Played Skyrim earlier. I found myself asking the question...

Requiemslove · August 2014

ZOS, why'd you do the things you do?

Just to clarify, I understand comparing ESO to the 2011 game of the year, is a bad judgment call, but it seems impossible not to. From the graphics simply being superior in Skyrim, [they are, its all more rich and vibrant and...magical] to the forceful exciting combat, to the incredible array of skills at your disposal, which allows you to eventually [though it does take a very long time] become master of all skills. Skyrim is better. It truly is and as a game only lacks in those areas it should lack, against MMOs as a single player adventure game, being RP elements and less customization elements, yet ESO does even those substandard, VS other titles. Just to clarify more so, as it may seem to be this is not in any way a review, its more a rebuke. I find myself asking ZOS why did you not take the incredible-ness of Skyrim, and bring its epic combat and amazing character build to ESO? ESO feels more to me a ES alike pretender, than the real McCoy. They promised us the ES world but set on a massive scale, yet the game does not feel either big enough, or intimate enough [in feel, you can zoom out way too far in ESO] to feel like an ES title. I am aware changes are on the way, and that ZOS want to create a more fulfilled vision, but I feel like ESO will not ever feel as it should have done from the start. And part of that, for me is because they cant marry the two halves of this concept together. Yet I feel maybe better developers could.

Sorry guys, rant over. I should maybe not play Skyrim as it only brings home the kind of experience this SHOULD be.

Weberda · August 2014

"Awesome combat" in Skyrim??!?!? With 2 weeks of creation your character can be one-shotting everything including dragons with a dragonbone sword or bow enchanted with chaos and whatever else you fancy. It was great early on but only has limited replay value. And personally I think the graphics in TESO are just as good as Skyrim's.

Audigy · August 2014

The original Skyrim graphics are not better, what made them good were mods. When Skyrim came out people were extremely [snip] by the poor visual settings and textures, keep in mind Skyrim didn't even ship with HD textures!

That whole game of the year etc. is flawed anyways. Skyrim was just like Fallout & co. a good game, but the real credit must go to all those Modders. Those made the games to what they are today.

We had modded lightning, textures, AI, housing, Dragons, NPCs, marriage & companion system, skill lines, dungeons, towns, armors and swords ... I didn't count them but I am sure there are about 100k of mods for Skyrim, prolly more.

[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Cursing & Profanity]

UrQuan · August 2014

Requiemslove wrote: »

Just to clarify, I understand comparing ESO to the 2011 game of the year, is a bad judgment call, but it seems impossible not to. From the graphics simply being superior in Skyrim, [they are, its all more rich and vibrant and...magical]

You can't compare the graphics in a single player game to the graphics in an MMO. You just can't. MMO graphics will never be as good. Having said that, ESO has the best graphics I've seen in an MMO, and on ultra settings they're almost on a level with Skyrim (mind you, I had a bunch of graphics mods in Skyrim to make it look better - compared to vanilla Skyrim ESO might actually have better graphics).

I also disagree on Skyrim having better combat. ESO combat takes way more skill and timing (especially since you can't pause to select a new spell that's perfect for the situation from your list of a bazillion spells). I went back and played a bit of Skyrim not that long ago, and hoo boy did the combat seem clunky and dull.

Having said that, there are definitely things that I think ESO didn't do as well as Skyrim.

SluggoV2 · August 2014

Got to agree w/ Audigy. Mods make the game awesome.

...and in my opinion, TESIV Oblivion was the best TES.

Sallington · August 2014

MRW reading this OP

Mods are what make Skyrim a great game. Other than that it's the worst of the series IMO.

MorHawk · August 2014

UrQuan wrote: »

I also disagree on Skyrim having better combat. ESO combat takes way more skill and timing (especially since you can't pause to select a new spell that's perfect for the situation from your list of a bazillion spells). I went back and played a bit of Skyrim not that long ago, and hoo boy did the combat seem clunky and dull.

Seconded. Skyrim simply wasn't fun for me until I could mod it to tie loadouts to hotkeys. It'd have been considerably more fun if it had more of ESO's combat mechanics.

Requiemslove wrote: »

the incredible array of skills at your disposal, which allows you to eventually [though it does take a very long time] become master of all skills.

Come on, you really think being an OP god of destruction is a good idea in an MMO? Skyrim was way too unbalanced to just port over as is. Some skills were *far* outstripping others, and most importantly, would promote homogeneous 'cover-every-role' builds a la GW2.

Anastasia · August 2014

Requiemslove wrote: »

ZOS, why'd you do the things you do?

Just to clarify, I understand comparing ESO to the 2011 game of the year, is a bad judgment call, but it seems impossible not to. From the graphics simply being superior in Skyrim, [they are, its all more rich and vibrant and...magical] to the forceful exciting combat, to the incredible array of skills at your disposal, which allows you to eventually [though it does take a very long time] become master of all skills. Skyrim is better. It truly is and as a game only lacks in those areas it should lack, against MMOs as a single player adventure game, being RP elements and less customization elements, yet ESO does even those substandard, VS other titles. Just to clarify more so, as it may seem to be this is not in any way a review, its more a rebuke. I find myself asking ZOS why did you not take the incredible-ness of Skyrim, and bring its epic combat and amazing character build to ESO? ESO feels more to me a ES alike pretender, than the real McCoy. They promised us the ES world but set on a massive scale, yet the game does not feel either big enough, or intimate enough [in feel, you can zoom out way too far in ESO] to feel like an ES title. I am aware changes are on the way, and that ZOS want to create a more fulfilled vision, but I feel like ESO will not ever feel as it should have done from the start. And part of that, for me is because they cant marry the two halves of this concept together. Yet I feel maybe better developers could.

Sorry guys, rant over. I should maybe not play Skyrim as it only brings home the kind of experience this SHOULD be.

You DO know of course that many console players who enjoyed all the other ES games do not, err, think as highly of Skyrim, don't you?

Also, ES VI should be out sometime in a couple years. THIS is an MMO set in a future ES-inspired world. Whether it was well done has merit as a discussion, but seeing as how the company spent mega time and money to draw in MMO players, both PvE AND PvP, I'd say its their take on an MMO, not the next ES single player game. Now, does that MMO 'take' work as was advertised?

ebondeath · August 2014

I played Skyrim last week and it felt a lot clunkier and unwieldy. Imo, in terms of graphics (unmodded), Skyrim has better scenery and atmosphere, ESO has better character models and movement. I also prefer ESO's combat and crafting systems by a landslide.

If Skyrim is vanilla ice cream and MMOs are chocolate, then ESO is some kind of fudge ripple with skittles. Still tastes good even if it's different.

Requiemslove · August 2014

Man, this was always going to happen I suppose. I did mention my OP was a personal rebuke and not an opener calling for discussion on the pro's and cons of both titles. Simply put I see a lot of stuff they had in Skyrim and previous titles mysteriously and incredulously lacking in ESO, as I said, I feel its ES alike, not an actual ES title. Any response to my OP, well everyone is free to voice their opinion but really I was not seeking the views of anyone when I created that post. I am out, all I wanted was to clear my head. The stage I leave to you all.

*waves bye*

BBSooner · August 2014

Shrug, I still am playing through morrowind while I play ESO, nothing wrong with enjoying multiple games.

I feel like instead of enjoying each game for themselves you are looking for a replacement to remove the need to play the other.

UrQuan · August 2014

Anastasia wrote: »

Also, ES VI should be out sometime in a couple years. THIS is an MMO set in a future ES-inspired world.

Set in the past, actually, compared to Skyrim, Oblivion, Morrowind, etc.

thorntk421 · August 2014

I agree with what everyone else has said. I also tried to play Skyrim again a couple weeks ago. That lasted about an hour and, I was done. the combat and movement felt clunky. Vanilla Skyrim graphics are far below ESOs.
Skyrim also felt lifeless to me. If that makes any sense.
Looking back now. Without all the mods, Skyrim kinda sucks.

Requiemslove · August 2014

BBSooner wrote: »

Shrug, I still am playing through morrowind while I play ESO, nothing wrong with enjoying multiple games.

I feel like instead of enjoying each game for themselves you are looking for a replacement to remove the need to play the other.

Actually I went into ESO looking for a replacement for lotro, not Skyrim. What I found was an MMO pretending to be half MMO half what ES titles are, and failing. ESO does not work as an MMO, not yet, not properly, things are missing in that regard as well.

Having said this, now, truly I am out. Leaving this thread now. Good day sir/Madam.

MorHawk · August 2014

Requiemslove wrote: »

Any response to my OP, well everyone is free to voice their opinion but really I was not seeking the views of anyone when I created that post. I am out, all I wanted was to clear my head. The stage I leave to you all.

I'm quite puzzled why you're posting on a forum then. Diaries sell for about $5 at Walmart, y'know.

Tabbycat · August 2014

I think the upcoming Spellcrafting, Champion and Justice systems will help ESO feel more like a TES game.

ESO is awesome as it is but it is still missing something.

Besides Todd Howard, I mean.

SluggoV2 · August 2014

I seen no comparison between LotR and ESO in the OP, the comparison was w/ Skyrim. Which if actually go back and play, you may realize that the combat is actually better in ESO, imo.

Not working as an MMO, really? I guess your are entitled to your opinion. I think that the game's pretty awesome, although it does have some things that can be improved upon, but ZOS has built a very solid foundation and I believe that this will continue to improve. I actually really enjoy the game, much more so than I did Skyrim, tbh.

Azzuria · August 2014

What makes ESO wildly different from Skyrim are necessary compromises when turning a single-player RPG into an MMO. Like them or not, it was impossible to create a story-driven MMO without turning a HUGE sandbox (Skyrim )into a collection of smaller, level-based sandboxes. It may annoy some of the hard-core ES players but, to my mind, it works well.

As to the vast array of skills available, I was stunned and a bit overwhelmed when I first started playing ESO. There were SO many choices every time I earned a skill point! And with the upcoming spell-crafting ability you'll see an exponential jump in numbers of spells, skills, builds, load-outs, etc. Talk about variety!

Comparing a fully-modded, 3 year old RPG with a few DLCs to a months-old MMO is apples - to - Volkswagens.

UrQuan · August 2014

Azzuria wrote: »

What makes ESO wildly different from Skyrim are necessary compromises when turning a single-player RPG into an MMO. Like them or not, it was impossible to create a story-driven MMO without turning a HUGE sandbox (Skyrim )into a collection of smaller, level-based sandboxes. It may annoy some of the hard-core ES players but, to my mind, it works well.

As to the vast array of skills available, I was stunned and a bit overwhelmed when I first started playing ESO. There were SO many choices every time I earned a skill point! And with the upcoming spell-crafting ability you'll see an exponential jump in numbers of spells, skills, builds, load-outs, etc. Talk about variety!

Comparing a fully-modded, 3 year old RPG with a few DLCs to a months-old MMO is apples - to - Volkswagens.

This Volkswagen doesn't taste nearly as good as an apple!

KitLightning · August 2014

UrQuan wrote: »

This Volkswagen doesn't taste nearly as good as an apple!

Problem is the Volkswagen pretends its a Ferrari

kassandratheclericb14_ESO · August 2014

Audigy wrote: »

The original Skyrim graphics are not better, what made them good were mods. When Skyrim came out people were extremely pissed by the poor visual settings and textures, keep in mind Skyrim didn't even ship with HD textures!

That whole game of the year etc. is flawed anyways. Skyrim was just like Fallout & co. a good game, but the real credit must go to all those Modders. Those made the games to what they are today.

We had modded lightning, textures, AI, housing, Dragons, NPCs, marriage & companion system, skill lines, dungeons, towns, armors and swords ... I didn't count them but I am sure there are about 100k of mods for Skyrim, prolly more.

Well I can't tell you how many in the world...but the Nexus has about 28,000 Skyrim mods. Everything from ENB to complete retextures and new meshes to hair and eyes and exploding chickens of death.

poodlemasterb16_ESO · August 2014

Requiemslove wrote: »

Man, this was always going to happen I suppose. I did mention my OP was a personal rebuke and not an opener calling for discussion on the pro's and cons of both titles. Simply put I see a lot of stuff they had in Skyrim and previous titles mysteriously and incredulously lacking in ESO, as I said, I feel its ES alike, not an actual ES title. Any response to my OP, well everyone is free to voice their opinion but really I was not seeking the views of anyone when I created that post. I am out, all I wanted was to clear my head. The stage I leave to you all.

*waves bye*

LOL. Skyrim is a nice toy, I played with it for some 800 hours. ESO is head and shoulders above it in almost every way except perhaps graphically.

Nox_Aeterna · August 2014

Skyrim , thanks to the mods like so many others said ( which is fine honestly , same could be said about Morrowind and oblivion also) , is an awesome game. You can improve it with mods to make it the best experience to you , you pretty much change the game to fit your ideas.

There is a reason a game from 2011 gets on steam alone , which means outside pirated copies , around 50.000 players/day playing at the same time , those numbers would be awesome if it was total players/day only lols.

ESO is a average game at best , it will never live up to what modders can make the other single player TES games be.

BBSooner · August 2014

Requiemslove wrote: »

BBSooner wrote: »

Shrug, I still am playing through morrowind while I play ESO, nothing wrong with enjoying multiple games.

I feel like instead of enjoying each game for themselves you are looking for a replacement to remove the need to play the other.

Actually I went into ESO looking for a replacement for lotro, not Skyrim. What I found was an MMO pretending to be half MMO half what ES titles are, and failing. ESO does not work as an MMO, not yet, not properly, things are missing in that regard as well.

Having said this, now, truly I am out. Leaving this thread now. Good day sir/Madam.

I dunno, it isn't hard to replace LotRO imo, it hasn't been worth paying since SoM, and it's best times were way back during SoA.

I'd suggest though that if you're unhappy with ESO to move on though.

Pallmor · August 2014

As has been said about a million times now:

ESO is not Skyrim
Skyrim is not ESO

If you want Skyrim, go play Skyrim. If you want a pretty darn good MMO set in the ES universe, play ESO. You simply can't port Skyrim over to an MMO without changing it significantly. That's just the way it is. You have balance issues to consider, you have graphics and bandwidth issues to consider, you have scaling issues, and about a million other things that make this simply impossible. It's just the way it is.

Now, personally I like ESO. I've played every ES game since Morrowind. And I like ESO because the world feels way more "alive" than any other game in the series. Nothing beats having real people in the world, instead of just a bunch of AI's. Nothing beats the impromptu team-ups, the weirdness and unpredictability, the marketplace and trading, the variety--all that you get from a game where you're playing with other real people.

Do I think ESO is perfect? Of course not! But do I think it is fundamentally flawed because it's not some carbon copy of Skyrim? Nope! It can't be.

Azzuria · August 2014

Pallmor wrote: »

Do I think ESO is perfect? Of course not! But do I think it is fundamentally flawed because it's not some carbon copy of Skyrim? Nope! It can't be.

Bingo! Been saying this since Day One.

SluggoV2 · August 2014

Love that fact the OP said he did not post this as a open discussion or with teh intent of hearing other people opinions... WTF?

Why post in a "Discussion Forum" if you didn't intend on hearing feed back from other gamers... Use social media if you just want to "get it off your chest".

geez... get a facebook account and play some Candy Crush.

FreedomDude · August 2014

All games look better modded, but I feel ESO looks better than vanilla Skyrim, but both games have a different art style:

Vanilla Skyrim:

Modded Skyrim:

Vanilla ESO:

http--www.gamegpu.ru-images-stories-Test_GPU-MMO-The_Elder_Scrolls_Online-cach-hd_1.jpg

"Modded" (sort of) ESO:

Saying ESO looks terrible is just silly...

Elad13 · August 2014

I can put it in simple terms...I enjoyed skyrim for about 3 months....I enjoyed teso for almost the same time....what's to come who knows???
by September I will be playing some other game anyways. TESO was fun...now its not much...maybe when consoles come out I will port over my character and have some fun again....outside that the game just didn't live up to expectations and on many levels fell short.

Nebthet78 · August 2014

I love Skyrim, and I am loving ESO... there is only one thing I am finding that disappoints be about ESO is that after completing quests, etc, I don't FEEL like I am actually making any Tamriel/World changing actions and that is mainly because it is an MMO and they have to put enough enemies there over and over again for other players to defeat, but it still sucks and ruins the immersion for me a little bit. But, I can live with it.

Plus, this is still a relatively new game...There is still plenty of landscape for us to explore in the future. In addition to a few other realms, like the full Shivering Isles and other parts of Oblivion should the developers choose to take us there.

MrDenimChicken · August 2014

Holy crap these forums have changed so much. Early after release everyone would agree with OP. Now any dissent against the game itself and how it feels, rather than bugs/balance (and sometimes even those), are responded too with almost vitriol.

Seeing these comments about ESO being "better in every way except graphics" is absurd. Sorry, but it's nearly unanimous from every professional game reviewer that ESO is not as good as Skyrim as a whole product. Sure, you can say they might not know their stuff or whatever, but I just find it so strange how everyone left on the forums is a huge fanboy defending their precious baby.....I guess all the people who didn't like it just left a while back.

I for one, agree with OP. I went back to Skyrim last week, and I haven't touched ESO since. Skyrim just makes you feel freaking epic man. This game feels so uninspiring, so constricted, like I'm on a treadmill. And it doesn't give me the same feeling of being in an MMO as did DAOC and WOW. I almost feel isolated from everyone running beside me, because the game just doesn't seem to promote grouping at all. And I feel like that is the most important aspect of an MMO.