a magicka NB ganker. So it kinda goes both ways.

At the moment you have to become a bit more prepared for these situations. Do some duels and find out what works and what not. Some great advice was given in this thread already.

But do bear in mind that, being a stealthed assassin and all, turning tail and running is a very valid strategy. Don't expect to outlast tanky builds when your attempt fails. When you get angry because you got killed by DK, think of all the times he got angry because he got insta-gibbed by two Lethal Arrows before he got a chance to do anything about it

This post sums it up pretty well in my opinion.

Get rid of the bow. Burn it, it's worthless and an eyesore, always has been not just since the patch.
All you do is sit in stealth and be unproductive while you could be sieging or helping that player who's fighting 5 enemies while your 10 buddies hide in stealth doing nothing and selfinshly waiting for their own kill. Also, DKs reflect everything you do with that weapons anyways.
There are plenty of other viable options for stamina-users and even if you dont have any points into magicka you should still be able to cast 1 or 2 spells, namely mass hysteria (or aspect of terror) or dark shades.

Stop being a boy playing with a slingshot, be a man who fights for his alliance!

I played a NB at launch and did manage to kill my share of DK's. But anyone who tells you they aren't tremendously overpowered is just being deliberately dishonest. You can talk all you want about tactics and how to micro manage abilities and your resource pools, if the DK knows what he's doing he'll kill you and your 5 friends and won't have to think about it overly hard.

The DK's you kill and I kill just suck full stop. That's the good thing about fighting the FOTD (flavor of the decade, ZOS has no intention of balancing DK, they won't) is that many bad players gravitate to it to compensate for lack of skill. But put a DK in a skilled players hands against an equally skilled NB, it's over and you don't have half a chance in hell in a straight up 1vs1 fight. This is what happens when one class has the best survivability, best CC, best utility, very good self healing and top end DPS. Those are certifiable facts, and how this can even occur in such a basic game with a mere 4 classes is baffling. It should be a rock paper scissors game. What you're left with is rock, paper, scissors, and bullet proof bulldozer with rocket jets. Brilliant idea really.

I played bounty hunter is SWG in 2 years, I played Brigand in EQ2 for 5, both of these classes were the most notoriously short handed classes in their respective games. Of course, there was lots of whining about that, but I stayed the course and didn't change classes and made it work, and that brought me a lot of pride. I don't get any pride out of killing a DK because when I do it's because they're controlled by someone who sucks. If they didn't suck they wouldn't be dying. This just makes PVP trivial. PVP is supposed to be about interacting with other players and competing, not one class steam rolling all others and requiring you to be Zen Chess Master 4000 just to close the gap a tiny bit and still ultimately lose because one class is grossly unbalanced. Any serious PVPer would laugh at the thought of playing garbage like that. Sure, we can bust our ass 10 times harder and maybe win, but ultimately it's because the other player was dumb or did something wrong. If the DK does it all right he doesn't lose, simple as that. Anyone who tells you otherwise is lying or just clueless.

Regardless of what anyone want's to say about it, the state of DK has had a negative impact on the game from the start, and is just another instance of mismanagement and very confusing design decisions which alienate people who come from far more complex games. 4 classes, seriously, how do you stuff that up?

Valymer wrote: »

My friend tested it today and blocking inside Caltrops didn't seem to drain stamina. Did they change this?

Shades works good though

No, it still drains stamina. At least for me XD.

Grim13 wrote: »

Fossilize I

Cast Time Instant
Target Enemy
Range 15 meters
Duration 12 seconds
Cost 46 Magicka

Stuns enemies for 12 seconds. Affected targets can take X damage before the stun breaks. Enemy Stamina, Magicka and Health recovery is decreased by 44%. Rocks shatter for 11 Magic Damage to target when effect ends.

New Effect: Reduces enemy health, stamina, and magicka regeneration.

Prolonged Suffering I

Cast Time 1.5 seconds
Target Enemy
Range 28 meters
Duration 12 seconds
Cost 42 Magicka

Stuns target for 12 seconds, effect is broken by damage from any other source. Deals 30 Magic Damage over 7 seconds when effect ends.

New Effect: Damage over time lasts for longer.

Here's a comparison of similar skills of DKs and NBs.

Notice how the DK morph is just that much stronger and more useful than the NB morph?

The same goes almost across the board for DK skills in comparison with their similar counterpart skills in other classes.

For whatever reason, ZOS are completely a-ok with this fact.

Pretty much this. Apparently the designers seemed to go for vaguely mirrored skill layouts to provide some sort of equality between classes, yet somehow they usually gave the coolest incarnation of any given utility to DKs.

Reflective Scales is the (enourmoulsy) better eclipse, talons is the better encase, unstable flame is the better criple/curse, Standard is the best persistent aoe and the best damage boost (on par with veil though) and so on.

LOl lies. My friends play DK's and own. Yeah that Caltrops didnt seem to do crap last night. Shades (Ilevel it to 4 months ago) seems to drain them down though...

Yusuf wrote: »

Get rid of the bow. Burn it, it's worthless and an eyesore, always has been not just since the patch.
All you do is sit in stealth and be unproductive while you could be sieging or helping that player who's fighting 5 enemies while your 10 buddies hide in stealth doing nothing and selfinshly waiting for their own kill. Also, DKs reflect everything you do with that weapons anyways.
There are plenty of other viable options for stamina-users and even if you dont have any points into magicka you should still be able to cast 1 or 2 spells, namely mass hysteria (or aspect of terror) or dark shades.

Stop being a boy playing with a slingshot, be a man who fights for his alliance!

Seems my crew was harassing enemy lines all night forcing them to zerg up on 6 guys versus a Keep...

Ambush 800-1k hit target stunned, Stealth Disguise, Soul Harvest 1.5k hit, Impale 1k hit. If they get out of the stun and start to attack, use Sparks.

If it's in the open, Crippling Grasp, Fear, to keep it busy and thinking he's winning while spamming Sap Essence until I can line it up for a stun and burst. If I don't get him to the point where I think the stun and burst will kill him thanks for Crippling Grasp and Sap Essence I'll have 200 Ultimate and I'll use Veil of Blades.

Fact really is though that if you want to screw them over, slot Cleanse and some fire resists, they are like puppies that way.

Stamina builds are just going to have to get over the fact that DK's are hard work for them the same way Sorcs are hard work for my magic melee build.

CapuchinSeven wrote: »

Ambush 800-1k hit target stunned, Stealth Disguise, Soul Harvest 1.5k hit, Impale 1k hit.

More like ambush, if you are a gank build with 0 sustain then it might hit for 800-1K.

Before you can do anything else, the DK breaks CC and blocks. Your soul harvest(assuming you had a charged ulti before the fight in the firstplace) will tickle him for 450-500, and you won't bother with impale execute because he is still well above half HP.

Then its the standard: eat invasion, talons, whip, talons. If you spark he will switch to destro staff and continue burning you down. He won't even bother with GDB up to this point. You have no sustain since you are a gank build, the best you can hope for now is to dodge roll and try to cloak away.

Good luck!