Players unsubbing because of trollcampers - Please help

Malveria · October 2014

And I'm not saying people who have poor camp placement, or people who are ganking.

But people who are literally, actually boasting in zone about it, who are being seen by multiple people as doing it, who are doing it purely and solely to grief. There is NO doubt what they are doing. You have been drowned in screenshots, reports, people begging for help. Now people are unsubbing purely because of the trollcamping.

Just ban then Zeni. I'm begging you. I am losing people because of this.

NadiusMaximus · October 2014

The only way out is to get rid of the camps altogether, and make one auto appear in a random location around the attacked place once it is flagged.

Xsorus · October 2014

They need to up wall hp and get rid of camps completely

Sapphy24 · October 2014

NadiusMaximus wrote: »

The only way out is to get rid of the camps altogether, and make one auto appear in a random location around the attacked place once it is flagged.

That is the best Idea, i'd really love them to think about it.

Grim13 · October 2014

NadiusMaximus wrote: »

The only way out is to get rid of the camps altogether, and make one auto appear in a random location around the attacked place once it is flagged.

I disagree.

They don't need to get rid of camps... they need a resident GM to kick the little *** placing troll camps offline when they're caught doing it.

Betamax need to step up and police their game.

NadiusMaximus · October 2014

Well then keep them, but make it so it takes three people to erect a tent. One person buys it, but three people have to be there and press x to pitch a tent sort of like a synergy.

Heh heh...... pitch a tent

nukeemstudiosub17_ESO · October 2014

Ad And Ep are the ones who started all the troll camps. everytime they get into a tough battle all the sudden troll camps pop up! Thats the only way i have seen them really beat us lately. pathetic!!!!!!!

DezIsDead · October 2014

I love how every thread turns into "these people started it" who cares, I didn't start I'm guessing you didn't, what we need is for it to be fixed, instead of pointing fingers at each other lets point at zeni for allowing it to still happen.

Kypho · October 2014

no camp do streak swarm streak aoe streak swarm streak aoe streak swarm

Darthryan · October 2014

I don't think people are.unsubbing because of troll camps. Its such a minor annoyance to leave a game for.

Malveria · October 2014

Darthryan wrote: »

I don't think people are.unsubbing because of troll camps. Its such a minor annoyance to leave a game for.

My diminishing friends and farewells list begs to differ.

Teargrants · October 2014

It's not the troll camps themselves that make ppl unsub, it's the lack of any disciplinary action by ZOS when players provide clear irrefutable evidence who the troll campers are and that they are doing it with malicious intent to grief others. Repeated failures to enforce their own ToS is the issue, this instance is sort of the final straw to many.

Xsorus · October 2014

Malveria wrote: »

Darthryan wrote: »

I don't think people are.unsubbing because of troll camps. Its such a minor annoyance to leave a game for.

My diminishing friends and farewells list begs to differ.

If your friends quit over troll camps in this game I wouldn't bother playing any other games with them... You got to be thin skinned to quit over something like that. In fact judging by the fact you think they quit over that I can guarantee you had to listen to a barrage of excuses nightly for why they lost and most consisted of how the other side "cheats"

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Rude and Insulting Comments]

JaJaLuka · October 2014

Because of the naming and shaming I won't post the video but I do have footage of someone rage quitting because of this.

For the time being if you get annoyed by this take a step away from pvp or go and find a small battle where these issue don't matter, just take a breath. Even msg someone on the opposite faction and organise a small scale fight on another campaign, anything that takes you away from it because it can be incredibly frustrating especially when there is nothing you can do about it.

OR

Opposing factions need to form an agreement to burn enemy camps that have been placed to troll. Some people can band together to stop this, though it needs to be an organised group so as not to lead players to legitimate camps. This could very easily turn into another form of trolling if it gets out of hand, though perhaps a lesser evil as another camp CAN be put down, however people of the same alliance CANNOT burn their own camp. We are all playing the same game after all, helping each other out to make it fun and fair is really the aim behind this.

I would like to hear from customer service on this as I don't want to be penalised for organising something that is considered cheating/spying etc, if the decision is made not to do it, I won't.

Malveria · October 2014

xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »

If your friends quit over troll camps in this game I wouldn't bother playing any other games with them... You got to be thin skinned to quit over something like that. In fact judging by the fact you think they quit over that I can guarantee you had to listen to a barrage of excuses nightly for why they lost and most consisted of how the other side "cheats"

I don't see how it's 'thin skin' to be angry that we can't even participate in PVP because of the malicious acts of one person. The loss of the keep itself is not the issue. It's how the keep was lost. Had it been an amazing fight myself and my guild would be happy. We want to fight. We want to PVP and be pushed and have fun. Not be forced to run a large distance and, when we get to the fight, be killed and have no chance to participate.

PVP involves player versus player combat, and these camps are literally prohibiting us from being involved in large-scale, keep-based combat. I don't understand how this is being thin skinned when the trollcamps are stopping people from getting involved in the play experience that they are paying for.

Seven camps across the top of the map that mean we can't even defend half of our home keeps. I don't give a damn who is doing it. I don't even consider it cheating. It's griefing. It's deliberate and it's malicious and it needs to stop.

What I listen to is a guild full of people who cannot get to the fight that they want to be a part of. Whether or not the keep is lost, there is a fight there, we want to be there, and we can't get there.

JaJaLuka wrote: »

Because of the naming and shaming I won't post the video but I do have footage of someone rage quitting because of this.

For the time being if you get annoyed by this take a step away from pvp or go and find a small battle where these issue don't matter, just take a breath. Even msg someone on the opposite faction and organise a small scale fight on another campaign, anything that takes you away from it because it can be incredibly frustrating especially when there is nothing you can do about it.

OR

Opposing factions need to form an agreement to burn enemy camps that have been placed to troll. Some people can band together to stop this, though it needs to be an organised group so as not to lead players to legitimate camps. This could very easily turn into another form of trolling if it gets out of hand, though perhaps a lesser evil as another camp CAN be put down, however people of the same alliance CANNOT burn their own camp. We are all playing the same game after all, helping each other out to make it fun and fair is really the aim behind this.

I would like to hear from customer service on this as I don't want to be penalised for organising something that is considered cheating/spying etc, if the decision is made not to do it, I won't.

We have people who are willing to burn our trollcamps. But you are asking them to wander around Cyrodiil just to burn camps, sometimes for hours at a time. (Yes, this trollcamper will trollcamp for hours at a time. And often several AD have to escort them so randoms don't gank and kill the generous person who is burning the camps for us, meaning that they also cannot participate in PVP.

And the reason we are so frustrated with this is because the trollcamps block every single fight that's happening.

There is nowhere else to go. And other than that, the solution you present is to stop PVPing. So it begs the question of what are we paying for?

[Moderator Note: Edited quote to match moderated version]

Lord_Draevan · October 2014

A solution to this would be to allow us to burn friendly camps. Obviously not a one button press like for enemy camps to prevent accidents, maybe a "Are you sure you want to burn this Forward Camp?" text prompt.

Or, maybe camps degrade very quickly if no one uses them for X amount of time, but that would mess with camps placed inside keeps and left there in case it unexpectedly comes under siege... maybe those inside keep walls would be exempt from this time degradation?

Rylana · October 2014

A certain failure of the ad variety should just be banned or suspended at this point.

I dont condone griefers in any way, but this is a special case, as this guy revels in the fact he is griefing and causing massive ruckus that is neither needed nor warranted.

Troll for the sake of troll, and I cant stand people like that.

ZOS_TristanK · October 2014

Hi, all. We wanted to pop in and let you know that we've removed several off-topic and disruptive comments from this thread. Please be sure to keep comments focused on the topic at hand.

We also want to let you know that we've been keeping an eye on forward camps and are developing ways of addressing some of these concerns. For instance in Update 5, you'll need to be at least Alliance Rank 6 to purchase Forward Camps. We are continuing to read your feedback here and on the PTS forums about this change and about Forward Camps in general, and welcome your other suggestions and input.

NadiusMaximus · October 2014

Then everyone would be here complaining about a failure of a player going around burning the properly placed camps griefing us that way.

jkirchner71ub17_ESO2 · October 2014

The bottom of the line is when one sub-paying player can compromise the experiences of the many sub-paying players via an "exploit of the game mechanics" then it warrants a ban and or investigation - PERIOD. Too often we hear Zos say "it is not in the spirit of the game" when it comes to their inability to address these issues that do jeopardize the "spirit of the game". I am beginning to wonder what is this "spirit" they speak of? Too often we have players hop on these troll camp threads and begin offering wonderful advice like - why don't you just rez at a nearby friendly keep and pony-up, the faction needs to keep FCs down so troll campers can't troll camp, players need to learn to "battlefield rez" dead players? But in the end for me, and you would assume any smart business, it comes down to one or two paying customers compromising the experiences of many paying customers.

And they think this Rank 6 change is going to improve things? They don't understand the mentality of some players and how quickly Rank 6 can be acquired. Why aren't FCs also Bind on Acquire / Pick-Up? Is there any good reason they aren't or maybe we are seeing more of the lackadaisical development of PvP game mechanics - like being able to place FCs at Gate Keeps, where there is completely NO REASON whatsoever to be able to drop them at Gate Keeps. We saw a certain AD of a failure player drop so many FCs this weekend in an effort to keep AD at the 10 Max FC Cap he was sure to keep them up at the Gate Keeps on more than one occasion. Sadly in some cases when placed at Gate Keeps it can hinder the defense of scroll temples and yet based on responses I got to numerous reports to Zos the "while not in the spirit of the game the placement of forward camps" is not an exploit. pffft.

Bramir · October 2014

Rank 6 to purchase camps is going to have literally zero effect on this situation.

How difficult is it to think these things through before implementing them? ZOS still has time to correct this waste of time at least...

The rule needs to be rank 6 to PLACE a camp, or make them bind of pickup. Don't bother with it at all if you can't implement it properly.

fritzOSU03 · October 2014

Lord_Draevan wrote: »

A solution to this would be to allow us to burn friendly camps. Obviously not a one button press like for enemy camps to prevent accidents, maybe a "Are you sure you want to burn this Forward Camp?" text prompt.

Or, maybe camps degrade very quickly if no one uses them for X amount of time, but that would mess with camps placed inside keeps and left there in case it unexpectedly comes under siege... maybe those inside keep walls would be exempt from this time degradation?

Brilliant but with one minor modification. I think you should probably have four players, one per corner, to remove the camp. If you're having problems with camps, a single four-man team could remove a camp as soon as one is needed in another area. It would also be a nice bonus if this deconstruction gives a good AP boost if the camp isn't located within a certain range of a keep or a resource. Maybe 7200 AP/4 or 1800 AP per player? Nothing would make my experience with a troll camper more gratifying than knowing that I'm making AP off of their despicable efforts.

jkirchner71ub17_ESO2 · October 2014

Yes it is definitely not too late. But based on my experiences in MMOs, once it hits PTS it is essentially a done deal short of fixing bugs the players discover. I hope Zos proves me wrong here and takes stronger steps with FCs. Up the rank requirement higher than rank 6, increase the AP cost and/or make them Bind on Acquire / Pick-Up. What we saw this weekend by that failure of an AD player was the most extreme I have seen it yet to date and this Rank 6 change won't resolve the issue at hand.

Short of Zos completely removing FCs from Cyrodiil we will always have issues with Troll Camps but they need to take further steps or we will be right back here complaining and raging once the dust settles on the next update and failure of an AD has enough time to hit rank 6.

Dominoid · October 2014

I don't have a particular dog in this fight but here's what I see looking in. People are complaining about troll camps being placed. The apparent popular solution to troll camps is to remove forward camps entirely. If you are proposing the removal of forward camps as the solution to troll camps, why do troll camps bother you? You don't want to use camps? Troll camps solved your problem.

Jaxsun · October 2014

NadiusMaximus wrote: »

The only way out is to get rid of the camps altogether, and make one auto appear in a random location around the attacked place once it is flagged.

I second this motion.

jkirchner71ub17_ESO2 · October 2014

Jaxsun wrote: »

NadiusMaximus wrote: »

The only way out is to get rid of the camps altogether, and make one auto appear in a random location around the attacked place once it is flagged.

I second this motion.

This is an interesting idea.

DezIsDead · October 2014

ZOS_TristanK wrote: »

Hi, all. We wanted to pop in and let you know that we've removed several off-topic and disruptive comments from this thread. Please be sure to keep comments focused on the topic at hand.

We also want to let you know that we've been keeping an eye on forward camps and are developing ways of addressing some of these concerns. For instance in Update 5, you'll need to be at least Alliance Rank 6 to purchase Forward Camps. We are continuing to read your feedback here and on the PTS forums about this change and about Forward Camps in general, and welcome your other suggestions and input.

well zos thanks for getting involved. just my .02, making people have to be alliance rank 6 isnt much of a fix. there are tons of brilliant suggestions in the forums about how to fix them. i dont know how feasible they are due to coding etc, but im sure you could make one work and avoid these situations. obviously a camp placed at our gates is a troll camp, it's pretty simple to know that.

Desdemonte · October 2014

ZOS_TristanK wrote: »

For instance in Update 5, you'll need to be at least Alliance Rank 6 to purchase Forward Camps.

Great idea!

lowf · October 2014

Has the idea of only allowing you to play PvP for a single alliance per account been considered? I imagine troll camps are being placed by people with an alt in some other alliance. Perhaps limiting an account to only play for a single alliance, combined with the rank requirement planned, could help?

Grim13 · October 2014

xsorusb14_ESO wrote: »

Malveria wrote: »

Darthryan wrote: »

I don't think people are.unsubbing because of troll camps. Its such a minor annoyance to leave a game for.

My diminishing friends and farewells list begs to differ.

If your friends quit over troll camps in this game I wouldn't bother playing any other games with them... You got to be thin skinned to quit over something like that. In fact judging by the fact you think they quit over that I can guarantee you had to listen to a barrage of excuses nightly for why they lost and most consisted of how the other side "cheats"

lol

Per usual, your response is unnecessarily [snip].

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Cursing & Profanity and Edited quote to match moderated version]

Grim13 · October 2014

Having thin skin would be quitting the first time it happened...

..what the AD are seeing, and I can only speak to the AD Thornblade NA experience, is a month + of repeated troll camping by a single person... who is willing to devote upwards of 8 hours a day to griefing the experience of every AD on the most populated server!

When you add in all of the other broken a PvP player has been forced to tolerate... then it's completely understandable that ZOS' inability to rein this in could be the final nail in the coffin for many.