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Should main story VR questlines in enemy factions allow for an assassiation/subterfuge/diplomacy?
Enkil
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This is in reference to the Caldwell's Almanac which currently consists of you being teleported back in time to run through the same quests in the enemy factions as if you have made an alt character there. There are 5 main quests per enemy zone. Would you like to see an alternative option with those replaced by quests in involving assassination, subterfuge, spying and maybe some diplomacy here and there? This new questline could culminate in the player have to face the enemy faction's leader as a final boss.
Edited by Enkil on July 22, 2014 11:54AM Should main story VR questlines in enemy factions allow for an assassiation/subterfuge/diplomacy? 120 votes
Yes
69%
83 votes
No
14%
17 votes
No opinion
9%
11 votes
Other
7%
9 votes
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Akiainavas✭✭✭No opinionIt would be interesting, but it would need creating different story lines etc. If you decide to play a betrayal etc. it would need to have consequences and steer the story in a different direction - probably difficult to do.0
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Enodoc✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭OtherYes to your purpose, No to your actual question.
Cadwell's Almanac is there for people to play the other alliance's content with the same character.
Having an alternative reason to go there for diplomacy and subterfuge should be an option, but not a replacement.UESP: The Unofficial Elder Scrolls Pages - A collaborative source for all knowledge on the Elder Scrolls series since 1995
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gurluasb16_ESO✭✭✭✭I think we'll visit the other areas for real in later content. Personally my character is going through this to understand the other alliances, and try to make peace.
This is basically a sort of alternate reality Meridia is showing us.2 -
Enkil✭✭✭✭✭
✭YesYes to your purpose, No to your actual question.
Cadwell's Almanac is there for people to play the other alliance's content with the same character.
Having an alternative reason to go there for diplomacy and subterfuge should be an option, but not a replacement.
I don't follow you... I am suggesting an alternative reason to go there... an additional option. The way it works now (alternate reality) would remain as one of 2 options given you by Caldwell. They would need to be mutually exclusive options to maintain continuity.
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theyancey✭✭✭✭✭
✭No opinionThere are a few places where that could be woven in but not in every interaction.1 -
Vahrokh✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭OtherOther.
They should alter the quests texts (and voiceovers) so that the replayed content has at least a parvence of consistency.
In example, there are several quests where it's specifically written you can do some special feat because you don't have a soul.Whereas this is true before Molab Bal defeat, then you DO get a soul so you should not be able to complete any of the other faction quests that explicitly write you could do them because you don't have a soul.
The spoiler text irritates me with ESO to no end, it's really sand in the eyes, along with other similar inconsistencies.Vaerah, Dark Elf Magicka Sorceress
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Enodoc✭✭✭✭✭
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They wouldn't need to be mutually exclusive if your suggestion took place after the end of the Planemeld. Experiencing an alternative history doesn't alter the directed future. Any subterfuge/diplomacy quest line could be post-Planemeld in the timeline, whereas the Cadwell quest line is contemporary in the timeline with the pre-Coldharbour content you have already done. You could choose to do either or both, as they do not need to occur at the same point in time.Yes to your purpose, No to your actual question.
Cadwell's Almanac is there for people to play the other alliance's content with the same character.
Having an alternative reason to go there for diplomacy and subterfuge should be an option, but not a replacement.
I don't follow you... I am suggesting an alternative reason to go there... an additional option. The way it works now (alternate reality) would remain as one of 2 options given you by Caldwell. They would need to be mutually exclusive options to maintain continuity.
Edit to respond to @Vahrokh:
But when playing the other faction content, you are playing in the timeline as if you had ended up there instead, i.e. before you got your soul back. Meridia's light presents a "what if" scenario; "what if you had landed somewhere else in the sea?"Other.
They should alter the quests texts (and voiceovers) so that the replayed content has at least a parvence of consistency.
In example, there are several quests where it's specifically written you can do some special feat because you don't have a soul.Whereas this is true before Molab Bal defeat, then you DO get a soul so you should not be able to complete any of the other faction quests that explicitly write you could do them because you don't have a soul.
The spoiler text irritates me with ESO to no end, it's really sand in the eyes, along with other similar inconsistencies.Edited by Enodoc on July 22, 2014 1:21PMUESP: The Unofficial Elder Scrolls Pages - A collaborative source for all knowledge on the Elder Scrolls series since 1995
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BBSooner✭✭✭✭✭
✭YesWhile getting the option for subterfuge would be acceptable, I'd also simply like to have the VR experience after 50 to continue where the main quest leaves off - either discovering what's molag bals next step, being sent back to PvE Cyrodil pre-alliance war to experience the tensions that lead up to the planemeld and Mannimarco's betrayal, or following Sai/Lyris somewhere.2 -
Enkil✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yes
They wouldn't need to be mutually exclusive if your suggestion took place after the end of the Planemeld. Experiencing an alternative history doesn't alter the directed future. Any subterfuge/diplomacy quest line could be post-Planemeld in the timeline, whereas the Cadwell quest line is contemporary in the timeline with the pre-Coldharbour content you have already done. You could choose to do either or both, as they do not need to occur at the same point in time.Yes to your purpose, No to your actual question.
Cadwell's Almanac is there for people to play the other alliance's content with the same character.
Having an alternative reason to go there for diplomacy and subterfuge should be an option, but not a replacement.
I don't follow you... I am suggesting an alternative reason to go there... an additional option. The way it works now (alternate reality) would remain as one of 2 options given you by Caldwell. They would need to be mutually exclusive options to maintain continuity.
But if you consider AD, the player would be going back in time and propping up the Queen, then if they wanted to do the spying/assassination they would be going through those same zones a second time doing alternate things and end up fighting the Queen. It would have to be mutually exclusive, otherwise you would be repeating history and creating a paradox. Trying to steer away from the time travel premise (which I find kinda silly), not complicate it further.
Edited by Enkil on July 22, 2014 1:31PM0 -
tylarthb16_ESO✭✭✭Well the veteran reuse of the other alliance content is an obvious tack on content wise, to extend game play without really any new content post main quest.
As a result of it not being part of the original design, there are inconsistencies (terrible in some cases), a detrimental effect on original alliance loyalty, and the loss freshness an alt experience in different alliance offer.
While the OP is right to suggest more options for vet, it won't occur due to how cheaply the normal content was just up leveled for vet reuse. Rather than the resources being used in a post main quest veteran quest line (infiltrations, spying and battling resurgent cultists etc). But such a revamp to be appropriate would cost a load in new dialogue recording, new quest/scenarios in areas, essentially 2 full campaigns created and written for content we'd have already finished.
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Enodoc✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Other
I don't see why you couldn't go through the quests and help the queen in an alternate history which never actually happened, and then go on to your own future and fight her.
They wouldn't need to be mutually exclusive if your suggestion took place after the end of the Planemeld. Experiencing an alternative history doesn't alter the directed future. Any subterfuge/diplomacy quest line could be post-Planemeld in the timeline, whereas the Cadwell quest line is contemporary in the timeline with the pre-Coldharbour content you have already done. You could choose to do either or both, as they do not need to occur at the same point in time.Yes to your purpose, No to your actual question.
Cadwell's Almanac is there for people to play the other alliance's content with the same character.
Having an alternative reason to go there for diplomacy and subterfuge should be an option, but not a replacement.
I don't follow you... I am suggesting an alternative reason to go there... an additional option. The way it works now (alternate reality) would remain as one of 2 options given you by Caldwell. They would need to be mutually exclusive options to maintain continuity.
But if you consider AD, the player would be going back in time and propping up the Queen, then if they wanted to do the spying/assassination they would be going through those same zones a second time doing alternate things and end up fighting the Queen. It would have to be mutually exclusive, otherwise you would be repeating history and creating a paradox. Trying to steer away from the time travel premise (which I find kinda silly), not complicate it further.UESP: The Unofficial Elder Scrolls Pages - A collaborative source for all knowledge on the Elder Scrolls series since 1995
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jrgray93✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭NoThe way I understood it was that you were "seeing events through another's eyes" or something to that effect. I really don't remember why / how you are there and if it is even supposed to be in a physical sense.EP: Slania Isara : Harambe Was an Inside Job0 -
Enkil✭✭✭✭✭
✭YesThe way I understood it was that you were "seeing events through another's eyes" or something to that effect. I really don't remember why / how you are there and if it is even supposed to be in a physical sense.
That's why I proposed the alternative above... it would make total sense and would be a continuation of the story, rather than traveling in time. You would be sent to infiltrate the enemy faction, gain intel, conduct sabotage and sow discord in the enemy's ranks....2 -
Azzuria✭✭✭✭✭YesThis is one of my main problems with the VR content in other faction lands. Just re-doing the same quests.
If they wanted to repurpose existing zones it would have been more interesting to have spy / sabotage / agent provacteur quests take the place of the faction aiding ones members of that faction undertake. You could still help out the people ( because people are people so why should it be that you and I should get along so awfully? ) but undermine the governance.Edited by Azzuria on July 22, 2014 5:05PMBrunhilda Icehammer - Nord Dragonknight, 'Smith & Enchantress 'What is 'ranged? I need to hit something!!'
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Evandus✭✭✭✭YesI'd be very pleased if there were other options to advancing my characters aside from helping enemy factions. I really don't like being forced onto that path.
One should have other options to gaining veteran ranks/champion points than being forced to do that.0 -
starlizard70ub17_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭YesIt would certainly be more interesting and I'd read the npc dialouge more often."We have found a cave, but I don't think there are warm fires and friendly faces inside."0 -
Zorrashi✭✭✭✭✭YesIt seems really nice and appealing in theory. But I have no clue as to how it should be implemented.0 -
Enkil✭✭✭✭✭
✭YesIt seems really nice and appealing in theory. But I have no clue as to how it should be implemented.
Only the main quest lines would need to be changed... Could rework some of the existing quests... Meet up with agents from home faction and conduct spying missions... Assassinate key figures.... Open dialog and work with dissidents... Establish an undercover basest operations... Lead an offensive... There are tons of possibilities...Edited by Enkil on July 23, 2014 12:36AM0 -
Evergnar✭✭✭✭✭
✭YesYes, I would love this but it won't happen. Zos won't take the time to rework it. Why? because it was never intended for vet levels to begin with. The marketable value in saying "Improved existing areas" is much less than being able to say "Brand new areas, never seen before". They will continue with new areas like Craglorn.0 -
Zorrashi✭✭✭✭✭YesIt seems really nice and appealing in theory. But I have no clue as to how it should be implemented.
The only thing that would need to be changed is the main quest lines... Could rework some of the existing quests... Meet up with agents from home faction and conduct spying missions... Assassinate key figures.... Open dialog and work with dissidents...
Establish an undercover base... There are tons of possibilities...
Yes, I agree that there are boundless possibilities, but a complete revamp of the main quest lines seems very time consuming.
On the other hand, additions like choice options, while easier, may seem lacking. I certainly don't want them to be half done.0 -
Daethz✭✭✭YesWell currently the system treats you as one of their own factions doing the same quests they do for the good of their kingdom.
It wouldent make sense to sabotage them because you are essentially viewing the "what if" of if you awoken'd in some other factions land instead of your own.
But I think ZOS should redo veteran content to be like this potentially in a future expansion, think of it as being like WoW's cataclysm, where they redid lower level quest zones.Waiting, and watching, for the return of Melee Weapons.
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skeletorz_ESO✭✭✭NoThis is a ridiculous suggestion.
The point, in the storyline, is so your character can find a way to make peace with the other factions. Assassinating their leaders? Kinda the opposite of that.“If you would be a real seeker after truth, it is necessary that at least once in your life you doubt, as far as possible, all things.” -- René Descartes1 -
Nox_Aeterna✭✭✭✭✭
✭OtherPeople make it sound so easy.
It would take a LOT and i mean a LOT of work to get all this done , this is not only a small change.
The reason they added the vet content was to buy time , it is just the same content they tossed over the players to make them play for longer doing quests and such. That was quick.
Also do consider , the point where they toss the player into cyro , is one where all faction are at the same stage.
You want the game to allow you to kill and ruin the enemy factions , at the same time cyrodiil appears that nothing changed.
This would also take a lot more to consider when adding exp packs that continue the story and so on."Never attribute to malice that which is adequately explained by stupidity."
-Hanlon's razor0 -
Enkil✭✭✭✭✭
✭Yesskeletorz_ESO wrote: »This is a ridiculous suggestion.
The point, in the storyline, is so your character can find a way to make peace with the other factions. Assassinating their leaders? Kinda the opposite of that.
Make peace? Huh??
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Enodoc✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Other
Well the exact wording is "see the world through the eyes of your former enemies". Take that how you will...skeletorz_ESO wrote: »This is a ridiculous suggestion.
The point, in the storyline, is so your character can find a way to make peace with the other factions. Assassinating their leaders? Kinda the opposite of that.
Make peace? Huh??UESP: The Unofficial Elder Scrolls Pages - A collaborative source for all knowledge on the Elder Scrolls series since 1995
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Innocente✭✭✭✭NoDo you seriously expect them to re-write the entire set of quest lines for all three factions?
Simply a not to well thought out suggestion.1 -
Anvos✭✭✭NoI have to say no as, what were witnessing is essentially how the other alliances got to the invasion of Coldharbor, so essentially you can't change anything that leads to that event occurring. Thus a history where you can't change anything important is pointless.
Also even if you view Meridia's Light/Artifact as more than a simulation of what happened for the other alliances it isn't that hard to believe that along with making your body respond as if it was still soulless, Merdia made it restrict your free will.Edited by Anvos on July 23, 2014 11:22PM0 -
Kalann_Pander✭✭✭YesNear the start of the main quest, the Prophet warns you that Worm Cult agents are everywhere, and to spend your spare time finding and defeating them.
Once your first faction - and the main quest - are finished, there should be no doubt that although you've finished clearing up your own barn, with the cult's highest figures dispatched, there still remains many cultists in Tamriel, most likely trying to manipulate the major factions into continuing the bloodshed and chaos.
Would be nice to get to clean them out
More gratifying than the "alternative story" thing.Also even if you view Meridia's Light/Artifact as more than a simulation of what happened for the other alliances it isn't that hard to believe that along with making your body respond as if it was still soulless, Merdia made it restrict your free will.
From what I remember from Skyrim, Meridia couldn't care less about your free will. Light needs to shine, undead need to be destroyed ... you will do it. She doesn't imagine you would refuse, and gives even less thought to why that could even happen.
Her goals are mostly in sync with Tamriel's living and civilized folk. She herself, however, is absolutely insufferable - the worst monomaniac dictator you could ever imagine.Opinions are like buttholes : Everybody has one, and they usually stink.
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Anvos✭✭✭NoActually since a large aspect of her was stuck in the city in coldharbor I would say she does have a large vested interest in restricting your free will in the other alliances so you don't stop the invasion from happening.0
