~+~ PvP is a money sink ~+~

KBKB · August 2014

With the lack of PvE options PvP is the only thing keeping the enchanting/provis/alchemy professions semi viable.

Maulkin · August 2014

hamon wrote: »

ok well , first i dont make any comment on whether killing zombies or collecting plants is fun. i find both much more boring than killing folk in pvp.

however this does not alter the fact that potions and buff foods don't materialize after every so many kills. they require someone goes anf farms the mats and makes the pots/food.

unlike the amount you get from killing zombies , the crafting/farming side and how much it is worth is in the hands of players. and if it becomes possible to sell them for more money , cos like the folk who are buying them suddenly have more money and can afford to pay more than the next guy. then you can bet the prices will go up.
so by rewarding pvp players for their time more it will be counterbalanced by paying higher prices for the stuff you want to buy with your new found wealth.

that will have the effect of leaving you in exactly the same predicament you find yourself in right now.
But i'm sure you already know this, cos you don't have to play much pvp to realise that stuff that is desirable to pvp players or raiders commands top dollar. hence why the most expensive thing in the entire game is purple food recipes.

and whatever FOTM equipment is likewise top of the price list for gear.

i don't think you need a masters in economics to wrap your head around this. just a modicum of common sense should be enough.

now the simple solution is either dont pvp for a while and farm/craft a nice big stock of goodies. or spend some time doing pvp while not using so much pots/food

cos just saying "give us more money" won't work, its just not that simple.

i was in a hardcore raid guild in wow many years ago, before wife and kids made that lifestyle unviable, and to raid you had to farm loads of mats for fire resist potions and crap like that.
If you couldnt be arsed farming the stuff yourself (cos it was boring) then you paid for it. and if you didnt want to do either you didn't raid.

pvp isnt that rigid its perfectly fun to pvp without using as much pots/food. it,s just once you get used to the crutch you feel its a requirement but its not.

I see we won't agree, which is fine.

however, once again I feel I have to stress that the premise of your argument is based around the idea that PvP players will have, and I quote "new found wealth". I explained to you why I feel that's not the case. Because PvPers currently grind and if they made more money through PvP they would stop grinding which would leave them with the same net money. Which means, no new found wealth.

If player's don't have more money than they had before, that means no increase in prices right?

SBR_QuorTek · August 2014

If want to completely remove any costs and yes it is viable, pick up alchemy and provisioning and make your own food and pots.

Also the amount of bags gotten should cover most expenses as well, everything you need for keeps and repairing walls you can buy with earned PvP money.

If any suggestion, could make pots and food being able to be bought and sold for points recieved doing this and that and only working within cyrodiil, other games feature those ways.

As for money sink it self, it is not only just in PvP there is money sinks, it exist in PvE areas as well, but for myself I barely have any costs because I craft everything on my own as of current reducing the cost to a little farming this or that now and then.

I wonder what is wrong with you or some of you people, it is about getting off your asses and doing something to help ya with the problems you may or may not have, all the tools to do such is delivered for free inside the game and honestly it doesnt really take that much effort to archieve.

And don't use the mentality 'I only want to PvP' would be the same as sayiing 'I only want to PvE' with no losses no matter what.

KBKB · August 2014

Keep wall repair kits are way too dear for what they are and what they give this needs a look at imo.

robertlive2014 · August 2014

To be honest, PvP isn't that interesting to me. I only had to PvP for one night to unlock some PvP skills that I needed for PvE. It also gave me the chance to experience some of the game crashes, fps lag, unstoppable zergs, and exploits (look mom, no walls!) in Cyrodiil. I think it sucks that PvP players are not being better rewarded for their efforts.

You can make a million gold selling PvE loot, and I sell loot sets to PvP focused players all the time. I like following the trends in PvP sets so I can capitalize (before the nerf bat) on popular gear sets (Syrabane's Grip, Necromancer, Way of Martial Knowledge, etc). Hopefully, there are some great new PvP gear sets coming that will help PvP players balance this trade deficit between the two worlds.

hamon · August 2014

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

hamon wrote: »

ok well , first i dont make any comment on whether killing zombies or collecting plants is fun. i find both much more boring than killing folk in pvp.

however this does not alter the fact that potions and buff foods don't materialize after every so many kills. they require someone goes anf farms the mats and makes the pots/food.

unlike the amount you get from killing zombies , the crafting/farming side and how much it is worth is in the hands of players. and if it becomes possible to sell them for more money , cos like the folk who are buying them suddenly have more money and can afford to pay more than the next guy. then you can bet the prices will go up.
so by rewarding pvp players for their time more it will be counterbalanced by paying higher prices for the stuff you want to buy with your new found wealth.

that will have the effect of leaving you in exactly the same predicament you find yourself in right now.
But i'm sure you already know this, cos you don't have to play much pvp to realise that stuff that is desirable to pvp players or raiders commands top dollar. hence why the most expensive thing in the entire game is purple food recipes.

and whatever FOTM equipment is likewise top of the price list for gear.

i don't think you need a masters in economics to wrap your head around this. just a modicum of common sense should be enough.

now the simple solution is either dont pvp for a while and farm/craft a nice big stock of goodies. or spend some time doing pvp while not using so much pots/food

cos just saying "give us more money" won't work, its just not that simple.

i was in a hardcore raid guild in wow many years ago, before wife and kids made that lifestyle unviable, and to raid you had to farm loads of mats for fire resist potions and crap like that.
If you couldnt be arsed farming the stuff yourself (cos it was boring) then you paid for it. and if you didnt want to do either you didn't raid.

pvp isnt that rigid its perfectly fun to pvp without using as much pots/food. it,s just once you get used to the crutch you feel its a requirement but its not.

I see we won't agree, which is fine.

however, once again I feel I have to stress that the premise of your argument is based around the idea that PvP players will have, and I quote "new found wealth". I explained to you why I feel that's not the case. Because PvPers currently grind and if they made more money through PvP they would stop grinding which would leave them with the same net money. Which means, no new found wealth.

If player's don't have more money than they had before, that means no increase in prices right?

no because they are grinding the stuff to get potions themselves. due to lack of money that increases the net amount of potions being made.

so if everyone who pvps now who grinds the stuff for their own potions stops doing so due to getting more money so decides to just buy them.
what you have is less potions being made and more folk trying to buy them.

guess what happens to prices then?

i,ll let you figure that out

Skafsgaard · August 2014

hamon wrote: »

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

hamon wrote: »

ok well , first i dont make any comment on whether killing zombies or collecting plants is fun. i find both much more boring than killing folk in pvp.

however this does not alter the fact that potions and buff foods don't materialize after every so many kills. they require someone goes anf farms the mats and makes the pots/food.

unlike the amount you get from killing zombies , the crafting/farming side and how much it is worth is in the hands of players. and if it becomes possible to sell them for more money , cos like the folk who are buying them suddenly have more money and can afford to pay more than the next guy. then you can bet the prices will go up.
so by rewarding pvp players for their time more it will be counterbalanced by paying higher prices for the stuff you want to buy with your new found wealth.

that will have the effect of leaving you in exactly the same predicament you find yourself in right now.
But i'm sure you already know this, cos you don't have to play much pvp to realise that stuff that is desirable to pvp players or raiders commands top dollar. hence why the most expensive thing in the entire game is purple food recipes.

and whatever FOTM equipment is likewise top of the price list for gear.

i don't think you need a masters in economics to wrap your head around this. just a modicum of common sense should be enough.

now the simple solution is either dont pvp for a while and farm/craft a nice big stock of goodies. or spend some time doing pvp while not using so much pots/food

cos just saying "give us more money" won't work, its just not that simple.

i was in a hardcore raid guild in wow many years ago, before wife and kids made that lifestyle unviable, and to raid you had to farm loads of mats for fire resist potions and crap like that.
If you couldnt be arsed farming the stuff yourself (cos it was boring) then you paid for it. and if you didnt want to do either you didn't raid.

pvp isnt that rigid its perfectly fun to pvp without using as much pots/food. it,s just once you get used to the crutch you feel its a requirement but its not.

I see we won't agree, which is fine.

however, once again I feel I have to stress that the premise of your argument is based around the idea that PvP players will have, and I quote "new found wealth". I explained to you why I feel that's not the case. Because PvPers currently grind and if they made more money through PvP they would stop grinding which would leave them with the same net money. Which means, no new found wealth.

If player's don't have more money than they had before, that means no increase in prices right?

no because they are grinding the stuff to get potions themselves. due to lack of money that increases the net amount of potions being made.

so if everyone who pvps now who grinds the stuff for their own potions stops doing so due to getting more money so decides to just buy them.
what you have is less potions being made and more folk trying to buy them.

guess what happens to prices then?

i,ll let you figure that out

No, we grind gold, not the mats. Mike is correct and you are wrong - and evidently have absolutely no clue, now go away.

smeeprocketnub19_ESO · August 2014

hamon wrote: »

Zubba wrote: »

"hamon wrote: »

but spamming pots isn't a basic requirment unless you make it so. thats the point.
only if you need to lean on pots cos you dont like to die as much as someone who doesnt use pots.

without spamming pots pvp is free. cos you've decided that you need pots to save your butt doesnt make it , nor should it be viewed as a necessity to go out and do some pvp.

I am guessing you do not PvP, and never have?

Pots and food makes a huge difference in how you will perform in this game. A huge difference in your performance in Pvp is kind of the competition.

i pvp often and have done since beta. do i use food yes do i use pots sometimes if i,m in a critical fight. but i have craft alts that make everything i need for all 6 profs.

but if pots and food are viewed as necessity's where do you draw the line?

should zos give you heaps of gold so you can afford purple recipes? they are optional extras. if you CHOOSE to feel that you can't face pvp without permanent buffs and an endless supply of pots then thats ok thats your choice.

however its not realistic to expect to not have to sacrifice a bit of time to gather the mats to do it. if they up the gold drops bigtime to enable you to afford everything without you having to do anything to get it , then all that happens is slowly the price increases for all this stuff as the folk who do actually gather the mats and make all this stuff realise they can charge more cos pvp folk have more money to buy it..

then you come back to the forums asking for more money cos you cant afford all the buff stuff again.

lol this is not some slippery slope of entitlement, we're just asking to not have to pve for the basics.

I am a dedicated crafter, but I can't even begin to farm enough columbine to keep up with my potion use.

If you want to cripple yourself in pvp, have at it, but the rest of us shouldn't have to.

Upping the end of campaign rewards will not wreck the economy. I don't know how you think a small infusion of gold is going to do that. We still have to buy the stuff, we just have more money to do it. Money we otherwise have to pve for. So that money is already being put out there.

hamon · August 2014

Skafsgaard wrote: »

hamon wrote: »

mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »

hamon wrote: »

ok well , first i dont make any comment on whether killing zombies or collecting plants is fun. i find both much more boring than killing folk in pvp.

however this does not alter the fact that potions and buff foods don't materialize after every so many kills. they require someone goes anf farms the mats and makes the pots/food.

unlike the amount you get from killing zombies , the crafting/farming side and how much it is worth is in the hands of players. and if it becomes possible to sell them for more money , cos like the folk who are buying them suddenly have more money and can afford to pay more than the next guy. then you can bet the prices will go up.
so by rewarding pvp players for their time more it will be counterbalanced by paying higher prices for the stuff you want to buy with your new found wealth.

that will have the effect of leaving you in exactly the same predicament you find yourself in right now.
But i'm sure you already know this, cos you don't have to play much pvp to realise that stuff that is desirable to pvp players or raiders commands top dollar. hence why the most expensive thing in the entire game is purple food recipes.

and whatever FOTM equipment is likewise top of the price list for gear.

i don't think you need a masters in economics to wrap your head around this. just a modicum of common sense should be enough.

now the simple solution is either dont pvp for a while and farm/craft a nice big stock of goodies. or spend some time doing pvp while not using so much pots/food

cos just saying "give us more money" won't work, its just not that simple.

i was in a hardcore raid guild in wow many years ago, before wife and kids made that lifestyle unviable, and to raid you had to farm loads of mats for fire resist potions and crap like that.
If you couldnt be arsed farming the stuff yourself (cos it was boring) then you paid for it. and if you didnt want to do either you didn't raid.

pvp isnt that rigid its perfectly fun to pvp without using as much pots/food. it,s just once you get used to the crutch you feel its a requirement but its not.

I see we won't agree, which is fine.

however, once again I feel I have to stress that the premise of your argument is based around the idea that PvP players will have, and I quote "new found wealth". I explained to you why I feel that's not the case. Because PvPers currently grind and if they made more money through PvP they would stop grinding which would leave them with the same net money. Which means, no new found wealth.

If player's don't have more money than they had before, that means no increase in prices right?

no because they are grinding the stuff to get potions themselves. due to lack of money that increases the net amount of potions being made.

so if everyone who pvps now who grinds the stuff for their own potions stops doing so due to getting more money so decides to just buy them.
what you have is less potions being made and more folk trying to buy them.

guess what happens to prices then?

i,ll let you figure that out

No, we grind gold, not the mats. Mike is correct and you are wrong - and evidently have absolutely no clue, now go away.

i dont normally respond to idiots like yourself but i'm feeling charitable. so you grind gold? what do you grind the gold for?

let me guess to buy pots and food? but i'm sure you arn't the spokesperson for the entire pvp community. (i would hope if there was such a person they would be more articulate and able to construct an arguement)

now for every person who simply grinds gold on mobs there will be as many who farm the mats. or picks the flowers while roaming and killing mobs. so once again if they all stop it cos zos gives them more gold through pvp they still want the pots and food.

which once more end in inflated prices for the pots.

basically no matter how you cut it , more money available to bid for pots means higher prices. thats it simplified down for those of limited capacity for new concepts.
the only way pots remain the same price is if you make them yourself. cos all it costs is the time you spend doing it.

hamon · August 2014

smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »

hamon wrote: »

Zubba wrote: »

"hamon wrote: »

but spamming pots isn't a basic requirment unless you make it so. thats the point.
only if you need to lean on pots cos you dont like to die as much as someone who doesnt use pots.

without spamming pots pvp is free. cos you've decided that you need pots to save your butt doesnt make it , nor should it be viewed as a necessity to go out and do some pvp.

I am guessing you do not PvP, and never have?

Pots and food makes a huge difference in how you will perform in this game. A huge difference in your performance in Pvp is kind of the competition.

i pvp often and have done since beta. do i use food yes do i use pots sometimes if i,m in a critical fight. but i have craft alts that make everything i need for all 6 profs.

but if pots and food are viewed as necessity's where do you draw the line?

should zos give you heaps of gold so you can afford purple recipes? they are optional extras. if you CHOOSE to feel that you can't face pvp without permanent buffs and an endless supply of pots then thats ok thats your choice.

however its not realistic to expect to not have to sacrifice a bit of time to gather the mats to do it. if they up the gold drops bigtime to enable you to afford everything without you having to do anything to get it , then all that happens is slowly the price increases for all this stuff as the folk who do actually gather the mats and make all this stuff realise they can charge more cos pvp folk have more money to buy it..

then you come back to the forums asking for more money cos you cant afford all the buff stuff again.

lol this is not some slippery slope of entitlement, we're just asking to not have to pve for the basics.

I am a dedicated crafter, but I can't even begin to farm enough columbine to keep up with my potion use.

If you want to cripple yourself in pvp, have at it, but the rest of us shouldn't have to.

Upping the end of campaign rewards will not wreck the economy. I don't know how you think a small infusion of gold is going to do that. We still have to buy the stuff, we just have more money to do it. Money we otherwise have to pve for. So that money is already being put out there.

your arguement is based on an assumption that while doing pve you completely ignore looking in chests/barrels for recipes, ingredients for food. or dont stop to pick flowers. now if you dont then thats stoopid imo, cos thats the stuff that earns the money or gets you the pots/food free.

but most folk who do pve realise that food items and flowers are a good source of money so include that in a search for money (or even collect that exclusively and kill nothing) so if they stop doing that cos they get more money from pvp rewards you have less stuff being collected and more folk wanting to buy pots/food

less stuff being collected + more gold = higher prices

so if you have more money but theres the same or less pots (cos less pvp players feel obliged to farm the stuff themselves.) you honestly can't grasp that that will simply lead to the price increasing?

it's like gold sellers , they cause inflation by injecting more money into the system therefore enabling higher bids on items. More gold available = higher prices.

but hey i dont mind , if they up the gold rewards I win, cos i do make the stuff myself. so my pots always cost me nothing, I'll just have more money to outbid you on anything i do want to buy

and if i do sell some pots you can bet i,ll get to sell them for more.

iliatha · August 2014

Emperor wrote: »

This is one of the big problems that comes with not being able to loot dead players. In a system that you can loot dead players the good PvPers gain money and the bad ones lose money.

Often times the bigger zerg wins. So more players = better players.. interesting.

Engelin · August 2014

Lol, how do u come to the conclusion that a bit of extra gold to pvp'ers will jump up the prices? As long as there is a 100 guys trying to sell me those potions, I don't see how the price will go up much. There is a TON of extra gold out there with those trial sets *** up, I don't see any change in prices. I was one of those that expected a huge increase in prices of certain mats when 1.3 hit, no such increase came. The only thing that will raise the prices is an increase in the price of the mats to make them.

eliisra · August 2014

It's because crafted potions are so expensive. One stack being 8-12k, which is understandable seeing how long it takes to farm the right flowers.

Almost everyone uses the same potions in PvP. We need Tri-stat and spell/crit/magicka potions. Than you have PvE'ers also needing them for trials. They have way more money than Cyrodiil citizens, for obvious reasons, pushing prices even higher.

Increase the number of reagents you get from alchemy nodes and potions will drop heavily in price. PvP'ers wont be forced to spend all their coins on consumables.

I waste 30-45 minutes every day picking my columbines, corn flowers, lady's smocks etc, only so I can go PvP after. That only covers potions for myself. It's stupid, considering you can get your daily food done in a few barrels.

SBR_QuorTek · August 2014

eliisra wrote: »

It's because crafted potions are so expensive. One stack being 8-12k, which is understandable seeing how long it takes to farm the right flowers.

Almost everyone uses the same potions in PvP. We need Tri-stat and spell/crit/magicka potions. Than you have PvE'ers also needing them for trials. They have way more money than Cyrodiil citizens, for obvious reasons, pushing prices even higher.

Increase the number of reagents you get from alchemy nodes and potions will drop heavily in price. PvP'ers wont be forced to spend all their coins on consumables.

I waste 30-45 minutes every day picking my columbines, corn flowers, lady's smocks etc, only so I can go PvP after. That only covers potions for myself. It's stupid, considering you can get your daily food done in a few barrels.

one of each type of flower make 4 potions, collecting 25 of each makes a 100 potions.

Make 40 potions which is 10 of each and buy the rest you have saved around 50% in gold, keep in mind the flowers drop on any map vr or not.

The other option is to buy the mats, sell off the surplus of products.

30-40minutes spend to not have to pay anything, as opposed to the system, it is silly that each columbine, burgloss or whichever else only drop in a 1:1 ratio, where a 3 or 4:1 ratio would be better as it is an instant buff, but it is mentioning it to the devs it is silly with the current gain of mats picked up doing such.

It is those fixes we want, not just... going like 'it is a money sink, lets not make it a money sink'

Keep in mind this more money that get between each player this more the price of basic items will rise as well, competetion creates those issues, it's called inflation, and technically make it even more hard for new players to the game as well.

Increasing the drop rate per pickup for instantly consumed/used items would be better if so, also guildwise would make it easier to sustain a healthy pool of potions for use and more.

Keep in mind bots seem to have drastically decreased in TESO, which make it a way much more controlled player enviroment, it is a better time to build on that rather than just add gold per kill.

If want to add more gold into everything in PvP, put it on taking actual objectives like 300 gold per keep, 50 gold per resource, 1000 per elderscroll successfully stolen and put into a keep at ones own territory but only for the player only carrying it.

A reason to avoid even more blobbing.

dodgehopper_ESO · August 2014

I'd also like to add, that pvp'ers have to do a lot of pve in order to get skill points to allow for variation in their builds. Everyone has to PVE if they want to optimize their character, and that's a fact. There is no way around this point. I haven't pvp'd much in a long time because of it, and I look forward to the day I can finally say 'ahhh' and be done with my skill grind hunting.

hamon · August 2014

Engelin wrote: »

Lol, how do u come to the conclusion that a bit of extra gold to pvp'ers will jump up the prices? As long as there is a 100 guys trying to sell me those potions, I don't see how the price will go up much. There is a TON of extra gold out there with those trial sets *** up, I don't see any change in prices. I was one of those that expected a huge increase in prices of certain mats when 1.3 hit, no such increase came. The only thing that will raise the prices is an increase in the price of the mats to make them.

which could happen if less folk go collecting them. cos they are no longer too skint to buy them. so the supply drops but demand remains the same.

which equals.... you guessed it higher prices.

MurkMuffin · August 2014

Why not just add stuff that PvP'ers generally use to be bought with AP??? I mean have like a food vendor or alchemist that sells descent respective items for alliance points? I think that would solve some of the issues talked about here and it would be a minor fix to a seemingly major problem. Just an idea.

hamon · August 2014

MurkMuffin wrote: »

Why not just add stuff that PvP'ers generally use to be bought with AP??? I mean have like a food vendor or alchemist that sells descent respective items for alliance points? I think that would solve some of the issues talked about here and it would be a minor fix to a seemingly major problem. Just an idea.

yes that could work, its a far more effective way to deal with it rather than say give us more money. cos like ive been trying to explain (with limited success it would seem) injecting more money into the economy would,nt have the effect of doing anything except cause inflation.

but some folk cant see why having more money could possibly be a bad idea. I've never said it would be a bad idea as usch , just not one thats gonna solve this particular problem.

SBR_QuorTek · August 2014

MurkMuffin wrote: »

Why not just add stuff that PvP'ers generally use to be bought with AP??? I mean have like a food vendor or alchemist that sells descent respective items for alliance points? I think that would solve some of the issues talked about here and it would be a minor fix to a seemingly major problem. Just an idea.

Only way you can do that is if that crafted food wont be useable in Cyrodiil and Cyrodiil food wont be useable outside cyrodiil.

You forget to take it a step further, if it is easy to acquire buffs and potions in the PvP area which it technically is with proposed system... eg. PvE place holders against PvP place holders... corrupting of having a chance to corrupt the balance of PvP.

SBR_QuorTek · August 2014

Engelin wrote: »

I think a lot of people are missing the point. Yes, it's very much possible to make a lot of gold AND pvp, it's also very possible to make just enough gold to not lose gold on pvp. BUT to do that you will need to do some form of pve. You just have to. And I'm one of those that really don't want to. I play for pvp and pvp only, forceing me to pve is the best way to get me to unsub. Now I realize that disqualifies me from some things like trial items and free acces to sets. I accept that. But pvp is indeed a huge gold drain, let me illustrate my consumptions in a week:

200 tri-potions - 20k (10k per stack)
About 30 pieces of food 9k (300 each)
100 soulgems 15k (15k per stack)

I total about 44k so around 90k for the duration of my 14 day campaign. Am I gonna sustain this by the reward or selling reward stuff for about 50g each? No I'm not, thuogh I'm lucky enough to be a member of a damn good guild so I get most that stuff free of charge.

So the point is, although it's very much possible to get the gold you new from pve a lot of us really resents having to!

Learn to play:
What more can I say, it is extreme abuse of potions you have there, feel a bit sorry for your guildies that have to cover your mess, but I wonder if you contribute back to them as well by keeping the stock healthy.

Learn the game:
Regardless of whichever excuse, if you want to down the cost, start crafting... or gather the items needed and having a guild mate craft for you... and yes plants grow in cyrodiil as well believe it or not.

Play the game:
You decide how you would play the game and how much effort you would like to put into it, if refusing some sides of the game you may have to cover it with gold or whatever, the essential of playing a game is trying to beat it one way or another with the tools given.

Conclusion:
Either you pay the current day price for pots or get them made or make them yourself, the game deliver every single tool to deduct the cost to 0 gold.

hamon · August 2014

SBR_QuorTek wrote: »

Engelin wrote: »

I think a lot of people are missing the point. Yes, it's very much possible to make a lot of gold AND pvp, it's also very possible to make just enough gold to not lose gold on pvp. BUT to do that you will need to do some form of pve. You just have to. And I'm one of those that really don't want to. I play for pvp and pvp only, forceing me to pve is the best way to get me to unsub. Now I realize that disqualifies me from some things like trial items and free acces to sets. I accept that. But pvp is indeed a huge gold drain, let me illustrate my consumptions in a week:

200 tri-potions - 20k (10k per stack)
About 30 pieces of food 9k (300 each)
100 soulgems 15k (15k per stack)

I total about 44k so around 90k for the duration of my 14 day campaign. Am I gonna sustain this by the reward or selling reward stuff for about 50g each? No I'm not, thuogh I'm lucky enough to be a member of a damn good guild so I get most that stuff free of charge.

So the point is, although it's very much possible to get the gold you new from pve a lot of us really resents having to!

Learn to play:
What more can I say, it is extreme abuse of potions you have there, feel a bit sorry for your guildies that have to cover your mess, but I wonder if you contribute back to them as well by keeping the stock healthy.

Learn the game:
Regardless of whichever excuse, if you want to down the cost, start crafting... or gather the items needed and having a guild mate craft for you... and yes plants grow in cyrodiil as well believe it or not.

Play the game:
You decide how you would play the game and how much effort you would like to put into it, if refusing some sides of the game you may have to cover it with gold or whatever, the essential of playing a game is trying to beat it one way or another with the tools given.

Conclusion:
Either you pay the current day price for pots or get them made or make them yourself, the game deliver every single tool to deduct the cost to 0 gold.

yes i,m tempted to ask what guild he's in where some fools donate potions for others to spam endlessly for free just cos they dont want to have to spend some of their precious pew pew time getting the stuff themselves.

i wonder how long this supply of free guild potions will last if we all join and demand free potions so we can quaff them non stop in cyrodiil.

MurkMuffin · August 2014

SBR_QuorTek wrote: »

MurkMuffin wrote: »

Why not just add stuff that PvP'ers generally use to be bought with AP??? I mean have like a food vendor or alchemist that sells descent respective items for alliance points? I think that would solve some of the issues talked about here and it would be a minor fix to a seemingly major problem. Just an idea.

Only way you can do that is if that crafted food wont be useable in Cyrodiil and Cyrodiil food wont be useable outside cyrodiil.

You forget to take it a step further, if it is easy to acquire buffs and potions in the PvP area which it technically is with proposed system... eg. PvE place holders against PvP place holders... corrupting of having a chance to corrupt the balance of PvP.

Well, This is the beauty of options. PvP players are generally going to be better in pvp due to playing it regularly and specializing their characters accordingly(gear, skills, etc). However, PvE'ers take the time to perfect things like....Alchemy or Provisioning. Thus making better than vendor sold items, giving pvp'ers options to fork out gold or use the more common AP. The more options the players have, the less likely "corruption" will happen, yet appease the reasonable request to alleviate gold problems that is supposedly common(I do both and make my own stuff) in strict pvp'ers.

MurkMuffin · August 2014

hamon wrote: »

SBR_QuorTek wrote: »

Engelin wrote: »

I think a lot of people are missing the point. Yes, it's very much possible to make a lot of gold AND pvp, it's also very possible to make just enough gold to not lose gold on pvp. BUT to do that you will need to do some form of pve. You just have to. And I'm one of those that really don't want to. I play for pvp and pvp only, forceing me to pve is the best way to get me to unsub. Now I realize that disqualifies me from some things like trial items and free acces to sets. I accept that. But pvp is indeed a huge gold drain, let me illustrate my consumptions in a week:

200 tri-potions - 20k (10k per stack)
About 30 pieces of food 9k (300 each)
100 soulgems 15k (15k per stack)

I total about 44k so around 90k for the duration of my 14 day campaign. Am I gonna sustain this by the reward or selling reward stuff for about 50g each? No I'm not, thuogh I'm lucky enough to be a member of a damn good guild so I get most that stuff free of charge.

So the point is, although it's very much possible to get the gold you new from pve a lot of us really resents having to!

Learn to play:
What more can I say, it is extreme abuse of potions you have there, feel a bit sorry for your guildies that have to cover your mess, but I wonder if you contribute back to them as well by keeping the stock healthy.

Learn the game:
Regardless of whichever excuse, if you want to down the cost, start crafting... or gather the items needed and having a guild mate craft for you... and yes plants grow in cyrodiil as well believe it or not.

Play the game:
You decide how you would play the game and how much effort you would like to put into it, if refusing some sides of the game you may have to cover it with gold or whatever, the essential of playing a game is trying to beat it one way or another with the tools given.

Conclusion:
Either you pay the current day price for pots or get them made or make them yourself, the game deliver every single tool to deduct the cost to 0 gold.

yes i,m tempted to ask what guild he's in where some fools donate potions for others to spam endlessly for free just cos they dont want to have to spend some of their precious pew pew time getting the stuff themselves.

i wonder how long this supply of free guild potions will last if we all join and demand free potions so we can quaff them non stop in cyrodiil.

Just LOLOLOL

hamon · August 2014

MurkMuffin wrote: »

hamon wrote: »

SBR_QuorTek wrote: »

Engelin wrote: »

I think a lot of people are missing the point. Yes, it's very much possible to make a lot of gold AND pvp, it's also very possible to make just enough gold to not lose gold on pvp. BUT to do that you will need to do some form of pve. You just have to. And I'm one of those that really don't want to. I play for pvp and pvp only, forceing me to pve is the best way to get me to unsub. Now I realize that disqualifies me from some things like trial items and free acces to sets. I accept that. But pvp is indeed a huge gold drain, let me illustrate my consumptions in a week:

200 tri-potions - 20k (10k per stack)
About 30 pieces of food 9k (300 each)
100 soulgems 15k (15k per stack)

I total about 44k so around 90k for the duration of my 14 day campaign. Am I gonna sustain this by the reward or selling reward stuff for about 50g each? No I'm not, thuogh I'm lucky enough to be a member of a damn good guild so I get most that stuff free of charge.

So the point is, although it's very much possible to get the gold you new from pve a lot of us really resents having to!

Learn to play:
What more can I say, it is extreme abuse of potions you have there, feel a bit sorry for your guildies that have to cover your mess, but I wonder if you contribute back to them as well by keeping the stock healthy.

Learn the game:
Regardless of whichever excuse, if you want to down the cost, start crafting... or gather the items needed and having a guild mate craft for you... and yes plants grow in cyrodiil as well believe it or not.

Play the game:
You decide how you would play the game and how much effort you would like to put into it, if refusing some sides of the game you may have to cover it with gold or whatever, the essential of playing a game is trying to beat it one way or another with the tools given.

Conclusion:
Either you pay the current day price for pots or get them made or make them yourself, the game deliver every single tool to deduct the cost to 0 gold.

yes i,m tempted to ask what guild he's in where some fools donate potions for others to spam endlessly for free just cos they dont want to have to spend some of their precious pew pew time getting the stuff themselves.

i wonder how long this supply of free guild potions will last if we all join and demand free potions so we can quaff them non stop in cyrodiil.

Just LOLOLOL

glad you got the joke. but still what guild gives free potions to some guys so they have no need to go farm thir own. i want to join it would save me having to do any work for ma buff stuff.

or just give me the names of these benevolent guys who are willing to make potions all day and give them away free. I'll up my potion intake to keep them busy making potions if thats how they enjoy spending their game time

Zubba · August 2014

SBR_QuorTek wrote: »

Engelin wrote: »

I think a lot of people are missing the point. Yes, it's very much possible to make a lot of gold AND pvp, it's also very possible to make just enough gold to not lose gold on pvp. BUT to do that you will need to do some form of pve. You just have to. And I'm one of those that really don't want to. I play for pvp and pvp only, forceing me to pve is the best way to get me to unsub. Now I realize that disqualifies me from some things like trial items and free acces to sets. I accept that. But pvp is indeed a huge gold drain, let me illustrate my consumptions in a week:

200 tri-potions - 20k (10k per stack)
About 30 pieces of food 9k (300 each)
100 soulgems 15k (15k per stack)

I total about 44k so around 90k for the duration of my 14 day campaign. Am I gonna sustain this by the reward or selling reward stuff for about 50g each? No I'm not, thuogh I'm lucky enough to be a member of a damn good guild so I get most that stuff free of charge.

So the point is, although it's very much possible to get the gold you new from pve a lot of us really resents having to!

Learn to play:
What more can I say, it is extreme abuse of potions you have there, feel a bit sorry for your guildies that have to cover your mess, but I wonder if you contribute back to them as well by keeping the stock healthy.

Learn the game:
Regardless of whichever excuse, if you want to down the cost, start crafting... or gather the items needed and having a guild mate craft for you... and yes plants grow in cyrodiil as well believe it or not.

Play the game:
You decide how you would play the game and how much effort you would like to put into it, if refusing some sides of the game you may have to cover it with gold or whatever, the essential of playing a game is trying to beat it one way or another with the tools given.

Conclusion:
Either you pay the current day price for pots or get them made or make them yourself, the game deliver every single tool to deduct the cost to 0 gold.

A game that forces players into one play style or another, is not the best way to draw maximum players/customers. I don't mind if the "crafters" make Money on the PvPers, but there need to be options for the PvP type of play to make enough money to pay for pots and food.

SBR_QuorTek · August 2014

Zubba wrote: »

SBR_QuorTek wrote: »

Engelin wrote: »

I think a lot of people are missing the point. Yes, it's very much possible to make a lot of gold AND pvp, it's also very possible to make just enough gold to not lose gold on pvp. BUT to do that you will need to do some form of pve. You just have to. And I'm one of those that really don't want to. I play for pvp and pvp only, forceing me to pve is the best way to get me to unsub. Now I realize that disqualifies me from some things like trial items and free acces to sets. I accept that. But pvp is indeed a huge gold drain, let me illustrate my consumptions in a week:

200 tri-potions - 20k (10k per stack)
About 30 pieces of food 9k (300 each)
100 soulgems 15k (15k per stack)

I total about 44k so around 90k for the duration of my 14 day campaign. Am I gonna sustain this by the reward or selling reward stuff for about 50g each? No I'm not, thuogh I'm lucky enough to be a member of a damn good guild so I get most that stuff free of charge.

So the point is, although it's very much possible to get the gold you new from pve a lot of us really resents having to!

Learn to play:
What more can I say, it is extreme abuse of potions you have there, feel a bit sorry for your guildies that have to cover your mess, but I wonder if you contribute back to them as well by keeping the stock healthy.

Learn the game:
Regardless of whichever excuse, if you want to down the cost, start crafting... or gather the items needed and having a guild mate craft for you... and yes plants grow in cyrodiil as well believe it or not.

Play the game:
You decide how you would play the game and how much effort you would like to put into it, if refusing some sides of the game you may have to cover it with gold or whatever, the essential of playing a game is trying to beat it one way or another with the tools given.

Conclusion:
Either you pay the current day price for pots or get them made or make them yourself, the game deliver every single tool to deduct the cost to 0 gold.

A game that forces players into one play style or another, is not the best way to draw maximum players/customers. I don't mind if the "crafters" make Money on the PvPers, but there need to be options for the PvP type of play to make enough money to pay for pots and food.

Ok by force what do you exactly mean? The game has a setting, one decide to play the game... follow the gameplay, no one is forced to do anything.

First of all the game is a RPG, it has a RPG with a PvP and PvE side to it for whichever one want to do, expecting to be skipping the entire RPG and get everything handed, then why not play a FPS game instead?

One have to keep in mind that certain aspects to the game would make it easier for one self and by going down those paths you are beating the game even more, mission accomplished.

No one should recieve special treatment other than getting actual bugs and exploits fixed.

Provisioning is the easiest grind in the game, look up some guides, likewise is alchemy, well second after provisioning, google is your friend for the grind of that, it is remarkable easy and take little effort, since pvp is not really worth it before you hit 40+ anyway then it is a neat little side project to do.

Also you could buy the mats when hitting endgame crafting and sell it off in a 50/50 ratio where you keep a supply for self and sell the other half with profit.

Does not mean it is not open to other ways, as mentioned earlier make a potion vendor that only sell PvP capable potions for alliance gold and only would work in a PvP enviroment.

nicholaspingasb16_ESO · August 2014

Alliance points are a thing for siege weapons, and as for potions, just spec into alchemy...

hamon · August 2014

Zubba wrote: »

SBR_QuorTek wrote: »

Engelin wrote: »

I think a lot of people are missing the point. Yes, it's very much possible to make a lot of gold AND pvp, it's also very possible to make just enough gold to not lose gold on pvp. BUT to do that you will need to do some form of pve. You just have to. And I'm one of those that really don't want to. I play for pvp and pvp only, forceing me to pve is the best way to get me to unsub. Now I realize that disqualifies me from some things like trial items and free acces to sets. I accept that. But pvp is indeed a huge gold drain, let me illustrate my consumptions in a week:

200 tri-potions - 20k (10k per stack)
About 30 pieces of food 9k (300 each)
100 soulgems 15k (15k per stack)

I total about 44k so around 90k for the duration of my 14 day campaign. Am I gonna sustain this by the reward or selling reward stuff for about 50g each? No I'm not, thuogh I'm lucky enough to be a member of a damn good guild so I get most that stuff free of charge.

So the point is, although it's very much possible to get the gold you new from pve a lot of us really resents having to!

Learn to play:
What more can I say, it is extreme abuse of potions you have there, feel a bit sorry for your guildies that have to cover your mess, but I wonder if you contribute back to them as well by keeping the stock healthy.

Learn the game:
Regardless of whichever excuse, if you want to down the cost, start crafting... or gather the items needed and having a guild mate craft for you... and yes plants grow in cyrodiil as well believe it or not.

Play the game:
You decide how you would play the game and how much effort you would like to put into it, if refusing some sides of the game you may have to cover it with gold or whatever, the essential of playing a game is trying to beat it one way or another with the tools given.

Conclusion:
Either you pay the current day price for pots or get them made or make them yourself, the game deliver every single tool to deduct the cost to 0 gold.

A game that forces players into one play style or another, is not the best way to draw maximum players/customers. I don't mind if the "crafters" make Money on the PvPers, but there need to be options for the PvP type of play to make enough money to pay for pots and food.

but again the point you and others seem to miss is that potion spamming is not a necessity to pvp , just cos some folk decide it is doesnt make it so.

you can pvp for free all day long. now i,m not saying i never quaff a pot. but i use them sensibly. if i,m getting gunned down anyway and all its gonna do is keep me alive for a second more i just die. but then i might use one if i,m in a smallish group taking a keep and every man could be vital to success.

but i see folk spamming them endlessly , then they wonder why its a drain on their resources.

Sunrock · August 2014

Emperor wrote: »

Most of the time I am playing this game I am PvPing. I am a former emperor. I played through the story line which helped me build about 100K gold. I have been using this gold to buy supplies for PvP and I assumed that as long as I did good, PvP should be a money maker, but I was wrong.

I am currently down to about 15K and I am not wasteful with my money. I have never upgraded anything I own past purple and I only buy things I need so why am I losing money?

Maybe it's just me, but I would think the warriors of Cyrodiil would be paid handsomely for fighting to the death! Any word on if PvP will be updated to allow us to at least not lose money somehow?

Players that only PvP, nothing else; not even crafting, are always pore in any MMORPG. Because you can always grind money faster in PvE and from crafting.

However when I only PvP for a few weeks I still go + with my money. Most of my money I get from the loot boxes you get in your mail. The worthy reward. I know PvP'ers that cant even bother to open them and just vendor the box for 24g. But if you bother to open them you can vendor the weapons for 64g and armor for 40g each. I also sell the PvP armor sets to players for 300-500 gold each now a days. Before I could sell them for around 3000.... But now a days I just want to get rid of them.

But you don't really need any money at all if you want to focus on PvP. If you are willing to go and farm herbs and food indigence your self and then craft for personal use. I play around 40 hours a week. And if I only spend 1-2 hours a week farming herbs and food It will last me the enter week. So if you spend 5% of your online time gather some resources you don't need money at all if your a "PvPer".

PS: OK now I know what zones that have the best concentration of herbs and where to look for them so I might find more herbs that I need faster then some one that never gathered resources in this game ever... But there are addons that help you figure stuff out like that. http://www.esoui.com/downloads/info57-HarvestMapEsoheadMarkers.html for an example

Emperor · August 2014

Sunrock wrote: »

Emperor wrote: »

Most of the time I am playing this game I am PvPing. I am a former emperor. I played through the story line which helped me build about 100K gold. I have been using this gold to buy supplies for PvP and I assumed that as long as I did good, PvP should be a money maker, but I was wrong.

I am currently down to about 15K and I am not wasteful with my money. I have never upgraded anything I own past purple and I only buy things I need so why am I losing money?

Maybe it's just me, but I would think the warriors of Cyrodiil would be paid handsomely for fighting to the death! Any word on if PvP will be updated to allow us to at least not lose money somehow?

Players that only PvP, nothing else; not even crafting, are always pore in any MMORPG. Because you can always grind money faster in PvE and from crafting.

However when I only PvP for a few weeks I still go + with my money. Most of my money I get from the loot boxes you get in your mail. The worthy reward. I know PvP'ers that cant even bother to open them and just vendor the box for 24g. But if you bother to open them you can vendor the weapons for 64g and armor for 40g each. I also sell the PvP armor sets to players for 300-500 gold each now a days. Before I could sell them for around 3000.... But now a days I just want to get rid of them.

But you don't really need any money at all if you want to focus on PvP. If you are willing to go and farm herbs and food indigence your self and then craft for personal use. I play around 40 hours a week. And if I only spend 1-2 hours a week farming herbs and food It will last me the enter week. So if you spend 5% of your online time gather some resources you don't need money at all if your a "PvPer".

PS: OK now I know what zones that have the best concentration of herbs and where to look for them so I might find more herbs that I need faster then some one that never gathered resources in this game ever... But there are addons that help you figure stuff out like that. http://www.esoui.com/downloads/info57-HarvestMapEsoheadMarkers.html for an example

1) You say players who only PvP in games are poor? Ha! Maybe bad PvPers. Usually the players that are good at PvP are among the richest players in the game.

2) I open all my "rewards for the worthy" and sell them to vendors and players.