Dear ZOS — What ESO players think of the ARMOR/STAMINA SYSTEMS: 70+ OPINIONS

ChillingSpree · September 2014

ALBUM HERE: http://imgur.com/a/0bpuK

There were many other screenshots of those in agreement that the armor system needs to be fixed, but I needed to keep the zip file under 10MB so I could send it to the developers. Despite the fact that I e-mailed it, I'm concerned it will not end up in their hands. Sending it through private channels also means that it won't create waves, it won't stimulate others to speak up, won't apply enough pressure, and won't get anything done. So I'm posting it here, where everyone can see it. If you agree, or have anything to add, please post here. Please don't dispute whether the armor and stamina systems are messed up unless you can provide actual evidence, mathematical, theoretical, or otherwise. Emotional arguments aren't going to do any good. I like heavy armor too... it's got the best models in the game, and it matches the character archetype I was going for in my templar. That was the whole point of creating a templar: a caster wearing plate armor. But nobody who's looked at the numbers can dispute the fact that heavy armor is substantially weaker, for ANY class and ANY role, than light armor.

So I encourage everyone to look through these opinions, look at the numbers, and form your own opinions. If you agree, and want BALANCE, then speak up. We need to speak loud and clear so ZOS can understand that we want balance, and we want it NOW. We're not content with waiting months for a major update. We want a patch, a hotfix, something that will solve this problem so that we don't have to keep paying $15/month for a game that doesn't let us pick the characters it said we could pick. Those who played the beta know that this complaint has been voiced a thousand times, and very little has been done about it other than the vampire dk fix. This solved a few vastly overpowered builds, but has not changed the fact that virtually all experienced/knowledgeable players, in all roles, wear light armor. We're not asking for nerfs to light armor... we're asking for the ability to wear heavy armor without getting laughed at. Even if you wear light armor and enjoy the advantages you have, a rebalance will allow you to make new characters, with new archetypes, and new backstories. It will make the realm of Tamriel realistic again. It will allow ESO to fit with the lore and the general TES universe. Without heavy armor, the game just doesn't make sense.

ZOS: Please fix this problem. If you can't take my word for it, then look through the album I've conveniently compiled for you, so you can see that I'm not the only one. If that's still not enough, then hopefully you can look through the other threads regarding this complaint, and some of the replies that will probably be posted in this thread.

http://imgur.com/a/0bpuK

ers101284b14_ESO · September 2014

/facepalm

They already know about stamina issues. They have already responded saying they are taking it slow instead of the normal knee jerk nerf everything reaction they did at the beginning. And contrary to popular belief hanging over people's shoulders telling them to hurry up and asking if its done yet every 10
Seconds does not actually make anyone work faster.

LtCrunch · September 2014

Medium is in a pretty good place right now and heavy is the best it's ever been, but they both still need some more tweaks. I would rather they continue to do small incremental changes and see how it affects the meta instead of trying to perform surgery with a sledgehammer.

I don't want to see the balancing of this game go the way of many other MMOs where a class or build can go from terrible to extremely overpowering within one patch.

Patience.

ChillingSpree · September 2014

ers101284b14_ESO wrote: »

/facepalm

They already know about stamina issues. They have already responded saying they are taking it slow instead of the normal knee jerk nerf everything reaction they did at the beginning. And contrary to popular belief hanging over people's shoulders telling them to hurry up and asking if its done yet every 10
Seconds does not actually make anyone work faster.

Okay, show me one instance where ZOS has acknowledged they are working on the fact that heavy armor is gimped. I actually spent several hours looking for a single instance of this before I made my other thread yesterday. There's not a single acknowledgement anywhere, in a single "Road Ahead" or update announcement. They haven't mentioned it even once, so you're just talking out of your ass. Moreover, the game has now been out for 5 months and this complaint has been aired even since beta. That's enough time to put out 4 updates with new content, new meshes, new models, new features, new everything, but not enough time to modify a few numbers and variables in the game's code? If you want to give ESO the benefit of the doubt, that's fine, but don't make something up to undermine valid complaints in the process. It makes you look like you're brown nosing, honestly. These complaints are 100% valid, and there hasn't been any acknowledgement that they're actually working on it. I've even e-mailed customer support to ask them to find me an instance where ZOS acknowledged they were working on it. Such an instance does not exist. So don't use made-up stories to try to undermine these complaints.

jelliedsoup · September 2014

Taking it slow does not mean making one change over several months.

Ive played since beta and have tried to make a stam build work. Simple fact is they don't.

I was thinking about remodelling my build to do more DPS and surprise surprise it involved increasing my magicka.

Any slower and glaciers would be moving at light speed.

ChillingSpree · September 2014

Brandalf wrote: »

Medium is in a pretty good place right now and heavy is the best it's ever been, but they both still need some more tweaks. I would rather they continue to do small incremental changes and see how it affects the meta instead of trying to perform surgery with a sledgehammer.

I don't want to see the balancing of this game go the way of many other MMOs where a class or build can go from terrible to extremely overpowering within one patch.

Patience.

I agree that it should be done incrementally, but it's been several months without a single change to stamina or heavy armor, period. Should be changed at least once every two weeks. But it's not, which suggests they're not working on it at all. Patience is a virtue, but not when you're sending ZOS $15 a month to pay for something that you're not getting. I don't pay Wal-Mart $15 a month for a $15 product I haven't even been promised I'm going to receive.

jelliedsoup · September 2014

Brandalf wrote: »

Medium is in a pretty good place right now and heavy is the best it's ever been, but they both still need some more tweaks. I would rather they continue to do small incremental changes and see how it affects the meta instead of trying to perform surgery with a sledgehammer.

I don't want to see the balancing of this game go the way of many other MMOs where a class or build can go from terrible to extremely overpowering within one patch.

Patience.

Patience is waiting for something which hasn't been scheduled?

ChillingSpree · September 2014

jelliedsoup wrote: »

Taking it slow does not mean making one change over several months.

Ive played since beta and have tried to make a stam build work. Simple fact is they don't.

I was thinking about remodelling my build to do more DPS and surprise surprise it involved increasing my magicka.

Any slower and glaciers would be moving at light speed.

Truth... while they're "making changes incrementally," we're paying $15 a month and getting no changes, several months in a row. This should be ZOS' top priority, yet they're putting all their energy into making new endgame content, instead of fixing the characters that are going to actually end up playing that content. If you want to actually play the endgame content wearing anything but a dress and a broomstick, you're going to have to start complaining about this. The way it's going right now, you're not gonna be running the Dragonstar Arena unless you're conforming to the singular class archetype that is viable in the current metagame. The fact is, being heavy handed about solving this isn't as bad as it sounds. The metagame already feels heavyhanded, it already feels totally butchered, so a quick change, even if sloppy, could hardly be any worse. It's not like it could make heavy armor any more useless than it already is. Even if it makes heavy armor and stam OP, at least we get a turn for once, and while they're solving that problem, they'll start to figure out balancing the two...

ChillingSpree · September 2014

jelliedsoup wrote: »

Brandalf wrote: »

Medium is in a pretty good place right now and heavy is the best it's ever been, but they both still need some more tweaks. I would rather they continue to do small incremental changes and see how it affects the meta instead of trying to perform surgery with a sledgehammer.

I don't want to see the balancing of this game go the way of many other MMOs where a class or build can go from terrible to extremely overpowering within one patch.

Patience.

Patience is waiting for something which hasn't been scheduled?

Hah, exactly. They haven't mentioned even once that they're going to fix this issue. I didn't pay to play an ELDER SCROLLS game with a broken character system. I don't continue to pay so I can be patient for something that nobody has confirmed is even going to happen. It's childish to expect something from game developers that hasn't been explicitly promised. They have no legal or financial obligation to fix this system. As long as people continue to pay their subscription fee, there's really no reason to fix anything that's broken. The only way we're going to see them prioritize this massive, gaping hole in the game, is if we TALK about it, COMPLAIN about it, even threaten to drop our subscriptions. Their income doesn't derive from making a balanced game, it derives from people paying their subscription fee. As long as we keep paying our fees, expecting that they'll eventually fix this, they have no reason to fix it.

Ironically, if you hold on hoping for change, you actually give them no reason to change.

Phinix1 · September 2014

ers101284b14_ESO wrote: »

/facepalm

They already know about stamina issues. They have already responded saying they are taking it slow instead of the normal knee jerk nerf everything reaction they did at the beginning. And contrary to popular belief hanging over people's shoulders telling them to hurry up and asking if its done yet every 10
Seconds does not actually make anyone work faster.

So far slow and steady seems to equate to basically nothing. A little extra stamina regen on medium armor in 5 months is PROGRESS?

Stamina weapons have CRAP AOE, mediocre damage, and have to share their damage resource with defensive abilities.

Also, they have to split their stats between stamina and magicka to avoid totally gimping the damage of class skills, which they must use since most stamina weapon abilities are crap, and there aren't enough worthwhile stamina abilities to fill a bar.

I don't really see some extra stamina regen as progress, but I am sure they will get there... some day... over the rainbow...

LtCrunch · September 2014

ChillingSpree wrote: »

Brandalf wrote: »

Medium is in a pretty good place right now and heavy is the best it's ever been, but they both still need some more tweaks. I would rather they continue to do small incremental changes and see how it affects the meta instead of trying to perform surgery with a sledgehammer.

I don't want to see the balancing of this game go the way of many other MMOs where a class or build can go from terrible to extremely overpowering within one patch.

Patience.

I agree that it should be done incrementally, but it's been several months without a single change to stamina or heavy armor, period. Should be changed at least once every two weeks. But it's not, which suggests they're not working on it at all. Patience is a virtue, but not when you're sending ZOS $15 a month to pay for something that you're not getting. I don't pay Wal-Mart $15 a month for a $15 product I haven't even been promised I'm going to receive.

Sorry but the bolded statement is just not true, medium got buffed in 1.2, heavy got buffed in1.3, light is getting a small nerf in 1.4. Stamina abilities have gotten or are getting buffed in all 3 of those updates. They're actively making changes with each major update, as well as constantly hitting their content cadence of 4-6 weeks; not many MMO developers can boast that.

If you can't justify paying $15 a month for ESO, then don't pay it and wait until the things you're concerned about are addressed in full. However if you're still paying it than something is obviously keeping you around.

ChillingSpree · September 2014

Brandalf wrote: »

ChillingSpree wrote: »

Brandalf wrote: »

Medium is in a pretty good place right now and heavy is the best it's ever been, but they both still need some more tweaks. I would rather they continue to do small incremental changes and see how it affects the meta instead of trying to perform surgery with a sledgehammer.

I don't want to see the balancing of this game go the way of many other MMOs where a class or build can go from terrible to extremely overpowering within one patch.

Patience.

I agree that it should be done incrementally, but it's been several months without a single change to stamina or heavy armor, period. Should be changed at least once every two weeks. But it's not, which suggests they're not working on it at all. Patience is a virtue, but not when you're sending ZOS $15 a month to pay for something that you're not getting. I don't pay Wal-Mart $15 a month for a $15 product I haven't even been promised I'm going to receive.

Sorry but the bolded statement is just not true, medium got buffed in 1.2, heavy got buffed in1.3, light is getting a small nerf in 1.4. Stamina abilities have gotten or are getting buffed in all 3 of those updates. They're actively making changes with each major update, as well as constantly hitting their content cadence of 4-6 weeks; not many MMO developers can boast that.

If you can't justify paying $15 a month for ESO, then don't pay it and wait until the things you're concerned about are addressed in full. However if you're still paying it than something is obviously keeping you around.

Uhh, right, how exactly did heavy armor get buffed in 1.3? Because that's just flat out not in the patch notes. And I'm not "still paying it," I bought 9 months when I paid for the game thinking that it actually had a balanced character system. Somehow the AAA developers managed to produce the most imbalanced character system of any game I've ever played, and now it's too late for me to stop paying. I'm still playing the game because I'm an elder scrolls junkie. But if they won't fix this, then what reason do I have to renew my subscription? They haven't said they're going to fix it, they haven't done anything about it, they've made a few minor changes a few months ago that cured a few vastly OP builds but didn't stop light armor from being by far the dominant choice, even for tanks, so where is the evidence that it's gonna get better? I haven't found any evidence that what you said was true regarding 1.3 and 1.4. It's true they buffed medium in 1.2, that was months ago... just like I said. In fact, that's what I was referring to. So where's the proof that they buffed heavy in 1.3, and where's the proof they're gonna nerf light in 1.4? From what I've read, they're not nerfing anything, and in fact I don't want them to. They shouldn't have to nerf light armor to make the game balanced. They should make it so that stamina builds don't have to share resources with abilities that everyone needs to use, like rolling and blocking and breaking CC. They should make it so that heavy armor actually gives an armor bonus, and is actually a viable choice for templar magicka builds. They should make it so that not all class skills use magicka, which forces anyone who's not 100% caster to split their attributes, weakening ALL their attacks and gimping them.

You should be able to choose between stamina and magicka, between light and heavy. Right now the only option is magicka and light armor, if you actually want to win. You might pick medium if you want to be a rebel, but you're gonna have a harder time succeeding, and if you disagree with that then you're either naive or lying to yourself. The fact is that the only thing differentiating each class from each other is the class skills. Since they all use magicka, if you pick a stamina build, you pretty much don't even have a class. You're using weapon skills, fighters guild skills, maybe some others, and ultra-weak class skills. If you want to actually BE your class, you have to pick magicka. If they fixed the system so that some class skills cost magicka, and some cost stamina, and maybe some cost both, it could fix that problem.

But they could also change it so that for some classes, class skills would cost whichever resource the player had specced higher in. They would also need to change roll dodge, CC break, and block to cost whichever resource the player had specced higher in. Because if you pick stamina, not only do you have to make do with weaker class skills, (or slightly weaker class AND weapon skills) you also have to drain your primary resource every time you dodge, block, or break CC. For magicka builds, you can keep burning, with max dps from max magicka, AND when you have to break CC or dodge or block, you aren't sacrificing your primary resource. That concept is the most obviously imbalanced thing in the game. If magicka and stamina are supposed to be equal resources, why does stamina get wasted when sprinting, blocking, dodging, and breaking CC? It would be fair if magicka regenerated more slowly, or if magicka attacks did less damage, but neither of those is true. In fact, stamina attacks do less damage per point on average! So what's the deal? Magicka has virtually every advantage. They could solve this any number of ways, but they don't.

LtCrunch · September 2014

ChillingSpree wrote: »

Brandalf wrote: »

ChillingSpree wrote: »

Brandalf wrote: »

Medium is in a pretty good place right now and heavy is the best it's ever been, but they both still need some more tweaks. I would rather they continue to do small incremental changes and see how it affects the meta instead of trying to perform surgery with a sledgehammer.

I don't want to see the balancing of this game go the way of many other MMOs where a class or build can go from terrible to extremely overpowering within one patch.

Patience.

I agree that it should be done incrementally, but it's been several months without a single change to stamina or heavy armor, period. Should be changed at least once every two weeks. But it's not, which suggests they're not working on it at all. Patience is a virtue, but not when you're sending ZOS $15 a month to pay for something that you're not getting. I don't pay Wal-Mart $15 a month for a $15 product I haven't even been promised I'm going to receive.

Sorry but the bolded statement is just not true, medium got buffed in 1.2, heavy got buffed in1.3, light is getting a small nerf in 1.4. Stamina abilities have gotten or are getting buffed in all 3 of those updates. They're actively making changes with each major update, as well as constantly hitting their content cadence of 4-6 weeks; not many MMO developers can boast that.

If you can't justify paying $15 a month for ESO, then don't pay it and wait until the things you're concerned about are addressed in full. However if you're still paying it than something is obviously keeping you around.

Uhh, right, how exactly did heavy armor get buffed in 1.3? Because that's just flat out not in the patch notes. And I'm not "still paying it," I bought 9 months when I paid for the game thinking that it actually had a balanced character system. *Snip*

Directly from the v1.3.3 patch notes:

Armor
Heavy Armor
Constitution: This passive now restores magicka and stamina when you take damage.

There was also a buff in the same patch that was not mentioned in the patch notes for whatever reason. Juggernaut now reduces the cost of break free by 2%/4% per piece of heavy armor worn. It's not enough to completely fix the problem but it's been relatively recent. I don't dispute heavy and to a lesser extent medium armor still need a bit of love. They are however in a much better position than ever before.

As for the rest of your post, I'm not going to play "arm-chair" developer. I don't design games for a living, and I'm willing to bet you don't either, so let's leave it that to the professionals.

KariTR · September 2014

This is a discussion forum. You can't demand people agree with an opinion or not post, that smacks of a petition, not a topic for discussion and these forums don't allow petitions.

ChillingSpree · September 2014

KariTR wrote: »

This is a discussion forum. You can't demand people agree with an opinion or not post, that smacks of a petition, not a topic for discussion and these forums don't allow petitions.

Did I demand that people agree with an opinion? I said I don't care about emotional points of view, and please don't clutter the thread with your "I still love heavy armor" posts unless you have a mathematical or theoretical way of backing it up. I backed up all my points with theoretical evidence, so if you want to disagree, and want me to actually listen to it, then you'll have to match that methodology. I never said that you can't post if you disagree... besides, how would I enforce that?

ChillingSpree · September 2014

Brandalf wrote: »

Directly from the v1.3.3 patch notes:

Armor
Heavy Armor
Constitution: This passive now restores magicka and stamina when you take damage.

There was also a buff in the same patch that was not mentioned in the patch notes for whatever reason. Juggernaut now reduces the cost of break free by 2%/4% per piece of heavy armor worn. It's not enough to completely fix the problem but it's been relatively recent. I don't dispute heavy and to a lesser extent medium armor still need a bit of love. They are however in a much better position than ever before.

As for the rest of your post, I'm not going to play "arm-chair" developer. I don't design games for a living, and I'm willing to bet you don't either, so let's leave it that to the professionals.

Ah okay, I was looking at v1.3.0 I guess? While I see what you mean, these aren't nearly enough to solve the problem. The simple fact that heavy armor plus immovable is far above the soft cap, and light armor plus immovable can reach the soft cap, means that heavy armor has no advantage. So long as light armor wearers can reach roughly the same armor rating that heavy armor wearers get, while receiving much better passive skills than heavy armor receives, we will have this problem. Giving tiny boosts to healing, etc, does not solve the problem. As of now, heavy armor only helps people who don't realize they should be using armor/spell resist buffs when they wear light armor.

I certainly don't develop games for a living, but I've played quite a few games and I've seen the way they balance them. I'm not purporting to know the right way to do this, merely stating that there are some very obvious problems. I don't think any of my suggestions would be perfect, but they would certainly be an improvement to what we have now. If the developers would instate some of these imperfect solutions, they would help the problem for now, appease a LOT of people, and then they could slowly work on perfecting the solution while testing and analyzing the changes caused by these imperfect solutions. Perfect solutions take a lot of analysis and testing, no matter which way you want to approach it, and you're never gonna get those solutions unless you start with imperfect ones. You have to hone the game, and inch towards a perfect solution. You can't just jump from the heap of crap that we call ESO's balance to a perfect harmony between stam/magicka and armor types. That doesn't just take time, it also takes incremental changes. And I've seen no incremental changes that would make any difference, other than minuscule buffs that aren't actually approaching the root problem, which is that heavy armor offers no real advantage in armor rating.

The fact that heavy armor and light armor soft caps are the same is the root problem, and the reason I say this would be easy to fix is because it WOULD be. They have changed the soft caps multiple times, and I imagine it's as simple as typing in a different number. Why they won't do this on the PTS, picking a new number every couple days, and getting to the perfect one through trial and error, is beyond me. They could be testing this RIGHT NOW, but they're not.

edit: Also I personally feel that heavy armor should give a large spell resist or spell reflect passive. It makes no sense to give such huge spell resistance to light armor, yet not give it to the people wearing reflect plates of armor made out of metal. Reflects/resistance makes sense not only from a realistic/lore standpoint, but also from a balance point of view. Since virtually all attacks in PvP are going to come in the form of magicka skills, it makes no sense that heavy armor wearers are more vulnerable in PvP than light armor wearers. If light armor wearers are more resistant to spells by a margin of over 60% after passives when they use annulment, then the game is broken. Mages are supposed to be squishy. They're supposed to be weak to all attacks, and supposed to depend on burst dps to kill before getting hit. Heavy armor wearers are so weak to spells that it's funny to see someone wearing heavy armor in cyro. In my opinion, light armor should ONLY give bonuses to DPS, and should give nothing for defenses. Heavy armor should be by far the most resistant type of armor, and it should be resistant to both stamina AND magicka attacks. Rarely in PvP are you going to be attacked by melee weapons... So it's ridiculous that heavy armor gives not only bonuses to physical defense like this, but also bonuses to melee weapon damage. Why do we get bonuses to the least needed form of defense, AND bonuses to the weakest type of attacks? We're supposed to be by far the most defensive... yet we're, in fact, by far the most vulnerable in PvP, AND by far the weakest in terms of dps, since we can't keep our magicka regenerating. Even with an 8-trait set we're still at a huge disadvantage with resource management.

Uisi · September 2014

This is a gamebreaking issue and they need to fix'it soon!
Personally, I dont think this is about patience, we pay some money every month and for that money we want to be heard, we want a product that meet our expectations. It is very important to remember that this is not a free to play game, here patience is money and, for all of us, a day will come when patience is not worth the price. Attitude like ”don't pay it and wait” is not constructive for the game and the community, because a mmorpg is sustained by paying customer and, even if you like the game and have more patience then others, you can't play'it ALONE!

AshySamurai · September 2014

I won't work faster if someone will standing right behind me and yelling at me all time: "Fix it! Fix it! Fix it!".

We have a nice topic about it and ZOS response there that they know about this issue and looking on it. So stop beating a dead horse (damn, this phrase become most frequently used for me on this forum).

Mendoze · September 2014

To be honest, I just don't understand why developers don't change armor skills to required at least 5 pieces before they can be used. Like immovable should need at least 5 heavy armor pieces. That should make a huge difference alone.

ChillingSpree · September 2014

AshySamurai wrote: »

I won't work faster if someone will standing right behind me and yelling at me all time: "Fix it! Fix it! Fix it!".

We have a nice topic about it and ZOS response there that they know about this issue and looking on it. So stop beating a dead horse (damn, this phrase become most frequently used for me on this forum).

Yeah, I know... I made the topic... and this album is literally full of responses FROM that topic.

DuelWieldingCheesyPoofs · September 2014

Your a little late Lol

Nox_Aeterna · September 2014

While the issues are obvious , i find this way quite silly to show it.

Personally i think that to only cut posts that agree with you from threads proves nothing.

Im quite sure i can, if i search the forums , fill 70+ (much more than that) posts that favor pretty much anything , put them on my thread and pretend that shows how important an issue is.

ChillingSpree · September 2014

Nox_Aeterna wrote: »

While the issues are obvious , i find this way quite silly to show it.

Personally i think that to only cut posts that agree with you from threads proves nothing.

Im quite sure i can, if i search the forums , fill 70+ (much more than that) posts that favor pretty much anything , put them on my thread and pretend that shows how important an issue is.

You can look at the thread that I pulled all these quotes from. Nearly all of them were in agreement. It's called "Armor Balance" I think... I made the thread, so maybe that's a reason why most of them agree with me. Either way, like I said in my post, I had to limit the number of quotes I included. I couldn't upload any more than what I already did, which is 9.8MB. The fact is, if you've got a tank and you're not wearing heavy armor, then you should be complaining too. If you haven't tried to play a tank class wearing heavy armor, then you really can't disagree with any credibility because you're not aware of how severely gimped is. This is why I said there's a learning curve here... it seems like everyone I've met who disagrees that armor is imbalanced is conveniently a light armor staff user. If you're on the bad end of an update that nerfs light armor and magicka, or buffs heavy armor and stamina, then I can see why you'd disagree... but this is a pretty objective issue. Most experienced players have multiple characters, all of which have been forced to use light armor. A nerf to light armor would make our characters weaker... but it would allow us to use heavy armor on those characters that we feel are MEANT to wear heavy armor. Such as my paladin character... I don't really like being force to wear light armor just to survive. It doesn't fit the backstory that I developed for the character. It doesn't fit the way I like to think about my character. That might sound cheesy to you, but you'll find that ESO has the highest population of RP-minded players of any popular MMO I've ever played or heard of. Most of us play ESO the same way we've played every other elder scrolls game... thinking about character development, backstory, and archetypes. My character no longer fits the archetype he was meant to portray, because he's stuck wearing light armor just to survive. I can't do heavy armor because it gives me no extra armor value, no extra spell resistance, and no magicka regen and reduced spell cost when compared to light armor. With light armor, I get all these benefits, and I can easily hit armor cap with one spell, which I'm allowed to steal from the heavy armor skill line. So I'm clearly benefiting from this imbalance, since I'm playing with the OP gear and skills... but honestly, I'm sick of it. I don't want to have such an OP build if it means I have to sacrifice the fact that my character is a paladin. I want to be on EQUAL ground with everyone else, and I want SKILL to be the determinant of who wins and who loses. Skill does not mean choosing light armor over heavy armor... all it takes to make that decision is a pro telling you what to do, or a quick look at the passives and the soft caps. That's not skill, that's simply selecting the only viable option.

reften · September 2014

it's so simple.

Make armor matter.
Have caps on light/med/heavy pieces that are much more significant.

done.

Stratti · September 2014

ChillingSpree wrote: »

Brandalf wrote: »

Directly from the v1.3.3 patch notes:

Armor
Heavy Armor
Constitution: This passive now restores magicka and stamina when you take damage.

There was also a buff in the same patch that was not mentioned in the patch notes for whatever reason. Juggernaut now reduces the cost of break free by 2%/4% per piece of heavy armor worn. It's not enough to completely fix the problem but it's been relatively recent. I don't dispute heavy and to a lesser extent medium armor still need a bit of love. They are however in a much better position than ever before.

As for the rest of your post, I'm not going to play "arm-chair" developer. I don't design games for a living, and I'm willing to bet you don't either, so let's leave it that to the professionals.

Ah okay, I was looking at v1.3.0 I guess? While I see what you mean, these aren't nearly enough to solve the problem. The simple fact that heavy armor plus immovable is far above the soft cap, and light armor plus immovable can reach the soft cap, means that heavy armor has no advantage. So long as light armor wearers can reach roughly the same armor rating that heavy armor wearers get, while receiving much better passive skills than heavy armor receives, we will have this problem. Giving tiny boosts to healing, etc, does not solve the problem. As of now, heavy armor only helps people who don't realize they should be using armor/spell resist buffs when they wear light armor.

I certainly don't develop games for a living, but I've played quite a few games and I've seen the way they balance them. I'm not purporting to know the right way to do this, merely stating that there are some very obvious problems. I don't think any of my suggestions would be perfect, but they would certainly be an improvement to what we have now. If the developers would instate some of these imperfect solutions, they would help the problem for now, appease a LOT of people, and then they could slowly work on perfecting the solution while testing and analyzing the changes caused by these imperfect solutions. Perfect solutions take a lot of analysis and testing, no matter which way you want to approach it, and you're never gonna get those solutions unless you start with imperfect ones. You have to hone the game, and inch towards a perfect solution. You can't just jump from the heap of crap that we call ESO's balance to a perfect harmony between stam/magicka and armor types. That doesn't just take time, it also takes incremental changes. And I've seen no incremental changes that would make any difference, other than minuscule buffs that aren't actually approaching the root problem, which is that heavy armor offers no real advantage in armor rating.

The fact that heavy armor and light armor soft caps are the same is the root problem, and the reason I say this would be easy to fix is because it WOULD be. They have changed the soft caps multiple times, and I imagine it's as simple as typing in a different number. Why they won't do this on the PTS, picking a new number every couple days, and getting to the perfect one through trial and error, is beyond me. They could be testing this RIGHT NOW, but they're not.

edit: Also I personally feel that heavy armor should give a large spell resist or spell reflect passive. It makes no sense to give such huge spell resistance to light armor, yet not give it to the people wearing reflect plates of armor made out of metal. Reflects/resistance makes sense not only from a realistic/lore standpoint, but also from a balance point of view. Since virtually all attacks in PvP are going to come in the form of magicka skills, it makes no sense that heavy armor wearers are more vulnerable in PvP than light armor wearers. If light armor wearers are more resistant to spells by a margin of over 60% after passives when they use annulment, then the game is broken. Mages are supposed to be squishy. They're supposed to be weak to all attacks, and supposed to depend on burst dps to kill before getting hit. Heavy armor wearers are so weak to spells that it's funny to see someone wearing heavy armor in cyro. In my opinion, light armor should ONLY give bonuses to DPS, and should give nothing for defenses. Heavy armor should be by far the most resistant type of armor, and it should be resistant to both stamina AND magicka attacks. Rarely in PvP are you going to be attacked by melee weapons... So it's ridiculous that heavy armor gives not only bonuses to physical defense like this, but also bonuses to melee weapon damage. Why do we get bonuses to the least needed form of defense, AND bonuses to the weakest type of attacks? We're supposed to be by far the most defensive... yet we're, in fact, by far the most vulnerable in PvP, AND by far the weakest in terms of dps, since we can't keep our magicka regenerating. Even with an 8-trait set we're still at a huge disadvantage with resource management.

As a Trial tank I run 5H/2L - with razor armor and spiked armor I'm hitting over 3k armor with the softcap being under 2k - if a tank is running anything less then yes he is doing his team a disservice . Plain and Simple - nothing mitigates better then Heavy with 2 Light . Magicka reserves are fine . Axes x4 still alive try doing that with light armor

Weak to spells = learn to play - Absorb Magic with reflective scales no issue

Green Dragon Blood with razor armor awesome

Yes you cannot dps in heavy armor as well as the others but that is fair enough

My opinion you are wrong