The Cost of Exploitation. Reference.

Armitas · August 2014

This is not a debate thread. This thread is to chronicle the cost that is paid due to exploiters. Of particular concern is the fact that the one who pays the cost of those who exploit is not the exploiter himself but everyone else who plays the game. I will try to keep this updated for reference purposes. If you have any additional costs to add please list them in the same manner and I will update the list.

1. Skill - Extended Chains. Exploiters were using extended chains and cross faction alts to pull players over walls and into keeps and over scroll gate walls. The response was to add a Y axis to extended chains. The consequence is that the skill barely works on players with the slightest difference in height and players can no longer pull keep defenders down from keep walls.

2. Siege Weapons - Rapid Deterioration. Exploiters were using siege weapons, particularly oil pots, to max out a keeps defensive siege cap. This was done so that the keep could not be defended and would be lost, resulting in the loss of emperor so that former emperor buffs could be farmed in a regular cycle without interference from those who wish to defend their territory. The consequence is that all siege weapons now have rapid deterioration if not in use.

3. Campaign Integrity The exploitation to derive former emperor buffs has resulted in destruction of campaign integrity and value. Including.
*Abusive and Harassing tells from players for not participating in or resisting former emperor farming.
*Players are harassed or threatened for not abdicating emperor to propagate former emperor farming
*Legitimate players are threatened by former emperor farmers that if they do not play along they will be falsely reported en masse.
* Campaign scores and territory are ignored and allowed to fall to facilitate emperor farming cycles.
(added from Dleatherus's post)

4. Delay of Bug fixes, Improvements, and Updates. Resources that could otherwise be used for fixing bugs, such as the door bug or the in combat bug, improving the game, such as the fps issues and memory leaks, or updating the game with new features are diverted toward finding ways to stop exploiters from exploiting.

Artemiisia · August 2014

Original Post:
yup lets list all the different ways of exploiting the game in one thread, so more can do them.....

Addition:
I misunderstood the thread, even from reading it, thx to @armitas and @pancake-Tragedy I understand the intension behind the thread.

For me the exploiters have ruined more for pve gaming then pvp, since everything affects each other, changing a fun skill in pve, because it gets overused and is to OP in pvp blows.

It would be greater if skills sets where designed for two game plays, pvp and pve

Armitas · August 2014

Artemiisia wrote: »

yup lets list all the different ways of exploiting the game in one thread, so more can do them.....

This is not a list of current exploits, it is a list of the costs that players incurred to stop former exploits used by exploiters. We are the ones who pay for the actions of exploiters.

Pancake-Tragedy · August 2014

Artemiisia wrote: »

yup lets list all the different ways of exploiting the game in one thread, so more can do them.....

I think the point of this thread went over your head. The OP is outlining former exploits and their consequences on the game.

Dleatherus · August 2014

Former Emperor farming

Personally I think this was the biggest exploit of them all

I watched as the selfish individuals and guilds wrecked first the Celarus campaign, and then other campaigns

their behaviour, particularly if legit players were trying to attack/defend keeps, was and is nothing short of disgusting

legit players would be sent harassing, abusive /tells

legit players would be harassed in zone by the mob mentality of the emperor farmers

legit players would be threatened to have all the exploiters report the legit player for exploiting and harassing and thus ban the LEGIT player

the emperor farmers were directly responsible for the DK chain pulling exploits and the max siege weapon limit exploits

I was a witness and target to all of the above - and funny enough to a large part am good with it

what i'm not good with is these selfish childish *** systematically over a period of several months drove hundreds, if not thousands, of players from PvP

sadly a large (but not all of them) majority of the 'elite' guilds that remain in cyrodiil took part in this ruining of the game for the rest of the PvP player base - what remains of it

D.

KBKB · August 2014

^ would be great if we could name and shame, these are the folks usually on their high horses calling others bad and throwing well thought out insults like "l2p". Truly funny how peoples egos can inflate so much from a series of pixels.

Halrloprillalar · August 2014

Which is why the fo(a)rmer emperor title is meaningless and trite to display.

Ifthir_ESO · August 2014

Exploiters have been ruining things (not just video games) since the dawn of time.

This is a people problem and you can't "fix" selfishness without more peer pressure. Rules alone never fix selfishness and greed.

Columba · August 2014

It's a shame that cheaters ruin the game for everyone. This is why we track them and refuse to group, speak with or help them. I wish zenimax wouldbe more aggressive in dealing with exploits.

driosketch · August 2014

This is the "Why we can't have nice things" thread.

Armitas · August 2014

driosketch wrote: »

This is the "Why we can't have nice things" thread.

Exactly.

bruceb14_ESO5 · August 2014

Exploits of skills bring about nerfs to skills that all pay for. OP makes a good point. ZOS has to spend resources then on balance over bugs or over new content. But if we have a skill that is OP, won't must of us spam it? Yet if it is a combination of skills or tactics that cause an unintended result that is misused, is that now taking advantage of an exploit or exploiting?

Gildren · August 2014

Yesterday I was told by a guild-mate that a DM went into one of the Cyrodiil servers and actually started policing some exploiters... publicly. My character doesn't happen to be a member or guest of that particular campaign, so yes I'm hearing second hand.

I'm not going to get into what the exploit supposedly was, or which pvp guild had members who were supposedly using the exploit, because I think that is not what is important to note here.

What I think is important is that is the first time in months of playing this game I have ever heard of any DM policing PvP in an aggressive public manner. It reminds me of the DM's approach to the botting problems in PvE.

If Zenimax would assign multiple DMs to each of Cyrodiil campaigns 24/7 and those DM's where openly present in /zone chat so that players knew they were there and looking for exploiters to ban, I think moral would improve.

Hopefully what I was told yesterday is true, and perhaps this indicates a move towards a more aggressive stance by Zenimax against exploiters in PvP.

Dleatherus · August 2014

Gildren wrote: »

Yesterday I was told by a guild-mate that a DM went into one of the Cyrodiil servers and actually started policing some exploiters... publicly. My character doesn't happen to be a member or guest of that particular campaign, so yes I'm hearing second hand.

I'm not going to get into what the exploit supposedly was, or which pvp guild had members who were supposedly using the exploit, because I think that is not what is important to note here.

What I think is important is that is the first time in months of playing this game I have ever heard of any DM policing PvP in an aggressive public manner. It reminds me of the DM's approach to the botting problems in PvE.

If Zenimax would assign multiple DMs to each of Cyrodiil campaigns 24/7 and those DM's where openly present in /zone chat so that players knew they were there and looking for exploiters to ban, I think moral would improve.

Hopefully what I was told yesterday is true, and perhaps this indicates a move towards a more aggressive stance by Zenimax against exploiters in PvP.

if this is true, then it's the best news i have heard in ages regarding the entire game, and maybe there is hope for it yet

awesome stuff!

D.

Komma · August 2014

Yes a gm was in cyrodiil and announced to all sides he/she was there and watching for people to go through the closed gates. Big brother is watching!

Rylana · August 2014

Emp farmers make me laugh. When I became emp of blackwater blade, one of the very first tells I got (no joke) was from a member of my own faction asking me if I was going to step down right away so that everyone on the top 10 could be emp.

I flat out told them to *** off, and even though I could tell certain elements of the faction never helped from that day forward, I made that stand and held my keeps until I leveled out of the campaign.

Farmers can suck it.

driosketch · August 2014

Rylana wrote: »

Emp farmers make me laugh. When I became emp of blackwater blade, one of the very first tells I got (no joke) was from a member of my own faction asking me if I was going to step down right away so that everyone on the top 10 could be emp.

I flat out told them to *** off, and even though I could tell certain elements of the faction never helped from that day forward, I made that stand and held my keeps until I leveled out of the campaign.

Farmers can suck it.

@Rylana You know I was wondering about that. We had a former EP join our side and tried to organize us into disposing you. Most on our side considered him a spy and refused to work with them. (Character name same as yours only with F and U in front.) It's kind of amusing. At the end of the day I respect your way of treating the empress position like it matters to the campaign you were in.

Luvsfuzzybunnies · August 2014

The worst part is once the exploits are no longer available those who did use them QQ cause they are no longer op and rage quit with a nice little forum message to see themselves out. Sad thing is the exploit erstwhile are always the ones telling others to L2P too.

Armitas · August 2014

Rylana wrote: »

Emp farmers make me laugh. When I became emp of blackwater blade, one of the very first tells I got (no joke) was from a member of my own faction asking me if I was going to step down right away so that everyone on the top 10 could be emp.

I flat out told them to *** off, and even though I could tell certain elements of the faction never helped from that day forward, I made that stand and held my keeps until I leveled out of the campaign.

Farmers can suck it.

Right on!

Rylana · August 2014

driosketch wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Emp farmers make me laugh. When I became emp of blackwater blade, one of the very first tells I got (no joke) was from a member of my own faction asking me if I was going to step down right away so that everyone on the top 10 could be emp.

I flat out told them to *** off, and even though I could tell certain elements of the faction never helped from that day forward, I made that stand and held my keeps until I leveled out of the campaign.

Farmers can suck it.

@Rylana You know I was wondering about that. We had a former EP join our side and tried to organize us into disposing you. Most on our side considered him a spy and refused to work with them. (Character name same as yours only with F and U in front.) It's kind of amusing. At the end of the day I respect your way of treating the empress position like it matters to the campaign you were in.

Its just the way I play and my ownpersonal code of conduct. When I am on AD, I am AD. When I am on EP, I am EP. When I am on DC (tba,

) I will be DC.

Spying is dumb, undermining the faction youre representing is dumb, but being crossfaction is just being a PvPer. Besides, you get more pewpew having toons in different factions. Someone is always the underdog somewhere.

The F U Lyzara guy, I know who they are, and its kinda stupid. They actively tried to stop me being emp in EP zone all of the time. I havent reported the name for harassment simply because the concept made me lol hard, I actually have a fanboy now.

I am probably coming back to blackwater in the near future, I have a level 5 DC alt that I set up last night and moved my mule stuff out of. So you never know, I might be on your side next cycle.

Cody · August 2014

Rylana wrote: »

driosketch wrote: »

Rylana wrote: »

Emp farmers make me laugh. When I became emp of blackwater blade, one of the very first tells I got (no joke) was from a member of my own faction asking me if I was going to step down right away so that everyone on the top 10 could be emp.

I flat out told them to *** off, and even though I could tell certain elements of the faction never helped from that day forward, I made that stand and held my keeps until I leveled out of the campaign.

Farmers can suck it.

@Rylana You know I was wondering about that. We had a former EP join our side and tried to organize us into disposing you. Most on our side considered him a spy and refused to work with them. (Character name same as yours only with F and U in front.) It's kind of amusing. At the end of the day I respect your way of treating the empress position like it matters to the campaign you were in.

Its just the way I play and my ownpersonal code of conduct. When I am on AD, I am AD. When I am on EP, I am EP. When I am on DC (tba, ) I will be DC.

Spying is dumb, undermining the faction youre representing is dumb, but being crossfaction is just being a PvPer. Besides, you get more pewpew having toons in different factions. Someone is always the underdog somewhere.

The F U Lyzara guy, I know who they are, and its kinda stupid. They actively tried to stop me being emp in EP zone all of the time. I havent reported the name for harassment simply because the concept made me lol hard, I actually have a fanboy now.

I am probably coming back to blackwater in the near future, I have a level 5 DC alt that I set up last night and moved my mule stuff out of. So you never know, I might be on your side next cycle.

ah. good. now I can kill you!:D

Cody · August 2014

Komma wrote: »

Yes a gm was in cyrodiil and announced to all sides he/she was there and watching for people to go through the closed gates. Big brother is watching!

nice! about time they took matters into their own hands. A few months late but better late then never.

Lord_Draevan · August 2014

I'm never going to forget when I saw a level 11 "Former Emperor" in Cyrodiil. Not Vet 11: level 11.

Rylana · August 2014

Lord_Draevan wrote: »

I'm never going to forget when I saw a level 11 "Former Emperor" in Cyrodiil. Not Vet 11: level 11.

How is that even possible... just getting enough AP to be leaderboard top is going to be more than enough XP to level up far more than one time.

That doesnt even include actually flipping keeps.

About the only way I could see this happening involves repair kits, never doing ANYTHING else, and somehow the faction crowns the guy.

But thats just silly stupid.

Lord_Draevan · August 2014

Rylana wrote: »

Lord_Draevan wrote: »

I'm never going to forget when I saw a level 11 "Former Emperor" in Cyrodiil. Not Vet 11: level 11.

How is that even possible... just getting enough AP to be leaderboard top is going to be more than enough XP to level up far more than one time.

That doesnt even include actually flipping keeps.

About the only way I could see this happening involves repair kits, never doing ANYTHING else, and somehow the faction crowns the guy.

But thats just silly stupid.

It might have been 12-13, but I know it was under 15. Either way, it's ridiculous. Emperor is now almost utterly meaningless. I'd be shocked if 1 in every 20 "Former Emp" earned it legitimately.

Columba · August 2014

Komma wrote: »

Yes a gm was in cyrodiil and announced to all sides he/she was there and watching for people to go through the closed gates. Big brother is watching!

So all those people who swore up and down and called me a liar....apology accepted.

zScars · August 2014

Every time I exploit i get a happy feeling in my heartless soul and once I get it, one does not stop in their adventure in seeking newer exploits