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So when's Dragon's Blood getting nerfed?
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Murmeltier✭✭✭✭Hm, only an Idea. I think we should wait for the Results of Speallweaving before we try to nerf Skills. Maybe you can create some nice Healingspells there, i mean it has a Restoration Tree, not 100% sure. We will see.2 -
makkon✭✭✭
thx, captainIf your spamming it then you are not killing anyone........and will soon be out of Magicka
btw - dragon blood, dragon scales and 1h/shield block is main sustain of this class which makes possible to tanking 5+ ppl alot of time.
only templars can also do such things. but they have not so much damage due casting times, low amount of DoTs etc.3 -
SFBryan18✭✭✭✭✭
✭demonlkojipub19_ESO wrote: »Why dont we nerf the entire templar healing line too, since its like all better than dragon blood.
give it a rest.
Probably because Templar is the healing class and all their other abilities don't compare to DK.Edited by SFBryan18 on July 24, 2014 6:03AM2 -
cracker81✭✭✭Again L2p... If someone is blocking all the time and spams equals easy kill. I am not going to give more on info that is already on YouTube.3 -
cracker81✭✭✭Mojomonkeyman wrote: »arkansas_ESO wrote: »Mojomonkeyman wrote: »So, according to your flawless logic, why did we need a nerf on BE again, Kirsika? Ah right, there`s not only black & white, but a wide variety of nuances inbetween... which make certain aspects "fun" to play against or no so "fun".
You all mustve been very vocal against the BE nerf... or it`s just bias speaking.
I think BE was overpowered in terms that a lot of CC didn't affect it. If you immobilized a sorc with something like Dark Talons, they could still BE away. If you snared them heavily, they could still use it. If you tried to use Invasion to CC them before they BE'ed, they'd go down but would still teleport away, meaning you would have to use Invasion again to get within close range of them. If they wanted to rework the nerf of BE in that it's distance was affected by the snares and CC on the sorc, I'd be all for it.
Ah, suddenly we are able to see nuances again, of course regarding a skill that has been nerfed long time ago. In all honesty, don`t you think, that the synergy between GDB and other, equally powerful sustain skills out of the DK arsenal and 1h/s may justify some slight adjustments here and there?
I mean it takes longer to kill a lvl 40 DK than two v12 NBs... I love NBs by the way
Did you ever think that dk was a tank?4 -
SFBryan18✭✭✭✭✭
✭So by tank, you mean they live longer but can't fight back?Edited by SFBryan18 on July 24, 2014 6:31AM1 -
cracker81✭✭✭All class have a good survivability just ppl don't know how to play. I can't help it if you spam all your stuff and go oom. Then you hold black and someone hits you with light attacks. You don't know how to play your class. Yea, I am a dk v2 killed v12 toons. Most seemed to just spam and hold block. I start laughing. When I am done that guy/gal has 0 stamina/mana and then mace to face. I even seen some lose track of me. As I am behind them lol.4
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Mojomonkeyman✭✭✭✭✭
✭All class have a good survivability just ppl don't know how to play. I can't help it if you spam all your stuff and go oom. Then you hold black and someone hits you with light attacks. You don't know how to play your class. Yea, I am a dk v2 killed v12 toons. Most seemed to just spam and hold block. I start laughing. When I am done that guy/gal has 0 stamina/mana and then mace to face. I even seen some lose track of me. As I am behind them lol.
What exactly defines a tank? A tank is usually defined by his setup (armor, traits, skills). DK in light armor should be glassy, right? Ever tried to burst a DK in light armor?
You simply are not allowed to burst a DK, except you happen to be NB with a well timed fear, because it ignores block. Anyone else has to fight for minutes, no matter how glassy/bursty he is built. Trying to outressource a 1h/s DK is laughable, considering the ressource management tools he is given in addition to powerful sustain skills.
It`s less the strength of DK abilities thats annoying, more the lack of counters to those sustain skills to have a shot at bursting before having a ressource war for eternities that disadvantages you the soon you don`t happen to wear 1h/s.
There is no successful PvP game I ever played where a class is allowed to survive any burst just ... well...he chose the right class. It should be difficult to be tanky/durable. Hold RMB + press a single button every 5 seconds is not exactly difficult. And you consider that a feat? Oh dude, I wan`t to be so naive again.Edited by Mojomonkeyman on July 24, 2014 7:26AMKoma Grey, Chocolate Thunder, Little Mojo, Dagoth Mojo & Mojomancy0 -
Mojomonkeyman✭✭✭✭✭
✭Then it is not dk you should want to Nerf but fix armor.
No, you misunderstood. It`s the lack of counters in combination with great sustain given to the class, not the setup. Ever played GW2 for example?
Imagine a 25-30-0-0-15 backstab thief vs a point def guard (basically most glassy class & build vs most tanky class & build). Both are given tools to either finish the fight quickly or stall forever, depending on how well they used their tools. The guard had to time his dodges/blocks (which lasted just 2-3 seconds and had CD) to directly counter the deadly spikes of the thief. If he messed up hitting the right timing window, he`d likely lose.
A DK on the other hand will just RMB all the way, no stress, just press either scales or blood when you feel bored or pressured and it`s hopeless to quickly end it for any opponent, no matter how glassy he`s build and no matter how bad the DK is, until the minute long ressource war is decided. That`s a bit too easy for my taste.
Make being tanky skillful. If you care to read my posts in this thread I never asked for a nerf. I just think the full picture of DK sustain synergies should be looked at.
Best regardsEdited by Mojomonkeyman on July 24, 2014 7:40AMKoma Grey, Chocolate Thunder, Little Mojo, Dagoth Mojo & Mojomancy0 -
cracker81✭✭✭
well I am a tank in pve and pvp in heavy/ light. Seems right to me. I don't put much dmg out and expect to live longer than a dps spec.Mojomonkeyman wrote: »Then it is not dk you should want to Nerf but fix armor.
No, you misunderstood. It`s the lack of counters in combination with great sustain given to the class, not the setup. Ever played GW2 for example?
Imagine a 25-30-0-0-15 backstab thief vs a point def guard (basically most glassy class & build vs most tanky class & build). Both are given tools to either finish the fight quickly or stall forever, depending on how well they used their tools. The guard had to time his dodges/blocks (which lasted just 2-3 seconds and had CD) to directly counter the deadly spikes of the thief. If he messed up hitting the right timing window, he`d likely lose.
A DK on the other hand will just RMB all the way, no stress, just press either scales or blood when you feel bored or pressured and it`s hopeless to quickly end it for any opponent, no matter how glassy he`s build, until the minute long ressource war is decided. That`s a bit too easy for my taste.
Best regards
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AlexDrago✭✭✭
Dragon blood will never be nerfed and the real reason is that dev's playing DK.It's pretty stupid as it stands. Didn't Wheeler say, "DKs still have too much survivability" about a month ago?
Update please!
But honestly, its OP skill and need to be nerfed as BE - nex cast within 4 sec stop Magika Regen and cost 80% more.
If you have nothing to say say nothing ©7 -
Mojomonkeyman✭✭✭✭✭
✭
well I am a tank in pve and pvp in heavy/ light. Seems right to me. I don't put much dmg out and expect to live longer than a dps spec.Mojomonkeyman wrote: »Then it is not dk you should want to Nerf but fix armor.
No, you misunderstood. It`s the lack of counters in combination with great sustain given to the class, not the setup. Ever played GW2 for example?
Imagine a 25-30-0-0-15 backstab thief vs a point def guard (basically most glassy class & build vs most tanky class & build). Both are given tools to either finish the fight quickly or stall forever, depending on how well they used their tools. The guard had to time his dodges/blocks (which lasted just 2-3 seconds and had CD) to directly counter the deadly spikes of the thief. If he messed up hitting the right timing window, he`d likely lose.
A DK on the other hand will just RMB all the way, no stress, just press either scales or blood when you feel bored or pressured and it`s hopeless to quickly end it for any opponent, no matter how glassy he`s build, until the minute long ressource war is decided. That`s a bit too easy for my taste.
Best regards
Of course, but I would like to make you work and think a bit harder for being as tanky as you are Koma Grey, Chocolate Thunder, Little Mojo, Dagoth Mojo & Mojomancy0 -
AnubisRe✭✭✭Seriously? Nerfing the dk again? We had our fair share of nerfs and everytime it was because of complaints from pvp players and it had serious impact on all who are playing pve only since they are not interessted in fighting with and against other players. Like me. I like doing inis and raids and in my guild i'm one of the most wanted tanks if it comes dungeons because i can survive severe blows by mobs and bosses. Green Dragon blood helps me doing it while other members receive more healing from the healer. It saved our groups more than once from getting wiped. So if the dk has to be nerfed again restrict the nerf to cyrodiil only i.e. in pvp green dragon blood costs more magicka, heals a bit less or using it in less than x seconds again doubles the cost (same mechanic like used for BE) and don't cripple the survivablity of dk tanks in dungeons.3
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tordr86b16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭all skills should have a pvp version, this will end the imbalance and leave all our abilities intact for pve. they did that in archeage, and zos should be able to do the same.Edited by tordr86b16_ESO on July 24, 2014 10:23AM4 -
isengrimb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »all skills should have a pvp version, this will end the imbalance and leave all our abilities intact for pve. they did that in archeage, and zos should be able to do the same.
WoW hasn't even figured that out yet.
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makkon✭✭✭survivability of dk tanks is in wearing heavy armor and holding 1h/shield block + stamina potions + standart + other members damage reduction buffs.
same for all other classes.1 -
Loco_Mofo✭✭✭✭✭tordr86b16_ESO wrote: »all skills should have a pvp version, this will end the imbalance and leave all our abilities intact for pve. they did that in archeage, and zos should be able to do the same.
I agree, they did it in GW2 as well.1 -
AnubisRe✭✭✭survivability of dk tanks is in wearing heavy armor and holding 1h/shield block + stamina potions + standart + other members damage reduction buffs.
same for all other classes.
And because everybody else does it that way means i have to do it the exact same way and justifies nerfing a skill which adds to that surviability because of complaints from some pvp players? PVP Players are not the only players playing the game! And as stated above Zeni should be able to do skill nerfs for pvp only. That way pve players are not hurt in their way of playing and pvp gets its balance.0 -
CapuchinSeven✭✭✭✭✭
✭Seriously? Nerfing the dk again? We had our fair share of nerfs and everytime it was because of complaints from pvp players and it had serious impact on all who are playing pve .
People like you, clearly have never worked in game development.
Long story short, forums have very little impact on game developers. Hell, most of the good ones don't even play games.0 -
makkon✭✭✭
you playing pve only, I playing pvp only. both we are playing teso. I don't care about pve, you don't care about pvp. both we have opinions.And because everybody else does it that way means i have to do it the exact same way and justifies nerfing a skill which adds to that surviability because of complaints from some pvp players? PVP Players are not the only players playing the game! And as stated above Zeni should be able to do skill nerfs for pvp only. That way pve players are not hurt in their way of playing and pvp gets its balance.
tank isnt class who can mitigate all incoming damage in teso. tank is class who can mitigate 2-3 very hard hits and aggro for some time bosses/trash.
your survivability will provide supports (templars mostly), as well as healing, buffing and such. you don't need anything except aggro and blocking.
all other pve content facerolling without any problems
so, if they even remove dragon blood - it will only hurt your SOLO pve. as well, as pvp. in trials, no1 need you green dragon blood.
probably even not dragon blood main problem...whole archetype mechanics is broken with current game design.
I argue very easy:
if some classes can solo survive active 5+ ppl full dps more than 10 seconds and kill some strangers while blocking - I think it is some lack in game mechanic and should be looking into with priority. dk can do it. good, they can do anything except escaping in this game
mb not by nerfing current skills, but by reworking whole class. for sure they won't do this, so, as result, ppl want to nerf main sustain abilities to balance current ingame sht
Edited by makkon on July 24, 2014 12:08PM1 -
smeeprocketnub19_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Man you got to have some serious cojones to be a DK and try to justify your skills as balanced, or even underpowered.
The group I run with has had needed 3 or 4 people to take out 1 vr12 DK. Any other class, np. Second runner up is sorcerers, not because we can't take them, because of BE and them running anytime they want.
We had a level 40 something DK drop banner and stand there while we attacked him from ranged and just green dragon blood over and over and heal anything we threw at him. Took forever to kill him, and everyone attacking was a veteran ranked player. (and yes we know how to play before you try to feed me that bs.)
Like I said, any other class is no issue. DK is overpowered.Dear Sister, I do not spread rumors, I create them.4 -
couchkyle25_ESO✭✭✭omg, more QQing about DK's. I am DK and I seem to be unable to achieve this supposed OPness that everyone *** about. I get killed all the time, in a matter of seconds at times because I typically get jumped by like 5-15 ppl and get slammed with Pulsar, Snipe, and CC galore. I burn all my Stamina on CC breaking and have non left to really block with, and as a result get rofl-pwnd into the dirt. I can't survive in Cyrodiil as it is. Stop QQing about my damn Class already.
[Moderator Note: Edited per our rules on Rude and Insulting comments]Edited by ZOS_JoanaL on July 25, 2014 2:23AM1 -
couchkyle25_ESO✭✭✭smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »couchkyle25_ESO wrote: »omg, more QQing about DK's. L2P, I am DK and I seem to be unable to achieve this supposed OPness that everyone *** about. I get killed all the time, in a matter of seconds at times because I typically get jumped by like 5-15 ppl and get slammed with Pulsar, Snipe, and CC galore. I burn all my Stamina on CC breaking and have non left to really block with, and as a result get rofl-pwnd into the dirt. I can't survive in Cyrodiil as it is. Stop QQing about my damn Class already.
maybe the problem is that you just really suck and even an OP class can't save you.
Man, you die to 5-15 people though? that's nuts, I know the rest of the classes have no problem with that small of a group. It's not like a 1v1 fight is challenging for the rest of us or anything.
or maybe the DK just isn't that big of a freaking issue, since you all insist DKs are so damn easy you can just literally roll your face over your Keyboard and win as one. I get totally outplayed by other classes at times, because those ppl know wth they are doing. imo everyone still QQing about DKs simply need to play better.4 -
Haewk✭✭✭couchkyle25_ESO wrote: »smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »couchkyle25_ESO wrote: »omg, more QQing about DK's. L2P, I am DK and I seem to be unable to achieve this supposed OPness that everyone *** about. I get killed all the time, in a matter of seconds at times because I typically get jumped by like 5-15 ppl and get slammed with Pulsar, Snipe, and CC galore. I burn all my Stamina on CC breaking and have non left to really block with, and as a result get rofl-pwnd into the dirt. I can't survive in Cyrodiil as it is. Stop QQing about my damn Class already.
maybe the problem is that you just really suck and even an OP class can't save you.
Man, you die to 5-15 people though? that's nuts, I know the rest of the classes have no problem with that small of a group. It's not like a 1v1 fight is challenging for the rest of us or anything.
or maybe the DK just isn't that big of a freaking issue, since you all insist DKs are so damn easy you can just literally roll your face over your Keyboard and win as one. I get totally outplayed by other classes at times, because those ppl know wth they are doing. imo everyone still QQing about DKs simply need to play better.
Apparently DKs just drop standard, spam Dragon's Blood and people drop dead. Have you tried that?2 -
couchkyle25_ESO✭✭✭couchkyle25_ESO wrote: »smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »couchkyle25_ESO wrote: »omg, more QQing about DK's. L2P, I am DK and I seem to be unable to achieve this supposed OPness that everyone *** about. I get killed all the time, in a matter of seconds at times because I typically get jumped by like 5-15 ppl and get slammed with Pulsar, Snipe, and CC galore. I burn all my Stamina on CC breaking and have non left to really block with, and as a result get rofl-pwnd into the dirt. I can't survive in Cyrodiil as it is. Stop QQing about my damn Class already.
maybe the problem is that you just really suck and even an OP class can't save you.
Man, you die to 5-15 people though? that's nuts, I know the rest of the classes have no problem with that small of a group. It's not like a 1v1 fight is challenging for the rest of us or anything.
or maybe the DK just isn't that big of a freaking issue, since you all insist DKs are so damn easy you can just literally roll your face over your Keyboard and win as one. I get totally outplayed by other classes at times, because those ppl know wth they are doing. imo everyone still QQing about DKs simply need to play better.
Apparently DKs just drop standard, spam Dragon's Blood and people drop dead. Have you tried that?
Of course I've tried that, I even CC them with the infamous "TALONS OF OPness!" And they just roll out of them and out of the Standards range. People seem to think Standard is an instant death, each tick does not exactly do a lot of damage folks. Everyone in here saying that Cloth and Staff are the problem, are absolutely right, because I don't use those things and have these problems. DK's are not the issue, it is Cloth and Staff.3 -
smeeprocketnub19_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭couchkyle25_ESO wrote: »couchkyle25_ESO wrote: »smeeprocketnub19_ESO wrote: »couchkyle25_ESO wrote: »omg, more QQing about DK's. L2P, I am DK and I seem to be unable to achieve this supposed OPness that everyone *** about. I get killed all the time, in a matter of seconds at times because I typically get jumped by like 5-15 ppl and get slammed with Pulsar, Snipe, and CC galore. I burn all my Stamina on CC breaking and have non left to really block with, and as a result get rofl-pwnd into the dirt. I can't survive in Cyrodiil as it is. Stop QQing about my damn Class already.
maybe the problem is that you just really suck and even an OP class can't save you.
Man, you die to 5-15 people though? that's nuts, I know the rest of the classes have no problem with that small of a group. It's not like a 1v1 fight is challenging for the rest of us or anything.
or maybe the DK just isn't that big of a freaking issue, since you all insist DKs are so damn easy you can just literally roll your face over your Keyboard and win as one. I get totally outplayed by other classes at times, because those ppl know wth they are doing. imo everyone still QQing about DKs simply need to play better.
Apparently DKs just drop standard, spam Dragon's Blood and people drop dead. Have you tried that?
Of course I've tried that, I even CC them with the infamous "TALONS OF OPness!" And they just roll out of them and out of the Standards range. People seem to think Standard is an instant death, each tick does not exactly do a lot of damage folks. Everyone in here saying that Cloth and Staff are the problem, are absolutely right, because I don't use those things and have these problems. DK's are not the issue, it is Cloth and Staff.
Yea I'm pretty sure this is a l2play issue. If every other DK can faceroll groups of people, you should be able to too.
My advice, run with a guild that emperor flips and become a vampire. Also, wear a dress and stick.Dear Sister, I do not spread rumors, I create them.1 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭couchkyle25_ESO wrote: »DK's are not the issue, it is Cloth and Staff.
If that was true, then every class would be just as powerful as a DK when using cloth and staff.
They aren't.
The issue is not cloth and staff, and the issue is not DK's.
The issue is a combinaton of factors that, when brought together, make DK much more powerful than the other classes.Edited by Sharee on July 24, 2014 12:55PM3 -
Haewk✭✭✭You will be able to craft your own spells soon. Perhaps then all the crying about DKs can cease and you can cry about that instead.0