Sapphy24 wrote: »

Ok, so I don't get it. Why would you log in and out over and over for? I have 8 toons and not one of them has ever got something by logging in and out.
Am I just having a blond moment?

Ok I can help here if you were to walk in to a building and open all the containers you would have to wait a few minutes for the containers to reset back to closed. If you relog the containers reset to closed so the wait is shorter.
That is the only real advantage it offers it means instead of looting 1 building then porting to another with lots of containers then another you can relog in the same one untill the RNG decides to give you a purple item.
At this point it then goes on to a cool down where you will be unable to loot another for somewhere around 3-5 hours.
If you do farm an area using this method for 20 mins or so a day within a few days it hits another cooldown and all the containers are already open when you enter the buildings in that zone.
I would suggest these are the changes that Jessica was talking about because at 1 point ppl where getting 10 in an hour now it's something like 2 a day untill wherever you are hits cooldown then you have to wait a week for the containers to be closed again.
Further to that it does not change the drop rate at all as zos easily control it by adding useless items to loot tables, increasing cool down length or making the timer before the second zone wide cooldown shorter. In this way they control just how rare these items are whether they are being farmed or not.

lathbury wrote: »

Sapphy24 wrote: »

Ok, so I don't get it. Why would you log in and out over and over for? I have 8 toons and not one of them has ever got something by logging in and out.
Am I just having a blond moment?

Ok I can help here if you were to walk in to a building and open all the containers you would have to wait a few minutes for the containers to reset back to closed. If you relog the containers reset to closed so the wait is shorter.
That is the only real advantage it offers it means instead of looting 1 building then porting to another with lots of containers then another you can relog in the same one untill the RNG decides to give you a purple item.
At this point it then goes on to a cool down where you will be unable to loot another for somewhere around 3-5 hours.
If you do farm an area using this method for 20 mins or so a day withing a few days it hits another cooldown and all the containers are already open when you enter the buildings in that zone.
I would suggest these are the changes that Jessica was talking about because at 1 point ppl where getting 10 in an hour now it's something like 2 a day untill wherever you are hits cooldown then you have to wait a week for the containers to be closed again.
Further to that it does not change the drop rate at all as zos easily control it by adding useless items to loot tables, increasing cool down length or making the timer before the second zone wide cooldown shorter. In this way they control just how rare these items are whether they are being farmed or not.

Correct. There is a built in cooldown on drops, a random chance for it to be something rare and random things like crap loot in the containers and some if them being empty. Far from the free ride that people who don't do it make it out to be.

In fact, because of the cooldowns I find it pointless to do it repeatedly. I've gotten the best results from sticking my farming toons where they need to be (currently 3) and playing one. Run a few quests, etc then log and do a farming run with each of the farmers, followed by another. Then go back to the toon I'm playing for a bit.

Really what this whole debate amounts to is what so many debates about eso amount to.. There is a brand of player who plays this game that can't seem to grasp the concept that it's not their prerogative to tell everyone else how to play and violations of their personal tastes aren't the same as violations of the rules, "exploits" or anything else.

Fleymark wrote: »

lathbury wrote: »

Sapphy24 wrote: »

Ok, so I don't get it. Why would you log in and out over and over for? I have 8 toons and not one of them has ever got something by logging in and out.
Am I just having a blond moment?

Ok I can help here if you were to walk in to a building and open all the containers you would have to wait a few minutes for the containers to reset back to closed. If you relog the containers reset to closed so the wait is shorter.
That is the only real advantage it offers it means instead of looting 1 building then porting to another with lots of containers then another you can relog in the same one untill the RNG decides to give you a purple item.
At this point it then goes on to a cool down where you will be unable to loot another for somewhere around 3-5 hours.
If you do farm an area using this method for 20 mins or so a day withing a few days it hits another cooldown and all the containers are already open when you enter the buildings in that zone.
I would suggest these are the changes that Jessica was talking about because at 1 point ppl where getting 10 in an hour now it's something like 2 a day untill wherever you are hits cooldown then you have to wait a week for the containers to be closed again.
Further to that it does not change the drop rate at all as zos easily control it by adding useless items to loot tables, increasing cool down length or making the timer before the second zone wide cooldown shorter. In this way they control just how rare these items are whether they are being farmed or not.

Correct. There is a built in cooldown on drops, a random chance for it to be something rare and random things like crap loot in the containers and some if them being empty. Far from the free ride that people who don't do it make it out to be.

In fact, because of the cooldowns I find it pointless to do it repeatedly. I've gotten the best results from sticking my farming toons where they need to be (currently 3) and playing one. Run a few quests, etc then log and do a farming run with each of the farmers, followed by another. Then go back to the toon I'm playing for a bit.

Really what this whole debate amounts to is what so many debates about eso amount to.. There is a brand of player who plays this game that can't seem to grasp the concept that it's not their prerogative to tell everyone else how to play and violations of their personal tastes aren't the same as violations of the rules, "exploits" or anything else.

Sorry but that's rubbish. The cool down means nothing until after you have found something. And your odds of finding the first motif are incredibly higher logging in and out of a building with several containers compared to running from town to town.

You aren't breaking the rules and that's fine. But please don't suggest it's just a different play style. We all know better.

Alphashado wrote: »

Fleymark wrote: »

lathbury wrote: »

Sapphy24 wrote: »

Ok, so I don't get it. Why would you log in and out over and over for? I have 8 toons and not one of them has ever got something by logging in and out.
Am I just having a blond moment?

Ok I can help here if you were to walk in to a building and open all the containers you would have to wait a few minutes for the containers to reset back to closed. If you relog the containers reset to closed so the wait is shorter.
That is the only real advantage it offers it means instead of looting 1 building then porting to another with lots of containers then another you can relog in the same one untill the RNG decides to give you a purple item.
At this point it then goes on to a cool down where you will be unable to loot another for somewhere around 3-5 hours.
If you do farm an area using this method for 20 mins or so a day withing a few days it hits another cooldown and all the containers are already open when you enter the buildings in that zone.
I would suggest these are the changes that Jessica was talking about because at 1 point ppl where getting 10 in an hour now it's something like 2 a day untill wherever you are hits cooldown then you have to wait a week for the containers to be closed again.
Further to that it does not change the drop rate at all as zos easily control it by adding useless items to loot tables, increasing cool down length or making the timer before the second zone wide cooldown shorter. In this way they control just how rare these items are whether they are being farmed or not.

Correct. There is a built in cooldown on drops, a random chance for it to be something rare and random things like crap loot in the containers and some if them being empty. Far from the free ride that people who don't do it make it out to be.

In fact, because of the cooldowns I find it pointless to do it repeatedly. I've gotten the best results from sticking my farming toons where they need to be (currently 3) and playing one. Run a few quests, etc then log and do a farming run with each of the farmers, followed by another. Then go back to the toon I'm playing for a bit.

Really what this whole debate amounts to is what so many debates about eso amount to.. There is a brand of player who plays this game that can't seem to grasp the concept that it's not their prerogative to tell everyone else how to play and violations of their personal tastes aren't the same as violations of the rules, "exploits" or anything else.

Sorry but that's rubbish. The cool down means nothing until after you have found something. And your odds of finding the first motif are incredibly higher logging in and out of a building with several containers compared to running from town to town.

You aren't breaking the rules and that's fine. But please don't suggest it's just a different play style. We all know better.

With recipes, the longer you wait the higher chances of getting a recipe. Quite often the first one you loot has one. But then the rarity works off of that. My observation is that motifs are on a different cooldown, but not entirely sure what. They definitely work differently than recipes though. Obviously the blues are more common than purples. I might get a run of blues and might not see any for a while. I've gotten two or three purple motifs in a day then gone 3 or 4 days without seeing one. In all of this time I've farmed I've only seen one imperial and three purple recipes. All v5 drinks. And it would seem that since the last patch the rates have been tweaked. Blue recipes are a tad more common and two of the three purples I've gotten were in the last several days. Meanwhile motifs across the board seem to be a lot more rare. Certainly blues.

In any case, I completely disagree. It IS simply just a different play style. The exact same thing could be accomplished by wayshrining back and forth between two or several camps and never logging. This method works better for me because recipes are level based and to accomplish what I'm going for, a full recipe set, I've made the effort to address that reality presented to us by the designers of the game. If you find that your goals are better met by doing other things I'm happy for you. But you have no moral superiority over me because of how you chose to play than I do over you so long as neither of us are breaking the rules. Which we aren't.

It has been officially stated definitively that this mechanic is working as intended and some tweaks were needed. Which have happened. Simply because some people chose to believe otherwise is their problem, frankly.

I think they are on the same cooldown but in each zone there are potentially 3 food and three drink purple recipes and only 2 motifs making them 3 times rarer but I could be wrong.

Nobody said it was faster. In fact I said relogging was faster.

dharbert wrote: »

That is true, but I don't mind engaging these people.

Love the game but sick to death of the types that infest it who think it's their job to tell everyone else how to play. And that they are morally and ethically WRONG to not do so. Because it's patently untrue.

Thankyou for your reply

lathbury wrote: »

Sapphy24 wrote: »

Ok, so I don't get it. Why would you log in and out over and over for? I have 8 toons and not one of them has ever got something by logging in and out.
Am I just having a blond moment?

Ok I can help here if you were to walk in to a building and open all the containers you would have to wait a few minutes for the containers to reset back to closed. If you relog the containers reset to closed so the wait is shorter.
That is the only real advantage it offers it means instead of looting 1 building then porting to another with lots of containers then another you can relog in the same one untill the RNG decides to give you a purple item.
At this point it then goes on to a cool down where you will be unable to loot another for somewhere around 3-5 hours.
If you do farm an area using this method for 20 mins or so a day within a few days it hits another cooldown and all the containers are already open when you enter the buildings in that zone.
I would suggest these are the changes that Jessica was talking about because at 1 point ppl where getting 10 in an hour now it's something like 2 a day untill wherever you are hits cooldown then you have to wait a week for the containers to be closed again.
Further to that it does not change the drop rate at all as zos easily control it by adding useless items to loot tables, increasing cool down length or making the timer before the second zone wide cooldown shorter. In this way they control just how rare these items are whether they are being farmed or not.

I used to just open containers in the bank but gave it up as a really bad idea as then I had to sort it all and put it somewhere as my banks always full. I didn't realise I might get a purple but... having said that.. i'm afraid I couldn't be bothered spending all my play time sorting and trying to get rid of all the stuff collected. I like purples but I wont be doing that.

Alphashado wrote: »

I couldn't really care less what you guys do. Never really have. I've ways viewed it as a design flaw that zos will just have to live with until they figure out a reasonable solution. Which they will.

What I disagree with is the amazingly predictable lvl of denial we get from you log farmers. You are free to do it w/o repricussion. But please give up with the notion that you are somehow just using another playstyle. You are taking advantage of a broken and poorly designed flaw in the system and you know it.

Do you honestly believe the folks at zos are admiring you unique "playstyle"?

There being a design flaw here is purely your opinion. That's it. Nothing is broken at all. You know how I know this?

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

This is not something we consider an exploit or bannable offense. Though it's working as designed, we do intend to make some improvements to the current design.

From this thread in April:

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/87214/need-confirmation-is-motif-farming-a-bannable-offense/p2

That's the official word. I didn't start doing it until I read that. It's not about a "unique playstyle" or anything else. The makers of the game have said that this is an intended option for those who choose to use it. How freaking hard is that to understand?

You guys who insist that it is otherwise are the ones in denial.

As has been said repeatedly in this thread, this really sums up a good portion of the eso community....Official word that this is working as intended and nothing is broken has been repeated over and over, yet you people still insist that your opinion to the contrary carries any weight in this matter. It doesn't. Get over it. It's ridiculous.

Feel free to find an official post to the contrary since. When you do, I'll concede you have a point. Until that time, stop deluding yourself that you aren't completely wrong and hold some moral high ground.

Doesn't say working as intended. It says working as designed. Huge difference. Do you REALLY believe they INTENDED for people to log in and out all day long to farm containers? Do you really believe that was part of what they envisioned for the game? Please.

The system is working as designed. And the design is flawed. They know it, I know it, and you know it.

Accepting the fact they made a poorly designed system with an unforeseen side effect is entirely different than working as intended which would imply they intended for you to log out all day long and collect motifs.

Working as designed and working as intended are two different things.

Plus like I said. I don't care either way. But I do find it very sad that the average explorer stands very little chance of finding rare motifs as a side effect of the "changes" made to deal with log farming.

Alphashado wrote: »

Doesn't say working as intended. It says working as designed. Huge difference. Do you REALLY believe they INTENDED for people to log in and out all day long to farm containers? Do you really believe that was part of what they envisioned for the game? Please.

The system is working as designed. And the design is flawed. They know it, I know it, and you know it.

Accepting the fact they made a poorly designed system with an unforeseen side effect is entirely different than working as intended which would imply they intended for you to log out all day long and collect motifs.

Working as designed and working as intended are two different things.

Plus like I said. I don't care either way. But I do find it very sad that the average explorer stands very little chance of finding rare motifs as a side effect of the "changes" made to deal with log farming.

As has already been addressed earlier in the thread, you are simply splitting hairs with a semantic argument to distract from the FACT that you are completely WRONG. No, there is no "huge" difference, as much as you would like for there to be since you have no other straw to grasp at. In fact, in all practicality, there's no difference whatsoever. When you get into the business of parsing finite meanings of every word in a completely unambiguous official statement, you might consider that you are fighting a losing battle in a debate you have already lost. LOL

No, the design is not flawed. Otherwise they would have changed it rather than tweaking it.

And no, I don't know that. I farm because this is the farming method they designed for us to have. As they have stated. I did not start until I read that statement. The tweaks to the system were not made because I farm. They were made because that's how ZOS wants it to be. I'm sorry that this FACT is inconvenient for your flawed logic and your apparent need to self appoint yourself the arbiter of how others play a game.

"Poorly designed system" is nothing more than your opinion. Unfortunately for you, the designers of the game don't share your opinion.

You know how I know all this? Because they said so...

ZOS_JessicaFolsom wrote: »

This is not something we consider an exploit or bannable offense. Though it's working as designed, we do intend to make some improvements to the current design.

From this thread in April:

http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/87214/need-confirmation-is-motif-farming-a-bannable-offense/p2



You really need to accept the fact that you are WRONG, get over it, and stop trying to foist your personal preferences on everyone else.

Alphashado wrote: »

Fleymark wrote: »

SFBryan18 wrote: »

Get enough people to argue that water isn't wet, and then get a customer service moderator to sign off on it, and guess what? Now none of us can find any water because they nerfed the *** out of it. Nice job!

Jessica and Gina are neither "customer service" nor "moderators." There are other people who do those things. They are public relations people in charge of being the go betweens between the company and developers of the game and the community. They are the public voices of ZOS.

Like I told the other guy, you can jump up and down and throw a tantrum all you want, make silly analogies all you want, etc etc but the fact remains, the makers of this game, the only opinions that truly matter on this issue, think farming like this is just fine to do. And they have said so. They have also tweaked it as they said they were going to also.

You really need to get over it.

All you guys are doing is screwing over those of us that refuse to use that strategy. And you know it. Every patch there are more and more nerfs to the drop rates because of you. And you know it. Quit trying to pis on our heads and tell us it's raining.

You keep on playing the game as it was "designed" and I will keep on playing the game as it was "intended".

No, I'm simply employing the farming method the developers provided for us. Nothing more nothing less. I did not start until I read the official post on it in the other thread.

You simply want the game to be changed to fit your particular personal preferences. I farm because that's the option we've been given. Simply because you are too lazy to do it doesn't mean it's wrong or I'm wrong or anyone else is wrong.

The option to farm is available to you to do at any time. Choose not to do it if you want, but the game was designed for it. No one is "screwing you over" but you.

Frankly, your argument is ridiculous. It would be like saying that everyone who quests to level are "screwing you over" because you refuse to quest. LOL

Don't blame those of us play the game the way it was designed to be played because you can't be bothered.

I've read it. They are basically saying they screwed up the design (my take - because people were using it in a way that was not intended) which is why we have seen so many 'improvements' since April.

smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »

why did you title this gold farming? That is not gold farming? Was it titled like that to evoke stronger emotions in people?

Well if you sell in game for gold is not gold farming??

I would say in a way it is gold farming for as long as you sell a item you have login and logout time and time again get then it is gold farming even if it is you do and not a bot for as long you make a profit on it is gold farming.