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Are DK really OP?
Revy
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I don't really pvp but in pve I dont see how DKs are really all that OP. In VR areas I can basically stack crit and cast critical surge and faceroll with pulsar and not worry about dieing. If I play like a mage on my DK I have no sustain, but if I go as a fighter my damage is pitiful. Most of my damage comes from class skills, but it seems that every patch they keep getting nerfed.
Can someone tell me how DK are OP? If its because of pvp why not do what other mmos do and to a pvp specific nerf. CC lasts 6 sec? Make it last 3 secs in pvp.
Can someone tell me how DK are OP? If its because of pvp why not do what other mmos do and to a pvp specific nerf. CC lasts 6 sec? Make it last 3 secs in pvp.
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Iago✭✭✭✭✭I pve and don't find my dk does any better off than my nightbladeThat which we obtain to cheap we esteem to lightly, it is dearness only that gives everything its value.
-Thomas Pain7 -
Iago✭✭✭✭✭I pve and don't find my dk does any better off than my nightbladeThat which we obtain to cheap we esteem to lightly, it is dearness only that gives everything its value.
-Thomas Pain7 -
PlagueMonk✭✭✭✭✭In PvP, yes..............run up, drop standard of might and then spam talons/shield bash so you are CC locked (and before you all scream, "just roll out of it!" Well because of the way the mechanics work, or don't, you can't). While you are busy trying in vain to roll out of it, they kill you. Wish I had an ultimate that would strip 1100 life when dropped.Edited by PlagueMonk on July 10, 2014 6:49AM9 -
Revy✭PlagueMonk wrote: »In PvP, yes..............run up, drop standard of might and then spam talons/shield bash so you are CC locked (and before you all scream, "just roll out of it!" Well because of the way the mechanics work, or don't, you can't). While you are busy trying in vain to roll out of it, they kill you. Wish I had an ultimate that would strip 1100 life when dropped.
Isn't that what negate magic is for? Seems like you could drop it before trying to roll out of the ult and talons. Also cant other classes try to take immovable to not get chained stunned?Edited by Revy on July 10, 2014 7:06AM0 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭Best to just go to cyrodiil and experience it firsthand. One picture is worth a thousand words, as they say.
Especially when the picture is a death recap.8 -
dsalter✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭High durability, high damage, a heal that can be spammed which recovers massive health, high resource management/gains.
Basicly most of their survivability comes from just passives as well as their resources so they rarely have down time and that dragons blood means no matter how hard you try his high resource management means he'll just jump back up in health within a second if he feels threatenedPLEASE REPLY TO ME WITH @dsalter otherwise i'm likely to miss the reply if its not my own thread
EU - [Arch Mage Dave] Altmer Sorcerer
Fight back at the crates and boxes, together we can change things.10 -
Revy✭I never thought of them as having high damage because most of it comes from aoe. And the heal can't crit and when I try to use mine it takes a good chunk of my magic. Are they using staffs and light armor or something? Whenever I did dungeons i was pretty hard to kill but never thought I dealt alot of damage though. Are most of them are using wings? Why wont the sorcerers switch to using lightning staffs? And cant templars out heal the damage and out tank them?2
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Honfold✭✭✭Are DKs really op? That is a loaded question. In pvp I think most people will say yes, with good reason. I typed out a lot more but I think I will just leave it at a yes, for pvp.4
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PlagueMonk✭✭✭✭✭PlagueMonk wrote: »In PvP, yes..............run up, drop standard of might and then spam talons/shield bash so you are CC locked (and before you all scream, "just roll out of it!" Well because of the way the mechanics work, or don't, you can't). While you are busy trying in vain to roll out of it, they kill you. Wish I had an ultimate that would strip 1100 life when dropped.
Isn't that what negate magic is for? Seems like you could drop it before trying to roll out of the ult and talons. Also cant other classes try to take immovable to not get chained stunned?
That's assuming a couple things........
1) I'm playing a Sorc (which I am not)
2) And even if I was you have to have the Ult up which can easily be on recharge.
3) You, as a Sorc, have to have taken it (which I would suggest) but there are other ultimates that have equal usefulness.
4) Also not using heavy armor.
Lastly and most important, there are a very limited number of slots on that hotbar. If I load up on those abilities I won't have the ones I need to deal with my opponent. If only I could have 30 abilities displayed at once like most other games.
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Revy✭PlagueMonk wrote: »PlagueMonk wrote: »In PvP, yes..............run up, drop standard of might and then spam talons/shield bash so you are CC locked (and before you all scream, "just roll out of it!" Well because of the way the mechanics work, or don't, you can't). While you are busy trying in vain to roll out of it, they kill you. Wish I had an ultimate that would strip 1100 life when dropped.
Isn't that what negate magic is for? Seems like you could drop it before trying to roll out of the ult and talons. Also cant other classes try to take immovable to not get chained stunned?
That's assuming a couple things........
1) I'm playing a Sorc (which I am not)
2) And even if I was you have to have the Ult up which can easily be on recharge.
3) You, as a Sorc, have to have taken it (which I would suggest) but there are other ultimates that have equal usefulness.
4) Also not using heavy armor.
Lastly and most important, there are a very limited number of slots on that hotbar. If I load up on those abilities I won't have the ones I need to deal with my opponent. If only I could have 30 abilities displayed at once like most other games.
Cant you just lvl up heavy armor to get immovable? Pretty sure you dont even need to be wearing heavy armor to use it and seems like a justifiable slot to counter many DKs.0 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭I never thought of them as having high damage because most of it comes from aoe.
Tooltips are a very poor way to judge the power of a class. You really need to experience it yourself.
In pvp, a V12 high rank DK charges you, drops talons while you're down, then drops banner, and your health evaporates before you can even use a roll dodge.
And while you are busy trying to first break out of the stun, then out of the root, he happily pumps you full of flame whips.
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IceDread✭✭✭PvP.. some builds works well against some builds but there are always ways to beat a build.
For PvE however, noone can compete with the sorcerers who walk around with 50% crit chance, heal on crit, aoe lockdown +damage. They are the single greatest class for aoe atm. All thou all classes can make due, but can't be as tuff or great at damage.1 -
Cant you just lvl up heavy armor to get immovable? Pretty sure you dont even need to be wearing heavy armor to use it and seems like a justifiable slot to counter many DKs.
No, you need at least 1 element of heavy armor equipped to have Immovable.
Edited by pavelcherepanskyrwb17_ESO on July 10, 2014 8:11AM"Do you want the book or not? Then go whack some people with Wabbajack!!"4 -
Sharee✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭✭✭pavelcherepanskyrwb17_ESO wrote: »
I did not check immovable, but elusion (the medium armor evade buff) can be used without any medium armor pieces equipped.1 -
Dalglish✭✭✭pavelcherepanskyrwb17_ESO wrote: »
Wrong, at this moment in time anyway.
You could run naked and still use any of the armour abilities.Victrix EU - EP & AD -
Xbox EU - DalglishUK5 -
Seroczynski✭✭✭
Move out of the Standard. If he spam Talons, CC break it once and be immune for another Talon for the next 3 seconds. It's not that hard. You are either living in the past (pre-DK nerfs), trolling, or have no clue on how to deal with DK's in PVP.PlagueMonk wrote: »In PvP, yes..............run up, drop standard of might and then spam talons/shield bash so you are CC locked (and before you all scream, "just roll out of it!" Well because of the way the mechanics work, or don't, you can't). While you are busy trying in vain to roll out of it, they kill you. Wish I had an ultimate that would strip 1100 life when dropped.
Edited by Seroczynski on July 10, 2014 9:49AM“To alcohol! The cause of, and solution to, all of life's problems.” ― Homer J. Simpson5 -
p_tsakirisb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭Can someone tell me how DK are OP? If its because of pvp why not do what other mmos do and to a pvp specific nerf. CC lasts 6 sec? Make it last 3 secs in pvp.
DKs are OP. Some combinations of skills and abilites even a class above OP to GOD MODE.
Examples? Plenty
a) PVP,
only very bad DK players going to lose a battle. They have many CC and one click abilities that even monkeys can use and win.
three nights ago, I did around 18000 damage to a DK according to CLS. The only things he was doing was cast scales, use gnb and use potions. he did 0 damage to me, but for 50 seconds I hammered him without success. And I couldn't even CC him, to get him under control.
After almost a minute, some of his mates came around and killed me.
Another instance. 4 DKs to be killed inside a tower, took 60 people and two wipes to do so.
They spam talons building Ultimate (they had at least one set ultimate reduction each according to their armour I saw), and rotation of 2 standards at all the time. They played well, but couldn't be broken nor kitted either.
b) PVE
The significan majority of them, can solo the Dark Anchors in Veteran areas.
And this before patch 1.2.4.
(Saw VR7 DK solo VR9 anchor, and didn't helped him, but observed him how he was doing it to learn)
DKs can even clear content in Craglorn that was designed for whole groups. And I know from my mate (DK), at vr4 decided and did all the group dungeons (normal difficulty) solo. Few hours later had cleared the lot.
At VR3 area (Shadowfen) while we were a grp of 3 gyuys (2 Templars and NB, after patch 1.1.2), trying to do the local public dungeon achievement, seeing the 6 dremora spawn in front of us who had just killed us, a VR3 DK went through, pulled both spawns (12 mobs) and wiped them in seconds.
Even my level 18 DK, feels ridiculous powerful, and for a test got him to Coldharbour killing level 45+ 3-4 mob spawns for heaven sake. And without sweating. Something my Templar struggled at level 45.
And everyone will say the same. They are overdue a big nerf, and a smaller one the Sorcerers to bring them all in line. Because even PvP has become ridiculous nowadays.6 -
nerrollus✭✭✭I don't really pvp but in pve I dont see how DKs are really all that OP. In VR areas I can basically stack crit and cast critical surge and faceroll with pulsar and not worry about dieing. If I play like a mage on my DK I have no sustain, but if I go as a fighter my damage is pitiful. Most of my damage comes from class skills, but it seems that every patch they keep getting nerfed.
Can someone tell me how DK are OP? If its because of pvp why not do what other mmos do and to a pvp specific nerf. CC lasts 6 sec? Make it last 3 secs in pvp.
I got killed by one in pvp, so yes.
Ragnarok Blackfist - Templar of the Ebonheart Pact
Ronin Wanderhome - Dragon Knight of the Ebonheart Pact6 -
schroed360✭✭✭Seroczynski wrote: »
Move out of the Standard. If he spam Talons, CC break it once and be immune for another Talon for the next 3 seconds. It's not that hard. You are either living in the past (pre-DK nerfs), trolling, or have no clue on how to deal with DK's in PVP.PlagueMonk wrote: »In PvP, yes..............run up, drop standard of might and then spam talons/shield bash so you are CC locked (and before you all scream, "just roll out of it!" Well because of the way the mechanics work, or don't, you can't). While you are busy trying in vain to roll out of it, they kill you. Wish I had an ultimate that would strip 1100 life when dropped.
I think that the op is not really interrested in pvp and is actually asking how DK is op for pve . I can t answer since only play DK so I can t compare . But i d say before there was good synergy between ardent flame and destro flame staff but that has been nerf so I also like to know what is still consider op...0 -
Maulkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »Can someone tell me how DK are OP? If its because of pvp why not do what other mmos do and to a pvp specific nerf. CC lasts 6 sec? Make it last 3 secs in pvp.
DKs are OP. Some combinations of skills and abilites even a class above OP to GOD MODE.
Examples? Plenty
a) PVP,
only very bad DK players going to lose a battle. They have many CC and one click abilities that even monkeys can use and win.
three nights ago, I did around 18000 damage to a DK according to CLS. The only things he was doing was cast scales, use gnb and use potions. he did 0 damage to me, but for 50 seconds I hammered him without success. And I couldn't even CC him, to get him under control.
After almost a minute, some of his mates came around and killed me.
Another instance. 4 DKs to be killed inside a tower, took 60 people and two wipes to do so.
They spam talons building Ultimate (they had at least one set ultimate reduction each according to their armour I saw), and rotation of 2 standards at all the time. They played well, but couldn't be broken nor kitted either.
b) PVE
The significan majority of them, can solo the Dark Anchors in Veteran areas.
And this before patch 1.2.4.
(Saw VR7 DK solo VR9 anchor, and didn't helped him, but observed him how he was doing it to learn)
DKs can even clear content in Craglorn that was designed for whole groups. And I know from my mate (DK), at vr4 decided and did all the group dungeons (normal difficulty) solo. Few hours later had cleared the lot.
At VR3 area (Shadowfen) while we were a grp of 3 gyuys (2 Templars and NB, after patch 1.1.2), trying to do the local public dungeon achievement, seeing the 6 dremora spawn in front of us who had just killed us, a VR3 DK went through, pulled both spawns (12 mobs) and wiped them in seconds.
Even my level 18 DK, feels ridiculous powerful, and for a test got him to Coldharbour killing level 45+ 3-4 mob spawns for heaven sake. And without sweating. Something my Templar struggled at level 45.
And everyone will say the same. They are overdue a big nerf, and a smaller one the Sorcerers to bring them all in line. Because even PvP has become ridiculous nowadays.
All very flawed or obsolete examples. If you can't clear a public VR3 dungeon with 2 mates, you're doing something very very very wrong. Don't put the blame on classes for that.
God mode in PvP? Don't make me laugh...
You all loved Sypher's vids, using them as an example of how DKs are OP and can win against 5-6 players. Well here's a vid of Sypher duelling a Templar and having 2 wins and 2 losses in 4 fights.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mM1k3jcnrvk
Edit: Brandoid FTW!Edited by Maulkin on July 10, 2014 10:44AMEU | PC | AD1 -
Vunter✭✭✭
Well, with my sorcerer I feel much more powerful than with my dragonknight.p_tsakirisb16_ESO wrote: »Can someone tell me how DK are OP? If its because of pvp why not do what other mmos do and to a pvp specific nerf. CC lasts 6 sec? Make it last 3 secs in pvp.
DKs are OP. Some combinations of skills and abilites even a class above OP to GOD MODE.
Examples? Plenty
a) PVP,
only very bad DK players going to lose a battle. They have many CC and one click abilities that even monkeys can use and win.
three nights ago, I did around 18000 damage to a DK according to CLS. The only things he was doing was cast scales, use gnb and use potions. he did 0 damage to me, but for 50 seconds I hammered him without success. And I couldn't even CC him, to get him under control.
After almost a minute, some of his mates came around and killed me.
Another instance. 4 DKs to be killed inside a tower, took 60 people and two wipes to do so.
They spam talons building Ultimate (they had at least one set ultimate reduction each according to their armour I saw), and rotation of 2 standards at all the time. They played well, but couldn't be broken nor kitted either.
b) PVE
The significan majority of them, can solo the Dark Anchors in Veteran areas.
And this before patch 1.2.4.
(Saw VR7 DK solo VR9 anchor, and didn't helped him, but observed him how he was doing it to learn)
DKs can even clear content in Craglorn that was designed for whole groups. And I know from my mate (DK), at vr4 decided and did all the group dungeons (normal difficulty) solo. Few hours later had cleared the lot.
At VR3 area (Shadowfen) while we were a grp of 3 gyuys (2 Templars and NB, after patch 1.1.2), trying to do the local public dungeon achievement, seeing the 6 dremora spawn in front of us who had just killed us, a VR3 DK went through, pulled both spawns (12 mobs) and wiped them in seconds.
Even my level 18 DK, feels ridiculous powerful, and for a test got him to Coldharbour killing level 45+ 3-4 mob spawns for heaven sake. And without sweating. Something my Templar struggled at level 45.
And everyone will say the same. They are overdue a big nerf, and a smaller one the Sorcerers to bring them all in line. Because even PvP has become ridiculous nowadays.
Yesterday I even killed 2 or 3 VR10 chars in PVP, and he's level 24. I guess it's a proof, right?No, it isn't.
Anyway, DKs with light + staff or light + sword and shield + weapon swap with resto are powerful. Dragon Blood can only restore 30% of your missing health, and spamming it can't heal you to 100%. And for someone without the freaking light armor it costs some magicka.
Sorry for my rudeness, but my medium armor DK he's having a bad time in VR group dungeons.
Edited by Vunter on July 10, 2014 10:44AM1 -
Maulkin✭✭✭✭✭
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Only with tri-stats.mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »Edit: Brandoid FTW!
If by tri-stats you mean the vr5 potions that give you stam+mag+hp then sure, but all players have access to themEU | PC | AD0 -
Seroczynski wrote: »
Move out of the Standard. If he spam Talons, CC break it once and be immune for another Talon for the next 3 seconds. It's not that hard. You are either living in the past (pre-DK nerfs), trolling, or have no clue on how to deal with DK's in PVP.PlagueMonk wrote: »In PvP, yes..............run up, drop standard of might and then spam talons/shield bash so you are CC locked (and before you all scream, "just roll out of it!" Well because of the way the mechanics work, or don't, you can't). While you are busy trying in vain to roll out of it, they kill you. Wish I had an ultimate that would strip 1100 life when dropped.
Correct me if I am wrong, but talons can not be cc breaked. Only dodge roll gets you out of it. At least it never work for me to mash both mouse button at the same time. For stun it works, but not for talons.
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Maulkin✭✭✭✭✭
✭✭✭sevcik.miroslaveb17_ESO wrote: »Seroczynski wrote: »
Move out of the Standard. If he spam Talons, CC break it once and be immune for another Talon for the next 3 seconds. It's not that hard. You are either living in the past (pre-DK nerfs), trolling, or have no clue on how to deal with DK's in PVP.PlagueMonk wrote: »In PvP, yes..............run up, drop standard of might and then spam talons/shield bash so you are CC locked (and before you all scream, "just roll out of it!" Well because of the way the mechanics work, or don't, you can't). While you are busy trying in vain to roll out of it, they kill you. Wish I had an ultimate that would strip 1100 life when dropped.
Correct me if I am wrong, but talons can not be cc breaked. Only dodge roll gets you out of it. At least it never work for me to mash both mouse button at the same time. For stun it works, but not for talons.
You can't CC break the talons you can only roll as it's soft CC.
But as I said on the other thread, every class has an AoE ultie, a hard CC ability and a soft CC ability. You can do to the DK exactly what they do to youEU | PC | AD1 -
p_tsakirisb16_ESO✭✭✭✭✭
✭sevcik.miroslaveb17_ESO wrote: »Seroczynski wrote: »
Move out of the Standard. If he spam Talons, CC break it once and be immune for another Talon for the next 3 seconds. It's not that hard. You are either living in the past (pre-DK nerfs), trolling, or have no clue on how to deal with DK's in PVP.PlagueMonk wrote: »In PvP, yes..............run up, drop standard of might and then spam talons/shield bash so you are CC locked (and before you all scream, "just roll out of it!" Well because of the way the mechanics work, or don't, you can't). While you are busy trying in vain to roll out of it, they kill you. Wish I had an ultimate that would strip 1100 life when dropped.
Correct me if I am wrong, but talons can not be cc breaked. Only dodge roll gets you out of it. At least it never work for me to mash both mouse button at the same time. For stun it works, but not for talons.
I tried many times to break in PVP Talons with roll, and just didn't move at all.
In PVE I do not have issue to break the Talons of NPC thought.
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Brandoid✭✭✭mike.gaziotisb16_ESO wrote: »You can't CC break the talons you can only roll as it's soft CC.
But as I said on the other thread, every class has an AoE ultie, a hard CC ability and a soft CC ability. You can do to the DK exactly what they do to you
It is difficult to have and ult ready to go at all times.
Edited by Brandoid on July 10, 2014 11:25AMBrandoid - Templar - Ebonheart Pack0 -
I have recently tried out a dragon knight. I have gotten him to lvl 9. So far he is not too overpowered . However, this completely changes when you try PVP.{|~My Characters~|}Ma'ir - Khajiit AD Sorcerer
Sanmire Korlael - Altmer AD Dragonknight
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