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How long should a [well known] bug take to get fixed?
Blackwidow
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There have been bugs in the game that have been here for well over a year.
Take the front door in Vulkhel in the bank building. That has been fixed, broken, fixed, broken, fixed and now broken for a few weeks again.
The door can sometimes catch you and not let you move or drop you off the face of the earth.
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/100615/fall-through-the-earth#latest
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2gw52WCSCs&feature=youtu.be
Should we really be falling through the world a few months after launch?
I know some of you will say it's still early in release.
I have to ask, when does that stop being viable excuse for you? 6 months? A year?
How long should ZOS expect people to pay to beta test ESO?
Edited by Blackwidow on June 11, 2014 8:05AM Take the front door in Vulkhel in the bank building. That has been fixed, broken, fixed, broken, fixed and now broken for a few weeks again.
The door can sometimes catch you and not let you move or drop you off the face of the earth.
http://forums.elderscrollsonline.com/discussion/100615/fall-through-the-earth#latest
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=i2gw52WCSCs&feature=youtu.beShould we really be falling through the world a few months after launch?
I know some of you will say it's still early in release.
I have to ask, when does that stop being viable excuse for you? 6 months? A year?
How long should ZOS expect people to pay to beta test ESO?
How long should a [well known] bug take to get fixed? 130 votes
A few days.
30%
39 votes
A few weeks.
42%
55 votes
A few months.
6%
9 votes
Over a year.
9%
12 votes
ESO dies not have bugs, what are you talking about?
11%
15 votes
3
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Ragekniv✭✭✭A few weeks.A few weeks is reasonable. Beta and three months with no resolution is ridiculous!
Zenimax has pocketed the initial game units revenue and three months subscription revenue. They've likely satisfied their investor return and are now simply milking the proverbial teat.
This isn't new in MMOs, it's been the bane of player base satisfaction and game platform stagnation for longer than ESO was envisioned.
Game stability, class balance and progressive end game design are months away if not longer.
Unfortunately, hopeful players are caught in the static loop of reactionary driven patches versus pro-active workable solutions by Zenimax.2 -
ThyIronFist✭✭✭✭✭A few days.There have been bugs in the game since beta that have not been fixed yet. You can't defend ZoS anymore at this point.The Elder Zergs Online
Sainur Ironfist - DK - EU - Ebonheart Pact
Retired4 -
david271749✭✭✭✭✭ESO dies not have bugs, what are you talking about?No need to fix bugs. They'll all forget when we slap a couple more vet ranks on this bad boy. Hey, Let's go work on that console release. Now, how do we implement a F2P system just in time?
Op, not sure if freudian slip or clever devil.Edited by david271749 on June 11, 2014 8:37AM2 -
Pele✭✭✭✭✭
That's not what I said at all, nor did I intend for my post to be so deep.Blackwidow wrote: »
The meaning of my post is perfectly clear.
If the devs can fix bugs in a day, great. If they cannot, we must wait until they can. Nothing less. Nothing more.7 -
Preachan✭✭✭A few months.As quick as possible, a few weeks are allright.
But being a TSW PvP player - some month are fine as well.
Just don't get us stuck with the same bugs for 2 years. -_-3 -
Blackwidow✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭A few weeks.
That's not what I said at all, nor did I intend for my post to be so deep.Blackwidow wrote: »
The meaning of my post is perfectly clear.
If you were just stating the obvious, then sure. Crystal clear.If the devs can fix bugs in a day, great. If they cannot, we must wait until they can. Nothing less. Nothing more.
You can wait around if you want. Not all of us will be here by then.
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Arsenic_Touch✭✭✭✭✭
✭You'll need a sundial and an abacus for measuring and calculating the time, a white goat(10 points if you get the euphemism) and a sharp knife to appease the Daedric Gods.
Then just maybe you'll find out how long it takes.Edited by Arsenic_Touch on June 11, 2014 9:08AM☠ Is it better to out-monster the monster or to be quietly devoured? ☠
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"Hope can drown lost in thunderous sound."
"Fear can claim what little faith remains."
"Death will take those who fight alone."
"But united we can break a fate once set in stone."
╚═════════════ ೋღ☃ღೋ ══════════════╝
NA // Ebonheart Pact // Leader of CORE Legion // Namira Beta Tester // VR11 NB1 -
Pele✭✭✭✭✭
Indeed.Blackwidow wrote: »
That's not what I said at all, nor did I intend for my post to be so deep.Blackwidow wrote: »
The meaning of my post is perfectly clear.
If you were just stating the obvious, then sure. Crystal clear.If the devs can fix bugs in a day, great. If they cannot, we must wait until they can. Nothing less. Nothing more.
You can wait around if you want. Not all of us will be here by then.2 -
Mablung✭✭✭✭✭A few weeks.Over 2 months now and the game is still fairly buggy. Each patch introduces new bugs or re-breaks old ones which is a sign of very poor coding.
My sub runs another month. That is how long they have. I am not hopeful however with the recent state of the game address.2 -
Swordguy✭✭✭A few weeks.As quick as possible, a few weeks are allright.
But being a TSW PvP player - some month are fine as well.
Just don't get us stuck with the same bugs for 2 years. -_-
been a while since I really played tsw... does the community server still crash all the time?IN SOVIET RUSSIA, GUN LOADS YOU!
Do you Troll bait?
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Preachan✭✭✭A few months.been a while since I really played tsw... does the community server still crash all the time?
Nah, it's allright now. And PvE bugs are mostly solved rather quickly, like problems during events and stuff. Just the PvP side of life doesn't get the love it deserves... but at least some PvP problems were fixed as well.0 -
jeevin✭✭✭✭✭A few weeks.The rate of progress feels terribly slow considering most of these bugs have been reported in beta. The game should never have been released in it's current form in my very humble opinion. But then again at the rate at which they are fixing the game, in another year I would still be replying to a similar thread.
Where do the devs begin though. Every aspect of the game has a host of bugs or is under developed. From horrible bank/inventory to bugged quests, from unbalanced classes to broken skills. Guild stores? Input lag? Weapon swapping? Animation cancelling? The game just isn't even near finished.2 -
Pele✭✭✭✭✭
Indeed. PvP gets no love from FC; it's the reason I no longer play much.been a while since I really played tsw... does the community server still crash all the time?
Nah, it's allright now. And PvE bugs are mostly solved rather quickly, like problems during events and stuff. Just the PvP side of life doesn't get the love it deserves... but at least some PvP problems were fixed as well.
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Lodestar✭✭✭✭A few weeks.It should take as long as it takes the devs to figure out how to fix it.
In that case, games should not be released with too many of them, as ESO clearly has until resolved.
Games software industry needs a massive crackdown, to introduce accountability, if they wish to engage in the big business. Seems they want the customer base and all the money, but not the responsibility of it. Only politics and banking have this little accountability.5 -
Pele✭✭✭✭✭
I wholeheartedly agree. Games nowadays seem to be released as if there was no beta stage or testing done prior to release.It should take as long as it takes the devs to figure out how to fix it.
In that case, games should not be released with too many of them, as ESO clearly has until resolved.
Games software industry needs a massive crackdown, to introduce accountability, if they wish to engage in the big business. Seems they want the customer base and all the money, but not the responsibility of it. Only politics and banking have this little accountability.
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Lodestar✭✭✭✭A few weeks.
I wholeheartedly agree. Games nowadays seem to be released as if there was no beta stage or testing done prior to release.It should take as long as it takes the devs to figure out how to fix it.
In that case, games should not be released with too many of them, as ESO clearly has until resolved.
Games software industry needs a massive crackdown, to introduce accountability, if they wish to engage in the big business. Seems they want the customer base and all the money, but not the responsibility of it. Only politics and banking have this little accountability.
Yes, and it is not just unfinished MMO's either. Those familiar with the Total War series of games, know it is standard for your cavalry mounted troops to be vulnerable against footmen with spears. Total War Medieval 2, after all it's time in development, released with cavalry charging into spear men, and not avoiding them. A week or to into release a patch came out to put this right, but for a game that had such an integral tactic for 3 previous games, it was a bit of a blunder.
In the same month Neverwinter 2 released with bugs and performance issues on high end graphics cards. They had not implemented these features properly, and were patching them post release weeks in. With these two being releases, being in such close proximity to each other. I realised then, we were in a culture of release now, patch later, and knowing corporate mindset, this was only going to exacerbate.
Watch Dogs also released with graphics issues, that took me a week to find a temporary solution while maybe a patch further down comes. We are paying for beta standard releases, as the norm. I recall a game in the 80's for the Spectrum, that was taken off the market due to a bug. And never released again.0 -
ESO dies not have bugs, what are you talking about?The only bugs i saw were dropping insect parts =x
oh yes i did......0 -
Are you new to gaming? Morrowind, Elderscrolls III, still has bugs. Assassin's Creed I, II, III, IV, still has bugs. WoW still has bugs. Civilization V still has bugs. In fact, I'd be hard pressed to find a game out there, old, new, or otherwise that doesn't have bugs, computer or console. Many times these bugs end up on youtube in amusing little videos.
For that matter, does anyone still get good old B.S.O.D. running windows? I know the odd time I do.
It's not a simple matter of coding /remove bug or /don'tcrash Every time something is added to the game, even seemingly minor, there is a chance it will interact with something already present in game in an unforeseen fashion. If you want a completely stable game, you're going to need something single player, on standardized hardware, that never gets updated. Even then, there's a chance you'll find something coders didn't consider.
Best thing you can do when you encounter a bug, is report it using the handy in game feature /bug Be sure to include as much detail as possible, such as what you were doing, if you've encountered the problem before, what you might have been doing differently if you did the same thing without a problem earlier. And if applicable, let them know anything you tried doing to resolve the issue on your own and how effective (or ineffective) it was.
Contrary to how you're feeling, the game was not coded specifically to ruin your fun or give you a hard time. Nor is the team that fixes bugs the same team adding new content. When thousands of players are doing the same thing at all hours of the day without an issue, it's probably not easy for the programmers to duplicate your specific problem. So give them a hand and they might just be able to fix it sooner.
Raging on forums or in zone chat that your gaming experience isn't exactly perfect, isn't productive. If you can't handle imperfect games, sell your computer and go to the local hobby store to pick up a board game or old fashion dice and pencil rpg.6 -
Falmer✭✭✭✭Over a year.Yes, I am voting over a year on this one. Bugs are not just unknown and well-known. They also have priorities.
How many people does this affect? What sort of impact does it cause?
I don't care how well-known a bug might be, if it only affects a handful of people with certain hardware who are performing a certain act the same way over and over again, and the only game world effect is that specific player falls to their death and has to respawn at a shrine. Yes, I would expect that to be at the very bottom of the bug fix list.
Bugs are not just fixed in the order they are discovered. They are given priorities. My guess is that for this particular bug, you would find yourself very surprised at how many people have NEVER fallen through the world even one time.3 -
UPrime✭✭✭✭Over a year.A bug that is re-broken is a new bug. So technically it wasn't here all this time.
In general though how long it takes to fix it depends on the bug. It's severity, what it would take to fix it, etc.2 -
A few weeks.Yes, I am voting over a year on this one. Bugs are not just unknown and well-known. They also have priorities.
How many people does this affect? What sort of impact does it cause?
I don't care how well-known a bug might be, if it only affects a handful of people with certain hardware who are performing a certain act the same way over and over again, and the only game world effect is that specific player falls to their death and has to respawn at a shrine. Yes, I would expect that to be at the very bottom of the bug fix list.
Bugs are not just fixed in the order they are discovered. They are given priorities. My guess is that for this particular bug, you would find yourself very surprised at how many people have NEVER fallen through the world even one time.
I get what your saying and its true but it seems like your only looking at his one example and there are quite a few more. I think most are being delayed because they have quick fixes like restarting the client etc. But pushing these back enough times can have it build up, one day I ended up just not being able to play because it felt like every quest I came to I was restarting to fix an npc that has disappeared or a crash had happened. There has to be a priority yes but also only so long you can push something back.
I think as for their coding ehh I have done enough programming to notice a few subtle things that seem to say so and so function was probably rushed right before beta/release just one small thing I remember was coding the bug reporting if you had a problem with a piece of gear certain weapons and armor would appear on the drop down with their full appropriate name while others would sometimes just say "hat" and there would be about 10 "hat"s and you had to guess which was actually yours, is it game breaking well no but it does seem to be unfinished. I think it would be ok to say that they may be dealing with the side effects of rushing at the end now if they did this to other areas of the game. Keep in mind though I am no expert I just have programming experience and that's what it seems like to me.1 -
Obscure✭✭✭✭✭Can't vote.
No option for: Bugs shouldn't make it into the game in the first place.
Good dev's avoid creating bugs to begin with. Since no one is perfect there are people called QA hired to find the bugs that get through and fix/isolate them before they get into the live build. If everyone does their god*** job, there's nothing to worry about. The hard to fix bugs are quarantined from the live build, and the easy to fix bugs are caught and dealt with before becoming an issue.
So time I expect things to get fixed varies based on the difficulty of the bug, but if they do their jobs I won't ever see them in the first place. When I encounter a bug I'm instantly frustrated that I found it, a paying customer, and not someone developing or QAing, a paid employee. DO YOUR MOTHER ***ING JOB! Yeah it's a big project, big projects take time and money, MMOs are like that. You know how a developer is supposed to manage that? Hire the right quality and quantity of people to do the job correctly! For *** sake, just do it right the first time and you aren't spending twice as much time fixing your *** ups as it would have taken to just do it right the first go around.
Every bug is unacceptable, and the appropriate time to fix it is before I ever see it.5 -
A few weeks.shadowedexistenceb16_ESO wrote: »Are you new to gaming? Morrowind, Elderscrolls III, still has bugs. Assassin's Creed I, II, III, IV, still has bugs. WoW still has bugs. Civilization V still has bugs. In fact, I'd be hard pressed to find a game out there, old, new, or otherwise that doesn't have bugs, computer or console. Many times these bugs end up on youtube in amusing little videos.
For that matter, does anyone still get good old B.S.O.D. running windows? I know the odd time I do.
It's not a simple matter of coding /remove bug or /don'tcrash Every time something is added to the game, even seemingly minor, there is a chance it will interact with something already present in game in an unforeseen fashion. If you want a completely stable game, you're going to need something single player, on standardized hardware, that never gets updated. Even then, there's a chance you'll find something coders didn't consider.
Best thing you can do when you encounter a bug, is report it using the handy in game feature /bug Be sure to include as much detail as possible, such as what you were doing, if you've encountered the problem before, what you might have been doing differently if you did the same thing without a problem earlier. And if applicable, let them know anything you tried doing to resolve the issue on your own and how effective (or ineffective) it was.
Contrary to how you're feeling, the game was not coded specifically to ruin your fun or give you a hard time. Nor is the team that fixes bugs the same team adding new content. When thousands of players are doing the same thing at all hours of the day without an issue, it's probably not easy for the programmers to duplicate your specific problem. So give them a hand and they might just be able to fix it sooner.
Raging on forums or in zone chat that your gaming experience isn't exactly perfect, isn't productive. If you can't handle imperfect games, sell your computer and go to the local hobby store to pick up a board game or old fashion dice and pencil rpg.
I think you may have taken this a bit too personally I'm honestly not sure. I think the OP is just trying to get input from other players and what we think as just a general guideline would be fair. Most know that whenever they add the tiniest new content in or change something it can ripple pretty hard and affect other issues and I don't think this was meant as a rage of any kind. Your post however sounds pretty aggressive towards the OP and plenty of us that would at least like to talk about time frames for the bugs. There are plenty of things that generally shouldn't be affected by something else such as the text issue I brought up with the bug report that seems like it just wasn't finished at some point to save time. Just ease up a bit if you could, I don't think anyone was meaning to come off as Raging or angry in the thread.0 -
As fast as they can reproduce, implement fix, test fix internally then on pts. That is of course if something deemed more important to fix doesn't pop up first. It's a triage that is constantly changing and with limited manpower to fix.
As to people "paying to beta test" and "game devs needing to be held accountable etc" it won't happen. Know why? Because no matter how much people complain on forums they still pre order and rush to get in the door. Where is the incentive to release a bug free game? Money talks.1
